Marriage-Divorce-Remarriage is not Adultery

[richard79408]

Spiritforce, greetings in Christ from sunny Texaz,


Yes, God did "divorce--" and, that translates that God gave the bill of divorcement and sent away that is cast out, abandoned or deserted in Jer 3.


No, Deut 24:1-4 is the first time God gave Israel laws regarding marriage, divorce and remarriage. That is not changed in Jer 3.


In Deut we have a woman married and divorced twice for reasons other than adultery and free to remarry for the third time. However, she could not remarry her first husband.


In the same law God makes it clear that He has not authorized a "divorce" that is a sending away and bill of divorcement when adultery is committed.

The guilty party is just cast out of the house and then the law says the guilty party is to be stoned to death. No sending away and givingthe bill of divorcement for adultery--none at all.

Richard 79408

 

[mark s]

Mark, greetings from sunny Texas,
you asked--Where in the Bible was Israel remarried after her divorce from God?

My observation--umm Now, God remarried on the day of Pentecost--Look at Romans 7:1-4

Hi Richard,

I've been thinking about this.

Romans 7:1-6 LITV
(1) Or are you ignorant, brothers, (for I speak to those knowing Law), that the Law lords it over the man for as long a time as he lives?
(2) For the married woman was bound by Law to the living husband; but if the husband dies, she is set free from the Law of the husband.
(3) So then, if the husband is living, she will be called an adulteress if she becomes another man's. But if the husband dies, she is free from the Law, so as for her not to be an adulteress by becoming another man's.
(4) So that, my brothers, you also were made dead to the Law through the body of Christ, for you to become Another's, to the One raised from the dead, so that we may bear fruit to God.
(5) For when we were in the flesh, the passions of sin were working in our members through the Law for the bearing of fruit unto death.
(6) But now we have been set free from the Law, having died to that in which we were held, so as for us to serve in newness of spirit, and not in oldness of letter.

I don't think that is what this passage is talking about.

Marriage is being used as a metaphor of a person's relationship to the Law, being exchanged for their relationship with Christ, as Who or what is the master over them.

Israel was considered married to God while still under the Law. Though God divorced Israel, that did not change the Law's governance over Israel. Personally, I see there coming a time when the nation returns to the LORD, and in that day, they will be re-wed.

But this is a small matter, not, in my opinion, clearly stated.

Love in Christ,
Mark

 

[richard79408]

Greetings in Christ from sunny Texas,

In the world of the first century there are some things that we sometimes "forget" shortly after reading because we are looking for something else.
Do we all know that like 95 per cent of the population were slaves?

Here is the problem for folks in dealing with marriages in the first century--who do not understand that God has given the authority of marriages to the civil government and not the RCC or to any other church.

An owner would take a strong male and have him mate with a female that the owner believed would make a good strong slave.

They have a couple of children and then the owner sells the woman to another owner--who then mates her with another male slave.
In the first century, this was acceptable and no one questioned it.

Now how does one apply the traditional teaching of MDr where remarriage constitutes adultery upon the remarriage?

It is not until over 500 years later--that the rcc begins to ponder over who has the power of the recently conqueored people that the Roman Army is overpowering?

A thousand years later at the council of Trent--Civil government loses to the RCC via the sacraments.
You and I live on the other side of "who has the authority" with the RCC winning that battle. Are we then to accept the RCC here and take the God given authority of the Civil government away from the princes--so we can rule with a heavy arm those who are less fortunate in their sins than some of those we committ?

Well, a 1550 year old lie is hard to overcome..but first we have to know about it.
Richard 79408

Mark--greetings in Christ from sunny Texas,

Hmmm. you are correct in one respect--I pointed it at God and not at Israel--that is the physical descendants of Abraham.

The Old Covenant had to die--that is to be fulfilled and taken out of the way.

The situation with God and Israel is an interesting one.

Jer 3:8 And I saw, when for all the causes whereby backsliding Israel committed adultery I had put her away, and given her a bill of divorce; yet her treacherous sister Judah feared not, but went and played the harlot also.
Jer 3:11 And the LORD said unto me, The backsliding Israel hath justified herself more than treacherous Judah.
Jer 3:12 Go and proclaim these words toward the north, and say, Return, thou backsliding Israel, saith the LORD; and I will not cause mine anger to fall upon you: for I am merciful, saith the LORD, and I will not keep anger for ever.
Jer 3:13 Only acknowledge thine iniquity, that thou hast transgressed against the LORD thy God, and hast scattered thy ways to the strangers under every green tree, and ye have not obeyed my voice, saith the LORD.
Jer 3:14 Turn, O backsliding children, saith the LORD; for I am married unto you: and I will take you one of a city, and two of a family, and I will bring you to Zion:

After verse 8--we have verse 14--which we almost always don't see.

