ONE Foundational Basis For All Biblical Good News!

[GRACE ambassador]

Previously:
1. Dispensation of Innocence = 'Good News' of God's Very Good Creation and man receiving

"responsibility for repleneshing, dominion, and care of the earth" = No Redemption needed...​

While I agree that this is good news, it doesn't seem to be what Jesus meant when He sent the apostles out to preach the gospel. (message)
I get no redemptive message from this. Though it may be foundational in some sense.

Precious friend, well spoken, and now we will see things Change Drastically?:

2. Dispensation of Conscience

• First, The 'Bad' News:

"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a​

tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her​

husband with her; and he did eat. And the eyes of them both were opened, and they knew that they​

were naked; and they sewed fig leaves together, and made themselves aprons." (Genesis 3:6-7 AV)​

Results of This disobedience to God's [ "In A Very Good Life" ] One Simple Command:

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for​

in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." (Genesis 2:17 AV)​

• first inkling of a Good News "Redemption [ for spiritual death? ] Message"?:

"And The LORD God Said unto the serpent,...​

​

...And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed​

and her Seed; It Shall Bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise His Heel."​

(Genesis 3:15 AV)​

Yes, Redemption IS now necessary, Thanks Be Unto God For His Provision. Amen?

Conclusion: Neither does this "seem to me" to be the Grace Gospel Given To Paul.

Precious friend, can we clearly/plainly see, and say without hesitation, that, in this inkling here,
there is 'only' one gospel of: "looking forward to Christ's DBR", as some have proposed to us?

Grace and Peace...

 

[St. SteVen]

Precious friend, can we clearly/plainly see, and say without hesitation, that, in this inkling here,
there is 'only' one gospel of: "looking forward to Christ's DBR", as some have proposed to us?

It seems to me that from our futuristic vantage point we can clearly see the unfolding plan.
Though it seems unlikely that those in the past were seeing what we see today.
(even though some biblical texts suggest such) ???
A&E were promised death if they ate thereof, but were not promised a redemption to come.
What God said about the seed of the woman and the serpent must have been a great mystery to them.
And probably no time to discuss it while they were being ushered out of the garden. (orchard)

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Previously:
2. Dispensation of conscience:

Were there New requirements for a 'sin-cursed life' after sinning and Banishment From
God's Wonderful Garden, to be Accepted By God?:

A&E were promised death if they ate thereof, but were not promised a redemption to come.
What God said about the seed of the woman and the serpent must have been a great mystery to them.

Was it what they { Apparently } explained / taught to their offspring "To be Accepted By God"?:

...Obedient Abel? faith + works?:

"And Abel, he also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof.
And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering" (Genesis 4:4)...
Disobedient Cain?:
..."And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto The LORD...But unto Cain and to his offering He had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell. And the LORD Said unto Cain,Why art thou wroth? and why is thy countenance fallen? If thou doest well,shalt thou not be accepted?" (Genesis 4:3-7) ...

God Required an 'offering' [ temporarily 'covering' sin? ] that we Now know was figuratively
a "type or shadow" Of the Reality of Future Redemption and Final Forgiveness Of sin?

Next, 3. Dispensation Of Human Government?:

Wait! Bad news?:

"And GOD Saw that the wickedness of man...The LORD said, I will destroy man"​

(Genesis 6:5-7)​

But, Good news to:

"Noah found grace in The Eyes of The LORD. (v 8) = New commandment to 'express' his faith?

​

...And God Said unto Noah...Make thee an ark of gopher wood..." (Genesis 6:13-14)...​

...with thee will I establish My covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark...​

...Thus did Noah; according to all that God commanded him, so did he.:​

(Genesis 6:18-22)​

+ Specific Requirement of "faith + works" By God?:

"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved with​

fear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemned​

the world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith."​

(Hebrews 11:7)​

Precious friend, 6 chapters into Genesis [ + Biblical Confirmation ], and the
first time we have seen this association, eh?

