The False vs True Gift Of Tongues

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Hobie

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The gift is for a purpose just like all the others from the Holy Spirit and not just blabbing unintelligent with no understading, it had to be able to communicate the gospel not just nonsense noises.

Isaiah 66:18
For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.

Acts 2:4-8
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.
Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

Acts 2:11
Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

1 Corinthians 14:23
If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

The gift of tongues was the many languages that were there at the time of the different nations, so it was given for this purpose, and it has been distorted with the babbling many use today.
 
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Pearl

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The gift of tongues was the many languages that were there at the time of the different nations, so it was given for this purpose, and it has been distorted with the babbling many use today.
Now, I think that people who believe what you say @Hobie have never had the gift and so assume that because you don't have it then it must be obsolete. I have had it for many years and so do many people I know.

I was thanking God only this morning for my gift of tongues. I love to sing in tongues, as well as pray, as singing was my very first experience of the gift. And I have to tell you that it is not 'babbling'. My gift manifests as beautiful tunes - always different - with verses and choruses and a natural end.

Also when I pray in tongues there is a pattern as in ordinary speech, with commas and full stops - i.e. a proper syntax.

If you have only ever heard 'babbling' maybe that's why you don't believe, but there are some real languages that may sound like babbling, one even sounds like clicking.

So please don't generalise and dismiss what God has given. Instead you could ask Him to give you the gift.

There have been similar threads on every Christian site I've belonged to and things can get nasty very quickly as those of who do have the gift are ganged up on. Even called heretics or liars. So I hope this thread doesn't descend into such negativity.
 
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Randy Kluth

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The gift is for a purpose just like all the others from the Holy Spirit and not just blabbing unintelligent with no understading, it had to be able to communicate the gospel not just nonsense noises.

Isaiah 66:18
For I know their works and their thoughts: it shall come, that I will gather all nations and tongues; and they shall come, and see my glory.

Acts 2:4-8
And they were all filled with the Holy Ghost, and began to speak with other tongues, as the Spirit gave them utterance.
And there were dwelling at Jerusalem Jews, devout men, out of every nation under heaven.
Now when this was noised abroad, the multitude came together, and were confounded, because that every man heard them speak in his own language.
And they were all amazed and marvelled, saying one to another, Behold, are not all these which speak Galilaeans?
And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?

Acts 2:11
Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.

1 Corinthians 14:23
If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?

The gift of tongues was the many languages that were there at the time of the different nations, so it was given for this purpose, and it has been distorted with the babbling many use today.
Tongues was a head-scratcher for me, having been raised a Lutheran and turning to a Charismatic Lutheran Pastor put out of the Lutheran Church because of his teaching the "Gifts of the Spirit." The Jesus People I was around, all of whom believed in tongues, but who were most often not brought up in Christianity like me, tried to pray over me and encourage me to start "blabbing."

I went into a room by myself and started asking God if Tongues was right, and as I prayed the most beautiful English prayer came out of my mouth--I'm not so eloquent! In the end I just put up with it until one day, in exasperation I asked God to either give me a sign from heaven or I would give up belief in Tongues. Convicted of my insolence I rephrased my "demand" that God give me a sign on the earth...immediately! Or, I would simply feel that God doesn't care that I believe in Tongues.

Immediately a firework, a sky rocket, shot up into the sky in the trees just beyond me, went high up into the sky and fell back to the earth--it was the only firework that happened at that time! And so, since then I've believed in Tongues although I reject any "jabbering" that I've done in the past. I accept that some have Tongues, and others "jabber." ;)
 

Pearl

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The Importance Of Speaking In Tongues.
There are at least four basic manifestations of the gift of tongue
  • Tongues for personal edification. (1 Corinthians 14:4) This is the supernatural language the Holy Spirit prays through us that we can use to pray hour after hour if we desire. It often accompanies the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
  • Tongues which require an interpretation. (1 Corinthians 14:5) This manifestation of tongues is normally presented in a public assembly accompanied by an interpretation by the same or another person. (Romans 8:26)
  • Tongues of deep intercessional groaning. (Romans 8:26) This diversification of tongues empowers the believers to stand in the gap for their own lives, their families, their church, their city, their nation etc. God may also call on them to intercede for someone or for some situation that is totally unknown.
  • Tongues as a sign to unbelievers. (1 Corinthians 14:22) This is the phenomenon that took place on the day of Pentecost. (Acts2:4-11) It occurs when the Holy Spirit transcends the intellect and all language barriers by empowering a believer to preach, teach or testify about Christ in some language of man of which the believer himself has no knowledge.


