The Godly Heresy of Sinless Perfectionism

[Adam]

There is a massive problem with believing yourself perfect. Jesus spent a good chunk of his ministry getting attacked by people who thought they were perfect, and they eventually put Jesus to death. Jesus said, your righteousness must exceed the scribes and pharisees. Jesus said that prostitutes and publicans would find the Kingdom of God first. Because they were humble. They accepted they did wrong. The scribes and pharisees were self-righteous, they thought that their faith and observances made them better than other people. You have to be better than that. Helping people in need is what makes you a better person.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

There is a massive problem with believing yourself perfect. Jesus spent a good chunk of his ministry getting attacked by people who thought they were perfect, and they eventually put Jesus to death. Jesus said, your righteousness must exceed the scribes and pharisees. Jesus said that prostitutes and publicans would find the Kingdom of God first. Because they were humble. They accepted they did wrong. The scribes and pharisees were self-righteous, they thought that their faith and observances made them better than other people. You have to be better than that. Helping people in need is what makes you a better person.

I believe that the saint who is perfect is not going to think they are perfect. Why? Because Jesus is the One who has gotten them there righteously speaking, and they of themselves alone are nothing without God.
They will always think they can do more or better for the Lord, as well.

As for the Pharisees:

Well, the Pharisees did not keep the weightier matters of the Law like love, faith, justice, and mercy (Matthew 23:23) (Luke 11:42). Jesus desired others to have a righteousness that would surpass the righteous acts of the Pharisees because of this. This literally meant that they had to be living more righteously than them.

As for prostitutes, publicans entering the Kingdom of God ahead of the Pharisees:

Now, this does not mean that they remained as sinners. Jesus called sinners to repentance. When a person is saved by God’s grace, they seek forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ and they do not intend to sin again. If they are still in their sins or they are justifying sin, then they have not really truly repented, and they have not been transformed by God (or saved by His grace). We do have to be humble before God’s grace, and accept it, but we also have to be humble in obeying God, as well. Most Christians I run into today believe they can sin and still be saved on some level. There is Hyper Grace, and there is the popular type of believers which I call Partial Hyper Grace (Who try to convince other Christians that they are sinners, and no believer can ever be perfect, and they are saved by His grace alone and in nothing you do, etcetera).

As for helping people in need: Yes, this is it. That is a part of our righteous instructions involving the faith. We are to help the poor, help the brethren, and others. Loving even our enemies. If we love the brethren, there is nothing on the inside of us that will make us stumble (1 John 2:10). Loving others (or faith that works by love) is actually a part of the Sanctification Process. God has chosen us to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit, and a belief of the truth (2 Thessalonians 2:13). This is a call of the gospel (2 Thessalonians 2:14).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The thread title is a heresy. No man can serve two masters. For he will hate the one and love the other.
So you will either serve God or you will serve sin. There is no middle road or lukewarm approach here where you can serve both.
For you will end up either hating the one and loving the other. In other words, if you don’t let go of sin, that means you love sin more than God. If you love God then you will desire to no longer sin any more because you want to do everything that pleases Him instead of pleasing yourself. It’s just that simple. People can twist the Bible to make it say so otherwise, but they are only fooling themselves.

Cleanse yourself from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1).

Yes, we are saved by His grace, but His grace is not a license for immorality (Jude 1:4).
To say that we must sin again and or we must be imperfect is to turn His grace into a license to sin in some way.
God never wants us to sin ever. So we count the cost in following Jesus and we pick up our cross, deny ourselves, and follow Jesus.
Your true allegiance is proven by what fruit you defend. If you defend how you must sin in some way, then sin (Which is of the devil) is your master. If you defend living righteously, and you strive to make that a reality with God with every fiber of your being (with God’s help), then God is your master. Most Christians I run into defend how they must sin again in some way. Jesus said, you will know them by their fruits. It’s not… you will know them if they believe on the finished work of the cross. That saying is not even in the Bible.

 

[mailmandan]

There is a massive problem with believing yourself perfect. Jesus spent a good chunk of his ministry getting attacked by people who thought they were perfect, and they eventually put Jesus to death. Jesus said, your righteousness must exceed the scribes and pharisees. Jesus said that prostitutes and publicans would find the Kingdom of God first. Because they were humble. They accepted they did wrong. The scribes and pharisees were self-righteous, they thought that their faith and observances made them better than other people. You have to be better than that. Helping people in need is what makes you a better person.