And, it is true that even after God divorced Israel--they were still held accountable to the covenant He had made with them.
This is why I put in Romans 7:1-4--God knew that Jesus was coming to fullfill the Mosaic law and take it out of the way.

Thus the way for the Jews for salvation lies in marrying Christ. When the will was probated on Pentecost--the first 8-10 years of the gospel being preached to the lost nation of israel before moving out to the Samaritans and later to the Gentiles--they heard and obeyed the gospel.
Richard79408



It is always uplifting to see folks who do understand the proper use of Romans 7:1-4
Richard 79408

 

[richard79408]

Greetings in Christ from sunny Texas,

Here is another example of a marriage that is legal in the first century and it is even today in many states...


#2 USUS-- In this "marriage" both the man and the woman had a say as far as deciding first if they wanted to get married and they could choose to whom they wanted to get married.
Keep in mind that this marriage had NO” written agreements” and no "legal documents” to show that a "marriage" had indeed taken place.

These folks” lived together" for twelve months or one full year and everyone considered them "married." In our” society" today what would we call this? In fact, some of our” States" recognizes this as marriage at the end of seven years.
This is what we would call "common Law."

In our "religious society" today some would throw a self-righteous fit. Why? There is no paperwork. In fact, there is nothing but a commitment by these two folks to get married.
There are no consequences to speak of in getting a divorce--for whatever reason in the world. So, what do we see? Religious folks today taking their beliefs on divorce and remarriage and” pushing" it back into a culture just because we want it--our way today.

If we can see and understand that marriage in the first century--outside of Judiasm was governed by civil authority--whether or not that authority was good, bad or indifferent--God has given civil authority the power here in marriages.
Richard79408
Marriage, Divorce, Remarriage Not Adultery
http://rgfheart.com/abs

 

[richard79408]

Greetings in Christ from sunny Texas,

Well, it is a beautiful day and when it is over I wonder if any of us will have decided that we need to start thinking about who and what we are for ourselves?

Let's try to stay together here on this:

[1] After the sin in the garden--sin entered into the lives of human beings. Hardness of heart also became a reality.

[2] Men from the time of the garden through today who are not in Christ are not under Well let's allow this passage to tell us--

Rom 8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

[a] To be free in Christ to have the law of the Spirit of life in Christ--one has to escape from somewhere. The text says we are free from God's Moral law of sin and of death by being in Christ--that is by being free in Christ.

So--who was in charge of marriages after the garden up to the time of the flood? Perhaps we should stop and ask rather, who is not in charge by God in this time period??

Now, would you believe that your opinion here in this time period is as good as anyone's including mine.

I do know that by this time here--God was very angry and upset--and He did something about it.

Gen 6:5 And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.

Gen 6:6 And it repented the LORD that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart.
Gen 6:7 And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them.

At this point of the flood--it really does not matter--all man is destroyed with the exception of Noah and His family.
And, that moves us forward in time to the next apostasty of man--

Man is not listening to God--they are instead building the tower of babel.

We need to stop and think because it is here that man is about to lose his commonality with one another.

What we do know is that man has God's moral law of sin and of death and with that law they knew right from wrong.

God comes down and man is befuddled by different languages so they have to move away from one another.

As they move away from this time period and move over the earth--nations begin to develop.

Now, Who has God put in charge of marriages? Each nation begins to form and develop and fight with one another--whom has God put in charge of marriages? It is the civil government of each nation and it is clear that they are not all doing marriages the same way.

Question when is the time that you have even thought about this?

Folks are so busy protecting their view of MDR--they cannot see what God has done and now many are reluctant to because it interferes with their doctrine.

Who was in charge of the marriages in Sodom and Gommorah? Sure was not God!! That civil government was responsible and understand that because of the "gayness" of the society God gave them over to their sin and then eventually destroyed them for the sin.

Folks who are gay have existed in every society--and that government will answer for its neglect.

Remember, they all have God's Moral law of sin and of death and that tells them that is wrong..Hardness of heart overrides and man does just whatever he wants to do. Sin always has consequences.

But it does give an accurate picture on mdr and how folks want control over others.

This my continuing effort to wake us up and to get each of us thinking for ourselves. many of us will not but some of us will get the picture and began to study for themselves. And that is really what this is all about. More information that you can check on and then make a decision on.

Now, the next time period is after the development of the gentile nations we have God using some of the head of families to deal with mankind.
Still, overall who has God placed in charge of marriages? It certainly is not His people--they are not doing well themselves with marriages.

