Two resurrections who they are

[afaithfulone4u]

This will be the First resurrection, the martyr's who are resting under the altar in heaven who will awake and come with Christ to Catch Up those who remained alive worthy to escape because they are blameless and they will be the 144,000 holy ones who were sealed from the harm for they retained the Word of God in their foreheads(thoughts) to overcome the lusts of the flesh being made into the image of Christ(attributes) They will be kings and priests for God and reign with the Word/Christ. It maybe that their families of those who were found worthy will be spared just as Noah's were when the first world was destroyed but I am not sure. If you look at the story if Noah, you will see it say and Noah "remained alive".... and all those who were with him. It is meaning that Noah was spiritually alive to God, but that the others in his family, who it never says walked with God as Noah, were just alive meaning they were just with him and not passed on, but not necessarily alive to God.
When Joseph's brother's came out of Egypt their whole household came with them 70 in all. So the son's who will marry the Bride and walk in white with Christ and martyr's may have the privilege of their families with them.

Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

First Resurrection:

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
KJV


All those who may have received Jesus to be saved to life again, but did not grow in Him to the fullness of Christ because they loved their lives more than Jesus and did not receive a washing of the Word, nor did they want to clothe themselves in Christ, nor feed upon the Bread of life for they either didn't desire to or didn't have the time. Which is really the same thing for we ALWAYS make time for the things we love to do.
So, they may have their name written down in the book of life, but their rewards will be according to what they have done in the body natural body and the body of Christ.


Here is the second resurrection where most come back to life, yet some to be thrown into the lake of fire for unbelief and rejection of Christ and others who are found in the book of life, which is the only time the book is seen opened so there must be people in this group who will be in it, will be the meek who inherit the rest of the earth as the saved nations outside of the Bride heavenly Jerusalem the capital of the world!

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Second resurrection:

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
KJV

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I think your interpretation is filled with error and assumption, not to mention contradiction. Paul said that the dead in Christ would be resurrected at his return; not some, all:

For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive [and] remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-18

It appears that you are assuming those who don't live up to "the standard" won't be part of the first resurrection; that only those who were killed, didn't worship the beast or his image, or take his number will be. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob don't appear to fit these qualifications; will they not be there?

(Please don't include unending scripture quotations. But if you must please format them so that your post doesn't look like a pile of spilled nails. Very hard to read.)

 

[afaithfulone4u]

I think your interpretation is filled with error and assumption, not to mention contradiction. Paul said that the dead in Christ would be resurrected at his return; not some, all:

For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive [and] remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep. For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words. 1 Thessalonians 4:15-18

It appears that you are assuming those who don't live up to "the standard" won't be part of the first resurrection; that only those who were killed, didn't worship the beast or his image, or take his number will be. Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob don't appear to fit these qualifications; will they not be there?

No, I don't, the Bible does. Did you not read it say that only the kings and priests being the martyr's who refuse the mark and are asleep under the altar in heaven and the 144,000 redeemed from the earth who are blameless and holy are the first resurrection? Why do you act as if I wrote that?

1 Cor 15:49-54
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood{THOSE STILL LED OF THEIR CARNAL NATURE, IMATURE IN CHRIST OR OUT} cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,
52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54 So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.
KJV
1 Thess 4:15-17
15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.
16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
17 Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.
KJV
Rev 6:9-11
9 And when he had opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of them that were slain for the word of God, and for the testimony which they held:
10 And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?
11 And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest{SLEEP} yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.
KJV