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. 1 John 1:8 - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

In Matthew 5:20, we read - "For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven." This statement from Jesus would come as a shock to the multitude of people who had great admiration for the scribes and Pharisees, for their knowledge of the law and seeming righteousness and holiness in external observance of the law, yet Jesus points out their righteousness was defective.

Paul explains in Romans 9:30-32 that even the Gentiles "who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith; but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness. Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone."

Paul makes it clear in Romans 10:3-4, "For they (Israel) being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."

We see in the parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector an example of those who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, yet despised others. (Luke 18:9-14) We also see this today with various modern day Pharisees. The righteousness that exceeds the "righteousness of the scribes and the Pharisees" (self righteousness) is the righteousness of God which is from God by faith.

Philippians 3:9 - and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, therighteousness which is from God by faith.

Romans 3:21 - But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22
even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference.

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

 

[RLT63]

The thread title is a heresy. No man can serve two masters. For he will hate the one and love the other.
So you will either serve God or you will serve sin. There is no middle road or lukewarm approach here where you can serve both.
For you will end up either hating the one and loving the other. In other words, if you don’t let go of sin, that means you love sin more than God. If you love God then you will desire to no longer sin any more because you want to do everything that pleases Him instead of pleasing yourself. It’s just that simple. People can twist the Bible to make it say so otherwise, but they are only fooling themselves.

Cleanse yourself from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1).

Yes, we are saved by His grace, but His grace is not a license for immorality (Jude 1:4).
To say that we must sin again and or we must be imperfect is to turn His grace into a license to sin in some way.
God never wants us to sin ever. So we count the cost in following Jesus and we pick up our cross, deny ourselves, and follow Jesus.
Your true allegiance is proven by what fruit you defend. If you defend how you must sin in some way, then sin (Which is of the devil) is your master. If you defend living righteously, and you strive to make that a reality with God with every fiber of your being (with God’s help), then God is your master. Most Christians I run into defend how they must sin again in some way. Jesus said, you will know them by their fruits. It’s not… you will know them if they believe on the finished work of the cross. That saying is not even in the Bible.

According to you Paul’s master was sin then. Romans 7:14-25

 

[RLT63]

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness. 1 John 1:8 - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

In Matthew 5:20, we read - "For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven." This statement from Jesus would come as a shock to the multitude of people who had great admiration for the scribes and Pharisees, for their knowledge of the law and seeming righteousness and holiness in external observance of the law, yet Jesus points out their righteousness was defective.

Paul explains in Romans 9:30-32 that even the Gentiles "who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith; but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness. Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone."

Paul makes it clear in Romans 10:3-4, "For they (Israel) being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."

We see in the parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector an example of those who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, yet despised others. (Luke 18:9-14) We also see this today with various modern day Pharisees. The righteousness that exceeds the "righteousness of the scribes and the Pharisees" (self righteousness) is the righteousness of God which is from God by faith.

Philippians 3:9 - and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, therighteousness which is from God by faith.

Romans 3:21 - But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22
even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference.

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

What denomination is teaching this sinless perfection nonsense?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

According to you Paul’s master was sin then. Romans 7:14-25

If you were to read again the beginning of Romans 7, the context or framework is the Old Law.

#1. “…brethren, (for I speak to them that know the law,)” (Romans 7:1).​

#2. “we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.” (Romans 7:6).​

Therefore, the struggle Paul is talking about in Romans 7:14-24 is in reference to his time when he was Saul in the false Pharisee religion under the 613 Laws of Moses. Paul was sinning or in the flesh because he was wrongfully under the Old Law.

Some quick points to consider:

#1. Christians cannot be justified by the Laws of Moses (Acts 13:39).​

#2. Gentile Christians were told by the Jerusalem council that they did not have to keep the Laws of Moses as a whole (Acts 15:5) (Acts 15:24).​

#3. The Law has changed (Hebrews 7:12).​

#4. The temple veil was torn from top to bottom letting us know that the Law and the priesthood had ended (Matthew 27:51).​

#5. Jesus said that the cup of the fruit of the vine represented the blood that would be shed for the New Testament (Luke 22:20).​

#6. Jesus‘ death starts the New Covenant (For a testament is not in force unless the testator dies - Hebrews 9:16-17).​

So when Paul talks about being ”in the flesh” in the next chapter (Romans 8) he is referring to how one seeks to be justified by the keeping of the Old Law (Which is no more) (Like keeping circumcision, dietary laws, sabbaths, holy days, etcetera).

