The two LOVE commands vs. the DECALOGUE (Ten Commands)

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robert derrick

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If you want to disobey God, go ahead.
The Fact is sabbatimos means the keeping of a sabbath rest.
The sabbath was made for man.
you pervert the verse from Romans speaking of new moons, and ceremonial feast days.Those parts of the ceremonial
law, have been fulfilled in Christ.
Those parts of the ceremonial law, have been fulfilled in Christ.

True, and all parts of the law of Moses with the Old Covenant have been done away. Only that written in the law of Christ pertains to the New Testament.

And a single sabbatismo zealously rendered as sabbath rather than rest, doesn't qualify.

The whole law of Moses with its' commandments, statutes, ordinances, testimonies, etc... which ministered death and condemnation written upon stones was done away and vanished, even as the covenant for which it was made.

Both the second set of tables written by Moses in the mount, and the book written by Moses in the wilderness, were put into the ark of the covenant, which tables are done away, and and written book is nailed to the cross.

If you want to disobey God, go ahead.

That's true with anybody and in any manner.

And I definitely do want to disobey men making law as God.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.
 

robert derrick

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If you want to disobey God, go ahead.
The Fact is sabbatimos means the keeping of a sabbath rest.
The sabbath was made for man.
you pervert the verse from Romans speaking of new moons, and ceremonial feast days.Those parts of the ceremonial
law, have been fulfilled in Christ.
The ten commandments was first spoken Personally by God to the children of Israel at the mount. They then withdrew from God, and had only Moses talk with God.

So, then God had to Personally write His commandments and judgments on tables of stone. Which moses proceeded to break.

So, then God had Moses hew out his own tables of stone and then had Moses write everything down, that God had personally written the first time.

These are the tables of stone with the law, the commandments, the judgments, and the ordinances of tabernacle service with sacrifices, that were put in the ark of the covenant, and now have been done away with, along with the death and condemnation they ministered.
 

robert derrick

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The Sabbath was commanded as law for the first time by God, while His people were in the wilderness, in order to govern the eating of manna. It was proceeded by the ordinance of the Passover in Egypt.

It was then written on stone with the first covenant at the mount.

The day of rest of God was never made a law. The law of the Sabbath was made for man's day of rest. Not God's day of rest, that we rest in Christ.

For God to make a law out of His day of rest is to kill in spirit of His rest by letter of law.

Only a carnally minded, carnal ordinance zealot, would ever think of God's day of rest as a law written on stone to obey outwardly or be killed.

God once commanded a day of rest for man, which command of man's day of rest is done away, since we now partake of His day of rest, which is far better than any man's outward practise and show of 'rest': Which is not rest of the heart, but of the flesh, no more than circumcision is of the flesh, but now is of the heart only, and no more than outward shows of worship, being worship of God in the Spirit.

All such outwardly commanded shows of rest, circumcision, and worship are a fair show in the flesh, commanded by men of carnal minds, but not with any respect nor pleasure to God.
 

robert derrick

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The law of the Sabbath was made for man, and man's rest of the flesh, not for God and His rest of the Spirit.

Those who outwardly obey a carnal commandment of 'rest', are carnally minded, fleshy, earthy, sensual, having not the Spirit nor the rest of God.
 

Instant

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The law of the Sabbath was made for man, and man's rest of the flesh, not for God and His rest of the Spirit.

Those who outwardly obey a carnal commandment of 'rest', are carnally minded, fleshy, earthy, sensual, having not the Spirit nor the rest of God.

This is an extremely judgmental comment, and it is in direct opposition to Paul's teaching in Romans that those who choose to do things like keep the Sabbath do so unto the Lord and should be accepted. My personal opinion is that the Sabbath rest was fulfilled through Christ. When we accept Him as our Lord and Savior, we enter into His rest and cease from our labors. Still, I can understand the reason why some choose to rest on the seventh day. This goes back to Genesis, before the Law of Moses was given. God hallowed the seventh day of the week because He rested on that day. I personally think that resting one day of the week is a good practice, as we all need time off to re-charge the batteries. Do we need to rest on the seventh day today? This has been debated in many forums, and nobody has been able to prove conclusively who is right and who is wrong. I know that by faith, I have entered into "His rest," but I respect those who choose to rest on the Sabbath.
 