Some say we had better "obey All the Commandments Of God" in The Bible, yet they refuse
to acknowledge that they themSELVES have "obeyed and prepared an ark to the saving of their
household to become an 'heir of righteousness'"?

Perchance this is only figurative and to be correctly 'interpreted' as the one gospel of

"looking forward to Christ's DBR"??? Of course, I could be mistaken, eh?​

Grace And Peace...

 

[St. SteVen]

Previously:
2. Dispensation of conscience:

Were there New requirements for a 'sin-cursed life' after sinning and Banishment From
God's Wonderful Garden, to be Accepted By God?:

Good question. Here's my take.

The knowledge of good and evil that had been gained due to the Fall gave A&E and their descendants a conscience to judge by.
For instance, where was the instruction for Cain to not murder his brother Abel? He knew it was wrong, but how?
The law had not been given.

Romans 5:13-14 NIV
To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given,
but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.
14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses,
even over those who did not sin by breaking a command,
as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.

Was it what they { Apparently } explained / taught to their offspring "To be Accepted By God"?:

God Required an 'offering' [ temporarily 'covering' sin? ] that we Now know was figuratively
a "type or shadow" Of the Reality of Future Redemption and Final Forgiveness Of sin?

Another good question.
Based on what we see happening with their children, Cain and Abel were bringing offerings of their firstfruits to God.
I don't think this was a sin offering, but rather an offering of thanksgiving for God's abundance for them. (giving thanks)
Abel got it right, bringing fat portions of the firstborn of his flock. Cain brought "some" of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord.
Cain's offering was perhaps out of a felt obligation. A&E told him to do it? But Abel's offering was generous. He gave his best.
Abel's offering pleased God. Cain became jealous and hateful.

 

[St. SteVen]

"By faith Noah, being warned of God of things not seen as yet, moved withfear, prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by the which he condemnedthe world, and became heir of the righteousness which is by faith."(Hebrews 11:7)
Precious friend, 6 chapters into Genesis [ + Biblical Confirmation ], and the
first time we have seen this association, eh?

Some say we had better "obey All the Commandments Of God" in The Bible, yet they refuse
to acknowledge that they themSELVES have "obeyed and prepared an ark to the saving of their
household to become an 'heir of righteousness'"?

Perchance this is only figurative and to be correctly 'interpreted' as the one gospel of

"looking forward to Christ's DBR"??? Of course, I could be mistaken, eh?

Certainly the best metaphor so far in terms of a symbol of salvation.

 

[complete]

Thanks for your post.
A&E obviously had no knowledge of the redemptive plan of God.
They had fallen from grace and were thrust out of the garden.
Left to deal with thistles and thorns and the murder of their first born.
Seemed like a hopeless situation. Did they find hope in the words of God at the Fall?
Was there hope in a gospel?

'And unto Adam He said,
Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife,
and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee,
saying, Thou shalt not eat of it:
cursed is the ground for thy sake;
in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee;
and thou shalt eat the herb of the field;
In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread,
till thou return unto the ground;
for out of it wast thou taken:
for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.'
(Gen 3:17-19)

Hi @St. SteVen.

Yet that was done out of love, wasn't it? For mankind would need work for his mental and physical welfare: His spiritual welfare too. for God's strength would be needed in his weakness.

'For the earnest expectation of the creature waiteth
for the manifestation of the sons of God.
For the creature was made subject to vanity,
not willingly, but by reason of Him Who hath subjected the same in hope,
Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption
into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit,
even we ourselves groan within ourselves,
waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
For we are saved by hope: but hope that is seen is not hope:
for what a man seeth, why doth he yet hope for?
But if we hope for that we see not, then do we with patience wait for it.
(Rom 8:19-25)

Praise God! For His wisdom, His provision and His grace.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

Good question. Here's my take.

The knowledge of good and evil that had been gained due to the Fall gave A&E and their descendants a conscience to judge by.
For instance, where was the instruction for Cain to not murder his brother Abel? He knew it was wrong, but how?
The law had not been given.

