The 70 Weeks Prophecy - The Ezra 6:14 Challenge

[GTW27]

No, I've been able to determine where much error has occurred. This is by much study and not assuming anything but the correctness of the original text of God's word. Once you have the courage to follow where this path leads, many things become clear and things that seem confusing become clear.

1. Restoration of the proper jewish calendar method in use during Biblical times. This is probably the MOST important thing.
2. Proper understanding of exactly when the crucifixion happened. On Wednesday, April 25, 31 AD. It was NOT on Good Friday. It was NOT in 30 AD or 33 AD.
3. Proper understanding of the 70 Weeks Prophecy. The Ezra 6:14 Challenge outline 8 FACTS which the proper interpretation meets and which no other interpretation meets.
4. The realization that the majority of the New Testament was written to Jewish believers - people who did not speak Greek as their main language. They spoke Aramaic. What this leads to is that the strange passages in the Greek text are easily explained by the fact that the Greek was a translation of the Aramaic and the translators didn't get everything correct. That's why there so very many variations across all the Greek manuscripts. The Aramaic Peshitta is the best preserved text of the original language.

These four things go against long held Church tradition. Church tradition is wrong. And not many people will realize this - it's part of the great deception of the Last Days.

Some times it is good to go with what is written in The Word of God "2. Proper understanding of exactly when the crucifixion happened. On Wednesday April 25, 31AD." In all four Gospels when put together, has Peter warming himself by the fire in the court yard. Winter in Jerusalem ends in March. Blessings!

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Some times it is good to go with what is written in The Word of God "2. Proper understanding of exactly when the crucifixion happened. On Wednesday April 25, 31AD." In all four Gospels when put together, has Peter warming himself by the fire in the court yard. Winter in Jerusalem ends in March. Blessings!

Nights are cool more than just at winter.
1. Matt 21:18-19. The first harvest of figs takes place at the end of April near Jerusalem.
2. Passover was NEVER in March during the temple era. The winter barley ripened several weeks AFTER the spring equinox and so had to be in April. The winter barley had to be ripe for the Feast of First Fruits.
And there's at least 8 other proofs that April 25, 31 AD was the actual date.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Here's another clue for the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

Ezra 6:14 lists 4 commands that were given in order for the temple to be completed - and by way of returning to the land and restoring it. The Hebrew words "sub" and "bana". "Return" and "restore". These are the words found in Daniel 9:25. The words which signaled the start of the entire period of the 70 Weeks.

Arguments have raged back and forth as to when did this period start. What king's decree started the whole thing? Look on any forum thread about this topic and every tom, dick and harry has their pet interpretation. Very few base theirs on an accurate understanding of the text. Some tie it to their particular denomination. Or some "personal vision from God". Or some supposed expert scholar. But no one realizes that Ezra 6:14 invalidates all of their interpretations. They don't acknowledge or realize that God's command to "sub" and "bana" came before any of the 3 kings' decrees.

This makes complete sense, unfortunately. Out of all the many English translations, they all interpret Daniel 9:25 differently. It's a complete mess. This shows that no translator has ever truly correctly understood the 70 Weeks prophecy.

The vast majority of proposed interpretations are based on the King James Version.
King James Bible
Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Some are very close in wording.
New American Standard Bible
So you are to know and understand that from the issuing of a decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem, until Messiah the Prince, there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with streets and moat, even in times of distress.

New International Version
"Know and understand this: From the time the word goes out to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until the Anointed One, the ruler, comes, there will be seven 'sevens,' and sixty-two 'sevens.' It will be rebuilt with streets and a trench, but in times of trouble.

But their biases are very evident. Anyone who knows the Hebrew language knows that there are no capital letters in Hebrew. Or punctuation. Any translation that puts in capitals and adds punctuation is making an INTERPRETATION of the original Hebrew text. It's very safe to say that anyone who bases their own view on the KJV, NASB, NIV or similar with added capitals will NEVER come to the correct view of the prophecy.