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Wrangler

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I personally think that resting one day of the week is a good practice, as we all need time off to re-charge the batteries. Do we need to rest on the seventh day today? This has been debated in many forums, and nobody has been able to prove conclusively who is right and who is wrong.

What proof would you accept?

Seems to me people take SHOULD these days to mean SHOULD NOT. You are absolutely right that resting one day of the week is a good practice. In high school and college, I worked every weekend in addition to going to school full time. Little rest during those 8 years. During the summers I often had Tuesday's and Thursday's off. Yes, I rested on those days. Now that I work M - F, there is no reason NOT to rest on the 7th day.
 

Iconoclast

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Holding to a Sabbath command because of the root word being used in the New Testament, that is normally translated as 'Rest', would be the same as declaring that our gathering together as Christians is a synagogue, because James used it's root word for our assembly:

For if there come unto your synagogue a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment.

There remaineth therefore a sabbatismo to the people of God.

It's not assembly but synagogue! Nor is it rest, but Sabbath!

Right. And it's not 'First day' of the week either:

Upon the Sabbatismo of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Sabbatismo is use three times in the new covenant, and one of them is to forbid judging one another according to Sabbatismo days, which would be necessary if Sabbatismo day is a command in the new covenant to keep.

And so, it is either a command to keep, and Col 2:16 contradicts it, or it is not a command to keep and Col 2:16 forbids it to be one.

Those who add to God's Word their own commandments of men will always have to contradict Scripture, or tangle it in an unrecognizable and confusing mess.

the link did not open before, I will post it now;
Sabbath Rest by Sinclair Ferguson
Sabbath Rest
by Sinclair Ferguson

The anonymous author of Hebrews found different ways of describing the superiority of the Lord Jesus Christ. One of them, which forms the underlying motif of chapters 3 and 4, is that Jesus Christ gives the rest that neither Moses nor Joshua could provide. Under Moses, the people of God were disobedient and failed to enter into God’s rest (3:18). Psalm 95:11 (quoted in Hebrews 4:3) implies that Joshua could not have given the people “real rest” since “through David” God speaks about the rest he will give on another day (Heb. 4:7). This in turn implies that “There remains a sabbath rest for the people of God” (Heb. 4:9).

In speaking of this rest (3:18; 4:1, 3-6, 8) the author consistently used the same word for “rest” (katapausis). Suddenly, in speaking about the “rest” that remains for the people of God,
he uses a different word (sabbatismos, used only here in the NT) meaning specifically a Sabbath rest. In the context of his teaching, this refers fundamentally to the “Sabbath rest” which is found in Christ (“Come … I will give you rest,” Matt. 11:28-30). Thus we are to “strive to enter that rest” (4:11).

Since Augustine, Christians have recognized that the Bible describes human experience in a fourfold scheme: in(i) creation, (ii) fall, (iii) redemption and (iv) glory. We are familiar with echoes of this in the Westminster Confession of Faith (chapter 9) and in Thomas Boston’s great book Human Nature in its Fourfold State. It is no surprise then that the Sabbath, which was made for man, is experienced by him in four ways.

In creation, man was made as God’s image—intended “naturally” as God’s child to reflect his Father. Since his Father worked creatively for six days and rested on the seventh, Adam, like a son, was to copy Him. Together, on the seventh day, they were to walk in the garden. That day was a time to listen to all the Father had to show and tell about the wonders of His creating work.

Thus the Sabbath Day was meant to be “Father’s Day” every week. It was “made” for Adam. It also had a hint of the future in it. The Father had finished His work, but Adam had not.

But Adam fell. He ruined everything, including the Sabbath. Instead of walking with God, he hid from God (Gen. 3:8). It was the Sabbath, Father’s Day, but God had to look for him!

This new context helps us to understand the significance of the fourth commandment. It was given to fallen man—that is why it contains a “you shall not.” He was not to work, but to rest. Externally, that meant ceasing from his ordinary tasks in order to meet with God. Internally, it involved ceasing from all self-sufficiency in order to rest in God’s grace.

Considering this, what difference did the coming of Jesus make to the Sabbath day? In Christ crucified and risen, we find eternal rest (Matt. 11:28-30), and we are restored to communion with God (Matt. 11:25-30). The lost treasures of the Sabbath are restored. We rest in Christ from our labor of self-sufficiency, and we have access to the Father (Eph. 2:18). As we meet with Him, He shows us Himself, His ways, His world, His purposes, His glory. And whatever was temporary about the Mosaic Sabbath must be left behind as the reality of the intimate communion of the Adamic Sabbath is again experienced in our worship of the risen Savior on the first day of the week&mdash the Lord’s Day.

