The eucharist

[Letsgofishing]

(thesuperjag;28133)
John 6:63 - It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Ha I knew that you were going to use that arguement, thats Why I posted the answer to that question on my first post a) Jesus' Eucharistic talk ends with verse 58 ( see verse 59) the dialogue of 60-70 occurs later and deals with faith, not the eucharist.

the word "spirit" is nowhere used in the bible to mean "symbolic" the spiritual is just as real as the material.c) In verse 63, Jesus is comparing the nonbeliever( "the flesh") with the spiritual or faith filled man. In 1 cor 2:14 we learn what Jesus means by flesh in verse 63 14"But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised" (1 cor 2:14)Note that Jesus says my flesh when discussing the eucharist. He says the flesh when refering to the nonbeliever who will not believe anything beyond his senses and reason. No christian believes that Jesus's flesh "counts for nothing" as said in verse 63 for his flesh was the means of our redemptiond) Note that the unbelieving disciples leave Jesus after verse 63-They would not have left at this point if Jesus had assured them he was only speaking symbollically This is the only time recorded int he new testament that any of Jesus's disciples leave him because they found his doctrine too hard to accept. of the twelve apostles apparently only Judas rejected the eucharistI posted it again just for you

your brother in christRyan Fitz

 

[Letsgofishing]

(kriss;28134)
If you dont understand that this is symbolic I do not know what else to say{quote}31Meanwhile his disciples urged him, "Rabbi, eat something." 32But he said to them, "I have food to eat that you know nothing about." 33Then his disciples said to each other, "Could someone have brought him food?" 34"My food," said Jesus, "is to do the will of him who sent me and to finish his work. (John 4:31-34)5When they went across the lake, the disciples forgot to take bread. 6"Be careful," Jesus said to them. "Be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees." 7They discussed this among themselves and said, "It is because we didn't bring any bread." 8Aware of their discussion, Jesus asked, "You of little faith, why are you talking among yourselves about having no bread? 9Do you still not understand? Don't you remember the five loaves for the five thousand, and how many basketfuls you gathered? 10Or the seven loaves for the four thousand, and how many basketfuls you gathered? 11How is it you don't understand that I was not talking to you about bread? But be on your guard against the yeast of the Pharisees and Sadducees." 12Then they understood that he was not telling them to guard against the yeast used in bread, but against the teaching of the Pharisees and Sadducees. (Mt 16:5-12)In these passages Jesus is talking about food in a symbolic or figurative way. The disciples interpret him to mean real food. Note how Jesus shows them in plain unmistakeable language that he is only speaking figuratively {quote}Now this is all symbolic Christ himself says so once it is told to us it is always the same thing when used in the same wayAs I said if he had met it to be different he would have made an ordinance or a rule for making it otherwise he did not there is nothing in the entire word that says a priest must do a ceremony over this by who's authority not GodsNo again I see this is the men of the church trying insert themselves between God and his children.I have no problem with a priest offering communion to the parisioners or believers taking it themselves either is the same.What sets the Catholic church apart is they are told first it must have a ritual done over it that literally changes it to something else we are not told to do.So are you taking communion to Christ or to the church????????
what makes communion so beutiful is its Christ giving himself to us. LITERALLY. and the church is not putting itself between god and its children, in the contrary its helping us get closer to God"What sets the Catholic church apart is they are told first it must have a ritual done over it that literally changes it to something else we are not told to do."I see your point the only problem is God told us to have the eucharist In his what you might call last will. the last supper.17And when He had taken a cup and given thanks, He said, "Take this and share it among yourselves; 18for I say to you, I will not drink of the fruit of the vine from now on until the kingdom of God comes." 19And when He had taken some bread and given thanks, He broke it and gave it to them, saying, "This is My body which is given for you; do this in remembrance of Me." 20And in the same way He took the cup after they had eaten, saying, "This cup which is poured out for you is the new covenant in My blood. ( Lk 22:17-20) So christ himself set up this ritual of having communionyour brother in christRyan Fitz

 

[Jordan]

(let'sgofishing;28171)
(thesuperjag;28133)
John 6:63 - It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. Jag Lovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Ha I knew that you were going to use that arguement, thats Why I posted the answer to that question on my first post a) Jesus' Eucharistic talk ends with verse 58 ( see verse 59) the dialogue of 60-70 occurs later and deals with faith, not the eucharist.