1 Kings 19:18
18 Yet I have left me seven thousand in Israel, all the knees which have not bowed unto Baal, and every mouth which hath not kissed him.
KJV
Rom 11:1-8
11:1 I say then, Hath God cast away his people? God forbid. For I also am an Israelite, of the seed of Abraham, of the tribe of Benjamin.
2 God hath not cast away his people which he foreknew. Wot ye not what the scripture saith of Elias? how he maketh intercession to God against Israel, saying,
3 Lord, they have killed thy prophets, and digged down thine altars; and I am left alone, and they seek my life.
4 But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace.{THESE ARE THE DRY BONES OF EZEK37 WHO CAME OUT OF THEIR GRAVES AT JESUS' RESURRECTION ONCE THE DEBT WAS PAID AND THEY ARE THE SAME 7,000 SOULS THEY ARE DEVOUT JEWS IN JERUSALEM}
6 And if by grace, then is it no more of works: otherwise grace is no more grace. But if it be of works, then is it no more grace: otherwise work is no more work.
7 What then? Israel hath not obtained that which he seeketh for; but the election hath obtained it, and the rest were blinded
8(According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.
KJV
Rev 11:11-15
11 And after three days and an half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.
12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.
13 And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14 The second woe is past; and, behold, the third woe cometh quickly.
15 And the seventh angel sounded;
KJV

Jew first... .then comes the birth of the son's of God being the HOLY body of Christ Rev.12


Sorry I did not see your question about father Abraham, and had to add my response late. The 144,000 are Jacob they are of natural Jew and Gentile mothers in the flesh, but born again from above to our spiritual mother heavenly Jerusalem and one Father/God.


Remember Jesus said YOU MUST be born again!

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

You pretty much avoided answering the question: Will Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob be in the first resurrection?

 

[afaithfulone4u]

You pretty much avoided answering the question: Will Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob be in the first resurrection?

No, I didn't they are part of the seven thousand that God has spared for Himself of the dry bones. Please reread my response, I added it late and apologized, but you may have read it before I added it. I didn't see your question about them until after I posted response. The seven thousand killed in the earthquake just after the two witnesses go up I believe are the same seven thousand being devout Jews in Jerusalem now fulfilling prophecy of Ez.37 dry bones, being the whole house of OT Israel. You will notice that if the 144,000 are the 12 tribes of Jacob sons and are all alive to this day because they were sealed from harm in these last days
. The follow the Lamb were every they go. The body of Christ is made of Jews(Rachel& Leah) and Gentiles(Egyptian servants) as the One New Man

Rev 14:1-5
14:1 And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.
2 And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps:
3 And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth.
4 These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb.
5 And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God.
KJV

Remember the 10 virgins, 5 wise, 5 unwise?

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

Your teachings are heretical and a stumbling block.

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

Your teachings are heretical and a stumbling block.

Your teachings are heretical and a stumbling block.

Quite. It's not the first time I've heard of a secret rapture for the "spiritual" and the rest have to go through the tribulation and will be picked up later IF they don't get the mark of the beast,

 

[veteran]

John 5:26-29
26 For as the Father hath life in Himself; so hath He given to the Son to have life in Himself;
27 And hath given Him authority to execute judgment also, because He is the Son of man.
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear His voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
(KJV)

That destroys... any idea that the wicked dead are not resurrected on the day of Christ's coming. BOTH resurrection types occur on the day of Christ's return, not just for those in Christ Jesus.

This means one has to stop and think as to how the "dead" of Rev.20:5 is actually meant. It's not about literally dead people in literal graves. It's about spiritually dead souls of the raised wicked ("resurrection of damnation").


When our Lord Jesus returns, those not destined to be destroyed on the day of His coming will be resurrected to their particular type, either the "resurrection of life" (which is the first resurrection), or to the "resurrection of damnation" (for the wicked).

ONLY those of the "resurrection of damnation" will STILL be subject to the "second death" mentioned in Rev.20.

