Speaking the Truth in Love

[Wynona]

Lol!
Greetings.

I speak a couple of languages, Afrikaans my mother tongue.
Only learned about boerewors? What about the pap and vleis? Delicious.

I am in Durban, so here the food is SPICY, think anything spicy, food wise, we have it.
Correct re the 11 official lingo's Wynona.

At the moment a heatwave upon heatwave here, other than that, all good.

Shalom to you and family
Johann

Yeah I just learned about the boerewors yesterday. Have never heard of pap or vleis. I will google it! I enjoy spicy food.

 

[Wynona]

@Johann Pap reminds me of grits!! Pap en vleis looks delicious!!

 

[Nancy]

I agree, prayer is essential in everything, and certainly in this! The Bible warns us about "feigned love". Using claims of "speaking the truth in love" as a cover for our own bad behavior.

To me there seems to be a real lack of understanding by a lot of people about what love really is. I think the same pride/envy/anger that drives people to just dump their poor opinions of others on them is what then drives them to claim "speaking truth in love".

Personally, I find I need to be in constant prayer over what I write, and what I say. Speaking untruth, and speaking not in love, is a sure indicator one is not walking in the Spirit.

I think I'm really fishing around for words, how do we describe what it's like to know and have Christian love for others? And not just worldly opinions and fleshy drives? One is warm, welcoming, inviting, one is cold and austere and divisive.

Much love!

"I think I'm really fishing around for words, how do we describe what it's like to know and have Christian love for others? "

Honestly speaking here, I've no idea what it is to actually be on the receiving end of another Christians "love".
Most I met in church's have been:

"...cold and austere and divisive." Hence, I no longer will even try another "church". I've prayed, begged to be led to a good church...I'm guessing God does not want me to attend or even try to "fit in" as...I REFUSE to "fit in" anymore. Just means you must be just like them...bunch of clones walking around with fake smiles and empty platitudes.
There's an old saying that says there are no lone ranger Christians...well, several on here have blasted that right out the water.
No need to "fit in" when I already "belong" to His family. Amen!

 

[marks]

"I think I'm really fishing around for words, how do we describe what it's like to know and have Christian love for others? "

Honestly speaking here, I've no idea what it is to actually be on the receiving end of another Christians "love".
Most I met in church's have been:

"...cold and austere and divisive." Hence, I no longer will even try another "church". I've prayed, begged to be led to a good church...I'm guessing God does not want me to attend or even try to "fit in" as...I REFUSE to "fit in" anymore. Just means you must be just like them...bunch of clones walking around with fake smiles and empty platitudes.
There's an old saying that says there are no lone ranger Christians...well, several on here have blasted that right out the water.
No need to "fit in" when I already "belong" to His family. Amen!

My wife and I have been twice blest with being led to a good church body. The church we are with now, we've been lamenting that there are so few opportunities to fellowship, we're so used to having lot's of things going one. And the other day we decided, as much as we love this pastor, and as great as the people are, we just plain are hungry for more.

So this Sunday, yesterday, after the teaching, we were fellowshiping, and, as I was being invited to a prayer group that meets weekly, my wife was being invited to a small ladies Bible study that meets weekly. At the same moment! I could see them talking across the room.

So, message received!

There are a lot of smiles at that church, but I don't see them as fake, being we talk about our problems too. We've only been there a few months and I feel so much at home with everyone. I'm so thankful to Him!!

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

My wife and I have been twice blest with being led to a good church body. The church we are with now, we've been lamenting that there are so few opportunities to fellowship, we're so used to having lot's of things going one. And the other day we decided, as much as we love this pastor, and as great as the people are, we just plain are hungry for more.

So this Sunday, yesterday, after the teaching, we were fellowshiping, and, as I was being invited to a prayer group that meets weekly, my wife was being invited to a small ladies Bible study that meets weekly. At the same moment! I could see them talking across the room.

So, message received!

There are a lot of smiles at that church, but I don't see them as fake, being we talk about our problems too. We've only been there a few months and I feel so much at home with everyone. I'm so thankful to Him!!

Much love!