Yet remember this--every nation began knowing the ideal one man and one woman. What changes this again--is man's indifference to God's moral law of sin and of death--so they do what seems right in their eyes--and, folks they not God make that determination.

Now, we come to the descendants of Abraham gathered together at Mt. Sinai to receive the Mosaic law.. It is not the law of Moses, it is the law of God given to Moses who gives it to the people.

Let's try a little rational logical thinking along with the texts here.

At. Mt. Sinai God separated the israelites out from among the rest of the world--and gave them law. God gives His people the first divorce law and how it is to be done in Deut 24:1-4 and different applications in other parts of the law.

Now outside of the newly formed nation of Israel--who has God given control of the marriages to? The local religious group in each nation? No! God gave it to the civil authority.

Deu 5:1 And Moses called all Israel, and said unto them, Hear, O Israel, the statutes and judgments which I speak in your ears this day, that ye may learn them, and keep, and do them.
Deu 5:2 The LORD our God made a covenant with us in Horeb.
Deu 5:3 The LORD made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day.
Deu 5:4 The LORD talked with you face to face in the mount out of the midst of the fire,

Now, God has never ever bound the law given at Mt. Sinai to any of the Gentiles present surrounding them at the time.

Each nation that existed around Israel at that time held responsibility for marriages. Their hardness of heart had moved them from the law and God gave them over to themselves.

That includes all kinds of marriages and not all nations had the same laws governing them. Gay folks lived and thrived under that civil law and paid the price for their indulgence.

So once again, ask yourself--Who has God placed in charge of marriages??in all the nations around Israel...

to be continued

Greetings in Christ from sunny Texas,

If you are still reading hopefully you can begin to see the huge issues set before us.

We have men usurping the authority of God in history but we are a little ahead of our selves.

Now we come to the time of Jesus--Jesus who by the way BY LAW and by choice did not change the law that His Father gave at Mt. Sinai and He was also present.

When Jesus was going to the lost sheep of the house of Israel who in the Gentile nations in the rest of the world was put in charge of marriages by God.
If you have problems with this Read Romans one. It was not God and it most certainly was not the Jews. it was the responsibility of each civil government...No one is claiming that they were ever good at it--quite the contrary--

Jesus is killed by the Jews..put on a cross and at that point in time they lost the kingdom of God forever. it wasn't like that they had not already lost it as a nation--because they had. Jesus said they were lost and they were.

With the good news of the kingdom of God back In Mark 1:1 following Jesus specifically forbid his folks from teaching to any but the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Now, we have the day of Pentecost--and the beginning of the New Covenant.

So, in the Gentile nations who has God got in charge of marriages?

Well, it is not the Jews and it is not the Christians--it is civil government--all of the people are alien sinners separated from God by sin..enhanced by hardness of heart.

As the gospel of Acts 2--now open to both Jews and Gentiles all who are alien sinners goes forth into the world.

Now, as Christians were made in each of the Gentile nation--who has God put in charge of marriages?

Well, it is not the Gentiles and it certainly is not the Christians so we are left with civil government.

Early on the church Fathers began to wrestle with this and some do better than others. Some began to believe that God has put "Christians" in charge not only of marriage but many other things.

Around 270 ad the persecuted church was recognized by civil government as a legal religion.

Just a sort 130 years later we see the Roman Army fighting for the church which is never a good thing but that is what happened.

At 400 AD who has God put in charge of marriages in the Gentile nations? It is not the Jews, It is not the Christians although that is beginning to think that they ought to be.

Now one church leader in 590-604AD is not only the spiritual leader but also ends up in charge of a part of the Roman army.

It is this man Gregory the First who really begins to question who should have the control over the people--civil government or hmmm. us, as the church.
Now, who has God put in charge of marriages in the Gentile nations?

Note Gentile now refers to all non Christian folks.

Well, it is still the civil government...but church leaders are beginning to want that job. Why? It grants the church complete and total control over all the people..This is something that they begin to work on.

It takes another 1,000 years of wrangling over who has control over the people and that would include marriages..

One helpful bit was that in 1486 the RCC inserted the title pages separating out the old from the new covenants\Testaments.

Another contributing factor is that they were the only ones with bibles..and, the control so it was no big deal for them to do this.

Civil Government lost that battle at the council of Trent.

Here is a man that you really must read--His name is Martin Buccer and lived during and after the Council of Trent. He has some interesting things to say about the RCC grapping of power over folks.

http://rgfheart.com/abs/550/mb/

To be continued

 

[aspen]

Some say God divorced Israel and remarried Gentiles

 

[Tex]

Aspen! This thread is over two years old! Posting here is taboo.