I have also found that singing in tongues to praise and worship is another lovely way we can use the gift .

And praying in tongues silently either in support of another person who is ‘ministering’ or in a public place is another way of using this gift.

I have come under fire on some Christian sites for expressing these views but I firmly believe them. And still sing and pray in tongues without 'babbling'.
 

Hobie

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Now, I think that people who believe what you say @Hobie have never had the gift and so assume that because you don't have it then it must be obsolete. I have had it for many years and so do many people I know.

I was thanking God only this morning for my gift of tongues. I love to sing in tongues, as well as pray, as singing was my very first experience of the gift. And I have to tell you that it is not 'babbling'. My gift manifests as beautiful tunes - always different - with verses and choruses and a natural end.

Also when I pray in tongues there is a pattern as in ordinary speech, with commas and full stops - i.e. a proper syntax.

If you have only ever heard 'babbling' maybe that's why you don't believe, but there are some real languages that may sound like babbling, one even sounds like clicking.

So please don't generalise and dismiss what God has given. Instead you could ask Him to give you the gift.

There have been similar threads on every Christian site I've belonged to and things can get nasty very quickly as those of who do have the gift are ganged up on. Even called heretics or liars. So I hope this thread doesn't descend into such negativity.
Well, you have to understand that there are many people who have been given a speaking of tongues that is not of God. In the islands we know as we see it many a day when a person is possessed. They speak with 'patterns' as you say and 'proper syntax' etc.. then proceed to throw five man in the air during a prayer meeting and jump beyond any normal human being can do, with no recollection later of what they did. Not all spirits are from God as well as prophets...

Micaiah Warns Ahab​

2 Now three years passed without war between Syria and Israel. 2 Then it came to pass, in the third year, that Jehoshaphat the king of Judah went down to visit the king of Israel.
3 And the king of Israel said to his servants, “Do you know that Ramoth in Gilead is ours, but we hesitate to take it out of the hand of the king of Syria?” 4 So he said to Jehoshaphat, “Will you go with me to fight at Ramoth Gilead?”
Jehoshaphat said to the king of Israel, “I am as you are, my people as your people, my horses as your horses.” 5 Also Jehoshaphat said to the king of Israel, “Please inquire for the word of the Lord today.”
6 Then the king of Israel gathered [a]the prophets together, about four hundred men, and said to them, “Shall I go against Ramoth Gilead to fight, or shall I refrain?”
So they said, “Go up, for the Lord will deliver it into the hand of the king.”
7 And Jehoshaphat said, “Is there not still a prophet of the Lord here, that we may inquire of [b]Him?”
8 So the king of Israel said to Jehoshaphat, “There is still one man, Micaiah the son of Imlah, by whom we may inquire of the Lord; but I hate him, because he does not prophesy good concerning me, but evil.”
And Jehoshaphat said, “Let not the king say such things!”
9 Then the king of Israel called an officer and said, “Bring Micaiah the son of Imlah quickly!”
10 The king of Israel and Jehoshaphat the king of Judah, having put on their robes, sat each on his throne, at a threshing floor at the entrance of the gate of Samaria; and all the prophets prophesied before them. 11 Now Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah had made horns of iron for himself; and he said, “Thus says the Lord: ‘With these you shall gore the Syrians until they are destroyed.’ ” 12 And all the prophets prophesied so, saying, “Go up to Ramoth Gilead and prosper, for the Lord will deliver it into the king’s hand.”
13 Then the messenger who had gone to call Micaiah spoke to him, saying, “Now listen, the words of the prophets with one accord encourage the king. Please, let your word be like the word of one of them, and speak encouragement.”
14 And Micaiah said, “As the Lord lives, whatever the Lord says to me, that I will speak.”
15 Then he came to the king; and the king said to him, “Micaiah, shall we go to war against Ramoth Gilead, or shall we refrain?”
And he answered him, “Go and prosper, for the Lord will deliver it into the hand of the king!”
16 So the king said to him, “How many times shall I make you swear that you tell me nothing but the truth in the name of the Lord?”
17 Then he said, “I saw all Israel scattered on the mountains, as sheep that have no shepherd. And the Lord said, ‘These have no master. Let each return to his house in peace.’ ”
18 And the king of Israel said to Jehoshaphat, “Did I not tell you he would not prophesy good concerning me, but evil?”
19 Then Micaiah said, “Therefore hear the word of the Lord: I saw the Lord sitting on His throne, and all the host of heaven standing by, on His right hand and on His left. 20 And the Lord said, ‘Who will persuade Ahab to go up, that he may fall at Ramoth Gilead?’ So one spoke in this manner, and another spoke in that manner. 21 Then a spirit came forward and stood before the Lord, and said, ‘I will persuade him.’ 22 The Lord said to him, ‘In what way?’ So he said, ‘I will go out and be a lying spirit in the mouth of all his prophets.’ And the Lord said, ‘You shall persuade him, and also prevail. Go out and do so.’ 23 Therefore look! The Lord has put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these prophets of yours, and the Lord has declared disaster against you.”
24 Now Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah went near and struck Micaiah on the cheek, and said, “Which way did the spirit from the Lord go from me to speak to you?”
25 And Micaiah said, “Indeed, you shall see on that day when you go into an inner chamber to hide!”
26 So the king of Israel said, “Take Micaiah, and return him to Amon the governor of the city and to Joash the king’s son; 27 and say, ‘Thus says the king: “Put this fellow in prison, and feed him with bread of affliction and water of affliction, until I come in peace.” ’ ”
28 But Micaiah said, “If you ever return in peace, the Lord has not spoken by me.” And he said, “Take heed, all you people!”
 
