Maturity in Christ

[amadeus]

You may be over your head on this one my friend...I mean knowing what Elohim means and all.

Surely so! Many years ago I read studies and did studies on this and others items of interest or as God led me. I did it but a lot of it unfortunately has slipped away again. Bits and pieces come back when someone mentions them but it won't stick any more. I am really dependent on God on this. That is the best way anyway for young or for old anyway.

If I really thought any of it would do any good, that is that it would somehow edify me or others, I might work at it again. When I was doing it then for a very few words it came to me that it would be a good thing to study the original languages learning to read my Bible in those languages. Too much for an already overworked brain. I lasted a few days soon realizing it was already too late for this old flesh and more importantly not in God's will.

I had done did it with German and I had done it with Spanish but that was when I was young, strong and energetic. It was also done in those days by me and for me with no real thoughts about God... although I know now that even then He already had me in mind.

Now when it comes to such things I must trust in God and in those who have the expertise to render some of those words into English. I have many reference books plus Internet access, but that must be it... as I head closer to that last day for me...as a man of flesh. Sometimes I want to look forward to it, but other times I simply trudge on from day to day with Him. I am ready, but I am not in a hurry...

 

[Episkopos]

Surely so! Many years ago I read studies and did studies on this and others items of interest or as God led me. I did it but a lot of it unfortunately has slipped away again. Bits and pieces come back when someone mentions them but it won't stick any more. I am really dependent on God on this. That is the best way anyway for young or for old anyway.

If I really thought any of it would do any good, that is that it would somehow edify me or others, I might work at it again. When I was doing it then for a very few words it came to me that it would be a good thing to study the original languages learning to read my Bible in those languages. Too much for an already overworked brain. I lasted a few days soon realizing it was already too late for this old flesh and more importantly not in God's will.

I had done did it with German and I had done it with Spanish but that was when I was young, strong and energetic. It was also done in those days by me and for me with no real thoughts about God... although I know now that even then He already had me in mind.

Now when it comes to such things I must trust in God and in those who have the expertise to render some of those words into English. I have many reference books plus Internet access, but that must be it... as I head closer to that last day for me...as a man of flesh. Sometimes I want to look forward to it, but other times I simply trudge on from day to day with Him. I am ready, but I am not in a hurry...

The Lord told me to learn Hebrew about 20 years ago now....and gave me an aptitude for it. I studied basically non-stop for years.

I think it's easier to learn a third language if you already know 2.

Learning a biblical language is good...but not for everyone.

 

[amadeus]

The Lord told me to learn Hebrew about 20 years ago now....and gave me an aptitude for it. I studied basically non-stop for years.

I think it's easier to learn a third language if you already know 2.

Learning a biblical language is good...but not for everyone.

These were certainly my thoughts on it. Through elementary and high school I never really learned the rules of English because I really did not need them. When I took Spanish, German and Latin in college, I learned English grammar as never before because it helped me with the new languages. I received my BA in Spanish Literature with a German minor in 1971. By the time I was interested in Greek and Hebrew after my retirement in 2000, while I could handle the single session understanding, I had no endurance to press on... Eventually I stopped.

Reading the Bible in Spanish was always easy for me, but learning to read a Luther Bible was a great challenge. For a long period of time I had to read with the two Bibles open, one in English and one in German. My German had slipped badly since returning from Germany in 1971. Slowly but surely things came back and I can now read it without the English accompanying Bible... although I usually have another Bible handy for reference. I understand the words, but the deeper concepts of scripture can be challenging in German especially.

 

[Nancy]

A living God to walk with...yes not just a paper God stuck in a book. The sheer scale of the difference between these.

The bible testifies of an extra biblical (not just paper) God. God is alive and active. Paul received the truth by revelation. As I did...it began with the words of the bible being quickened in me...into a walk in the light where I could see eternal things everywhere. I saw in the Spirit...even things over the heads of people. The bible testifies of a walk in the Spirit...as I have a lot of experience with over the last 40 years or so.