Our Lord Jesus revealed these two resurrected groups co-existing during His future Milennial reign with His elect, in Ezekiel 44, in all His teachings about those cast to the "outer darkness", and also in Rev.22:14-15 about those who may enter into the gates of the City and have right to the tree of life, vs. the wicked who will be outside the gates in that time.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
There are but two resurrections (Dan 12:2, John 5:29). Since the second
resurrection is reserved for the dead (Rev 20:11-15) then I'm pretty sure
that Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob will be in on the first resurrection because
according to Jesus' testimony, as an expert witness in all matters pertaining
to the afterlife; the patriarchs aren't registered with the dead; but rather with
the living, even though they're currently deceased. (Mark 12:26-27)

Believing Christians are registered with the living (John 5:24) while unbelieving
Christians are registered with the dead. (Matt 7:22-23)

Buen Camino
/

 

[1peterlight]

I may have missed something but I am curious as to what the second death in Revelation is? Is this after the 1000 year reign and Satan's return? Thank you. I am also curious in case I missed, why did God reserve 7000 from Israel but 144,000 are sealed. I read the post about the dry bones, but is this an additional 7000 then to the 144,000?

 

[Episkopos]

This will be the First resurrection, the martyr's who are resting under the altar in heaven who will awake and come with Christ to Catch Up those who remained alive worthy to escape because they are blameless and they will be the 144,000 holy ones who were sealed from the harm for they retained the Word of God in their foreheads(thoughts) to overcome the lusts of the flesh being made into the image of Christ(attributes) They will be kings and priests for God and reign with the Word/Christ. It maybe that their families of those who were found worthy will be spared just as Noah's were when the first world was destroyed but I am not sure. If you look at the story if Noah, you will see it say and Noah "remained alive".... and all those who were with him. It is meaning that Noah was spiritually alive to God, but that the others in his family, who it never says walked with God as Noah, were just alive meaning they were just with him and not passed on, but not necessarily alive to God.
When Joseph's brother's came out of Egypt their whole household came with them 70 in all. So the son's who will marry the Bride and walk in white with Christ and martyr's may have the privilege of their families with them.

Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years,
3 And cast him into the bottomless pit, and shut him up, and set a seal upon him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years should be fulfilled: and after that he must be loosed a little season.

First Resurrection:

4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,
KJV


All those who may have received Jesus to be saved to life again, but did not grow in Him to the fullness of Christ because they loved their lives more than Jesus and did not receive a washing of the Word, nor did they want to clothe themselves in Christ, nor feed upon the Bread of life for they either didn't desire to or didn't have the time. Which is really the same thing for we ALWAYS make time for the things we love to do.
So, they may have their name written down in the book of life, but their rewards will be according to what they have done in the body natural body and the body of Christ.


Here is the second resurrection where most come back to life, yet some to be thrown into the lake of fire for unbelief and rejection of Christ and others who are found in the book of life, which is the only time the book is seen opened so there must be people in this group who will be in it, will be the meek who inherit the rest of the earth as the saved nations outside of the Bride heavenly Jerusalem the capital of the world!

Rev 20:7 And when the thousand years are expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison,

8 And shall go out to deceive the nations which are in the four quarters of the earth, Gog and Magog, to gather them together to battle: the number of whom is as the sand of the sea.
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Second resurrection:

11 And I saw a great white throne, and him that sat on it, from whose face the earth and the heaven fled away; and there was found no place for them.
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.
KJV

Very good! The Lord bless you!

 

[veteran]

I may have missed something but I am curious as to what the second death in Revelation is? Is this after the 1000 year reign and Satan's return? Thank you. I am also curious in case I missed, why did God reserve 7000 from Israel but 144,000 are sealed. I read the post about the dry bones, but is this an additional 7000 then to the 144,000?

The "second death" of Rev.20 is one's soul with spirit cast into the "lake of fire" at the end of Christ's "thousand years" reign.

Different times between the 7,000 and the 144,000. Revelation 7 is not about those 144,000 of Israel being the only ones sealed with His seal. Rev.7:9 forward is showing us a FUTURE look at Gentile believers that came out of great tribulation before Christ's Throne, and that is a future view AFTER His return and gathering of His Church. That "great multitude" there is so many it cannot be numbered.

But the 144,000 apply specifically... to Israelites of those 12 tribes (Dan is left out). It's important to note that historically and Biblically only the 3 tribes of Judah, Benjamin, and Levi represent the Jews. The rest represent the ten lost tribes of Israel, minus Dan.