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Pearl

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Well, you have to understand that there are many people who have been given a speaking of tongues that is not of God. In the islands we know as we see it many a day when a person is possessed. They speak with 'patterns' as you say and 'proper syntax' etc.. then proceed to throw five man in the air during a prayer meeting and jump beyond any normal human being can do, with no recollection later of what they did. Not all spirits are from God as well as prophets...
Which islands?
 

Behold

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The gift is for a purpose just like all the others from the Holy Spirit and not just blabbing unintelligent with no understading, it had to be able to communicate the gospel not just nonsense noises.

Reader,

Here is how to understand this "tongues" issue...

There is the "Gift of a foreign language" that God gives , for the purpose of ministering to people who can't understand your language..

Notice, that during Pentecost, in Acts 2... Peter is using the Gift of Tongues.. and its explained like this... "we heard Him preach in OUR Language"... said some of those JEWS who were there that day, listening.
Notice also that Peter was never water baptized that day, and yet, he received this spiritual Gift.

So, that is the "GIFT of Tongues"..

Now why is this such a confused mess... in the body of Christ, regarding understanding it..????

Its because there is also a "prayer language" that is for "self edification"...
This is a spiritual phenomenon... a manifestation... that is real, but is often faked by people who want to make you believe that they are "spiritual"....
Watch out for these nut-bars, as they have some issues in their head that lead them to behave like that, and its not good.

The "tongues" CONFUSION< is created by the Charismatic and Pentecostal movement, who do not make or understand the distinction between a prayer language manifesting , that is for personal self edification, and the GIFT of a Foreign Language, that is the #9 Spiritual Gift on Paul's List of Spiritual Gifts.

Notice that it's always PAUL who is teaching all the deep doctrinal aspects regarding doctrine for the Church.
Paul is your Teacher.... Study His Epistles.

Start here..

Hebrews 13:8
Romens 3:21-28
2 Corinthians 5:19
Romans 4:8

Now, there are those who will say that "all this Apostle stuff" , all "" the early Church Stuff, is no longer in process""", based on a couple of NT verses.
And i know the verses, but that is not this post., so, those of you who know those verses, dont need to get upset.
Just relax.
You can start your own Thread on those verses regarding this topic, .... if you feel the urge, and i'll meet you there, if i see it.