A person who resists this truth resists the Spirit. THAT is also testified of in the bible. So you need more than just a book and an opinion based on an interpretation of a book...no matter how true that book is. It is the Spirit that gives life.

About half the people on this forum have no idea who the Holy Spirit is. Yet we are to walk in victory BY the Spirit...not bible interpretations. The letter kills...as you do...but the Spirit gives life. The sons of God are led by the Spirit.

You see my walk and testimony as something to be avoided, shunned and attacked...but your stance is exactly backwards...unless you work for the opposition..which you do unwittingly.

Do you even know what blasphemy of the Spirit is? When you attribute the precious and holy presence of God (even in a brother) to a demonic incursion...you are damned for it. The fear of the Lord (which you don't know either) preserves your life so that when Jesus is revealed you will not be ashamed.

"God is alive and active.

Hebrews 4:12
12" For the word of God is Sharper than any double-edged sword,it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."

The Lord told me to learn Hebrew about 20 years ago now....and gave me an aptitude for it. I studied basically non-stop for years.

I think it's easier to learn a third language if you already know 2.

Learning a biblical language is good...but not for everyone.

I have always wanted to learn a biblical language but then, who would I talk to in it, on a regular basis?? I would lose it before long, lol.

 

[Episkopos]

"God is alive and active.

Hebrews 4:12
12" For the word of God is Sharper than any double-edged sword,it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart."

I have always wanted to learn a biblical language but then, who would I talk to in it, on a regular basis?? I would lose it before long, lol.

Shalom lach achoti. The Hebrew for me is more of a reading language. It is different from the modern Hebrew. To them speaking with biblical verbs sounds like King James English does to us. But there are enough similarities to make it worthwhile to pick up some modern Hebrew as well.

An example is "this is not for me" (as many of these threads are to me)

In biblical Hebrew it would sound like.... ze lo le-ma'ani.
In modern Hebrew it is sounds like....ze lo bishvili.

Can you see and hear the difference in vintage? But notice the sentence structure is the same.

Are there any other Hebrew readers or speakers here I wonder?

 

[Nancy]

Shalom lach achoti. The Hebrew for me is more of a reading language. It is different from the modern Hebrew. To them speaking with biblical verbs sounds like King James English does to us. But there are enough similarities to make it worthwhile to pick up some modern Hebrew as well.

An example is "this is not for me" (as many of these threads are to me)

In biblical Hebrew it would sound like.... ze lo le-ma'ani.
In modern Hebrew it is sounds like....ze lo bishvili.

Can you see and hear the difference in vintage? But notice the sentence structure is the same.

Are there any other Hebrew readers or speakers here I wonder?

Seems like hours, and hours and years of study. If only I could put that much into my bible!

 

[Episkopos]

Seems like hours, and hours and years of study. If only I could put that much into my bible!

I became quite obsessed with the language. I studied at work and then at home until I went to bed. I did this for years...until Hebrew became to me like another language I recognize as my own. But that passion was from the Lord. I heard His voice saying to me..."learn Hebrew" and that set me going!

It's not like I'm a Zionist or anything...just the words from God. The "davar"...

 

[Nancy]

I became quite obsessed with the language. I studied at work and then at home until I went to bed. I did this for years...until Hebrew became to me like another language I recognize as my own. But that passion was from the Lord. I heard His voice saying to me..."learn Hebrew" and that set me going!

It's not like I'm a Zionist or anything...just the words from God. The "davar"...

How intriguing to know the language of the bible. I would be overjoyed just at the thought of visiting The Holy Land.

 

[farouk]

Hi sbg!..been gone but growing and good to be back!

Welcome back...

 

[faithfulness]

Welcome back...

Thanks, farouk!

 

[farouk]

Thanks, farouk!

YW.