.
There are but two resurrections (Dan 12:2, John 5:29). Since the second
resurrection is reserved for the dead (Rev 20:11-15) then I'm pretty sure
that Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob will be in on the first resurrection because
according to Jesus' testimony, as an expert witness in all matters pertaining
to the afterlife; the patriarchs aren't registered with the dead; but rather with
the living, even though they're currently deceased. (Mark 12:26-27)

Believing Christians are registered with the living (John 5:24) while unbelieving
Christians are registered with the dead. (Matt 7:22-23)

Buen Camino
/

There is no reserved resurrection for the dead, which wrongly implies men's doctrines that the Rev.20:5 "dead" aren't raised at Christ's second coming also, like John 5:28-29 shows.

Many on that doctrine that the "dead" of that verse are still waiting it out in the ground have failed to understand that at Christ's second coming this present flesh world will be over, done, and no more. Christ's Salvation is not to our flesh bodies; it's to our spirit with soul, being given a "spiritual body" like Paul revealed in 1 Cor.15, not another flesh body. None will be in flesh type bodies after Christ's return, and that applies to the wicked dead also, as John 5:28-29 does reveal.

 

[HeRoseFromTheDead]

I may have missed something but I am curious as to what the second death in Revelation is? Is this after the 1000 year reign and Satan's return? Thank you. I am also curious in case I missed, why did God reserve 7000 from Israel but 144,000 are sealed. I read the post about the dry bones, but is this an additional 7000 then to the 144,000?

The second death is after the 1000 years and satan's return.

There were 7000 persons in Elijah's day who were still faithful to GOD. That is all that means.

The 144,000 are a future remnant that will be, or are, sealed by GOD for some purpose.

 

[Webers_Home]

.
The Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15 doesn't take place
until the close of the millennium and the complete destruction of the current
cosmos. (Rev 20:5-6, Rev 20:11)

The dead are mentioned in connection with the Great White Throne event
four times while the living aren't mentioned because their resurrection will
have taken place earlier. If any of the living attend the Great White Throne
event at all it will be as spectators rather than any of the poor slobs on trial.
And nobody goes to heaven from the Great White Throne. The reason being
that heaven is only for the living.

†. Rev 20:15 . .Whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast
into the lake of fire.

Buen Camino
/

 

[veteran]

.
The Great White Throne event depicted at Rev 20:11-15 doesn't take place
until the close of the millennium and the complete destruction of the current
cosmos. (Rev 20:5-6, Rev 20:11)

The dead are mentioned in connection with the Great White Throne event
four times while the living aren't mentioned because their resurrection will
have taken place earlier. If any of the living attend the Great White Throne
event at all it will be as spectators rather than any of the poor slobs on trial.
And nobody goes to heaven from the Great White Throne. The reason being
that heaven is only for the living.

†. Rev 20:15 . .Whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast
into the lake of fire.

Buen Camino
/

The "dead" are still called... "the dead" even when they appear standing before God's Great White Throne Judgment, as written in Rev.20.


Rev 20:12
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
(KJV)

At one time I did not understand this, especially in relation to John 5:28-29, until... I began recalling the idea of the spiritually dead which our Lord Jesus gave, like Matt.8:22; Matt.22:32; Matt.23:27; Luke 11:44.

God's Word gives a teaching about the concept of spiritual death vs. eternal Life through Christ Jesus. It is applied to a person alive walking upon the earth too!

How many didn't know there are DEAD people walking around us today upon this earth? I'm not talking about Hollywood horror movies either.

Matt 23:27
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
(KJV)

Jude 1:12
12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
(KJV)

The idea of those being called "twice dead" means when they die in their flesh, and then the second death of their spirit in the future lake of fire which is a spiritual death. The idea of resurrection per 1 Cor.15 is to a "spiritual body", not to another flesh body.


Mark 12:26-27
26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
(KJV)

Luke 20:37-38
37 Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.
38 For He is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto Him.
(KJV)

Likewise, God's Word covers the idea of "the living" in the spiritual body/resurrection sense too.


