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Featured Salvation the free gift

Discussion in 'Christian Theology Forum' started by Christophany, Nov 16, 2020.

  1. Blood Bought 1953

    Blood Bought 1953 Well-Known Member

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    OSAS is false doctrine. It also comforts those who are not obeying the Lord, whether fully or slightly. Truth is, you can't keep on living in a cesspool of sin and expect eternal life.

    I believe that Jesus is not a Liar.....if OSAS is not true , Jesus “ IS” a Liar. John5:24 says that if I Believe in Him , I already have Eternal Life and shall NEVER come under Condemnation.
    Knowing that to be True makes me want to sin less— not more. Knowing that gives me no “ comfort” - it makes Sinning equal to sticking one’s Hand in a fire.....who would want to exist in a “ cesspool” Of constantly doing things they don’t “ want” to do
    The biggest “ cesspool” in Life would be Living an Existence where one does not take God at His Word when He sticks His neck way out there and says” Anybody that asks to be Saved WILL be Saved” .... Everybody sins....God’s got that covered —- not everybody refuses to Trust Him and His Word —- there’s your “ cesspool” that will take you to Hell.....
    The world’s biggest sinner with enough Faith in Jesus and Jesus ALONE to Save Him, has a better chance of getting Saved than a self-righteous man who doubts God's Word.......I’ll repeat it “ If you Believe In Me you already have Eternal Life and shall never come under Condemnation” Do you take Jesus at His Word ( Faith That Saves ) or is Jesus a Liar ?
     
  2. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    If it doesn't matter whether the believer continues in sin (i.e. they continue to be saved in the midst of willfully sinning against the Lord) then what is the point of "restoring" them?

    What are they being restored from and to?
     
  3. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    "Lucky Repentance" is a biblical doctrine (1 Corinthians 15:37, Matthew 13:30). (see also scriptures that I have referenced below).

    It is you who preach a false gospel because your gospel is devoid of the need to repent. You would condemn John the Baptist as a false teacher. And Jesus Himself too; for He spoke of the need to repent.

    That is false teaching...not in the literal rendering of what you are saying...that is accurate...but in the spirit of what is behind your statement.

    Read Matthew 7:23, Matthew 13:41-42, and Luke 13:1-5...

    And you will see that a change of direction away from sin and towards righteousness is a major aspect of biblical faith.

    Read also, and compare, 1 John 5:1 w/ 1 John 3:9.

    However it is true that both of these are not yet saved.

    And i think that Jesus spoke so well to the problem of self-righteousness that it is very likely that a self-righteous person might come to realize that he is a sinner in that his self-righteousness is a sin and then come to repentance and faith in the Lord Jesus Christ and what He did for him on the Cross.

    I know that I don't put my trust in my ability to keep the law for my salvation.
     
  4. Ziggy

    Ziggy Well-Known Member

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    You can be talked out of eternal life.

    Understand that once you believe in God Almighty creator of Heaven and Earth. PERIOD.
    This IS knowing Eternal Life... God IS Life Eternal. If you don't KNOW Him, You Don't know Eternal Life.
    Once you accept God as your Saviour and turn from your NOT KNOWING, to KNOWING...
    This is when you RECEIVE Eternal Life. Eternal Life IS the Spirit of God. It is the Knowing of God.
    Once you KNOW God, and BELIEVE that God IS your God, Then you want to do things God's way.
    You want to KNOW His Word. You want to KNOW His Truth and you want to KNOW his ways.
    Jesus Is the Word, the Truth, and the Way to KNOWING and Learning of God. JESUS IS THE DOOR.
    This IS Life Eternal. To KNOW THEE and THY SON Jesus.

    Now as time goes by you put God on the shelf, you go about your daily life, you fall back into your own ways..
    You are slipping into dangerous territory.
    If you can be pursuaded to believe in Evolution or Science or another Religion that makes you disclaim God.

    Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

    (I used to believe in God but I know better now. This big bang and evolution makes more sense. Besides I don't get ridiculed for having a "crutch" like those other crazy bible believing fanatics.)

    You just broke that relationship with eternal life... you are twice dead.. once before you knew God and after when you chose to not know him anymore.

    Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
    Heb 6:7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
    Heb 6:8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

    During the transition from KNOWING to NOT knowing, God will throw everything in the book at you to get you to return to Him.
    He will put obstacles at every turn, your life will become difficult. Things will happen that will make you want to come back.
    But if you persist in your stubborness of not knowing and not believing, and not walking with Him.
    You plucked yourself out of God's hands.
    This IS the second death, of which there is NO return after you die in this world.

    Mar 12:29 And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:
    Mar 12:30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.
    Mar 12:31 And the second is like, namely this, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. There is none other commandment greater than these.