 

[tzcho2]

First motions? First impulse? This sounds like a person who has learned self-control more than someone who walks in the crucified life. Dead to sin means that sin has no first impulse...actually NO impulse...because dead is dead. But to have such self-control is a very good thing.

The Christian life is not a discipline as many older believers believed back in the day. It is NOT an imitation. This is not a monkish thing.

It is a restoration to the perfection that God created in Adam before the fall.

BE perfect as God is perfect (teleos). This means we were created in HIS image...and in Christ we return to THAT perfect image. The image of God. This is without sin..any spot or wrinkle of sin. This is through surrender of our lives and entering into His life. No longer I but Christ.

Fallen man is NOT in the image of God...but in the image of this world which is under the power of the devil.

1John 1:8 " 8 If we say we have no sin, WE DECEIVE ourselves , and the TRUTH is Not in us.

 

[tzcho2]

I became quite obsessed with the language. I studied at work and then at home until I went to bed. I did this for years...until Hebrew became to me like another language I recognize as my own. But that passion was from the Lord. I heard His voice saying to me..."learn Hebrew" and that set me going!

It's not like I'm a Zionist or anything...just the words from God. The "davar"...

You think God talks to you? like a prophet?

 

[Episkopos]

You think God talks to you? like a prophet?

I don't like labels. But one day I was called in to work on a Sunday (they were forcing me in). As I was driving there a voice inside said..."when he asks you who told you to learn Hebrew...say it was the one he calls Hashem, He told you to learn Hebrew"

So I get to work and sure enough my Israeli friend was there. He asked me if I could join him...so we walked together to another part of the plant...although we were to work in different departments. About half-way there he stops and says to me..."Why are you so interested in learning Hebrew? Do you want to meet my rabbi? (I had been asking him lots of questions concerning the lishon hakodesh)

So I said word for word what I had been given to say.

He exploded and told me to leave the job immediately...that he couldn't work with someone who spoke with God. (He knew I was a Christian already) He told me I should be working for God not some company fixing jet engines (I was working at Rolls Royce at the time).

God later used this outburst to confirm that He was calling me to serve Him full time....which I did about 17 years ago now. The fellowship had asked me to quit my job to devote more time to the word and all our guests.

I have heard God's voice many times...with many gifts and all these peculiar miraculous things following. My wonder is that more Christians don't also experience this kind of contact with the living God by the Spirit.

We need but ask...with a little faith. Is that too hard?

It isn't us that are special for all the divine happenings and works. It is He!

All praise to Him.

 

[tzcho2]

I don't like labels. But one day I was called in to work on a Sunday (they were forcing me in). As I was driving there a voice inside said..."when he asks you who told you to learn Hebrew...say it was the one he calls Hashem, He told you to learn Hebrew"

So I get to work and sure enough my Israeli friend was there. He asked me if I could join him...so we walked together to another part of the plant...although we were to work in different departments. About half-way there he stops and says to me..."Why are you so interested in learning Hebrew? Do you want to meet my rabbi? (I had been asking him lots of questions concerning the lishon hakodesh)
So I said word for word what I had been given to say.
He exploded and told me to leave the job immediately...that he couldn't work with someone who spoke with God. (He knew I was a Christian already) He told me I should be working for God not some company fixing jet engines (I was working at Rolls Royce at the time).
God later used this outburst to confirm that He was calling me to serve Him full time....which I did about 17 years ago now. The fellowship had asked me to quit my job to devote more time to the word and all our guests.
I have heard God's voice many times...with many gifts and all these peculiar miraculous things following. My wonder is that more Christians don't also experience this kind of contact with the living God by the Spirit.
We need but ask...with a little faith. Is that too hard?
It isn't us that are special for all the divine happenings and works. It is He!

All praise to Him.