But we have not yet reached the goal. We still struggle to rest from our labors; we still must “strive to enter that rest” (Heb. 4:11). Consequently the weekly nature of the Sabbath continues as a reminder that we are not yet home with the Father. And since this rest is ours only through union with Christ in His death and resurrection, our struggles to refuse the old life and enjoy the new continue.

But one may ask: “How does this impact my Sundays as a Christian?” This view of the Sabbath should help us regulate our weeks. Sunday is “Father’s Day,” and we have an appointment to meet Him. The child who asks “How short can the meeting be?” has a dysfunctional relationship problem—not an intellectual, theological problem—something is amiss in his fellowship with God.

This view of the Sabbath helps us deal with the question “Is it ok to do … on Sunday?—because I don’t have any time to do it in the rest of the week?” If this is our question, the problem is not how we use Sunday, it is how we are misusing the rest of the week.

This view of the Lord’s Day helps us see the day as a foretaste of heaven. And it teaches us that if the worship, fellowship, ministry, and outreach of our churches do not give expression to that then something is seriously amiss.

Hebrews teaches us that eternal glory is a Sabbath rest. Every day, all day, will be “Father’s Day!” Thus if here and now we learn the pleasures of a God-given weekly rhythm, it will no longer seem strange to us that the eternal glory can be described as a prolonged Sabbath!
 

Iconoclast

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"robert derrick,

Hello rd,
Those parts of the ceremonial law, have been fulfilled in Christ
.

[True, and all parts of the law of Moses with the Old Covenant have been done away.]

Glad we can agree on this.


[ Only that written in the law of Christ pertains to the New Testament.]

I disagree. Are you saying all the psalms and proverbs are not valid for NT.Christians?
All the prophetic books?


[And a single sabbatismo zealously rendered as sabbath rather than rest, doesn't qualify.]
Sure it does. That is exactly what it means, that is why God had them write it.
You suggested earlier that there was no reference, you were obviously mistaken. It could not be clearer.
By the way, how many times does God have to say something for it to be valid?


{The whole law of Moses with its' commandments, statutes, ordinances, testimonies, etc... which ministered death and condemnation written upon stones was done away and vanished, even as the covenant for which it was made.}

Yes it was done away, because of the weakness of the people. The 10 commandments predated the Mosaic covenant. It is a creation ordinance as God himself "rested".


[Both the second set of tables written by Moses in the mount, and the book written by Moses in the wilderness, were put into the ark of the covenant, which tables are done away, and and written book is nailed to the cross.]

The ten Commandments are not on stone, but in our heart, by the Spirit now.The Spirit enables us to obey...
The first 4 commandments, love to God, the last 6 love our neighbors.



If you want to disobey God, go ahead.

That's true with anybody and in any manner.

And I definitely do want to disobey men making law as God.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.



Yes. I did not write Hebrews 4:9 ...God had them write it...I will obey God.
 

Iconoclast

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The ten commandments was first spoken Personally by God to the children of Israel at the mount. They then withdrew from God, and had only Moses talk with God.

So, then God had to Personally write His commandments and judgments on tables of stone. Which moses proceeded to break.

So, then God had Moses hew out his own tables of stone and then had Moses write everything down, that God had personally written the first time.

These are the tables of stone with the law, the commandments, the judgments, and the ordinances of tabernacle service with sacrifices, that were put in the ark of the covenant, and now have been done away with, along with the death and condemnation they ministered.


RD, I believe they were in effect since creation, and are still in effect now.
What do you think the heathen will be judged by?
Rom2

14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)


Gal4;4
4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

 

Curtis

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:)
Matthew 5:17-18

Psalm 111:7-8 “The works of His hands are verity and judgment; all His commandments are sure. They stand fast for ever and ever, and are done in truth and uprightness.”

God commanded animal sacrifice in the law of Moses.

Where do you sacrifice your animals at?
 

Curtis

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"robert derrick,

Hello rd,
Those parts of the ceremonial law, have been fulfilled in Christ
.

[True, and all parts of the law of Moses with the Old Covenant have been done away.]

Glad we can agree on this.


[ Only that written in the law of Christ pertains to the New Testament.]

I disagree. Are you saying all the psalms and proverbs are not valid for NT.Christians?
All the prophetic books?


[And a single sabbatismo zealously rendered as sabbath rather than rest, doesn't qualify.]
Sure it does. That is exactly what it means, that is why God had them write it.
You suggested earlier that there was no reference, you were obviously mistaken. It could not be clearer.
By the way, how many times does God have to say something for it to be valid?


{The whole law of Moses with its' commandments, statutes, ordinances, testimonies, etc... which ministered death and condemnation written upon stones was done away and vanished, even as the covenant for which it was made.}

Yes it was done away, because of the weakness of the people. The 10 commandments predated the Mosaic covenant. It is a creation ordinance as God himself "rested".


[Both the second set of tables written by Moses in the mount, and the book written by Moses in the wilderness, were put into the ark of the covenant, which tables are done away, and and written book is nailed to the cross.]

The ten Commandments are not on stone, but in our heart, by the Spirit now.The Spirit enables us to obey...
The first 4 commandments, love to God, the last 6 love our neighbors.



If you want to disobey God, go ahead.

That's true with anybody and in any manner.

And I definitely do want to disobey men making law as God.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.



Yes. I did not write Hebrews 4:9 ...God had them write it...I will obey God.

The ten commands ARE the covenant, says many scriptures.

They are called the covenant on two tables of stone.

Maranatha
 

Iconoclast

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The ten commands ARE the covenant, says many scriptures.

They are called the covenant on two tables of stone.

Maranatha
I am aware of the verses you are speaking of

They became a central feature of that Covenant. They already existed, and still are in effect today.
 

kcnalp

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I am aware of the verses you are speaking of

They became a central feature of that Covenant. They already existed, and still are in effect today.
I really don't think you obey the Sabbath COMMANDS! You can't just pick the parts you like, unless you want to burn in Hell!
Exodus 31:15 (NKJV)
15 Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
 

robert derrick

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RD, I believe they were in effect since creation, and are still in effect now.
What do you think the heathen will be judged by?
Rom2

14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:

15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)


Gal4;4
4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
RD, I believe they were in effect since creation

Since I only go by Scripture and not by what we believe. Show the Scripture where the Sabbath was in effect for man to rest by since the beginning by commandment.

No doubt the holy men of old, from Seth to Enoch to Noah to Abraham, etc... may well have practised a personal day of rest each week, even as they knew God had done so by way of example. Which is still perfectly fine for any person on earth to do so after reading the Bible.

But we are not talking personal practise of faith by example of God: you are talking about law of God by commandment on pain of transgression.

That was not spoken by God until the children in the wilderness, and has not been since the cross.

What do you think the heathen will be judged by?

You err in the Scripture here. In Romans 2 it is clear Paul is speaking of Christian believers from among the Gentiles, who were fulfilling the righteousness of God by the law of Christ written on their hearts vs those born Jews after the flesh, who were transgressing the law of God, and yet claiming righteousness with God by outward circumcision of the flesh.

Paul was not speaking of a Roman, Greek, Scythian, or Chinese law that they had committed to their hearts and so were justified with God, because they were so sincere in it.

I.e. You call them heathen, not Scripture: they were believers taken from among the Gentiles to show the work of the law of God written in the hearts, which fulfilled the righteousness of God, that they who held the old oracles of God were not doing, but only claiming to do so by outward works of the flesh.

Romans 2 is all about the change from a covenant by the law of carnal commandment (Heb 7:16), that could not produce righteousness of God, even in them that obeyed it outwardly, to a covenant of the law of the Spirit of life, which could by oath of an endless life produce by grace through faith the righteousness of God in them that obeyed from the heart, all the while without hypocrisy of transgression:

I.e. being circumcised of heart with the law of Christ written in their hearts by the Spirit, they fulfilled without transgression the righteousness of God, that they of the first covenant could never do.
 

robert derrick

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"robert derrick,

Hello rd,
Those parts of the ceremonial law, have been fulfilled in Christ
.

[True, and all parts of the law of Moses with the Old Covenant have been done away.]

Glad we can agree on this.


[ Only that written in the law of Christ pertains to the New Testament.]

I disagree. Are you saying all the psalms and proverbs are not valid for NT.Christians?
All the prophetic books?


[And a single sabbatismo zealously rendered as sabbath rather than rest, doesn't qualify.]
Sure it does. That is exactly what it means, that is why God had them write it.
You suggested earlier that there was no reference, you were obviously mistaken. It could not be clearer.
By the way, how many times does God have to say something for it to be valid?


{The whole law of Moses with its' commandments, statutes, ordinances, testimonies, etc... which ministered death and condemnation written upon stones was done away and vanished, even as the covenant for which it was made.}

Yes it was done away, because of the weakness of the people. The 10 commandments predated the Mosaic covenant. It is a creation ordinance as God himself "rested".


[Both the second set of tables written by Moses in the mount, and the book written by Moses in the wilderness, were put into the ark of the covenant, which tables are done away, and and written book is nailed to the cross.]

The ten Commandments are not on stone, but in our heart, by the Spirit now.The Spirit enables us to obey...
The first 4 commandments, love to God, the last 6 love our neighbors.



If you want to disobey God, go ahead.

That's true with anybody and in any manner.

And I definitely do want to disobey men making law as God.

Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men.



Yes. I did not write Hebrews 4:9 ...God had them write it...I will obey God.
I disagree. Are you saying all the psalms and proverbs are not valid for NT.Christians? All the prophetic books?

No. All Scripture is still profitable for use by any, who desire to do so. But not all Scripture is law of God, which is now law of Christ.

If you want to keep a Sabbath day of rest. Do so. Along with any other statute, command, ordinance, etc... of the Scripture pertaining to the law of Moses in the Old Covenant.

You have all liberty to do so, as does anyone on the planet.

But teaching it for law of Christ today as New Testament commandment for the believers of Jesus to obey is false doctrine and commandments of men, who have no clue what they are doing or talking about. ()

You are carnally obedient to a carnal commandment, that God no longer commands to His people.

The Old covenant is vanished, and the law of God changed from that of Moses to Christ, and yet you love the commandment of the Sabbath of old to do as the did the children of Israel and the Jews of old. Fine.

Show the Scripture where Seth, Enoch, Noah, Abraham, Isaac, Jacob obeyed a commandment of Sabbath.

If not, then no commandment of Sabbath to obey.

Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws. (Gen 26)

No one has any ideas what these were, except for " Get thee out of thy country, and from thy kindred, and from thy father's house, unto a land that I will shew thee" "And ye shall circumcise the flesh of your foreskin; and it shall be a token of the covenant betwixt me and you."

Any others found in Scripture?

Oh yes, "Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of."
 

robert derrick

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This is an extremely judgmental comment, and it is in direct opposition to Paul's teaching in Romans that those who choose to do things like keep the Sabbath do so unto the Lord and should be accepted. My personal opinion is that the Sabbath rest was fulfilled through Christ. When we accept Him as our Lord and Savior, we enter into His rest and cease from our labors. Still, I can understand the reason why some choose to rest on the seventh day. This goes back to Genesis, before the Law of Moses was given. God hallowed the seventh day of the week because He rested on that day. I personally think that resting one day of the week is a good practice, as we all need time off to re-charge the batteries. Do we need to rest on the seventh day today? This has been debated in many forums, and nobody has been able to prove conclusively who is right and who is wrong. I know that by faith, I have entered into "His rest," but I respect those who choose to rest on the Sabbath.

This is an extremely judgmental comment, and it is in direct opposition to Paul's teaching in Romans that those who choose to do things like keep the Sabbath do so unto the Lord and should be accepted. I know that by faith, I have entered into "His rest," but I respect those who choose to rest on the Sabbath.

Oh really? I'm sorry. I thought we were dealing with people who demand a Sabbath day by commandment of God, or else!: rebellion and eternal damnation. I didn't realize we were sharing good things about keeping a physical day of rest as a really good practice, based upon God's example with creation.

Huh. My bad.

No wait. I went and briefly reviewed. No, I am dealing with people demanding and commanding and judging all others by a carnal law, that no longer exists with God for His people.

So, it seems you are no doubt trying to insert reasonableness of Scripture here, to which I agree, but you need to take your reasonableness to the opposers, and see who well you are received. I have no doubt, once you do so carefully, sincerely, and in love, that they will then concede your point and gladly agree, that keeping a day of rest by example of God in His creation is a really good and voluntary thing to do. And if not, then, oh well, they miss out on a blessing.