    If you DO NOT have these two.... you are GODLESS. You don't have God and He don't have you.

    Jde 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
    Jde 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.


    Knowing and believing is the beginning... Your new life has only just begun.
    Get ready for the journey of a lifetime.

    1Jo 4:2 Hereby know ye the Spirit of God: Every spirit that confesseth that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is of God:

    (YE MUST BE BORN AGAIN... IS KNOWING.. and BELIEVING..and DOING... HEART/MIND/SOUL ..is IN YOU)

    1Jo 4:3 And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world.

    (NOT KNOWING...NOT BELIEVING...NOT FOLLOWING.. No Desire/No thoughts/No fruit ... IS IN YOU, IS NOT OF GOD)

    1Jo 4:4 Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world.

    Greater is He IN your HEART and IN your MIND and In your Soul, than he that is in an UNKNOWING world.

    1Jo 4:5 They are of the world: therefore speak they of the world, and the world heareth them.

    The Ignorant of God, Speak in ignorance, and Ignorance hears them. Ignorance = The UNKNOWING

    1Jo 4:6 We are of God: he that knoweth God heareth us; he that is not of God heareth not us. Hereby know we the spirit of truth, and the spirit of error.

    Jhn 17:3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

    AMEN
     
  5. mailmandan

    mailmandan Well-Known Member

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    That's called "type 2 works salvation" and it's a false gospel. From beginning "have been saved through faith" (Ephesians 2:8) to end "receiving the end of your faith--the salvation of your souls" (1 Peter 1:9) salvation is by faith and is not by works. (Romans 3:24-28; 4:2-6; 5:1; Ephesians 2:8,9; Philippians 3:9; Titus 3:5; 2 Timothy 1:9 etc..).
     
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  6. Christophany

    Christophany Well-Known Member

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  7. Blood Bought 1953

    Blood Bought 1953 Well-Known Member

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    Read about the guy sleeping with his father’s wife.....he was chastised.....kicked out of the church....he had been “ turned over to Satan” for punishment and his conscience had been buffeted to the point that he abandoned his Sin and then the church welcomed him back with open arms.....THAT is what “ restoration” looks like....
     
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  8. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    I didn't ask you what restoration looks like...

    I asked you what is the point of restoring a person to living a holy life if turning away from sin is of no consequence to our salvation?

    What is the person restored from and what is he restored to?

    Is it not that he is restored from living unholy and restored to living a holy life in Christ?

    If not that, then what?

    If someone fell away from faith in Christ, they cannot be brought back to repentance, Hebrews 6:1-8.

    And therefore, restoration is not from unbelief concerning Christ.

    It has to do with the life that you are living as a Christian.

    Restoration is from a state of backsliding.
     
  9. MattMooradian

    MattMooradian Well-Known Member

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    Why do we continue to argue the milk instead of advancing to the meat? Works do not save anyone. Salvation is by faith alone. If we sin deliberately over and over, we sear the Holy Spirit and are shown to be not of the "chosen". Weather we were saved and lost our salvation, or we were never saved and lost nothing is not an edifying discussion. We can all agree, I hope, that works (although they do not save us) are extremely important for our future in Heaven. If we ignore doing good works, then we are hindering our own spiritual growth in Christ and we are failing to 'lay up treasures in Heaven.
     
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  10. Christophany

    Christophany Well-Known Member

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    Agreed see Ephesians 2:8-10 you are preaching to the choir Matt.
     
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  11. Blood Bought 1953

    Blood Bought 1953 Well-Known Member

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    You quote from Ezekiel? Really? A great Prophet, for sure, but he taught from the Law in the Age Of The Law......you ever here of a thing called “ the Cross?” .....it changed everything.
    We NOW live in the Age Of Grace.....why not quote From a Bible Character That preaches the Grace of God ......we are not under the Law.....God “ Found fault” with it and Paul said it was “ weak and useless”.......Ezekiel and the other Prophets were great men of God - “ they served their generation well” —
    In this Age Of Grace , we certainly do not ignore what the Old Testament Prophets taught....but their teachings contain no “ Gospel” .....no Resurrection.....no Grace.God Never said to follow Ezekiel for our Doctrine in this present Age of Grace—— God said it “ follow Paul as Paul followed Christ”
    Nothing wrong with Ezekiel, but if one is to quote verses of Scripture to make a case or show a proper way of doing things, doesn’t it make more since to quote from the New Testament? Something pertinent for Today's Believers ?
     
  12. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Paul wrote this:

    2Ti 3:16, All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
    2Ti 3:17, That the man of God may be perfect, throughly furnished unto all good works.
     