Romans 5:13-14 NIV
To be sure, sin was in the world before the law was given,
but sin is not charged against anyone’s account where there is no law.
14 Nevertheless, death reigned from the time of Adam to the time of Moses,
even over those who did not sin by breaking a command,
as did Adam, who is a pattern of the one to come.


Another good question.
Based on what we see happening with their children, Cain and Abel were bringing offerings of their firstfruits to God.
I don't think this was a sin offering, but rather an offering of thanksgiving for God's abundance for them. (giving thanks)
Abel got it right, bringing fat portions of the firstborn of his flock. Cain brought "some" of the fruits of the soil as an offering to the Lord.
Cain's offering was perhaps out of a felt obligation. A&E told him to do it? But Abel's offering was generous. He gave his best.
Abel's offering pleased God. Cain became jealous and hateful.

'Know ye not,
that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey,
his servants ye are to whom ye obey;
whether of sin unto death,
or of obedience unto righteousness?
(Rom. 6:16)

Hello @St. SteVen,

The earth had been cursed, and Cain was coming to God his own way, bringing the fruits of that cursed ground, that he had grown, that he had tended, coming by way of his own works, his own righteousness. Not submitting to the will of God, not taking advantage of the sacrifice provided that would receive God's approval, which God said was at his door, submissive to Cain's will. But he would not.

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[St. SteVen]

Yet that was done out of love, wasn't it? For mankind would need work for his mental and physical welfare: His spiritual welfare too. for God's strength would be needed in his weakness.

We know very little about life for A&E after the Fall.
They were left with a mysterious death threat, exile from the garden, thistles and thorns, the murder of their son.
What was left of their relationship with God? Was daily fellowship gone?
Somehow, Cain and Abel were bringing offerings to God. And they were on speaking terms.
What did they learn from their parents? What hope did they have for the future?

 

[St. SteVen]

The earth had been cursed, and Cain was coming to God his own way, bringing the fruits of that cursed ground, that he had grown, that he had tended, coming by way of his own works, his own righteousness. Not submitting to the will of God, not taking advantage of the sacrifice provided that would receive God's approval, which God said was at his door, submissive to Cain's will. But he would not.

I suppose Cain felt that he was dealt a bad hand in life. The produce he brought from the cursed ground must have been hard won.
Perhaps he thought his offering was proportionate to the blessing. Why not keep the best for himself? He did the hard work.
Abel's attitude was a 180 from that. Fat portions from his firstfruits.

 

[complete]

Thanks for your post.
A&E obviously had no knowledge of the redemptive plan of God.
They had fallen from grace and were thrust out of the garden.
Left to deal with thistles and thorns and the murder of their first born.
Seemed like a hopeless situation. Did they find hope in the words of God at the Fall?
Was there hope in a gospel?

Hello @St. SteVen,

Yes I believe there was hope in the words of God at the Fall, shown in Adam's choice of name for Eve his wife, as 'the mother of all living.' (Gen. 3:20) He believed God! God proceeded to provide for them, in clothing them, ensuring their welfare, and His words to Satan ensured a posterity for Adam, and deliverance through one of his own, in the person of the One Who was to come - The Lord Jesus Christ The Deliverer, who would vanquish death: Now,risen and glorified and sat at God;s right hand, and we in Him.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

We know very little about life for A&E after the Fall.
They were left with a mysterious death threat, exile from the garden, thistles and thorns, the murder of their son.
What was left of their relationship with God? Was daily fellowship gone?
Somehow, Cain and Abel were bringing offerings to God. And they were on speaking terms.
What did they learn from their parents? What hope did they have for the future?

Hello again, @St. SteVen,

Access to the tree of life was now denied them, but their lives were saved, and they knew that they had a posterity, and a hope to come.
Access was not denied them, for we read of those of their offspring who walked with God, who were preachers of righteousness before the flood (Gen. 5:22, 24; & 6:9: 2Pet. 2:5).