Deceiving spirits can do EXACTLY the same thing as you claim, and speak the same way, that's why the Bible identifies them as deceiving spirits. As a matter of fact , in the Bible , our Lord Jesus Christ warned about those that will produce wonders to NOT be deceived by them! Jesus warned that at the end of the age there would be an increase in spiritual deception. Those who are in Christ's church need to be very careful and spiritually discerning and to confirm all by the authority of the Bible scriptures.
I have very strong FAITH in JESUS, in the heavenly FATHER GOD, the HOLY SPIRIT, And the Holy God-breathed scriptures.
Matt 24:24
"23 At that time, if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There He is,’ do not believe it. 24 For False Christs and False prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would mislead, if possible, even the elect.
25“Behold, I have told you in advance.
26“So if they say to you, ‘Behold, He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out, or, ‘Behold, He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe them.
27“For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be.
28“Wherever the corpse is, there the vultures will gather."

 

[Episkopos]

Deceiving spirits can do EXACTLY the same thing as you claim, and speak the same way, that's why the Bible identifies them as deceiving spirits. As a matter of fact , in the Bible , our Lord Jesus Christ warned about those that will produce wonders to NOT be deceived by them! Jesus warned that at the end of the age there would be an increase in spiritual deception. Those who are in Christ's church need to be very careful and spiritually discerning and to confirm all by the authority of the Bible scriptures.
I have very strong FAITH in JESUS, in the heavenly FATHER GOD, the HOLY SPIRIT, And the Holy God-breathed scriptures.
Matt 24:24
"23 At that time, if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There He is,’ do not believe it. 24 For False Christs and False prophets will appear and perform great signs and wonders that would mislead, if possible, even the elect.
25“Behold, I have told you in advance.
26“So if they say to you, ‘Behold, He is in the wilderness,’ do not go out, or, ‘Behold, He is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe them.
27“For just as the lightning comes from the east and flashes even to the west, so will the coming of the Son of Man be.
28“Wherever the corpse is, there the vultures will gather."

Bless you for your concerns but I can assure you that I am in good Hands!

 

[David kilmer]

I posted this elsewhere but I thought to make a new thread for this topic....which is so important.

The Holy Spirit is IN a person who is born again. It is Christ IN us. But it takes going to the throne of grace to get the FULL measure of grace. We need to further enter into someone who isn't us....Jesus Christ Himself. It's like the 10 lepers who were healed but only one came back to Jesus. ALL were indeed healed. But there was a selfishness in the other 9 as in...I got what I came for. (Come and get YOUR miracle today).


The Christian walk is about pressing on to maturity. But even maturity is at different levels.


Imagine going for a long walk...say 30 miles. Some people could do that in a day. But then another person takes 2 days....because he is also carrying 80 pounds on his back. So who must be in the better shape?


That's the way it is with the narrow path. Some people seem to have a harder time of it...but their calling is higher. We can be as mature as can be...but maturity in the spiritual walk of purity (holiness) is something vastly different. The walk of the righteous person is one thing...but to walk as Jesus walked for any length of time is miraculous. Can a man walk on water as if he was walking on land?


So then I divide maturity in righteousness...becoming more loving, more forgiving...getting to know God better. That's good...very good. (And it is very necessary) And that's one thing....but then there's maturity IN the Spirit which is like getting used to living on another planet. What makes a person at home on earth does not automatically make a person able to survive in another world. Of course righteousness and holiness are related. Learning righteousness helps with a longevity in holiness...even though it doesn't lead to it.


But the scandal of Jesus Christ is that He didn't just perfect a walk in the power of the flesh for us to grow into or imitate. He perfected humanity by a higher walk...a spiritual walk, and then brings us into it through translation into Zion in the Spirit. The scandal is that we can never improve ourselves into holiness. Holiness is a gift. Spiritual maturity is how long we can walk in the Spirit. Like how long we can walk on water for.


