I didn't change my story, you changed it and then tried to knock down the strawman you invented out of whole cloth.
This might help.
This might help.
Salvation really?
- Thread starter Sabitarian
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Grace + anything else is salvation by works. Period. Either its by grace, or its not.
Love in Christ,
Mark
Love in Christ,
Mark
No, the Holy Spirit is the imputus through us to do good works. Salvation is the porpitiation of sin.
I would rather say that salvation is receiving God's reconciliation by faith in Jesus Christ, and as we receive Jesus as our rightful Master, God gives us re-birth, as His children.
Having therefore a new nature, we act according to our nature, doing those things that agree with God's will and purpose.
Love in Christ,
Mark
marksman
My eldest granddaughter showing the result of her
Better stop drinking milk then. That is produced by cows eating grass which has all sorts of dirty stuff on it.
Romans 14
14 As one who is in the Lord Jesus, I am fully convinced that no food is unclean in itself. But if anyone regards something as unclean, then for him it is unclean. 15 If your brother is distressed because of what you eat, you are no longer acting in love. Do not by your eating destroy your brother for whom Christ died. 16 Do not allow what you consider good to be spoken of as evil. 17 For the kingdom of God is not a matter of eating and drinking, but of righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit,18 because anyone who serves Christ in this way is pleasing to God and approved by men.
Blessings!!!
Propitiation (sorry for the mispelling). Salvation is a one time, instantaneous event. Grace is the unmerited favor of God upon the sinner. That is, we don't earn salvation, nor do we put ourselves into a position to receive salvation. Salvation is a monergistic work of the Godhead upon the sinner, independant of the sinner's desires, wishes, or even permission.
You are talking about the beginning of a race as if it were the end. We are saved away from the world and sin so as to run for God and attain to Christ. Salvation in it's eternal state must be walked through to the end of the race...after which we will be judged on HOW we ran....that is if we continue to the end.
We are saved for the works prepared in advance. Those who sit idly by after having received grace are like the unjust steward who is rejected. We are saved in order to do good works in this world. We are to be salt and light in the midst of darkness. This rewquires an active participation of those who have been empowered with light.
What is actually required is our participation in God's redemptive plan for mankind.
Amen...so very well said.
I think you're talking about sanctification. Salvation is an instantaneous event, the moment we receive Christ's righteousness and He takes our sin. From that moment on we are seen as clean by God. But sanctification is something that takes a lifetime. Sanctification is a progressive work of God and man that makes us more and more free from sin and like Christ in our actual lives. It's walking in our faith and striving every day by the power of the Holy Spirit to put sin to death and to live for and like Jesus.
sanctification is not optional. Without holiness no one shall see God. Sanctification is the process that redemption started. A cake must be baked..but without sanctification we are only half-baked. ;)
Salvation is a process that must be maintained in order to be lawful.
Yes, sanctification begins at redemption, but salvation is not a "process for us to maintain". The problem with that idea is the New Testament. Scripture is very clear that salvation is a free gift...that is has nothing to do with us at all...it is won and given to us by Christ, a process won in an instant in time (the cross) and received in another instant in time (regeneration). The proof of that regeneration is the process that follows...sanctification. Some people put up their hands and say they're Christians, but they don't grow, don't even try, and use their 'freedom' as license to sin. They have not been truly born again.
Sanctification is man working in cooperation with God as he puts sin to death every day and walks closer to God. Salvation is God acting alone save us. biggandyys illustration is correct. The thing with salvation/sanctification is that if salvation relied on our walk, we would fail. Salvation comes only from perfection...which we have in Christ. So it is just as well that redemption comes to us in the form of a free gift already won! Sanctification, because it is a lifelong process in which God helps us get up again and again and again and walk forwards after every stumble...it is not only something we can do, but are required to do.
Here's a couple of scriptures to consider.
And I am certain that God, who began the good work within you, will continue his work until it is finally finished on the day when Christ Jesus returns.
Phil 1:6 (NLT)
We do this by keeping our eyes on Jesus, the champion who initiates and perfects our faith. Because of the joy awaiting him, he endured the cross, disregarding its shame. Now he is seated in the place of honor beside God’s throne.
Heb 12:2 (NLT)
And I am certain that God, who began the good work within you, will continue his work until it is finally finished on the day when Christ Jesus returns.
Phil 1:6 (NLT)
We do this by keeping our eyes on Jesus, the champion who initiates and perfects our faith. Because of the joy awaiting him, he endured the cross, disregarding its shame. Now he is seated in the place of honor beside God’s throne.
Heb 12:2 (NLT)
Very good post Rach...
Sanctification means everyday we have to make a decision as to whether
we want to be obedient to God, or do we want to do it our way. If we do
it our way we will not be obedient to God, but we will become rebellious
and begin to justify our actions. Do we lose our salvation @ that point?
That's the big question.
The answer is NO. Why? Because your sanctification has nothing to do with
your justification. Justification is a one time experience and God will not take
away His Gifts.
What will rejecting santification do for you? It will disqualify you to be an over-
comer and you will have to await the general resurrection (2nd resurrection).
You will be saved from the Lake of Fire, but you will have to learn obedience
@ a later time. God will not use you in the next age because you rejected His
discipline (Sanctification) in this age.
In essence, it's called giving up your birthright just as Easu gave up his right
to rule for a bowl of soup. When we become children of God, as Rach said, we
are responsible for our daily actions until the end of our lives. We go from glory
to glory by our everyday decisions and allow the Holy Spirit to guide ours ways
so we can run this race and finish it as an Overcomer.
All of us should understand that the race we are running is to qualify us for the
big prize. Jesus will give us immortality (the big prize), when he comes a second
time and he will give us life and give life more abundantly as he gathers the Sons
of God in the near future.
So the purpose of santification is to learn obedience, and in turn you become
meat for the Masters use, to feed the ones that are hungry for the Word of God.
God is @ the brink of changing the way the world runs it's business. He is calling
out a remnant and another questions to ask is do you want to be part of that
remnant? Zech. 8:12 says,
12 For the seed shall be prosperous; the vine shall
give her fruit, and the ground shall give her increase,
and the heavens shall give their dew; and I will cause
the remnant of this people to possess all things.
That's why we want to be santified. Do you want to possess all things? If so,
let's all learn obedience through santification.
What a God! What a Plan!
Logabe
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