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Really worth a look vatican again

Discussion in 'Ethics & Morality Forum' started by Ally.s.j, Dec 29, 2017.

  1. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    It's pointless defending against stupidity. The guy in the video is wrong but you like what he says because it meets some sick need.
    Everything the Church does and teaches is a matter of public record. There are no conspiracies. If you believe the Church is conspiring against you then you need a psychiatrist, not a computer.


     
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  2. Ally.s.j

    Ally.s.j Active Member

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    Who said the church was conspiring against me? Thats in your head not mine.
     
  3. Ally.s.j

    Ally.s.j Active Member

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    So is pedeophila it seems as it all coming out in Austialia just now and many cases world wide
     
  4. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    Cardinal Pell has been framed.
    I have lots of links on the framing of Cardinal Pell and the sex scandals but first you give me the name of your church. Failing to do that I will have to make general references to all of Protestantism and you can take accountability for them.
    Is there a point to this thread? Or do you just hate a church of your imagination because she is older and bigger than yours?

    Pontifical Commission for the Protection of Minors
    Profile

    Since sex scandals have become worse in number in your church, has it formed a similar commission?
     
  5. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    There are at least 3 reasons why Ally.s.j refuses to name his church. He is either ashamed of what I will dig up, he has no church, or is totally unaware of what the Church has done since the scandals broke out 40 60 years ago. But he will continue to use the sex scandal bat to beat Catholics with because he is very much part of a culture that wants to keep the stake fires burning.

    004% OF CLERGY GUILTY OF ABUSE
    Bill Donohue comments on the 2016 Annual Report on clergy sexual abuse in the Catholic Church:

    The latest audit of the Catholic clergy involved in the sexual abuse of minors shows that there were two new substantiated cases made during the period of July 1, 2015 through June 30, 2016 against 52,238 priests and deacons. That comes to .004 percent of the clergy.

    Though the report does not mention it, we know of no other institution in the United States, secular or religious, which has a better record than the Catholic Church today when it comes to the sexual abuse of minors by adult employees.

    There was a total of twenty-five new allegations made by minors during this one-year time period. Of that number, two were substantiated; eight were still being investigated; eleven were unsubstantiated or unable to be proven; two were referred to a religious order; one was referred to a diocese; and one investigation had to be postponed.

    Overall, a total of 728 allegations were made in the year of the study, almost all from previous years. Most of the alleged offenders—80 percent of them—are either dead, already removed from ministry, or missing.

    As always, almost 8 in 10 of the victims were male (78%), and the vast majority (85%) were postpubescent.

    This report, as well as all previous reports, fails to draw the obvious conclusion: The sex abuse scandal in the Catholic Church has been driven largely by homosexuals (though over the past year thirteen of the alleged new victims were male, and twelve were female). The reasons for not facing up to this fact cannot be justified on the basis of science.

    The report mentions that sixteen priests or deacons were returned to ministry over the year the audit was conducted. We need to know more about them.
    Were there sixteen different lawyers who sued them, or did a few lawyers do most of the suing?
    What happened, if anything, to the accusers? Are some of them recidivists, accusers from previous years? Most important, how are these maligned priests doing now that they have been returned to ministry?

    These questions are never asked, never mind answered. True victims of sexual abuse deserve our compassion and aid, but so do priests and deacons who have had their reputations damaged, if not ruined, by false claims.

    .004% OF CLERGY GUILTY OF ABUSE
     
  6. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    No, the way you misrepresent everything is unfit for a pig sty.

    The the sick, twisted distorted demonization of the Catholic Church is not of God either. We see that in your perverted videos.
    [​IMG]Is this what you really hate? Do you hate the Protestants who come to our many centers to help as well?
    You should be ashamed of yourself for posting such garbage. What did we ever do to you???
    Would you like to have a discussion or a meaningless rock throwing contest??? You must be from the south.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
  7. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    “Vatican’s U.N. ambassador in Geneva, Archbishop Silvano Tomasi, revealed the figures during a second day of grilling by a U.N. committee monitoring implementation of the U.N. treaty against torture. Tomasi insisted the convention applied only inside the tiny Vatican City state. But he nevertheless released statistics about how the Holy See has adjudicated sex abuse cases globally, and significantly, he didn’t dispute the committee’s contention that sexual violence against children can be considered torture. Tomasi said that since 2004, more than 3,400 credible cases of abuse had been referred to the Vatican, including 401 cases in 2013 alone. He said that over the last decade, 848 priests had been defrocked, or returned to the lay state by the pope. Another 2,572 were sentenced to a lifetime of penance and prayer or some other lesser sanction, which is often used when the accused priest is elderly or infirm. Acknowledging the high number of priests sanctioned with the lesser punishment, Tomasi said it still amounted to disciplinary action and that the abuser is “just put in a place where he doesn’t have any contact with the children.” The Associated Press in January reported that then-Pope Benedict XVI had defrocked 384 priests in the final two years of his pontificate.”
     
  8. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Sorry Kepha - Bill Donahue is about as credible as Phil Donahue
     
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  9. Ally.s.j

    Ally.s.j Active Member

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    Why have you twisted anything I said ?
     