At Christ's future second coming, ALL still in flesh bodies upon this earth are going to be changed, at the twinkling of an eye, like Apostle Paul showed in 1 Corinthians 15 (pulling from Isaiah 25). Also, all those who have died will be resurrected at that same time of Christ's coming (per John 5:28-29). This is something we as believers on Christ Jesus are to understand, not be confused about. This is why John 5:28-29 reveals there are TWO types of resurrection on the day of Christ's return, one for the just and another for the wicked.

When Jesus went and preached to the spirits in prison, He was preaching The Gospel to 'the dead' there, and led out those who believed The Gospel (1 Peter 3:18-20; 1 Peter 4:5-6). Those spirits were of those that had died back to Noah's days. Were they literaly dead in literal graves? Absolutely not. They were SPIRITUALLY dead, which meant their spirit was subject to perishing later at God's Great White Throne Judgment.

That's the state of "the dead" of Rev.20 also like those "spirits in prison". They are NOT in literal graves with no conscious awareness. It's simply that their spirit is still subject to the "second death". God considers the soul/spirit after flesh death as either 'spiritually' dead, or of 'the living' like Abraham, Moses, etc. (see also our Lord's story of Lazarus and the rich man of Luke 16).

If the believer misses this important Bible matter, they will never come to a true understanding of those Rev.20 Scriptures of who those 'dead' are, and what state they are in after Christ's coming to the end of the thousand years and thereafter.

 

[logabe]

The "dead" are still called... "the dead" even when they appear standing before God's Great White Throne Judgment, as written in Rev.20.


Rev 20:12
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
(KJV)

At one time I did not understand this, especially in relation to John 5:28-29, until... I began recalling the idea of the spiritually dead which our Lord Jesus gave, like Matt.8:22; Matt.22:32; Matt.23:27; Luke 11:44.

God's Word gives a teaching about the concept of spiritual death vs. eternal Life through Christ Jesus. It is applied to a person alive walking upon the earth too!

How many didn't know there are DEAD people walking around us today upon this earth? I'm not talking about Hollywood horror movies either.

Matt 23:27
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
(KJV)

Jude 1:12
12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
(KJV)

The idea of those being called "twice dead" means when they die in their flesh, and then the second death of their spirit in the future lake of fire which is a spiritual death. The idea of resurrection per 1 Cor.15 is to a "spiritual body", not to another flesh body.


Mark 12:26-27
26 And as touching the dead, that they rise: have ye not read in the book of Moses, how in the bush God spake unto him, saying, I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?
27 He is not the God of the dead, but the God of the living: ye therefore do greatly err.
(KJV)

Luke 20:37-38
37 Now that the dead are raised, even Moses shewed at the bush, when he calleth the Lord the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob.
38 For He is not a God of the dead, but of the living: for all live unto Him.
(KJV)

Likewise, God's Word covers the idea of "the living" in the spiritual body/resurrection sense too.


At Christ's future second coming, ALL still in flesh bodies upon this earth are going to be changed, at the twinkling of an eye, like Apostle Paul showed in 1 Corinthians 15 (pulling from Isaiah 25). Also, all those who have died will be resurrected at that same time of Christ's coming (per John 5:28-29). This is something we as believers on Christ Jesus are to understand, not be confused about. This is why John 5:28-29 reveals there are TWO types of resurrection on the day of Christ's return, one for the just and another for the wicked.

When Jesus went and preached to the spirits in prison, He was preaching The Gospel to 'the dead' there, and led out those who believed The Gospel (1 Peter 3:18-20; 1 Peter 4:5-6). Those spirits were of those that had died back to Noah's days. Were they literaly dead in literal graves? Absolutely not. They were SPIRITUALLY dead, which meant their spirit was subject to perishing later at God's Great White Throne Judgment.