Galatians 4:9-11

​

9 “…whereunto ye desire again to be in bondage?​

10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.​

11 I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.”​

As we can see in this above passage, Paul was afraid for the Galatian believers because they were keeping days, months, and years (Which is the keeping of the ceremonial days exclusive to the Laws of Moses, i.e. the Old Law).

“Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:4).​

Paul was saying this because people were thinking they had to be circumcised to be saved.

Acts 15:1​

”And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.”​

​

Galatians 5:2​

”Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.”​

Circumcision was given to Abraham and his people and it was given to those under the Laws of Moses.
Circumcision was not given to us by Jesus and His followers.

In Romans 7:14-24: Paul wanted to keep the “righteousness of the Law” (or the righteous aspect or part of the Old Law) (Like do not steal, do not covet, etcetera), but he was unable to do so because he was wrongfully under the Old Covenant Law system as a whole (Instead of being under the New Covenant way).

Romans 8:2 says:

“For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.”​

Two laws are mentioned in this verse above here.

#1. The Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus (i.e. New Covenant Law), and:​

#2. The Law of Sin and Death (Old Covenant Law or the Laws of Moses).​

Note: It’s called the Law of Sin and Death because you could be put to death physically for disobeying certain aspects of the Laws of Moses (Which is not the case with the laws of Christ because Christians are to love their enemies and not stone them with physical death).

Romans 8:4 says:

”That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.”​

We have to walk after the Spirit (Which is only made possible after one accepts Jesus Christ as their Savior and or they believe the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, and they then seek to obey the commands that come from Jesus and His followers in the New Testament).

One way the righteousness of the Law can be fulfilled by walking after the Spirit is by doing the following…

Romans 13:8-10

8 “Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law.​

9 For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.​

10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.”​

New Covenant loving (like helping your brother in need, or helping the poor with a pure heart of love) fulfills all the requirements of the Old Law (Even though the Old Law is technically no more). In other words, if one wants to keep the Old Law, the only way to do it today (Because we are under the New Covenant) is by loving your neighbor and not by keeping all 613 Laws of Moses.

In Romans 7:14-24: Paul wanted to keep this Moral Law in Romans 13:8-10 but he could not do so because he was trying to keep all 613 laws of Moses (and he did not realize that Christ nailed to the cross those ordinances that were against us - Colossians 2:14).

 

[mailmandan]

What denomination is teaching this sinless perfection nonsense?

I'm not sure.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

What denomination is teaching this sinless perfection nonsense?

Believers generally do not go from zero to hero overnight; So the ”Slave to Sin Type Christians” have the wrong idea of Sinless Perfection in that the Christian must be living perfect right now or they are condemned (Rather than being on the road to making that happen at some point in this life). All true Christians are going to meet the bare minimum level requirement of living holy but perfection is something that one does to holiness as a part of the cleansing process (2 Corinthians 7:1). Just as a child grows and matures and learns things, so it is also with a Christian. It takes time for a believer to be perfect and it is only possible by the power and working of God. For with God, all things are possible (As Jesus said).

But what churches believe in Sinless Perfection?
Well, they are in the small minority and so they should not be much of a concern for you.
The apostasy or falling away has happened.
Most want to defend sin (Which is of the devil) instead of following Jesus and His righteousness.

But if you truly want to know…

International Fellowship of Bible Churches http://www.ifbc.org/ is one of them.
Jesus said strive to enter the straight gate.
Christians today do not even think they have to strive.

In context, Jesus was talking to believers who believed in HIm. So this would be within the context or framework of Christians.

Luke 13:24-27
24 “Strive to enter in at the strait gate: for many, I say unto you, will seek to enter in, and shall not be able.
25 When once the master of the house is risen up, and hath shut to the door, and ye begin to stand without, and to knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open unto us; and he shall answer and say unto you, I know you not whence ye are:
26 Then shall ye begin to say, We have eaten and drunk in thy presence, and thou hast taught in our streets.
27 But he shall say, I tell you, I know you not whence ye are; depart from me, all ye workers of iniquity.”

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@mailmandan

My apologies for suggesting that you created your avatar with the intentions to promote a sinful TV-show. I do realize that your initial intent may have in fact been to just show that you are a mailman or how you used to be one. But I am concerned that you are keeping the avatar up even when I have shown multiple times that this is a screen capture from the actual TV-show called “Seinfeld” that does promote sinful things (even according to various articles). If you truly are for following the righteousness of Christ, then things that promote sin should be put away - IMHO.

