What are your thoughts on this cartoon?

[Shingy]

...Focusing on the last three boxes of the cartoon, what do you think?

18A certain ruler asked him, "Good teacher, what must I do to inherit eternal life?" 19"Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good—except God alone. 20You know the commandments: 'Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not give false testimony, honor your father and mother.'" 21"All these I have kept since I was a boy," he said. 22When Jesus heard this, he said to him, "You still lack one thing. Sell everything you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven. Then come, follow me." 23When he heard this, he became very sad, because he was a man of great wealth. 24Jesus looked at him and said, "How hard it is for the rich to enter the kingdom of God! 25Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." 26Those who heard this asked, "Who then can be saved?" 27Jesus replied, "What is impossible with men is possible with God." 28Peter said to him, "We have left all we had to follow you!" 29"I tell you the truth," Jesus said to them, "no one who has left home or wife or brothers or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30will fail to receive many times as much in this age and, in the age to come, eternal life."Luke 18
edit: sorry, this should go in the Bible section.

 

[Shingy]

anyone?111

 

[sevver]

I don't think that it means that you have to sell everything you own in a literal sense. What I feel that it means is that you shall have no God but God, you shall worship nothing but God, and you shall hold nothing Dear, except God. If you love drinking more than God, you should give up drinking, smoking, give it up, whatever it is, give it up and put your mind on God, and the furthering of his Kingdom.What he was doing IMHO, is telling the rich man to sell his possessions, because, his possessions were more important to him than God was.

 

[HammerStone]

The cartoon makes the same mistake a lot of people make. There is no condition of selling all of your earthly goods to get to heaven; you could do the inverse and still come out in trouble. The point of the message of Jesus there is evident when you read it slowly. It has nothing to do with selling everything you have; instead, it has everything to do with where your heart is. As sevver said, you can translate this to anything. The point is that Jesus knew his heart and he still put his earthly possessions above God. Notice that it was not said that a rich man couldn't enter heaven; it just becomes a harder task because those who generally have it all place high value in material things. Digging deeper into the Hebrew, there was actually a gate literally called Needle's Eye. What sources we do have suggest that this gate was so low that a camel would have to pass underneath it without any sort of burden. In other words, the focus is even more on removing the burdens of life - be they riches, people, or anything else that we place above God. I Timothy 6:10For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.

 

[Hylke]

(sevver;8403)
I don't think that it means that you have to sell everything you own in a literal sense. What I feel that it means is that you shall have no God but God, you shall worship nothing but God, and you shall hold nothing Dear, except God. If you love drinking more than God, you should give up drinking, smoking, give it up, whatever it is, give it up and put your mind on God, and the furthering of his Kingdom.What he was doing IMHO, is telling the rich man to sell his possessions, because, his possessions were more important to him than God was.
But I'm guessing you live in a life of luxury right? And is God more important than that to you? Now don't just say yes, consider.Did you ever eat meat? if yes: congratulations you just killed one of God's creations in order to eat a good meal, while plants could've fed you.

 

[sevver]

(Hylke;8438)
But I'm guessing you live in a life of luxury right? And is God more important than that to you? Now don't just say yes, consider.Did you ever eat meat? if yes: congratulations you just killed one of God's creations in order to eat a good meal, while plants could've fed you.
So am I not to eat meat? I believe that early on all things were given to us as food. As for living in the life of luxury, I suppose I do, I am not super rich, but I have a modest home, and a couple of cars, two kids, one more on the way, and a good marriage. Everyone is healthy, we don't have alot of "toys", but we survive. I don't have a big screen tv, just a 27" and a couple of 13" ones for the kids, I have a computer, and a laptop for the wife and kids, we have one phone in our house, and me and the wife have a cell phone. Honestly, I don't feel that I value material possessions, I would not care if it all absolved into nothing, I still have God, I have been a part of some amazing things since finding him. Honestly, the whole eating plants thing has me stumped though, would you follow that up with some good scriptural backing? If it is just your personal feelings on the subject then I will happily dismiss it.

 

[HammerStone]

Did you ever eat meat? if yes: congratulations you just killed one of God's creations in order to eat a good meal, while plants could've fed you.
Not to be too snide here, but did you ever read the Scriptures? Genesis 1:28And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. That is, of course ignoring the food laws which specifically explain what is clean and what is not for consumption: Leviticus 11:1-4And the LORD spake unto Moses and to Aaron, saying unto them,2Speak unto the children of Israel, saying, These are the beasts which ye shall eat among all the beasts that are on the earth.3Whatsoever parteth the hoof, and is clovenfooted, and cheweth the cud, among the beasts, that shall ye eat. There's nothing wrong with preferring vegetables and fruits to meat; but don't try to pawn it off as being a sin to eat meat when it's written right there in front of us that it is not.