That's the state of "the dead" of Rev.20 also like those "spirits in prison". They are NOT in literal graves with no conscious awareness. It's simply that their spirit is still subject to the "second death". God considers the soul/spirit after flesh death as either 'spiritually' dead, or of 'the living' like Abraham, Moses, etc. (see also our Lord's story of Lazarus and the rich man of Luke 16).

If the believer misses this important Bible matter, they will never come to a true understanding of those Rev.20 Scriptures of who those 'dead' are, and what state they are in after Christ's coming to the end of the thousand years and thereafter.

The whole point was to let us know he wasn't a spirit after His Resurection.
Luke 24:36-42 says,

36 While they were telling these things, He
Himself stood in their midst and said to them,
"Peace be to you."
37 But they were startled and frightened and
thought that they were seeing a spirit.
38 And He said to them, "Why are you troubled,
and why do doubts arise in your hearts ?
39 " See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself ;
touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh
and bones as you see that I have."
40 And when He had said this, He showed them
His hands and His feet.
41 While they still could not believe it because of
their joy and amazement, He said to them, " Have
you anything here to eat ?"
42 They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish ;
43 and He took it and ate it before them.

Is Jesus showing us how we will be in our resurrection? It looks like He has
flesh and bones. He even looked like Himself before He died. He also showed
them He could eat food like them. Does a spirit need food?

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[Webers_Home]

.
†. John 6:53 . . Jesus said to them: I tell you the truth; unless you eat the
flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.

The life to which Jesus referred wasn't human life; but rather, a species of
life that's impervious to death.

†. John 6:54 . .Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life,
and I will raise him up at the last day.

So then; people who lack eternal life are dead on the hoof. But worse;
according to God's testimony as an expert witness in all matters pertaining
to His own son; people who lack eternal life don't have His son; in other
words: they are not only dead; but also quite christless.

†. 1John 5:11-12 . .And this is what God has testified: He has given us
eternal life, and this life is in His son. So whoever has God's son has the life;
whoever does not have the life, does not have His son.

Are there any Christians out and about who are don't have eternal life now
but instead are hoping to obtain it in the next life? Are you kidding? Of course!
There's approximately 1.2 billion in just one denomination alone that I could
name; but of course won't. They're all christless, and dead on the hoof.
That's a lot of Christian mortality for just one denomination.

Buen Camino
/

 

[veteran]

The whole point was to let us know he wasn't a spirit after His Resurection.
Luke 24:36-42 says,

36 While they were telling these things, He
Himself stood in their midst and said to them,
"Peace be to you."
37 But they were startled and frightened and
thought that they were seeing a spirit.
38 And He said to them, "Why are you troubled,
and why do doubts arise in your hearts ?
39 " See My hands and My feet, that it is I Myself ;
touch Me and see, for a spirit does not have flesh
and bones as you see that I have."
40 And when He had said this, He showed them
His hands and His feet.
41 While they still could not believe it because of
their joy and amazement, He said to them, " Have
you anything here to eat ?"
42 They gave Him a piece of a broiled fish ;
43 and He took it and ate it before them.

Is Jesus showing us how we will be in our resurrection? It looks like He has
flesh and bones. He even looked like Himself before He died. He also showed
them He could eat food like them. Does a spirit need food?

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

Matt 22:30
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
(KJV)

Mark 12:25
25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
(KJV)

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
(KJV)


Anyone can do a pick 'n choose of Scripture to try and make it say what they want. But God's people try to carefully weigh all Scripture as a whole. That's what must be done to understand this, for in the above Scripture examples our Lord Jesus declared those of the resurrection are "as the angels of God in heaven."

Apostle Paul also declared there in 1 Cor.15 that the resurrection body is not of flesh and blood.

I could also post Scripture proof of how God's heavenly angels manifested on earth and ate man's food, and how God's people in the wilderness ate angel's food, manna from Heaven. Even Hebrews 13:2 tells us to be mindful to entertain strangers, for some have entertained angels and didn't know they were angels.