the word "spirit" is nowhere used in the bible to mean "symbolic" the spiritual is just as real as the material.c) In verse 63, Jesus is comparing the nonbeliever( "the flesh") with the spiritual or faith filled man. In 1 cor 2:14 we learn what Jesus means by flesh in verse 63 14"But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised" (1 cor 2:14)Note that Jesus says my flesh when discussing the eucharist. He says the flesh when refering to the nonbeliever who will not believe anything beyond his senses and reason. No christian believes that Jesus's flesh "counts for nothing" as said in verse 63 for his flesh was the means of our redemptiond) Note that the unbelieving disciples leave Jesus after verse 63-They would not have left at this point if Jesus had assured them he was only speaking symbollically This is the only time recorded int he new testament that any of Jesus's disciples leave him because they found his doctrine too hard to accept. of the twelve apostles apparently only Judas rejected the eucharistI posted it again just for you

your brother in christRyan FitzYou ain't getting the point. Christ was not speaking about eating His flesh body at all. And about "THE FLESH" as being the unbelievers is quite ridiculous, we believers are also flesh, whether we be filled with the spirit-filled or not. The flesh profits nothing.When the "temperarily" disciples followed Him after He feed them with the miracles. They could NOT understand the spiritual of what Christ is saying. So they left Him because they think He is a mad man.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.

 

[crooner]

How come the catholic church say they can only have communion. They freak out if your a non catholic and you want to take communion in their church?????

 

[Letsgofishing]

(crooner;28178)
How come the catholic church say they can only have communion. They freak out if your a non catholic and you want to take communion in their church?????
This is a very very good question. A question Ive had. I am very big into christian unity, I hate the idea that christianity is split up into 33,000 different churches. Therefore the catholic church saying your not good enough to have communion with us to protestants I found ridiculous.well I did until I geard this explanation. As I have explained before Protestants believe that The eucharist is present symbollically while catholics believe that the eucharist is Jesus's actual flesh and blood. Now when we go up to take communion the priest says " body and blood of christ"and you say " amen"now if you don't believe that the eucharist is Jesus in the flesh than this act is completley against your religon.you just called what you just believe is a cracker God. in other words you worshipped a cracker. so we don't let you take part of the eucharist for respect of your religon. Personally I think that what we believe should be clearly explained before each communion and then have whoever believes that it is true( cathlic or protestant, doesn't matter) can take part in it.hope that helps Ryan Fitz

 

[Jordan]

(Letsgofishing;28179)
This is a very very good question. A question Ive had. I am very big into christian unity, I hate the idea that christianity is split up into 33,000 different churches. Therefore the catholic church saying your not good enough to have communion with us to protestants I found ridiculous.well I did until I geard this explanation. As I have explained before Protestants believe that The eucharist is present symbollically while catholics believe that the eucharist is Jesus's actual flesh and blood. Now when we go up to take communion the priest says " body and blood of christ"and you say " amen"now if you don't believe that the eucharist is Jesus in the flesh than this act is completley against your religon.you just called what you just believe is a cracker God. in other words you worshipped a cracker. so we don't let you take part of the eucharist for respect of your religon. Personally I think that what we believe should be clearly explained before each communion and then have whoever believes that it is true( cathlic or protestant, doesn't matter) can take part in it.hope that helps Ryan Fitz
The bible never used the word "eucharist". Yahshua never said He was an "eucharist" So I don't like it when men creates a name for Him or a doctrine that try to fit into the bible. It's not right...JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.

 

[crooner]

Jesus also washed the deciples feet. An ordanance of humility. These all are ordanances of humility and rememberance, not literal. However I dont have a problem with Catholics doing it there way. As long as we all end up in heaven together. Jesus will straighten out our butts very quickly. Dont you agree?

 

[Jordan]

Verily, verily I say unto thee, there is only one way to Heaven. (John 14:6) For we should not make another doctrine that does not fit in the bible. (II Corinthians 11:4) For the way to Heaven is narrow. (Matthew 7:13-14) It is never a good time to find another way. (John 10:1) Christ Himself said let no man deceive you. (Matthew 7:15, Matthew 16:6, Matthew 24:5) Even Paul said it... (II Thessalonians 2:3)Conclusion:I John 4:1 - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(thesuperjag;28195)
Verily, verily I say unto thee, there is only one way to Heaven. (John 14:6) For we should not make another doctrine that does not fit in the bible. (II Corinthians 11:4) For the way to Heaven is narrow. (Matthew 7:13-14) It is never a good time to find another way. (John 10:1) Christ Himself said let no man deceive you. (Matthew 7:15, Matthew 16:6, Matthew 24:5) Even Paul said it... (II Thessalonians 2:3)Conclusion:I John 4:1 - Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
What is the "other way" we are suggesting? All of the verses used to support Jesus literally in the Eucharist are from Jesus' own words. This is my question: We've clearly shown it IS in the Bible - quite literally Jesus said to eat of his flesh - His flesh is true food - the Greek word for "eat" literally means to chew. Plus, for 1,600 plus years all Christians believed it was the TRUE body & blood, soul & divinity - not something symbolic. The whole "it's just a symbol" thing is fairly new in Christian history. Regarding "false prophets" - it would seem that a false prophet would be teaching something new - not something that Jesus spoke of and the earliest Christians - those taught by the Apostles believed to be true. So my question: Clearly there are two sides.. what makes you so certain you are on the right side?