However...= This post is to show you the distinction between a "SIGN" gift, that is "The gift of Tongues" "that are for a SIGN">..... and a spiritual manifestation that is a "prayer language" that is not the "Gift of Tongues".

Reader.....These 2 are not the same, and a few denominations don't make this distinction, and that is what causes a lot of confusion, regarding this topic, worldwide.
 
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Hobie

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Which islands?
Well in Cuba we have Santeria, and Haiti and Dominica its Voodoo, and Puerto Rico in the backwoods its Hechizo, and we have it under other names in the other parts of the Caribbean, but its all from the same origin....
 

Hobie

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Reader,

Here is how to understand this "tongues" issue...

There is the "Gift of a foreign language" that God gives , for the purpose of ministering to people who can't understand your language..

Notice, that during Pentecost, in Acts 2... Peter is using the Gift of Tongues.. and its explained like this... "we heard Him preach in OUR Language"... said those who were there that day, listening.
Notice also that Peter was never water baptized that day, and yet, he received this spiritual Gift.

So, that is the "GIFT of Tongues"..

Now why is this such a confused mess... in the body of Christ, regarding understanding it..????

Its because there is also a "prayer language" that is for "self edification"...
This is a spiritual phenomenon... a manifestation... that is real, but is often faked by people who want to make you believe that they are "spiritual"....
Watch out for these nut-bars, as they have some issues in their head that lead them to behave like that, and its not good.

The "tongues" CONFUSION< is created by the Charismatic and Pentecostal movement, who do not make or understand the distinction between a prayer language manifesting , that is for personal self edification, and the GIFT of a Foreign Language, that is the #9 Spiritual Gift on Paul's List of Spiritual Gifts.

Notice that it's always PAUL who is teaching all the deep doctrinal aspects regarding doctrine for the Church.
Paul is your Teacher.... Study His Epistles.

Start here..

Hebrews 13:8
Romens 3:21-28
2 Corinthians 5:19
Romans 4:8

Now, there are those who will say that "all this Apostle stuff" , all "" the early Church Stuff, is no longer in process""", based on a couple of NT verses.
And i know the verses, but that is not this post., so, those of you who know those verses, dont need to get upset.
Just relax.
You can start your own Thread on those verses regarding this topic, .... if you feel the urge, and i'll meet you there, if i see it.

However...= This post is to show you the distinction between a "SIGN" gift, that is "The gift of Tongues" "that are for a SIGN">..... and a spiritual manifestation that is a "prayer language" that is not the "Gift of Tongues".

Reader.....These 2 are not the same, and a few denominations don't make this distinction, and that is what causes a lot of confusion, regarding this topic, worldwide.
It was all to communicate with the languages of other countries, that was the purpose and it has been twisted and distorted so that the spirits of evil can sway and misdirect souls away from God, Its right there...
Acts 2:11
Cretes and Arabians, we do hear them speak in our tongues the wonderful works of God.
 

Truthnightmare

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The Holy Spirit can speak to all people of all languages at once… no need for an interpreter.
 
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Pearl

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Well in Cuba we have Santeria, and Haiti and Dominica its Voodoo, and Puerto Rico in the backwoods its Hechizo, and we have it under other names in the other parts of the Caribbean, but its all from the same origin....
Oh, right. I thought we were discussing the use of tongues by Christians.
 

Hobie

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Oh, right. I thought we were discussing the use of tongues by Christians.
What does it matter if someone who claims to be a christian follows a spirit that is of evil and of the devil, does that change the spirit. Need to test the spirit..
1 John 4:1 King James Version
4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
 
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Pearl

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What does it matter if someone who claims to be a christian follows a spirit that is of evil and of the devil, does that change the spirit. Need to test the spirit..
1 John 4:1 King James Version
4 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
Oh well I'm not getting into discussing non-Christian 'tongues'.
 

amadeus

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Well, I am with our dear sister @Pearl on this. I don't sing in tongues, but I communicate with God in a prayer language. During my morning time with God as I am reading my Bible or talking with Him, I regularly lapse into the prayer language which He gave me for the first time in 1976.