In Eccl.12:5-7 we are shown early on about our makeup here on earth, our flesh body coming from earthly matter, and our spirit being given from God, which each going back to their original origin at flesh death.

Then there's a multitude of New Testament by Apostle Paul declaring Christ's Salvation to our spirit, and not to our flesh body.

I can cover all that, and all you have is that one Scripture example of our Lord Jesus telling His disciples to touch Him after His Resurrection, to prove to them that He was really there. Our Lord's flesh body was transfigured, our flesh bodies won't be, but will cast off, won't need them anymore ever. His Salvation is not to our flesh, but to our spirit, which is the real part of our being.

 

[logabe]

Matt 22:30
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
(KJV)

Mark 12:25
25 For when they shall rise from the dead, they neither marry, nor are given in marriage; but are as the angels which are in heaven.
(KJV)

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
(KJV)


Anyone can do a pick 'n choose of Scripture to try and make it say what they want. But God's people try to carefully weigh all Scripture as a whole. That's what must be done to understand this, for in the above Scripture examples our Lord Jesus declared those of the resurrection are "as the angels of God in heaven."

Apostle Paul also declared there in 1 Cor.15 that the resurrection body is not of flesh and blood.

I could also post Scripture proof of how God's heavenly angels manifested on earth and ate man's food, and how God's people in the wilderness ate angel's food, manna from Heaven. Even Hebrews 13:2 tells us to be mindful to entertain strangers, for some have entertained angels and didn't know they were angels.

In Eccl.12:5-7 we are shown early on about our makeup here on earth, our flesh body coming from earthly matter, and our spirit being given from God, which each going back to their original origin at flesh death.

Then there's a multitude of New Testament by Apostle Paul declaring Christ's Salvation to our spirit, and not to our flesh body.

I can cover all that, and all you have is that one Scripture example of our Lord Jesus telling His disciples to touch Him after His Resurrection, to prove to them that He was really there. Our Lord's flesh body was transfigured, our flesh bodies won't be, but will cast off, won't need them anymore ever. His Salvation is not to our flesh, but to our spirit, which is the real part of our being.

Let me give you another scripture so you want think I am taking one scripture
out of context. Rom. 8:23 says,

23 Not only so, but we ourselves, who have the firstfruits
of the Spirit, groan inwardly as we wait eagerly for our
adoption as sons, the redemption of our bodies.

Are you waiting eagerly for your adoption as a son, because Paul says, it will be
when God gives us redemption of our body? Our bodies will be changed and we
will not have sin in our members after God completes our redemption.

Paul used a whole chapter to explain the importance of the resurrections and why
it was needed to complete the Plan of God. 1st Cor. 15:12-19 says,

12 But if it is preached that Christ has been raised from
the dead, how can some of you say that there is no
resurrection of the dead?
13 If there is no resurrection of the dead, then not even
Christ has been raised.
14 And if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is
useless and so is your faith.
15 More than that, we are then found to be false witnesses
about God, for we have testified about God that he raised
Christ from the dead. But he did not raise him if in fact the
dead are not raised.
16 For if the dead are not raised, then Christ has not been
raised either.
17 And if Christ has not been raised, your faith is futile; you
are still in your sins.
18 Then those also who have fallen asleep in Christ are lost.
19 If only for this life we have hope in Christ, we are to be
pitied more than all men.

I think Paul makes it very clear that there will be a physical resurrection and we
know and understand that Jesus is our pattern for that resurrection. That's what
the whole Plan of God is all about. That is our hope (Rom. 8:23-24) and Jesus is
coming to fulfill that hope of a better life in the flesh.

Everything that God created was very good, but sin entered into the universe.

What a God! What a Plan!

Logabe

 

[Episkopos]

You pretty much avoided answering the question: Will Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob be in the first resurrection?

Yes! They are a part of the saints. The saints are in the first resurrection.

The second resurrection is for the world at large both righteous and wicked. Those not written in the book of life in the second rez are killed in fire.
The first resurrection is actually for Israel, the people of God and all those who are born of incorruptible seed.