Obviously, the English language needs punctuation. But what about those translations who don't add capitals for "messiah" and "prince"?
NET Bible
So know and understand: From the issuing of the command to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until an anointed one, a prince arrives, there will be a period of seven weeks and sixty-two weeks. It will again be built, with plaza and moat, but in distressful times.

JPS Tanakh 1917
Know therefore and discern, that from the going forth of the word to restore and to build Jerusalem unto one anointed, a prince, shall be seven weeks; and for threescore and two weeks, it shall be built again, with broad place and moat, but in troublous times.

Coverdale Bible of 1535
Vnderstode this then, and marcke it well: that from the tyme it shalbe concluded, to go and repayre Ierusalem agayne, vnto Christ (or the anoynted) prynce: there shalbe seuen wekes. Then shall the stretes & walles be buylded agayne [sixty-two] wekes, but with harde troublous tyme.

Even though the Coverdale still capitalizes "Christ", they include the alternate "anoynted". But notice where the periods of weeks occur. Totally different. And what are you going to do with this translation?
English Standard Version
Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time.

The proper interpretation is all tied to the original Hebrew text. No one will understand the prophecy correctly by reading an English translation. That is part of the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

Well I took you r challenge and you failed.

First Cyrus is also known as Darius and Artexerxes so it is not three kings giving a decree but one.

Second: when you count th eyears (and that date is established in history-= from the time of the decree to rebuild Jerusalem and not just the temple comes to 69 "7s".

 

[Ronald Nolette]

No, I've been able to determine where much error has occurred. This is by much study and not assuming anything but the correctness of the original text of God's word. Once you have the courage to follow where this path leads, many things become clear and things that seem confusing become clear.

1. Restoration of the proper jewish calendar method in use during Biblical times. This is probably the MOST important thing.
2. Proper understanding of exactly when the crucifixion happened. On Wednesday, April 25, 31 AD. It was NOT on Good Friday. It was NOT in 30 AD or 33 AD.
3. Proper understanding of the 70 Weeks Prophecy. The Ezra 6:14 Challenge outline 8 FACTS which the proper interpretation meets and which no other interpretation meets.
4. The realization that the majority of the New Testament was written to Jewish believers - people who did not speak Greek as their main language. They spoke Aramaic. What this leads to is that the strange passages in the Greek text are easily explained by the fact that the Greek was a translation of the Aramaic and the translators didn't get everything correct. That's why there so very many variations across all the Greek manuscripts. The Aramaic Peshitta is the best preserved text of the original language.

These four things go against long held Church tradition. Church tradition is wrong. And not many people will realize this - it's part of the great deception of the Last Days.

Well maybe you should check with Messianic Hebrew Scholars who know and read the original Hebrew.

Jesus did die on Friday. that is established absolutely in Scripture and history. Jesus died the day before a Sabbath and that Sabbath was a high Sabbath (the eight days of Pesach).

I do not know where and who you got this information from but they are wrwong.

Two Messianic Jews who are very adept at the Hebrew SCriptures you can check with are Alfred Eddersheim and Arnold Fruchtenbaum.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Well I took you r challenge and you failed.

First Cyrus is also known as Darius and Artexerxes so it is not three kings giving a decree but one.

Second: when you count th eyears (and that date is established in history-= from the time of the decree to rebuild Jerusalem and not just the temple comes to 69 "7s".

You obviously did not read the English Standard Version. How do you explain their translation?

 

[Ronald Nolette]

@covenantee It's obvious the only thing you got is to mock and ridicule. You haven't even done any simple research. And you keep on harping on supposed "errors" that you don't even understand what you are saying. It's all just so expected from you.

Hoerner had some very solid ideas but his dasting methods are all wrong like you ridentrifying the one king with three biblical names as three seperate kings.

this is an excellent work, which supports Hoerner but corrects his mistakes.

https://digitalcommons.liberty.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1208&context=eleu

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You obviously did not read the English Standard Version. How do you explain their translation?