When a natural baby begins to make noises with his mouth it is babble which has no meaning and so no one understands. As the child grows some of the babble begins to have meaning for him and for others, such as the baby sounds: ma ma, da da; which in time may become mum or mama or daddy. A baby whose growth is stunted may never move beyond babble to a language in which he is able to intelligently converse with his parents and others.

Similarly, when a baby Christian first speaks in a "new tongue [language]" it may seem to some to be no more than an unintelligible babble. Some new believers get lazy and/or are told they need do nothing else and they do not. They do not continue to use their new language by talking with God... and babble it remains on those rare occasions when they open their mouths to God. Probably too many baby Christians even some or many of those who regularly spend time in the pews have never grown up. They remain babies all of their lives! They need to eat His flesh and drink His blood regularly [daily?]

My wife received a different gift of tongues from God. She receives messages in an unknown tongue and sometimes is also given an interpretation into English for other people's understanding.

Does every part of the Body of Christ know everything about all the other parts working in the functions given to them by God? There is only one Head of the Body of Christ and that is not you nor me, but Jesus!

"And he is the head of the body, the church..." Col 1:18

Give God the glory!
 

Pearl

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Well, I am with our dear sister @Pearl on this. I don't sing in tongues, but I communicate with God in a prayer language. During my morning time with God as I am reading my Bible or talking with Him, I regularly lapse into the prayer language which He gave me for the first time in 1976.

When a natural baby begins to make noises with his mouth it is babble which has no meaning and so no one understands. As the child grows some of the babble begins to have meaning for him and for others, such as the baby sounds: ma ma, da da; which in time may become mum or mama or daddy. A baby whose growth is stunted may never move beyond babble to a language in which he is able to intelligently converse with his parents and others.

Similarly, when a baby Christian first speaks in a "new tongue [language]" it may seem to some to be no more than an unintelligible babble. Some new believers get lazy and/or are told they need do nothing else and they do not. They do not continue to use their new language by talking with God... and babble it remains on those rare occasions when they open their mouths to God. Probably too many baby Christians even some or many of those who regularly spend time in the pews have never grown up. They remain babies all of their lives! They need to eat His flesh and drink His blood regularly [daily?]

My wife received a different gift of tongues from God. She receives messages in an unknown tongue and sometimes is also given an interpretation into English for other people's understanding.

Does every part of the Body of Christ know everything about all the other parts working in the functions given to them by God? There is only one Head of the Body of Christ and that is not you nor me, but Jesus!

"And he is the head of the body, the church..." Col 1:18

Give God the glory!
@amadeus That is wonderful, :dusted::dusted::dusted::dusted:
 
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Randy Kluth

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Well in Cuba we have Santeria, and Haiti and Dominica its Voodoo, and Puerto Rico in the backwoods its Hechizo, and we have it under other names in the other parts of the Caribbean, but its all from the same origin....
I have a relative from the Dominican Republic--I'm going to have to ask her. Just curious what her experience was?
 
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quietthinker

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Are 'the wonderful works of God' communicated to the hearers in a tongues manifestation?
Are 'the wonderful works of God' communicated in prayer?

Jesus glorified is none other than 'the wonderful works of God'....and what are they? are they not the manifestation of his character. Are they not the refuting of all that misrepresents God's character?...........and who has done the misrepresenting?

Ohhh, who can hear it? ...as the Universe resounds with admiration (Revelation 5)
 

Hobie

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I have a relative from the Dominican Republic--I'm going to have to ask her. Just curious what her experience was?
Well, just to give you a taste of what was in the islands, was a almost fear and superstitions of the people of what these spirits could do to them, much like the witch doctors back in Africa. My grandmother was from the Bay Islands, and she would grab us and hold us back from things which were only superstitions, but it was strong in her mind. She finally let God into her life and they faded, but I never forgot how it had a hold on her.
 
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Pearl

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The "false" is the belief that they are present and needed today.
Oh, really, seems like you've not seen my posts. The gift of tongues is alive and being manifest in countless church groups. Just because your church isn't one of them don't make the mistake of arrogantly generalising without knowing the full facts. Just because you personally don't do it or believe in it does not mean other people still use the gift of tongues every day. God knows our hearts and he sees your unbelief.

Read my posts 2 and 4.
 
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