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(crooner;28187)
Jesus also washed the deciples feet. An ordanance of humility. These all are ordanances of humility and rememberance, not literal. However I dont have a problem with Catholics doing it there way. As long as we all end up in heaven together. Jesus will straighten out our butts very quickly. Dont you agree?
We have a foot washing ceremony at my parish. And yes, I agree that Jesus will straighten us all out.(well ...... mostly you guys

)

 

[crooner]

You literaly cant eat his flesh, so it makes sence its is symbolic. Thats not hard to understand is it???? Come on!!! No wonder people cant agree on anything. I want the truth for the sake of God, not my church. the church means nothing compared to the truth and salvation which is freeeeeeee.

 

[Jordan]

(crooner;28202)
You literaly cant eat his flesh, so it makes sence its is symbolic. Thats not hard to understand is it???? Come on!!! No wonder people cant agree on anything. I want the truth for the sake of God, not my church. the church means nothing compared to the truth and salvation which is freeeeeeee.
Yes it is symbolic. There is no way around it. There is no possible way you are going to find Christ's literal flesh body in your flesh life. So we can get that out of the head. It is the words of Him that sent Him. His words giveth life.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(crooner;28202)
You literaly cant eat his flesh, so it makes sence its is symbolic. Thats not hard to understand is it???? Come on!!! No wonder people cant agree on anything. I want the truth for the sake of God, not my church. the church means nothing compared to the truth and salvation which is freeeeeeee.
Your response is the EXACT same response of many of those Jews who sat as His table. 52The Jews therefore strove among themselves, saying, How can this man give us his flesh to eat? 53Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you. 54Whoso eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, hath eternal life; and I will raise him up at the last day. 55For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed. 56He that eateth my flesh, and drinketh my blood, dwelleth in me, and I in him. 57As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me. 58This is that bread which came down from heaven: not as your fathers did eat manna, and are dead: he that eateth of this bread shall live for ever.They wouldn't accept it. And the Bible tells us what they did: 66From that time many of his disciples went back, and walked no more with him. Is it hard to believe that Jesus gives us His flesh to eat? Yes. But it's also hard to believe that He "spoke" and created everything. It's hard to believe that he knows how many hairs I have on my head - that He can feed 5,000 with a few loaves & fish. ALL of it is difficult to believe using our own logic. But God tells us to have FAITH. Bottom line, Jesus said it was his flesh. MY Flesh is MEAT - MY Blood is DRINK.There is no hint of symbolism at all. THAT is a man-made idea. I'm sticking with the words of Christ. I've chosen to believe Him and not walk away because it is "hard."

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(thesuperjag;28203)
His words giveth life.JagLovest thou in Christ Yahshua, Lord and Saviour of the world.
Of course His words give life. But according to Him, His flesh does also.It's not an either / or. It's both - otherwise you pretty much have to ignore most of John 6.

 

[crooner]

Yes his followers ask how do we eat his flesh? They do it symbolically thats the only way it can be done. You are brainwashed if you dont see it. I work with Jws and they keep repeating the same dialog over and over until they can beat a person down. But I can do the the same thing too. I just have my robot take over my key pad.

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(crooner;28216)
Yes his followers ask how do we eat his flesh? They do it symbolically thats the only way it can be done. You are brainwashed if you dont see it. I work with Jws and they keep repeating the same dialog over and over until they can beat a person down. But I can do the the same thing too. I just have my robot take over my key pad.
All I can say is I hope I'm standing next to you in heaven when Jesus walks up to say, "crooner. .. HOW could I have made it any plainer.. What part of EAT MY FLESH didn't you get???? And that's when I'll turn to you and say,

Told ya!

 

[crooner]

No Jesus going to say Crooner I cant believe Peace be with you bit my arm right off and she wont give it back. She thought I meant it literally. But I still love her and now shes in heaven and you two will be friends forever. Go have fun!!!! Love ya Crooner

 

[Peacebewithyou]

(crooner;28221)
No Jesus going to say Crooner I cant believe Peace be with you bit my arm right off and she wont give it back. She thought I meant it literally. But I still love her and now shes in heaven and you two will be friends forever. Go have fun!!!! Love ya Crooner
Oh crooner! You are too funny! Go catch a sheephead for me! This former Florida girl is freezing her tail off in Chicago today.. every time I see your picture I'm jealous! love ya back! We'll see in heaven who is right, brother! (me!

)

 

[crooner]

Come on down I will take you fishing

 

[crooner]

Come on down I will take you fishing I am waitng for friends to come here from Chicago any time but flight delays!!!