You are both very blessed brother!

 

[Johann]

@Johann Pap reminds me of grits!! Pap en vleis looks delicious!!

Doesn't taste like grits though, but for the last couple of years I am on a health diet, no sugars, no bread, drinking beetroot juice and Ensure, containing all the 7 essential amino acids the body needs, in fact, a complete meal replacement, for my supplement, since I am still doing gym, throwing weights around.

 

[Johann]

Doesn't taste like grits though, but for the last couple of years I am on a health diet, no sugars, no bread, drinking beetroot juice and Ensure, containing all the 7 essential amino acids the body needs, in fact, a complete meal replacement, for my supplement, since I am still doing gym, throwing weights around.

This is the way I am doing it

 

[Johann]

"I think I'm really fishing around for words, how do we describe what it's like to know and have Christian love for others? "

Honestly speaking here, I've no idea what it is to actually be on the receiving end of another Christians "love".
Most I met in church's have been:

"...cold and austere and divisive." Hence, I no longer will even try another "church". I've prayed, begged to be led to a good church...I'm guessing God does not want me to attend or even try to "fit in" as...I REFUSE to "fit in" anymore. Just means you must be just like them...bunch of clones walking around with fake smiles and empty platitudes.
There's an old saying that says there are no lone ranger Christians...well, several on here have blasted that right out the water.
No need to "fit in" when I already "belong" to His family. Amen!

Well said, I don't go to Church, and there is a reason why, but we should fellowship in a Church.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

I don't often go back and forth with people anymore on here because I feel like Ill lose my spiritual fruit in the process.

That’s exactly what happens. When He calms our flesh, we still have habit though. We often revert to habit. (I’m not talking about before He calms our flesh. Before He does, we just live in near constant emotional turmoil, resentments and harassment). I’m talking about AFTER we are weaned from our flesh. When His Presence then comes to us, or on us, if we revert to habit, like…repaying a snipe with a snipe, the Presence leaves.
I only just finally put it together this morning. After we are weaned and in calmness of soul/mind will emotions, we don’t actually HAVE to revert back to habit. We can learn not to.

 

[marks]

Pap en vleis

Just did a search on this one, on the "images" page, scrolled down, oh wow! Such great looking foods!!

Much love!

 

[Nancy]

nn

Well said, I don't go to Church, and there is a reason why, but we should fellowship in a Church.
J.

Hi Johann,
This is what is missing big time, fellowship. I do have fellowship with my sisters and at least one brother of mine but, it is not enough IMHO. It would be so nice to find a good bible study or prayer group near me but most of the church's around me are Catholic, way too liberal or Calvinist. I've tried to go to many, getting there early and leaving late in hopes of striking up a conversation with some of the congregants. Only problem there is that every single one of the church's, after pastor dismissing at the end of his sermon, they fly out of the building so fast I am left sitting in the "fellowship room" alone. So, I've given up trying to be a part of these church's. I have also tries a couple small group studies at one of the church's (huge church) they petered out and down to just myself and a married couple who hosted. Started with 8 of us and one by one, they stopped coming, sigh.

 

[Johann]

Just did a search on this one, on the "images" page, scrolled down, oh wow! Such great looking foods!!

Much love!

Lol!
Real African/boere food!
But like I have said to our sister, I am on a health diet marks.
I have my oats and bananas in the morning, chicken and pasta midday, and another pasta and cheese, with lots and lots of beetroot juice and homemade energy shakes, no sugars, no bread.
Sounds boring, but it helps!
Anyway, great to see you are still here brother.
J.

 

[stunnedbygrace]

"I think I'm really fishing around for words, how do we describe what it's like to know and have Christian love for others? "

Honestly speaking here, I've no idea what it is to actually be on the receiving end of another Christians "love".
Most I met in church's have been:

"...cold and austere and divisive." Hence, I no longer will even try another "church". I've prayed, begged to be led to a good church...I'm guessing God does not want me to attend or even try to "fit in" as...I REFUSE to "fit in" anymore. Just means you must be just like them...bunch of clones walking around with fake smiles and empty platitudes.
There's an old saying that says there are no lone ranger Christians...well, several on here have blasted that right out the water.
No need to "fit in" when I already "belong" to His family. Amen!