In either case, we can agree to disagree in love.

May the Lord Jesus Christ and His love shine upon you.

 

[-Phil]

It’s uncanny how what’s appearing as the thoughts & ideas of selves & sins goes unquestioned and therein, entirely unnoticed.
Arguably too perfect!

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Those who believe they live a sinless, without fault or defect, flawless, absolute perfect life 100% of the time (exactly as Jesus lived) are suffering from a terminal case of self righteousness.

You have the wrong idea. Holiness is something that has to be perfected in this life (See 2 Corinthians 7:1). We are to cleanse ourselves from ALL filthiness of the flesh and spirit perfecting holiness in the fear of God (2 Corinthians 7:1). So the outcome or goal is to overcome in cleansing ourselves from ALL filthiness & spirit, and not some filthiness of the flesh and spirit.

Many I have talked with who believe as you do have basically expressed the idea that the word “fear” does not mean to be afraid of God in that our souls could be at risk. It’s because they believe they can sin and still be saved on some smaller level (in that they must sin again occasionally - which is their condition this side of Heaven). So this wrong mindset does not believe Jesus when He said, “sin no more”; Thus, they are against the real Jesus of the Holy Scriptures, and His standard of living righteously.

Yes, righteousness is imputed to us by a belief when we first come to the LORD, but that is not the only way to be righteous according to the Bible (See also 1 John 3:7).

1 John 1:8 - If we say that we have no sin, (present tense) we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 10 If we say that we have not sinned, (past tense) we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

In 1 John 2:1, John says to ”sin not” and he says in 1 John 2:3 that the way we can know the Lord is if we find we are keeping His commandments. In 1 John 2:4, the person who says they know the LORD, and they do not keep His commandments is a liar and the truth is not in them. 1 John 1:6 says, “If we say that we have fellowship with him, and walk in darkness, we lie, and do not the truth:”.

The context does not support the idea that we must sin but it talks about how we are not to sin.

In 1 John 2:26 - John says that he writes these things to those who are trying to seduce them.
So this means that 1 John 1:10 is one of their false beliefs that says that one has never sinned in the past ever.
This would be a denial of sin’s existence in the past.
So if they denied sin in past, then they would deny the existence of sin in the present.
Meaning, they would think sin is an illusion or not real. This is what 1 John 1:8 is talking about in the present tense.
It is a present tense denial of the existence of sin in that if they sin they don’t have to worry about doing anything because they don’t think sin exists. But John is saying sin does exist and the way to deal with it is by confessing your sins to the LORD Jesus Christ (1 John 1:9) (1 John 2:1). This has to be the interpretive viewpoint otherwise one must be declaring they are sinning 24/7 around the clock. For if you are to take the most strictest literal reading on 1 John 1:8, you must believe that you are in sin right now (because it is talking in the present tense). Surely this is not what it is saying. 1 John 1:8 is saying, “If we say we have no sin [in the sense that sin does not exist or it is an illusion], we deceive ourselves and the truth is not in us.”

In Matthew 5:20, we read - "For I say to you, that unless your righteousness exceeds the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven." This statement from Jesus would come as a shock to the multitude of people who had great admiration for the scribes and Pharisees, for their knowledge of the law and seeming righteousness and holiness in external observance of the law, yet Jesus points out their righteousness was defective.

Nowhere did Jesus ever lead up to a point in saying that living righteously was not possible or it was futile to live righteously and therefore you need to trust in the finished work of the cross. No such sayings exists by our Lord Jesus Christ and or by any of His followers. If Jesus was saying that they could not live righteously, then His many words would have been a lie because many of His instructions were focused on how we are to live holy in conduct and not solely by a belief alone.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Paul explains in Romans 9:30-32 that even the Gentiles "who did not pursue righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness of faith; but Israel, pursuing the law of righteousness, has not attained to the law of righteousness. Why? Because they did not seek it by faith, but as it were, by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumbling stone."

Yes, we cannot start off entering the Kingdom based on doing good things like by obeying the Laws of Moses (Which is what Paul was talking about). Christians are not even under the Laws that came through Moses.

Yes. We must first be saved by God’s grace through faith or a belief alone (which is a process of salvation that is without works) because we are initially saved by God’s grace and mercy. Yes. We are saved initially by believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 in that Christ died for our sins, He was buried, and risen the third day (for our salvation). But this does not mean that works of faith are not later required as a part of the Sanctification of the Spirit (involving our salvation) after we are saved by God’s grace. As I already stated in another thread in my Post #30, it makes it abundantly clear that works are later required to enter the Kingdom of God. Let the good Berean seek out these Scriptures and believe them plainly.