No I di dnot but let me look and quote it here:

The Seventy Weeks

24“Seventy weeksc are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.d 25Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built againe with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing. And the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Itsf end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war. Desolations are decreed. 27And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week,g and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.”

Your big problem is yo are trusitng an "essential literal" translation and it is loaded with many errors here.

They have added punctuation wrongly like making a new sentence at the end of verse 25. then in verse 24 they added "place". These are wrong and do not appear in the Hebrew.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

No I di dnot but let me look and quote it here:

The Seventy Weeks

24“Seventy weeksc are decreed about your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to put an end to sin, and to atone for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal both vision and prophet, and to anoint a most holy place.d 25Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built againe with squares and moat, but in a troubled time. 26And after the sixty-two weeks, an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing. And the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Itsf end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war. Desolations are decreed. 27And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week,g and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.”

Your big problem is yo are trusitng an "essential literal" translation and it is loaded with many errors here.

They have added punctuation wrongly like making a new sentence at the end of verse 25. then in verse 24 they added "place". These are wrong and do not appear in the Hebrew

Wow. They did not make a mistake. They actually translated the Hebrew text correctly. Hebrew does not have capital letters. Neither does it have punctuation. The "ands" in Hebrew signify changes in thought.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Hoerner had some very solid ideas but his dasting methods are all wrong like you ridentrifying the one king with three biblical names as three seperate kings.

this is an excellent work, which supports Hoerner but corrects his mistakes.

https://digitalcommons.liberty.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1208&context=eleu

I've looked into this quite thoroughly. I show exactly where both Anderson and Hoehner have calculations that are off.

And besides, that article also accepts that March 4 is equivalent to Nisan 1. First, there is no where in the text that states the decree was on Nisan 1. And second, even if it was, Nisan 1 could NEVER be in March. Babylonian new years ALWAYS happen on the new moon after the spring equinox. Always. So it could not have been March 4.

No. Andersons' and Hoehner's interpretation has been quite thoroughly refuted.

 

[Jay Ross]

No, I've been able to determine where much error has occurred. This is by much study and not assuming anything but the correctness of the original text of God's word. Once you have the courage to follow where this path leads, many things become clear and things that seem confusing become clear.

This is what many scholarly members here are also attempting to do. I would like to propose a test for you. In Ezekiel 34:11-16 what is the prophecy that God is presenting in this passage.

Perhaps you may be able to enlighten us all with your wisdom with respect to these few verses?

Now I do agree with your words where you said: 'Once you have the courage to follow where this path leads, many things become clear and things that seem confusing become clear.' Perhaps if you can convince the members that your understanding of this portion of scripture is on the money, then perhaps they will also begin to accept your thoughts with respect to Dan 9:24-27.

Shalom

 

[Phoneman777]

My claim is that ALL interpretations of the 70 Weeks Prophecy can not pass this test. Except for the one correct one.

The "one correct one" is the interpretation that has Artaxerxes' 457 B.C. decree during his "seventh year reign" as the start of the prophecy.
Not Cyrus' decree.
Not Darius' decree.
And, not the 444 B.C. "decree" which was merely a REINSTATEMENT of the 457 B.C. decree after it was suspended until a review of the records proved the restoration of Jerusalem had been previously decreed by Artaxerxes.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Wow. They did not make a mistake. They actually translated the Hebrew text correctly. Hebrew does not have capital letters. Neither does it have punctuation. The "ands" in Hebrew signify changes in thought.

Yeah they did. According to four Hebrew lexicons, Arnold Fruchtenbaum (native speaker and bachelor in Hebrew), Eddersheim and Keil and Delitzsch

 

[Ronald Nolette]

I've looked into this quite thoroughly. I show exactly where both Anderson and Hoehner have calculations that are off.