  13. Blood Bought 1953

    Blood Bought 1953 Well-Known Member

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    The ultimate “ meat” is Resting in the Finished Work Of The Cross.....Allowing God to bless you with Assurance Of Salvation and the True Joy and Obedience that follows that knowledge.....” Nothing But The Blood” is the “ MEAT”...... try preaching that here and the “ milk drinkers” will show up like magic...that is why we are stuck spinning our wheels with “ weak brothers” ( often, not even brothers)..... we have to endure weak Believers, but we don’t have to let them run the church...too many weak people here want to run things and in the process, ruin Newbies to the Faith, most of whom have been poorly taught...
    Leaven has to be stamped out as soon as it rears it’s ugly, Damnable head.....it ruined many of Paul’s churches....I’d hate to see it ruin this place .....when the Leaven stops arriving, maybe THEN we could move on to the “ meat”.....
     
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  14. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    I find more and more that preaching the truth is not going to get me acclaim or prestige or a good name...but rather the hatred of people who do not want to accept the truth.

    My spidey sense tells me that you are trying to refer to me...

    This is your wishful thinking, I would be willing to gather.

    You should really consider that your judging the salvation of others may be indicative of the fact that the Lord has already judged you to be without salvation in Christ (see Luke 6:41-42).
     
  15. Christophany

    Christophany Well-Known Member

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    ahh the self absorbed has struck again............
     
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  16. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    Jesus said,

    Jhn 15:17, These things I command you, that ye love one another.
    Jhn 15:18, If the world hate you, ye know that it hated me before it hated you.
    Jhn 15:19, If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you.
    Jhn 15:20, Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
    Jhn 15:21, But all these things will they do unto you for my name's sake, because they know not him that sent me.

    And the apostle John said this under the inspiration of the Holy Ghost:

    1Jo 3:13, Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
    1Jo 3:14, We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
    1Jo 3:15, Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
    1Jo 3:16, Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

     
  17. Blood Bought 1953

    Blood Bought 1953 Well-Known Member

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    I am not judging you......God's Word is.....All Those that Preach a Perverted Gospel ( such as “ Lucky Repentance” ) as you have even admitted to , is “ ACCURSED.” ............That literally means “ God Damned !” If the shoe fits....wear it!
    Does Paul’s Gospel , given to him personally by Jesus , say ANYTHING about having to remember and repent of all your sins before you die , lest you be damned! Of course not ! I have asked you before, and now I will ask you again.....how is what you preach NOT a False , Perverted “ Gospel” That Paul warns about? An on-looking World awaits your answer..... you got one ?
     
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  18. Christophany

    Christophany Well-Known Member

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    Yes its the Matthew 18 principle in action where 2 or 3 witnesses are gathered together(in agreement) in Christs name He is with them in the disciplinary actions taken to cause the offender to come to repentance.
     
  19. theefaith

    theefaith Well-Known Member

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    And baptism

    Context of Jn 3:5 “born again”

    John1:26 John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not; (John prepared the way by baptism)

    John 2:6 And there were set there six waterpots of stone, after the manner of the purifying of the Jews, containing two or three firkins apiece. (Old covenant prefiguring of baptism, purification from sin)(His disciples believed because the ever Virgin mother of God interceded Jn 2:11)

    John3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. (Baptism)

    John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized. 23 And John also was baptizing in Aenon near to Salim, because there was much water there: and they came, and were baptized.(Baptism)

    John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John.

    Born again means Baptism!

    —————

    Becoming a Disciple by baptism!

    Matt 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

    John 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

    John 3:22 After these things came Jesus and his disciples into the land of Judaea; and there he tarried with them, and baptized.

    John 4:4 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John,

    Act 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Acts 8:36 And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?

    37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

    Acts 22:16 And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

    Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

    Romans 6:3
    Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

    1 Corinthians 12:13
    For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

    Galatians 3:27
    For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

    Colossians 2:12
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

    2 Corinthians 5:17
    Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.
    (Born again by baptism)

    Titus 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Spirit.

    1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

    21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
    (Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
    (Outside the ark none were saved, outside the church none are saved)
     
  20. justbyfaith

    justbyfaith Well-Known Member

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    It was Paul who said that all scripture is inspired of the lord and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, and for instruction in righteousness...

    So then, the following is profitable for doctrine...

    And also, the "Lucky" aspect of repentance is most assuredly spoken of in 1 Corinthians 15:37, Matthew 13:30...

    So, I'm sorry to tell you, your contention that lucky repentance is a false doctrine places certain scripture as teaching false doctrine...

    And I will rather believe that the scripture is teaching sound doctrine and that what you are teaching is false...because I would rather believe God than man.
     
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