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[St. SteVen]

Yes I believe there was hope in the words of God at the Fall, shown in Adam's choice of name for Eve his wife, as 'the mother of all living.' (Gen. 3:20) He believed God! God proceeded to provide for them, in clothing them, ensuring their welfare, and His words to Satan ensured a posterity for Adam, and deliverance through one of his own, in the person of the One Who was to come - The Lord Jesus Christ The Deliverer, who would vanquish death: Now,risen and glorified and sat at God;s right hand, and we in Him.

Except for Eve's name, which happened before the Fall, I see no indication in the narrative of a positive outlook for A&E.
They just messed up big time. Probably waiting for the other shoe to drop on the death threat?
They had nothing to compare the situation in the garden to, except the harshness of exile.
I don't think A&E understood their good fortune before the Fall. It was all they knew.

As I wrote earlier:

It seems to me that from our futuristic vantage point we can clearly see the unfolding plan.
Though it seems unlikely that those in the biblical past were seeing what we see today.
(even though some biblical texts suggest such) ???
A&E were promised death if they ate thereof, but were not promised a redemption to come.
What God said about the seed of the woman and the serpent must have been a great mystery to them.
And probably no time to discuss it while they were being ushered out of the garden. (orchard)

 

[St. SteVen]

Access to the tree of life was now denied them, but their lives were saved, and they knew that they had a posterity, and a hope to come.

You have a much more hopeful view of their situation than I do.
It was obvious to me that after one bite they had surrendered their minds to the enemy's shame-filled accusations.
At the end of Genesis chapter two they were naked and unashamed. After the Fall...
God asked Adam, "Who told you that you were naked?' Who indeed.

 

[complete]

Except for Eve's name, which happened before the Fall, I see no indication in the narrative of a positive outlook for A&E.
They just messed up big time. Probably waiting for the other shoe to drop on the death threat?
They had nothing to compare the situation in the garden to, except the harshness of exile.
I don't think A&E understood their good fortune before the Fall. It was all they knew.

As I wrote earlier:

It seems to me that from our futuristic vantage point we can clearly see the unfolding plan.
Though it seems unlikely that those in the biblical past were seeing what we see today.
(even though some biblical texts suggest such) ???
A&E were promised death if they ate thereof, but were not promised a redemption to come.
What God said about the seed of the woman and the serpent must have been a great mystery to them.
And probably no time to discuss it while they were being ushered out of the garden. (orchard)

'And Adam called his wife's name Eve;
because she was the mother of all living.'
(Gen 3:20 )

Hi @St. SteVen,

This is recorded as taking place after the fall. Yes, we are seeing these things retrospectively, with the advantage of knowing the outcome. and life must have been hard for Adam and Eve. The loss of their son Abel in such circumstances, must have hit them hard. Yet the word's spoken by God to them and to the Serpent did ensure a future, in order for it to come to fruition. Eve was beguiled, but Adam knew what he was doing, he chose to disobey God's known will, so brought what followed upon himself.

The promised Seed would come, God's will would and will be done, as He promised in Gen, 3:15. God's work of redemption would and will be fulfilled.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[complete]

You have a much more hopeful view of their situation than I do.
It was obvious to me that after one bite they had surrendered their minds to the enemy's shame-filled accusations.
At the end of Genesis chapter two they were naked and unashamed. After the Fall...
God asked Adam, "Who told you that you were naked?' Who indeed.

@St Steven

Their own eyes told Adam and Eve that they were naked: They now saw through eyes which had the knowledge of good and evil.

Chris

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Gospel = good news. What good news? That we do not have to die in our sins. That God has offered a way to salvation since before the foundation of the earth, a plan of redemption.
ONE GOSPEL: WE ARE SAVED BY GRACE GRACE THROUGH FAITH IN CHRIST!(Eph. 2:8-9)
"According to John MacArthur, people before Christ's death were saved by faith in God and His promised Messiah, just as New Testament believers are saved by faith alone in Jesus Christ; Old Testament saints trusted in God's coming atonement ( Christ's sacrifice - 1 Cor. 15-3-4), while New Testament believers trust in His finished work, with both being saved by God's grace through faith, not works."