And besides, that article also accepts that March 4 is equivalent to Nisan 1. First, there is no where in the text that states the decree was on Nisan 1. And second, even if it was, Nisan 1 could NEVER be in March. Babylonian new years ALWAYS happen on the new moon after the spring equinox. Always. So it could not have been March 4.

No. Andersons' and Hoehner's interpretation has been quite thoroughly refuted.

Well what I posted is not
Anderson or Hoerner so they are irrelevant to this conversation.

But looking back from Palm Sunday when Jesus presented Himself as Messiah and going back 483 years we get to Cyrus/Darius/Artaxerxes decree to rebuild Jerusalem.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Well what I posted is not
Anderson or Hoerner so they are irrelevant to this conversation.

But looking back from Palm Sunday when Jesus presented Himself as Messiah and going back 483 years we get to Cyrus/Darius/Artaxerxes decree to rebuild Jerusalem.

Actually it is based on Anderson and Hoehner very much. And what you said is very easily refuted.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Yeah they did. According to four Hebrew lexicons, Arnold Fruchtenbaum (native speaker and bachelor in Hebrew), Eddersheim and Keil and Delitzsch

It does not matter what these scholars said if it can be shown they are in error. If someone includes capital letters in the passage, most of what they say is suspect. Each of them includes capitals on "M"essiah and "P"rince. What they say is garbage.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

Actually it is based on Anderson and Hoehner very much. And what you said is very easily refuted.

So then refute it. Easy to say that, now do it.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

It does not matter what these scholars said if it can be shown they are in error. If someone includes capital letters in the passage, most of what they say is suspect. Each of them includes capitals on "M"essiah and "P"rince. What they say is garbage.

And your expertise to accuse them of error is??????

So I suppose you accept all Greek scholars of being in error as well for Greek had no caps or punctuation. but I notice you cite chapter and verse which do not appear in any manuscripts either of early origin.

It seems you are more about straining at gnats and swallowing camels.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

So then refute it. Easy to say that, now do it.

I did several posts ago. Specifically. Read more carefully before spewing.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

And your expertise to accuse them of error is??????

So I suppose you accept all Greek scholars of being in error as well for Greek had no caps or punctuation. but I notice you cite chapter and verse which do not appear in any manuscripts either of early origin.

It seems you are more about straining at gnats and swallowing camels.

My expertise? 45 years of study. Degree in Religious Studies. And a logical and truth seeking mind. I go where the evidence leads. How about you? What denomination and church traditions are you tied to?
I don't automatically have a closed mind to everything and am not threatened when ignorant and arrogant people spout falsehoods using some supposed expert they quickly searched on g**gle to try and bash some one over the head with.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

This is one of the most precise English translations of the 70 Weeks Prophecy you will come across. No English translation reads this way. No English translation has translated the Hebrew text properly.

[Daniel 9:24-27 based on ESV text but translates much more accurately the Hebrew text]
Removed capitals. Removed punctuation. Each "and" starts a new thought. Combined "and" where they are similar items. Some words replaced with more precise words.

[Purpose]
"seventy weeks are decreed concerning your people and your holy city to finish the transgression
and to put an end to sin
and to atone for iniquity
and to bring in everlasting righteousness
and to seal both vision and prophet
and to anoint holy holies

[7 Weeks]
and know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word concerning to return to and build jerusalem until anointed one prince [there shall be] seven weeks

[62 Weeks]
and sixty-two weeks will be returned to and will be rebuilt with wide flat spaces and upright sections even in a troubled times

[After]
and after the sixty-two weeks an anointed one shall be cut off and shall have nothing
and the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary
and its end shall come with a flood
and to the end there shall be war
desolations are decreed.

[1 Week]
and he will confirm, re-enable covenant with many for one week
and for half of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and grain offering
and on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate
and until the complete destruction and the decisive decision is poured out on the desolator."