If I only spoke about what men can do...I would not be hated for speaking of the the cross of Christ in this way...the break with human kind which separates us from what we can do in our own capabilities...even mature capabilities. But I speak of the unspeakable gift...so I'm hated by many. The gift of God is the perfection of Christ's humanity given to us already perfected...as a gift. His perfect walk...as a gift. No improvements are required. It's the whole enchilada right away. That is what grace is. A gift of an eternal walk in an eternal life....not our life...but as partakers of HIS life. So the spiritual maturity is learning to walk IN someone else...not yourself. Jesus Christ.


Hard to believe? Absolutely. Not of this world.

But there it is!


Having said all that...God loves us who walk after Him in the fear of Him and the hope of a future life with Him. We are saved not just by an active faith in the moment but also a living hope in the long race. God works with us...and guides us by His Spirit. We are His people who obey His commands and seek after Him.

And then there's the saints...

As in maturity in Christ.. as we are in Christ, we are to say change from our old ways. No more lust or desires of the flesh. Jesus helps and forgives sins to help you best temptation and you grow as you read Jesus words in the Bible. I did. I used to be evil then I repented of sins and got encouragement from God and Jesus. They said het as sinners though they lived us, or liked us. God doesn't judge sinners, he gives them chances, but who really is good to say he's without fault or perfect? God is a Good and holy and upright. My question is can holy judgement or wrath get out of hand? God is good, sure. He loves us and gives us rewards. He beckons us, helps us, and inspires us as does Christ. We are to offer up sacrifices to God through Jesus. When I was struggling Jesus helped me. I felt hopless and received help from God and Jesus. God sends people to heaven, and hell sounds scary. What's around the corner? What does God have in store for us? What does the devil? I have won souls for God and his church and Jesus. Souls interested. Souls maybe wanting? Will good win or the devil? What do you believe? Jesus took the penalty for our sins and upon repentance of sins or fleshy desires we can be saved. There's light and dark.v It's like star wars. good wisdom and deeds are good too, it's good for the christian and sinner. It,s a good standing with heavenly ranks such as God or Jesus and so is sacrifice. Sometimes you should put others first. Or do what you can. I encourage the former. Putting others first when possible. Live happy with your children or kids and try to live your wife or husband. Respect each other when possible or circumstances arise. Have each other's back. Love your kids and live according to one of 2 nature's as best you can. Jesus would have it that way, so would God and the family.

 

[David kilmer]

Jesus is the go between orefiator between God and man. And if Earth, the planet is one million years old it could still have that much time left. It's a good place to live and all the convenience stores and game stores are cool. They make millions of dollars. It's fruitful and so are the lives if people who play them. Carnal isn't always lower, but spiritual is good too when needed. It's a good nature. Just don't judge pagans or the like too undoundly or because they smoke Mary Jane, just help them. Rewards can come forth.

 

[David kilmer]

Jesus said that all you need is faith the size of a mustard seed, and you will be able to move mountains. That may sound paradoxical but many teachings of Christ are paradoxical.

And Jesus said unto them, Because of your unbelief: for verily I say unto you, If ye have faith as a grain of mustard seed, ye shall say unto this mountain, Remove hence to yonder place; and it shall remove; and nothing shall be impossible unto you. (Mt 17:20)

The modern bible versions have distorted this teaching and say "Because of your little faith" instead of "because of your unbelief" (total lack of faith).

We need to be the fullness of the Christ body. We need to have good faith and do good works. We need to be a good representative of Christ and live according to the Bible, the gospels, and the ten commandments of God and commands of Jesus, Master Jc. Nobody is quite perfect but good likes us to try, so does Jesus, but we don't have to.

 

[marks]

I have heard God's voice many times...with many gifts and all these peculiar miraculous things following. My wonder is that more Christians don't also experience this kind of contact with the living God by the Spirit.

We need but ask...with a little faith. Is that too hard?

It isn't us that are special for all the divine happenings and works. It is He!

Indeed, why should we not think this is so! Why are be born again if not to be children of our Father?

Much love!