 

[GRACE ambassador]

ONE Foundation For All Different Good News...

Previously found:

2... Conscience: Abel, By faith, "...brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof.
And The LORD Had Respect unto Abel and to his offering"...
3... Human Government: Noah, By faith, "prepared an ark to the saving of his house; by
the which he condemned the world, and became heir of the righteousness"...

Continuing:

4. Dispensation Of Promise?:

a) Abraham? "look forward to Christ's DBR"? OR?:

"After these things The Word Of The LORD Came unto Abram in a vision, Saying,​

​

Fear not, Abram: I AM thy Shield, and thy Exceeding Great Reward. And Abram said,​

Lord GOD, what wilt Thou Give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house​

is this Eliezer of Damascus?​

​

And Abram said, Behold, to me Thou Hast Given no seed: and, lo, one born in my​

house is mine heir. And, behold, The Word Of The LORD Came Unto him, Saying,​

​

This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be​

thine heir. And He Brought him forth abroad, and Said, Look now toward heaven, and tell​

the stars, if thou be able to number them: and He Said Unto him, So Shall thy seed be.​

And he believed in The LORD; and He Counted it to him For righteousness."​

(Genesis 15:1-6 AV)​

b) Abraham's wife? "look forward to Christ's DBR"? OR?:

"Through faith also Sara herself received strength to conceive seed, and was delivered of​

a child when she was past age, because she judged Him Faithful Who Had Promised."​

(Hebrews 11:11)​

Q: What happened to these all, who had faith? Did they "look forward to Christ's DBR" and

"confess Him As LORD"?:​

"These all died in faith, not having received the Promises, but having seen Them afar off,​

and were persuaded of Them, and embraced Them, and confessed that they were strangers​

and pilgrims on the earth." (Hebrews 11:13)​

Precious friend, @St. SteVen, by now I am as perplexed as you as to how [ in the world ] these
previous 'good news' From God, are "The Exact SAME one gospel" As: Christ's DB&R of Today?

Where, in Heaven's name is, The Biblical Evidence of the critics? I have found none, yet, but,
I will humbly keep going as a diligent student of God's Pure and Precious Word Of TRUTH!

Grace and Peace...

 

[St. SteVen]

'And Adam called his wife's name Eve;
because she was the mother of all living.'
(Gen 3:20 )

Hi @St. SteVen,

This is recorded as taking place after the fall.

Very good. Thanks for the correction.

Their own eyes told Adam and Eve that they were naked: They now saw through eyes which had the knowledge of good and evil.

If nakedness was evil after the Fall, why wasn't it evil before the Fall?

Remember, God asked Adam, "Who told you that you were naked?"

 

[St. SteVen]

4. Dispensation Of Promise?:

a) Abraham? "look forward to Christ's DBR"? OR?:

"After these things The Word Of The LORD Came unto Abram in a vision, Saying,

Whereas I saw salvation as a metaphor in the story of Noah,
I now see hope for the future in the promise given to Abraham.

Precious friend, @St. SteVen, by now I am as perplexed as you as to how [ in the world ] these
previous 'good news' From God, are "The Exact SAME one gospel" As: Christ's DB&R of Today?

Yes. We can certainly see the connections from our end of history,
but I see no way that they could have understood these things in total.

Even clear prophesy of a coming Messiah came much later in the story.
(what God said to the serpent was much too cryptic to understand) IMHO
The story of grace unfolds slowly. A mystery playing out over time.

 

[complete]

Very good. Thanks for the correction.

If nakedness was evil after the Fall, why wasn't it evil before the Fall?
Remember, God asked Adam, "Who told you that you were naked?"

Hello @St. SteVen.

Because they were in a state of innocence prior to eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. Knowledge brought with it responsibility.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris