Thoughts on Invocation and Benediction

[St. SteVen]

Recent discussions on the forum got me to thinking about this.

I was a bit bothered by the use of Matthew 18:20 as either an apologetic, or invocation.
"For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them." - Matthew 18:20 NIV
The problem being contextual. Not what Matthew 18:18-20 is about. And theologically speaking,
we are not required to gather with believers for Christ to be present with us.

There is however, an aspect to the gathering of believers that has to do with
the presence of the Holy Spirit in each individual having an effect on the spiritual atmosphere.
Not sure of the stated biblical theology/doctrine of that, but I certainly notice it in practice.

But rather than turn this topic into a heated discussion about biblical theology/doctrine,
I wanted to focus on the positive side of Invocation and Benediction. And not just in the formal sense,
but more as a mindset, or personal blessing. Not just left to leadership to open or close a service.

I grabbed a couple of definitions of Invocation and Benediction online.

Invocation

• The act or an instance of invoking, especially an appeal to a higher power for assistance.
• A prayer or other formula used in invoking, as at the opening of a religious service.

On a personal level, this could be seen as inviting God into whatever we are doing.

Benediction

• A blessing.
• An invocation of divine blessing, usually at the end of a church service.

On a personal level, this could be seen as speaking a blessing over others when we part.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Questions:

- What are your thoughts on this subject?
- How can we live this out on a personal level?
- Do you have a personal testimony about this?
- Is Invocation and Benediction not to be used in personal application? (qualified clergy only)
- Any thoughts on the doctrine or theology of Invocation and Benediction?

/

 

[Lizbeth]

Recent discussions on the forum got me to thinking about this.

I was a bit bothered by the use of Matthew 18:20 as either an apologetic, or invocation.
"For where two or three gather in my name, there am I with them." - Matthew 18:20 NIV
The problem being contextual. Not what Matthew 18:18-20 is about. And theologically speaking,
we are not required to gather with believers for Christ to be present with us.

There is however, an aspect to the gathering of believers that has to do with
the presence of the Holy Spirit in each individual having an effect on the spiritual atmosphere.
Not sure of the stated biblical theology/doctrine of that, but I certainly notice it in practice.

But rather than turn this topic into a heated discussion about biblical theology/doctrine,
I wanted to focus on the positive side of Invocation and Benediction. And not just in the formal sense,
but more as a mindset, or personal blessing. Not just left to leadership to open or close a service.

I grabbed a couple of definitions of Invocation and Benediction online.

Invocation

• The act or an instance of invoking, especially an appeal to a higher power for assistance.
• A prayer or other formula used in invoking, as at the opening of a religious service.

On a personal level, this could be seen as inviting God into whatever we are doing.

Benediction

• A blessing.
• An invocation of divine blessing, usually at the end of a church service.

On a personal level, this could be seen as speaking a blessing over others when we part.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Questions:

- What are your thoughts on this subject?
- How can we live this out on a personal level?
- Do you have a personal testimony about this?
- Is Invocation and Benediction not to be used in personal application? (qualified clergy only)
- Any thoughts on the doctrine or theology of Invocation and Benediction?

/

Formal liturgies, order of service, and such belonged to the Law and the Temple. Jesus came and showed us how to serve in the new way of the Spirit, in the simplicity of Christ, not the old way of formulas and rituals and liturgies. Tell me where the new testament even mentions such a thing as "church services"? It is always just about when we "come together" or "gather" in His name, and mentions meeting from house to house. The early believers also met informally in the Temple courts.

When did Jesus ever conduct a church service? But the flesh of man is always at war with the Spirit. For one thing, the flesh wants to be in control - it wants everything predictable and cut & dried and tied up with a bow and gives men titles and special robes, and they rule in place of Christ. But all this unfortunately has the effect of feeding the flesh of man instead of denying it and putting it death, and leads to bad fruit.

At the risk of being laughed out of town, there seems to be something observable about men with power.....power turns them into silverbacks and they start helping themselves to the King's harem. It's just what seems to happen over and over again. Very regular scandals hitting the news, and how about all the ones that don't get caught or reported? I don't know if it's a testosterone thing, I think that is what turns an ordinary male gorilla into a silverback, they start producing extra testosterone. Someone should research that with regard to human males, if they haven't already - if it's true men need to be aware of this and be prepared to handle it. I'm not being facetious here - the simplicity of Christ is a safeguard against the flesh, because it's about the whole body of Christ, not just one member being elevated so to speak, and controlling the others.

Need to really let this sink in:

2Co 11:3

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

The simplicity of Christ is NOT the way of the world and flesh. God's ways are not man's ways.

 

[St. SteVen]

Formal liturgies, order of service, and such belonged to the Law and the Temple. Jesus came and showed us how to serve in the new way of the Spirit, in the simplicity of Christ, not the old way of formulas and rituals and liturgies. ...

Translation: "I didn't read the OP, only the topic title."

Want to give it another go?

For one thing, the flesh wants to be in control - it wants everything predictable and cut & dried and tied up with a bow...

Really?
What are you up to?

/

 

[Cassandra]

How does one gather in Jesus name? Isnt that a Christian assembly? Jesus is always with us, but if we are with unbelievers, is that a gathering in Jesus; name (unless its a Bible study?). I don't think it is.

 

[Lambano]

On a personal level, this could be seen as speaking a blessing over others when we part.

When I leave, they say, "Thank God, he's gone!"

 

[St. SteVen]

How does one gather in Jesus name? Isnt that a Christian assembly? Jesus is always with us, but if we are with unbelievers, is that a gathering in Jesus; name (unless its a Bible study?). I don't think it is.

Not what this topic is primarily about. Did you read the OP?

Good point to consider though. What gatherings fit the category of "in Jesus name"?
A worship service, or business meeting, seems like it would fit,
But can two Christians meet for coffee in Jesus' name?
I suppose, if they are prepared to do kingdom business. Discipleship/fellowship/encouragement. ???

/

 

[St. SteVen]

When I leave, they say, "Thank God, he's gone!"

No way!
That is funny though. - LOL

/

 

[St. SteVen]

Formal liturgies, order of service, and such belonged to the Law and the Temple.

What do you make of these New Testament Benedictions?

Now to him who is able to strengthen you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery that was kept secret for long ages but has now been disclosed and through the prophetic writings has been made known to all nations, according to the command of the eternal God, to bring about the obedience of faith— to the only wise God be glory forevermore through Jesus Christ! Amen.—Romans 16:25–27

Now to him who is able to do far more abundantly than all that we ask or think, according to the power at work within us, to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, forever and ever. Amen.—Ephesians 3:20–21

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.—2 Corinthians 13:14

Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.—1 Thessalonians 5:23

May grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord.
His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence—2 Peter 1:2–3

Now may the God of peace who brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, the great shepherd of the sheep, by the blood of the eternal covenant, equip you with everything good that you may do his will, working in us that which is pleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory forever and ever. Amen.—Hebrews 13:20–21

Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy, to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.—Jude 24–25

Source

/

 

[St. SteVen]

Need to really let this sink in:

2Co 11:3

But I fear, lest by any means, as the serpent beguiled Eve through his subtilty, so your minds should be corrupted from the simplicity that is in Christ.

The simplicity of Christ is NOT the way of the world and flesh. God's ways are not man's ways.

What does it mean in context? (not what you claim)

/

 

[Lambano]

I'm trying to think of some examples of Invocation and Benediction outside of a formal worship service. Some committee meetings start with an Invocation asking for God's wisdom and guidance. And Bible studies. I saw a gathering in a Korean restaurant that started with what was obviously a prayer. I know only about three words of Korean, but the "Amen" is universal.

I had a pastor who would start his sermons with, "Lord, we ask that either through me, or in spite of me, Your word would be heard today". But that's also inside the context of formal worship.

And then.... The documentation for some software (not mine) was going through a group review. One section referred to the "invocation of the program". My boss red-lined that and wrote, "Invocation? What, is the user supposed to pray to Almighty God that the software works?"

 

[St. SteVen]

I'm trying to think of some examples of Invocation and Benediction outside of a formal worship service.

I guessing it wasn't very clear in my OP, but I was hoping that rather than find formal wording
for an Invocation and Benediction, that we would discuss this as an attitude of invocation and benediction.
That we would invite God into what we are doing and that we would bless others in the process.
I suppose, as a lifestyle of invocation and benediction. Not even necessarily a prayer.

From the OP:

- On a personal level, this could be seen as inviting God into whatever we are doing.

- On a personal level, this could be seen as speaking a blessing over others when we part.

/

 

[St. SteVen]

I'm trying to think of some examples of Invocation and Benediction outside of a formal worship service.

Aside from not be formal, there's no need for them to be formalized, or formulated. - LOL

Meeting for coffee, an invocation and benediction may look like this:

Having just sat down with your coffee, lift your cup and say, "May God be present with us here."
To which your coffee guest would likely reply, "Amen." while lifting the cup.
On departure you could say, "The Lord's blessing on you and yours."
To which your coffee guest would likely reply, "Likewise."
Or they may want to add their own blessing.

Here's one I never understood.

MAY THE GROUND RISE TO MEET YOU.

Sounds like a face-plant in the gravel to me. - LOL

/

 

[Lizbeth]

What does it mean in context? (not what you claim)

/

Jesus came to give and show us a way, a simple living way, a way of Life, not to introduce a form of ecclesiasticism.

 

[Lizbeth]

Translation: "I didn't read the OP, only the topic title."

Want to give it another go?

I read it but didn't understand the connection between what Jesus said and what you are saying about Benedictions/Invocations.

Really?
What are you up to?

? You advertised this thread and invited comment, so I commented. Just wanted to try and share a vision for the new covenant church that is the same as or close to what the new testament scriptures depict. We've been doing it all wrong....we need to have our minds renewed to better see how things should be with the church. "When you come together, everyone of you hath....." something to contribute according to the gift that is within them.....as the Spirit of Christ leads.....He being the Head of His church.

 

[Lizbeth]

What do you make of these New Testament Benedictions?

Now to him who is able to strengthen you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery that was kept secret for long ages but has now been disclosed and through the prophetic writings has been made known to all nations, according to the command of the eternal God, to bring about the obedience of faith— to the only wise God be glory forevermore through Jesus Christ! Amen.—Romans 16:25–27

Now to him who is able to do far more abundantly than all that we ask or think, according to the power at work within us, to him be glory in the church and in Christ Jesus throughout all generations, forever and ever. Amen.—Ephesians 3:20–21

The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ and the love of God and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all.—2 Corinthians 13:14

Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.—1 Thessalonians 5:23

May grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord.
His divine power has granted to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of him who called us to his own glory and excellence—2 Peter 1:2–3

Now may the God of peace who brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, the great shepherd of the sheep, by the blood of the eternal covenant, equip you with everything good that you may do his will, working in us that which is pleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory forever and ever. Amen.—Hebrews 13:20–21

Now to him who is able to keep you from stumbling and to present you blameless before the presence of his glory with great joy, to the only God, our Savior, through Jesus Christ our Lord, be glory, majesty, dominion, and authority, before all time and now and forever. Amen.—Jude 24–25

Source

/

Pray and bless, as the Spirit leads, that's all. Why formalize things of God who blows as He wills like the wind, and give things ecclesiastical names? And do you have to do that by rote every time you get together? Paul was a Jew don't forget, and it certainly isn't a sin to pray and bless. God's house is to be a house of prayer so we should always pray when we come together. But ecclesiasticism (as I call it) is a slippery slope that leads away from the simplicity of Christ.

What I seem to observe, is that the stronger the presence of the Holy Spirit is the less ecclesiasticism there is and the more ecclesiasticism there is, the weaker (or absent altogether) is the presence of the Holy Spirit.

 

[Lizbeth]

Not what this topic is primarily about. Did you read the OP?

Good point to consider though. What gatherings fit the category of "in Jesus name"?
A worship service, or business meeting, seems like it would fit,
But can two Christians meet for coffee in Jesus' name?
I suppose, if they are prepared to do kingdom business. Discipleship/fellowship/encouragement. ???

/

You're probably tired of hearing from me by now, but I think it's just a matter of purpose. Gathering and meeting for the purpose of meeting with God, as opposed to a secular or practical kind of purpose. Like how the angels assembled and presented themselves before God. We are to distinguish between the holy and the common.

 

[St. SteVen]

I read it but didn't understand the connection between what Jesus said and what you are saying about Benedictions/Invocations. ... Jesus came to give and show us a way, a simple living way, a way of Life, not to introduce a form of ecclesiasticism. ...

What do you make of this?

Luke 10:5 NIV
“When you enter a house, first say, ‘Peace to this house.’

Matthew 10:13 NIV
If the home is deserving, let your peace rest on it; if it is not, let your peace return to you.

Mark 5:34 NIV
He said to her, “Daughter, your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be freed from your suffering.”

Luke 24:36 NIV
While they were still talking about this, Jesus himself stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.”

Mark 10:16 NIV
And he took the children in his arms, placed his hands on them and blessed them.

Luke 24:50-51 NIV
When he had led them out to the vicinity of Bethany, he lifted up his hands and blessed them.
51 While he was blessing them, he left them and was taken up into heaven.


/

 

[St. SteVen]

? You advertised this thread and invited comment, so I commented. Just wanted to try and share a vision for the new covenant church that is the same as or close to what the new testament scriptures depict. We've been doing it all wrong....we need to have our minds renewed to better see how things should be with the church. "When you come together, everyone of you hath....." something to contribute according to the gift that is within them.....as the Spirit of Christ leads.....He being the Head of His church.

What does that have to do with the topic?

/

 

[St. SteVen]

You're probably tired of hearing from me by now, but I think it's just a matter of purpose. Gathering and meeting for the purpose of meeting with God, as opposed to a secular or practical kind of purpose. Like how the angels assembled and presented themselves before God. We are to distinguish between the holy and the common.

Sounds as if you never been on a leadership board at a church or
understand what is required to make sure the roof doesn't leak and that the bills get paid.
Not to mention putting up with fine folks like you. - LOL

/

 

[St. SteVen]

Pray and bless, as the Spirit leads, that's all.

See posts #11 and #12 please.
That's what I am proposing.

It was also the thrust of the OP.
Which seems to gone over the head of most respondents. (my bad)

/