  10. pastor marty

    pastor marty Active Member

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    whoops/miskey !
     
  11. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    I notice you give no examples and offer no evidence. I also notice you give no sources. Did you write it up yourself?
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
  12. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    There are at least 3 reasons why Ally.s.j refuses to name his church. Can anybody think of one?
    You complain with the media the extent of abuse and when the Church does something about it, you complain even more. Your article is dated May, 2014. You need to go back to the 2010 stats for fresher dirt.
     
  13. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    Vatican Sets Record Straight on Sexual Abuse
    • ARCHBISHOP SILVANO TOMASI
    The following facts were presented to the United Nations Human Rights Council on Sept. 22, 2009 by Archbishop Silvano Tomasi, the Holy See's permanent observer to the United Nations in Geneva.

    Mr. President,

    Let me clarify the issue raised by the International Humanist and Ethical Union in its intervention.

    While many speak of child abuse, i.e. pedophilia, it would be more correct to speak of ephebophilia, being a homosexual attraction to adolescent males. Of all priests involved in the abuses, 80% to 90% belong to this sexual orientation minority which is sexually engaged with adolescent boys between the age of 11 and 17 years old.

    From available research we now know that in the last 50 years somewhere between 1.5% and 5% of the Catholic clergy has been involved in sexual abuse cases. The Christian Science Monitor reported on the results of a national survey by Christian Ministry Resources in 2002 and concluded:
    "Despite headlines focusing on the priest pedophile problem in the Roman Catholic Church, most American churches being hit with child sexual-abuse allegations are Protestant".

    1 Sexual abuses within the Jewish communities approximate that found among the Protestant clergy.2

    About 85% of the offenders of child sexual abuse are family members, babysitters, neighbors, family friends or relatives. About one in six child molesters are other children, while most of the offenders are male3.

    According to a major 2004 study commissioned by the U.S. Department of Education, nearly 10% of U.S. public school students have been targeted with unwanted sexual attention by school employees. The author of the study concluded that the scope of the school-sex problem appears to far exceed the clergy abuse scandal in the Roman Catholic Church and concluded in an interview with Education Week "the physical abuse of students in schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests".4

    The Church is very conscious of the seriousness of the problem. The Code of Canon Law stipulates that priests involved in sexual abuse cases must be "punished with just punishments, not excluding expulsion from clerical state"5. The American Bishops Conference issued in 2002 "essential norms for diocesan/eparchial policies dealing with allegations of sexual abuse of minors by priests or deacons". The guidelines mention among others that "in case of sufficient evidence the bishop will withdraw the accused from exercising the ministry, impose or prohibit residence in a given place or territory ... pending the outcome of the process." Other national bishops' conferences have taken similar measures.
    As the Catholic Church has been busy cleaning its own house, it would be good if other institutions and authorities, where the major part of abuses are reported, could do the same and inform the media about it.

    Vatican Sets Record Straight on Sexual Abuse
     
  14. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    BBC, CATHOLIC CHURCH, AND SEXUAL ABUSE
    Bill Donohue has written an in-depth analysis of sexual abuse at the BBC, and the BBC’s coverage of sexual abuse in the Catholic Church. He explains the similarities and dissimilarities, focusing on why the scandals occurred and how the top brass in each institution reacted. He concludes that while the BBC got off easy in a recent report on its problems, its coverage of the Church’s problems was patently unfair. To read his article, click here.

    Donohue holds a Ph.D. in sociology from New York University and is the author of several books on civil liberties, social issues, and Catholicism. aspen thinks Bill Donahue is about as credible as Phil Donahue. ha ha ha.
     
  15. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    I am Catholic Kepha, but I am not tribal. I can critique my own church. Membership in the Catholic Church is not about being a fan - it is about living out the gospel and when it is not being lived out by leadership, not whitewashing it. I am hardly alone; I am standing on the shoulders of giants - Hildegard of Bingen and St. Teresa of Avila come to mind and.....

    “Catherine of Siena wasn’t afraid to confront anyone, even the pope.

    She traveled to Avignon, France, where Pope Gregory XI was residing and spent three months trying to convince him to return to Rome. Going against his closest advisors, Gregory eventually did go back to Rome and returned the papacy to the Eternal City.”
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2018
  16. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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  17. kepha31

    kepha31 Well-Known Member

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    What Commonwealth Magazine says about Donahue doesn't concern me. The Catholic League prints good articles in opposition to the tidal wave of media hype on sex abuse scandals. I use them extensively. I've never denied corruption in the clergy, and standing against lapsed leadership is admirable, but in an anti-Catholic forum? Who are you trying to impress?
     
  18. aspen

    aspen “"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few

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    Perhaps impressing people is important to you? You asked for an article on Donahue, i provided it and you, to no one’s surprise, dismissed it. If this was an anticatholic board, you would not be allowed to apologize for Catholicism here.
     
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2018
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  19. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    Ummm. I don't see a snake. I stoped following this thread closely. So I am not sure what I am looking at or qhat I am supposed to see.

    But I don't see a snake.
     
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  20. FHII

    FHII Well-Known Member

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    That is totally unacceptable. Really? Aounds like a new modern day inquisition to me.
     
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