Paul makes it clear in Romans 10:3-4, "For they (Israel) being ignorant of God's righteousness, and seeking to establish their own righteousness, have not submitted to the righteousness of God. For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes."

Romans chapters 9-10 is dealing with Israel and how they need to GET saved.
It’s not talking about the secondary aspect of salvation (Which is mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2:13 in that God has chosen us to salvation through the Sanctification of the Spirit and a belief of the truth).

When we are first saved in our Initial Salvation, we have to first believe God (in believing the gospel message in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 or in believing in Jesus as our Savior), and this belief is accounted to us as righteousness just as Abraham believed the promise and it was accounted to him as righteousness. Where many in your camp stumble at the Word is Sanctification verses that relate to our salvation (After we are saved by His grace - which is a gift).

Folks here do not seem to realize that even gifts come with responsibilities In taking care of them.
For we can lose our gift if we are not responsible with it.

We see in the parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector an example of those who trusted in themselves that they were righteous, yet despised others. (Luke 18:9-14) We also see this today with various modern day Pharisees. The righteousness that exceeds the "righteousness of the scribes and the Pharisees" (self righteousness) is the righteousness of God which is from God by faith.

The problem here is that the Pharisee made it all about “Works ALONE Salvationism” that did not include God’s grace and mercy at all because the Pharisee did not do what the Tax Collector did in seeking full forgiveness with the LORD. Nobody can be saved by "Works ALONE Salvationism" without God’s grace. This does not mean Jesus was saying that no righteous works are required later after we are saved by God’s grace. Again, simply look at my post Post #30 in the other thread.

Philippians 3:9 - and be found in Him, not having my own righteousness, which is from the law, but that which is through faith in Christ, therighteousness which is from God by faith.

Righteousness from the Law.
This would be the Torah or the Laws of Moses that Christians are not under.

Romans 3:21 - But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets, 22
even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference.

Paul is concerned here at this point about how a person needs to be INITIALLY saved by God’s grace through faith (Which is a process of salvation without works). This again does not mean that works of faith are not later required as a part of salvation (See: John 15:4-6).

For if you want to say you are fallen short of the glory of God in Romans 3 in your present tense walk with God, then you must also include Romans 3:11 in that it says that one does not seek after God and they have no understanding. Are you claiming to have no understanding and that you don’t seek after God? So surely this is talking about our old life and how we need to GET saved for the first time (Which is by God’s grace).

Romans 4:5 - But to him who does not work but believes on Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is accounted for righteousness, 6 just as David also describes the blessedness of the man to whom God imputes righteousness apart from works.

Still talking about Initial Salvation, and not a salvation lived out by faith (After we are saved by God’s grace).

Romans 2:25-29, and Romans 3:1 is refuting the false belief of those who thought they had to be circumcised to be initially saved (vs. being saved by God’s grace through faith in Jesus Christ). See also Acts 15:1, and Galatians 5:2.

Read on in Romans 6, and it says shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? Paul says, God forbid.
So grace will not abound if one continues in sin. You have declared that you must sin again based on a false interpretation on 1 John 1:8 (Which is not supported by the context because John says to ”sin not” etcetera).

Romans 8:13 says if you live after the flesh, you will die, but if you put to death the misdeeds of the body by the Spirit, you will live.

Romans 8:13 is talking about a secondary aspect of salvation.
Galatians 6:8-9 is also talking about a secondary aspect of salvation.
Let the good Berean check these verses for themselves closely and believe them.

 

[-Phil]

You have the wrong idea

‘Wrong’ is an idea.

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

either serve God or you will serve sin.

Serve God or serve the devil

either serve God or you will serve sin.

Or to put it another way, we either choose to serve God, or serve the devil

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

Nobody can be saved by "Works ALONE Salvationism"

Amen

 

[-Phil]

And “the devil” too!
Absolute perfection.

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

What denomination is teaching this sinless perfection nonsense?

Evangelical Christianity, for over 300 years now

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

And “the devil” too!
Absolute perfection.

Thanks be to God for His indescribable gift! 2 Cor. 9:15

 

[2 Chr. 34:19]

He (she) who sins, is of the devil...1 John 3:8a.
ironically from the same letter that people go to when making excuse for sin.