Spoken by the prophets? Yes, but where?

[Strider324]

You telling me what appeals to me is either a sorry attempt at mind reading - or just an intellectually lazy claim you can’t support without my input. I’ll let you clarify which it is.

 

[Matthias]

You telling me what appeals to me is either a sorry attempt at mind reading - or just an intellectually lazy claim you can’t support without my input. I’ll let you clarify which it is.

Does unbelief in God not appeal to you?

 

[Strider324]

Does unbelief in God not appeal to you?

No. What other naked assumptions would you like to make?

 

[Matthias]

No.

It isn’t appealing to me. If it isn’t appealing to you then why are you using the unbelief of the majority of Jews to support your atheism?

 

[talons]

What do you say specifically about Matthew 2:23?

“He came to a town called Nazareth and lived there. Then what had been spoken by the prophets was fulfilled, that Jesus would be called a Nazarene.”

(Matthew 2:23, NET)

What we have is a translation of the inspired word of God as delivered to us in the book of Matthew . Matthew has not been questioned as to being the author . Matthew said prophets as in plural , so was God revealing something to Matthew that we will never know , could be . All the words of God's prophets are not in the bible , not by a long shot I figure . We are told plainly we do not have all the things that Jesus did , which would surely include things He said .

25And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

 

[Matthias]

What we have is a translation of the inspired word of God as delivered to us in the book of Matthew . Matthew has not been questioned as to being the author .

I agree.

Matthew said prophets as in plural , so was God revealing something to Matthew that we will never know , could be . All the words of God's prophets are not in the bible , not by a long shot I figure . We are told plainly we do not have all the things that Jesus did , which would surely include things He said .

25And there are also many other things which Jesus did, the which, if they should be written every one, I suppose that even the world itself could not contain the books that should be written. Amen.

Thanks. When Matthew said prophets in the plural, I think he was probably referring to the collection of the writings by the major and minor prophets. It doesn’t require all of the prophets to say it, nor does it require more than one to say it. It is said somewhere in the works of the prophets.

None of the prophets explicitly say it. Not even one. We can quickly confirm this by consulting a Concordance.

It’s true that not all of the words of God’s prophets are preserved in the Bible. I take it that those which are essential for us to know have been preserved for us. (Search the scriptures to see if what is said is true.) Matthew had to have known that his remark would be challenged. “Show us that it is there” or “Show us where it is” would be reasonable requests. There is no record of that request being made. Whether it was or it wasn’t, I think Matthew would have anticipated it and been prepared to give an answer.

Who would ask him about it? The first ones which come to my mind are those who were not receptive of the remark. “God gave me a private revelation” isn’t going to persuade them. Matthew would like to persuade them.

But those who were receptive to the message should have inquired about it also. “God gave me a private revelation” would naturally evoke the suspicious question, “Why only to you? Why not to others also?” There might be a good answer for that but raising doubts in their minds isn’t a good way to try to persuade them.

Let’s try to put ourselves in a neutral position, as if we were hearing it ourselves for the very first time. (I know. That’s hard for us to do.) We’re Jews interested in what Matthew has said but we’re as yet undecided. We may or may not know about the tradition. We ask Matthew to elaborate on his remark.

Scenario 1. Matthew takes a deep breath, smiles and says, “It isn’t written in the scriptures which we have available to us. (Red flag?) I know it is there but it has been lost. (Red flag?) God told me about it in a dream. You’ll just have to take my word for it.” (We have a decision to make, and I’m leaning away.)

Scenario 2. Matthew takes a deep breath, smiles and says, “It is written in the scriptures which we have available to us. (Yellow flag?) It is found in Isaiah 11:1. Let’s read it together. (Green flag?) We read the passage with him and ask him to explain it to us. He does, pointing out the word-play in Hebrew. (We have a decision to make, and I’m leaning in.)

Was God revealing something to Matthew in a private revelation - which Matthew didn’t feel it important to point out to his audience - about some lost writing of the prophets? As you say, could be.

As a neutral but interested Jew, which would be you more drawn in by?