Until that time, I stand by the very judgmental judgment that the who make up carnal ordinances to live by in Christ, that Christ's apostles never said, are thus making themselves carnally minded in a willful and outward worship and service of Christ: I.e. forsaking the law of the Spirit of Life in Christ, to impose on themselves and others a carnally-minded rule, carnally obeyed, that frustrates the Spirit of grace.

Now, if they agree with you,a nd I was mistaken, then I will gladly withdraw that judgment of them by Scripture.
 

Iconoclast

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I really don't think you obey the Sabbath COMMANDS! You can't just pick the parts you like, unless you want to burn in Hell!
Exodus 31:15 (NKJV)
15 Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
Hello Kc,
Christians do not keep the Mosaic sabbath, but rather the Christian Lord's Day.

9 I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ, was in the isle that is called Patmos, for the word of God, and for the testimony of Jesus Christ.

10 I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,
 

Iconoclast

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robert derrick,
Young's Literal: For, when nations that have not a law, by nature may do the things of the law, these not having a law -- to themselves are a law
I asked you
[What do you think the heathen will be judged by?]
you said;
[You err in the Scripture here. In Romans 2 it is clear Paul is speaking of Christian believers from among the Gentiles, who were fulfilling the righteousness of God by the law of Christ written on their hearts vs those born Jews after the flesh, who were transgressing the law of God, and yet claiming righteousness with God by outward circumcision of the flesh.

Paul was not speaking of a Roman, Greek, Scythian, or Chinese law that they had committed to their hearts and so were justified with God, because they were so sincere in it.]

Robert you are completely wrong on this;FRom precept austin;
HCSB - The Gentiles do not have the Mosaic law as a moral guide, but they do have an inner law that informs their conscience. All humans have this instinctively as a component of their being created in God's image (Gen 1:26). Kant, the philosopher, spoke of "the starry heavens above and the moral law within." This moral law will accuse or excuse daily moral choices, but ultimately demonstrates that all people fall short of God's holiness.

Gentiles who do not have the Law - That is they do not have the written Law as did the Jews (Ro 9:4). Without knowing the written Law of God, men and women in pagan societies by nature ("instinctively"), instinctively value and attempt to practice justice, honesty, compassion, goodness toward others, etc, this practice testifying to the fact that the divine law has been written in the heart of even the most primitive tribesman. While Paul says that a Gentile may by nature do the things contained in the law, he is very careful not to say that a Gentile could fulfill the requirements of the law by nature.

Gentiles (1484) (ethnos) refers to non-Jews or the heathen and when preceded by the definite article ("the") in Greek, means "the nations" which is synonymous with the Gentiles a description implying those who practice idolatry and are ignorant of the true and living God.

All of mankind can be divided into Jew and Gentile and thus Gentile is a synonym for anyone who is non-Jew or who is not a member of the "chosen people". The Hebrew word corresponding to Gentile is goyim. From Genesis 12 onward the majority of the Scripture deals with Israel and the Jews, with the Gentiles mentioned primarily as they interface with the Jews. The NT does have more mention of the Gentiles after the formation of the Church, but the last book, the book of Revelation is very "Jewish" with over 200 OT quotes or allusions to OT passages!

Do instinctively the things of the law - In Romans 1 Paul had clearly taught that Gentiles were "without excuse (defense)" because that which can be known about God was evident within them (cp "conscience.")

I.e. You call them heathen, not Scripture: they were believers taken from among the Gentiles to show the work of the law of God written in the hearts, which fulfilled the righteousness of God, that they who held the old oracles of God were not doing, but only claiming to do so by outward works of the flesh.

Romans 2 is all about the change from a covenant by the law of carnal commandment (Heb 7:16), that could not produce righteousness of God, even in them that obeyed it outwardly, to a covenant of the law of the Spirit of life, which could by oath of an endless life produce by grace through faith the righteousness of God in them that obeyed from the heart, all the while without hypocrisy of transgression:


I.e. being circumcised of heart with the law of Christ written in their hearts by the Spirit, they fulfilled without transgression the righteousness of God, that they of the first covenant could never do.[/QUOTE]
 

Iconoclast

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RD,you said;
[Romans 2 is all about the change from a covenant by the law of carnal commandment (Heb 7:16), ]

No it is not...romans 2 show both jew and gentile are both condemned apart from God's mercy.
Your attempt to link it to Hebrews 7 is a fail as Hebrews 7 is speaking of a change in priesthood.