Proof of the Trinity. No takers?
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Think about those scriptures longer. Sometimes the revelation doesn't come in just a moment of time.
Again: I did. My answer did not support the "substance" claims. And it's not like I can imagine I got a different answer.
ONE God in three persons-- yes I can embrace that and do fullheartedly. But thorough study and prayer leads me to the conclusion that they are are ONE through unity, and not through "substance" that I find no where in the Bible.
On which point in particular? (Asking so I can address that particularly point in depth, if the answer is the whole thing I can do that too.)
Why is this?
Jesus in response to a question gave only two commandments as being the greatest and neither one of them mentions a need to understand that God has a triune nature:
"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets." Matt 22:37-40
Father, Son and Holy Spirit are clearly mentioned over and over in many New Testament passages (Matt. 28, John 13 thru 17, John's First Epistle, Romans 8, etc.).
But does the Bible teach that believing in the traditional concept of the Trinity is essential to salvation? I can see where it might be concerning the concept of the Deity of Christ; but nowhere do I see condemnation concerning the Oneness concept of the Trinity. In fact, they have more of a claim to salvation than most Trinitarians because of Acts 2:38.
Acts 2.38 does not teach that one becomes baptised in order to become saved, or in order to receive forgiveness. It refers to doing so on account of the fact that through faith one's sin's are forgiven. Salvation is a work of Father, Son and Holy Spirit, all in concert: the middle chapters of John's Gospel, Romans 8, etc. show this clearly.
Someone in the good of this glorious salvation demonstrated Scripturally to be the working of Father, Son and Holy Spirit likely does not want to deny the deity of any of the Divine Persons.
My question was not whether or not they are mentioned. Seemingly they are mentioned in scripture but so are many other things which are attributed to the nature of God. Why should anyone presume that the One God is a trinity instead of simply one God with many ways [certainly more than three] of manifesting Himself?
Remembering that we are to live for God by faith rather than by knowledge, why should anyone presume knowledge about something that cannot be proven and then insist that others believe the same thing?
While I believe that a person can receive the Holy Spirit through merely asking (though seeking and knocking is surely an element...Luke 11:9-13), I believe that the Holy Ghost is absolutely promised to those who receive baptism in Jesus' name. And it is for the remission of sins, after repentance has been established.
Also, in Romans 8:30, it is said that basically He justifies and glorifies those whom He has called. And this has a powerful bearing on the subject of whether baptism in Jesus' name is optional or necessary.
No, no reason to argue, but people often do. I simply stand usually on the other side. That side is certainly also scriptural.
I strongly disagree with you. Romans 8 says, If any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of His. When we were born again, this was spiritual, not physical. And it's the blood of Christ by faith through the eternal Spirit (Hebrews 9) that purges sins, not the baptismal tank.
No they do not show any such thing. Just as you are not your father, neither is your father you, Jesus is the "only begotten" (uniquely begotten) Son of God, as well as God the Word.
For me, "substance" doesn't come into play because... frankly I just don't find it in the Bible.
Unity comes into play because it's all over the Bible-- God constantly commanding peoples to be one. It's especially highlighted during the Intercessory Prayer, when Christ prays that His follows be one, even as He and the Father are one (see John 17).
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