It’s a big struggle. First, because of our flesh, we struggle to release others and to leave wrath behind and to bear with each others flesh. Then, He eventually calms our flesh, but we find no one to help us understand so we can make greater strides onward. We are are very real mess as a whole, not in any way moving together in the Spirit.

 

[Johann]

nn

Hi Johann,
This is what is missing big time, fellowship. I do have fellowship with my sisters and at least one brother of mine but, it is not enough IMHO. It would be so nice to find a good bible study or prayer group near me but most of the church's around me are Catholic, way too liberal or Calvinist. I've tried to go to many, getting there early and leaving late in hopes of striking up a conversation with some of the congregants. Only problem there is that every single one of the church's, after pastor dismissing at the end of his sermon, they fly out of the building so fast I am left sitting in the "fellowship room" alone. So, I've given up trying to be a part of these church's. I have also tries a couple small group studies at one of the church's (huge church) they petered out and down to just myself and a married couple who hosted. Started with 8 of us and one by one, they stopped coming, sigh.

Hi Nancy, I can empathize how you must feel.
I remember a ministry here in Durban called The Ark, putting Mat 25 in action, a ministry the same as David Wilkerson and Nicky Cruz, remember him?
It was not a "church" per se, but we were catering for the needs of all the outcasts, the disenfranchised, drug addicts, prostitutes, homeless etc.
I was in this ministry for close to 40 years and have seen miraculous conversions to Christ Jesus.
We even had a clinic and performed small operations, a clothing store, and much, much more.
I came to Durban as a dying alcoholic, came to The Ark and was in one night delivered from alcohol and its cravings, nobody prayed for me, it was all the Lord's doing.
We all worked as a team, the pastors and sisters, and I can remember the "presence" of the Holy Spirit hovering over the Ark.
Long story short, this is what is needed Nancy, for affluent people to help missionaries to open places like the Ark, and see how God is working through the Spirit.
See that guitar, left-hand guit' in my profile picture?
I was a worship leader there.
Now, it is a white elephant, the building is still there, but it is now a museum.

Now that is what I call a Church, all the other local assemblies here pales in comparison of what I have seen and experienced in that place, the many, many wonderful conversions of drug addicts, becoming pastors themselves, with the Holy Spirit leading and guiding, and the Lord added daily to that place such as should be saved.

I miss the Ark Nancy.

I hope this all came out OK, since English is not my mother tongue.

May our great God and savior Christ Jesus richly bless you in every sphere of your life, you and family.
I believe we are born for a purpose, and may our Lord open doors for you to enter in to that which He has called you to do.

Shalom
Johann

 

[Nancy]

Hi Nancy, I can empathize how you must feel.
I remember a ministry here in Durban called The Ark, putting Mat 25 in action, a ministry the same as David Wilkerson and Nicky Cruz, remember him?
It was not a "church" per se, but we were catering for the needs of all the outcasts, the disenfranchised, drug addicts, prostitutes, homeless etc.
I was in this ministry for close to 40 years and have seen miraculous conversions to Christ Jesus.
We even had a clinic and performed small operations, a clothing store, and much, much more.
I came to Durban as a dying alcoholic, came to The Ark and was in one night delivered from alcohol and its cravings, nobody prayed for me, it was all the Lord's doing.
We all worked as a team, the pastors and sisters, and I can remember the "presence" of the Holy Spirit hovering over the Ark.
Long story short, this is what is needed Nancy, for affluent people to help missionaries to open places like the Ark, and see how God is working through the Spirit.
See that guitar, left-hand guit' in my profile picture?
I was a worship leader there.
Now, it is a white elephant, the building is still there, but it is now a museum.

Now that is what I call a Church, all the other local assemblies here pales in comparison of what I have seen and experienced in that place, the many, many wonderful conversions of drug addicts, becoming pastors themselves, with the Holy Spirit leading and guiding, and the Lord added daily to that place such as should be saved.

I miss the Ark Nancy.

I hope this all came out OK, since English is not my mother tongue.

May our great God and savior Christ Jesus richly bless you in every sphere of your life, you and family.
I believe we are born for a purpose, and may our Lord open doors for you to enter in to that which He has called you to do.

Shalom
Johann

Your English is superb,
Thank you for sharing this Johann! Now, THAT'S the kind of church we just don't see anymore...unless perhaps just a few? And yes! I remember David Wilkerson and Nicky Cruz...I read the Cross and the Switchblade several times and received D.W. newsletters on a regular basis.

In all those years brother, yes, I do believe you witnessed many souls saved!

Hey, why don't you send us a video of you playing a song?!!

 

[Vinil Stephen]

Ephesians 4:14-16 KJV
14) That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15) But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
16) From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.

The idea of "speaking the truth in love" is something I fear many people actually use as an excuse to do exactly opposite what the verse is instructing us.

Truth, not opinion. Truth, not slander. Love. How you define Love? What does love mean to you? What does it mean that God loves you?

To me, Christian Love is the inner commitment towards someone else's wellbeing. To prioritize what is good for them over what is good for me. Affection is involved, but that commitment exists in the absence of affection just the same.

However, I've learned that as we love others with Godly love, our emotions towards them become repaired, affection grows into the emotional love we look for.

Speaking the truth in love, This is a line in the sand. We need to correctly divide between flesh and spirit, and not speak out of our feelings, our pride, our envy,

Ephesians 4:28-30 KJV
28) Let him that stole steal no more: but rather let him labour, working with his hands the thing which is good, that he may have to give to him that needeth.
29) Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.
30) And grieve not the holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption.

Who is able to tame their tongue? But if you do, you will be able to control your entire body. The same effort, the same mindset that overcomes the tongue is able to equally overcome the rest of the flesh. The tongue is the heaviest weight to lift, so once you can lift it, you can lift all the others too.

Let him that stole, steal no more, instead work to be able to give good things to others.

Nothing corrupt is to come out of our mouths. Godly rebuke? Or irritated flesh? Irritated flesh will NOT give grace to those who hear it. The wrath of man works not the righteousness of God. If that's what we are dishing out, we are like the man who is stealing instead of giving. Corrupt words come either from ignorance or because they appeal to the flesh in pridely self-affirmation.

Godly rebuke will not come with presumption and false words. Negative opinions of others should not be "repackaged" as "Godly rebuke".

In humble commitment to each other, this is how we can build each other in love.

Much love!

Speaking the truth in love, as per the Bible, means communicating with kindness and compassion while still being honest and direct. It's about being truthful but also showing love and respect to the person you are communicating with. This approach is based on the Bible verse Ephesians 4:15 which says "Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ."

 

[Johann]

Your English is superb,
Thank you for sharing this Johann! Now, THAT'S the kind of church we just don't see anymore...unless perhaps just a few? And yes! I remember David Wilkerson and Nicky Cruz...I read the Cross and the Switchblade several times and received D.W. newsletters on a regular basis.

In all those years brother, yes, I do believe you witnessed many souls saved!

Hey, why don't you send us a video of you playing a song?!!

I'm in my 60's now, and I was with the Ark close to 40 years, now that I type it here, I see how the Lord used me, in active, ministerial ministry.
No @Nancy, you will never see me in a video playing my guit'...and I never look into a mirror admiring myself.

Rev 3:8 I know your [record of] works and what you are doing. See! I have set before you a door wide open which no one is able to shut; I know that you have but little power, and yet you have kept My Word and guarded My message and have not renounced or denied My name.
AMP

Like I have said, we are not born without a purpose, maybe our Father is tugging in your heart.

Shalom
J.

 

[Lambano]

Only problem there is that every single one of the church's, after pastor dismissing at the end of his sermon, they fly out of the building so fast I am left sitting in the "fellowship room" alone.

Yep. Gotta beat the Baptists to the Cracker Barrel.

 

[Nancy]

Yep. Gotta beat the Baptists to the Cracker Barrel.

Around here a lot go to Denny's, SRO on Sunday's lunch time..