 

[Shingy]

(sevver;8403)
I don't think that it means that you have to sell everything you own in a literal sense. What I feel that it means is that you shall have no God but God, you shall worship nothing but God, and you shall hold nothing Dear, except God. If you love drinking more than God, you should give up drinking, smoking, give it up, whatever it is, give it up and put your mind on God, and the furthering of his Kingdom.What he was doing IMHO, is telling the rich man to sell his possessions, because, his possessions were more important to him than God was.
I think it would be nice if it were literal. But, then in a way, we'd be hippies.(SwampFox;8407)
The cartoon makes the same mistake a lot of people make. There is no condition of selling all of your earthly goods to get to heaven; you could do the inverse and still come out in trouble. The point of the message of Jesus there is evident when you read it slowly. It has nothing to do with selling everything you have; instead, it has everything to do with where your heart is. As sevver said, you can translate this to anything. The point is that Jesus knew his heart and he still put his earthly possessions above God. Notice that it was not said that a rich man couldn't enter heaven; it just becomes a harder task because those who generally have it all place high value in material things. Digging deeper into the Hebrew, there was actually a gate literally called Needle's Eye. What sources we do have suggest that this gate was so low that a camel would have to pass underneath it without any sort of burden. In other words, the focus is even more on removing the burdens of life - be they riches, people, or anything else that we place above God. I Timothy 6:10For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows.
Kinda like I can interpret Genesis into anything and still make it meaningful. I agree with both of your interpretations on this. I think it can symbolise removing the extra baggage from our lives, and making God number one. Thanks.(Hylke;8438)
But I'm guessing you live in a life of luxury right? And is God more important than that to you? Now don't just say yes, consider.Did you ever eat meat? if yes: congratulations you just killed one of God's creations in order to eat a good meal, while plants could've fed you.
I sometimes wonder that, too. Would I really die for God over my family and possesions? Sometimes I don't thik I would, but I can only speculate. I agree that eating meat is completely uneccessary for about anyone who owns a computer can sustain a healthy diet purely on vegetables and a vitamin derrived from veetables based supplement. Unfortuantely, the Bible states it is OK to eat meat; God ate meat as an angel in Abraham's house, Jesus ate meat, and also murdered 2,000 piggies. Some of the 2,000 year old morals listed in the Bible don't really cut it in first world country contmeporary times, imo.

 

[Hylke]

Well ok sorry my fault.But anyway, my main point was that I wonder if anyone would give up luxury if it was just a minor offense to God, just slightly across the line that the bible draws.I mean: there are people who consider having a pc or even a tv 'unchristian', there are people who think wearing a condom/going to the doctor to get treated is 'unchristian'. Are those claims based on nothing?This is the basis for my believe that being a Christian/Muslim/Jew has absolutely nothing to do with the book they believe in, you could easily say that one thing should be taken literally, while the other is metaphorical, if Jesus says give everything away, but you live in a wealthy country like we do, you could say it's a metaphore, perhaps you say he means giving away luxury that you don't need, such as tv's pc's etc.perhaps he just means putting faith in front of everything, perhaps he means serving just one god, who knows?But the comic, in my opinion, shows the state of modern believe: taking literal what suits you, and taking metaphorical what doesn't suit you.Now I heard someone say, and I do not know if this is true, that the bible says you should kill any man that shares the bed with another man equal to a woman. Or in other words: kill homosexuals.I don't see any Christians doing that, some just reject homosexuals, some don't and think they are normal, however in other countries they get beaten up or even killed. But in a country like the one we live in, this would be illegal, therefore not suitable to be followed.

 

[Shingy]

I agree, most Bible literalists do interpret the Bible which every way they want, but that's the beauty of these millenia old Holy books;One can believe they're real, and then interpret them to say whatever you want. The irony here is clear.

 

[HammerStone]

Jesus ate meat, and also murdered 2,000 piggies
I hate to be picky here Shingy, but this statement came to my attention. Jesus didn't kill the pigs.

 

[Christina]

(Hylke;8487)
Well ok sorry my fault.But anyway, my main point was that I wonder if anyone would give up luxury if it was just a minor offense to God, just slightly across the line that the bible draws.I mean: there are people who consider having a pc or even a tv 'unchristian', there are people who think wearing a condom/going to the doctor to get treated is 'unchristian'. Are those claims based on nothing?This is the basis for my believe that being a Christian/Muslim/Jew has absolutely nothing to do with the book they believe in, you could easily say that one thing should be taken literally, while the other is metaphorical, if Jesus says give everything away, but you live in a wealthy country like we do, you could say it's a metaphore, perhaps you say he means giving away luxury that you don't need, such as tv's pc's etc.perhaps he just means putting faith in front of everything, perhaps he means serving just one god, who knows?But the comic, in my opinion, shows the state of modern believe: taking literal what suits you, and taking metaphorical what doesn't suit you.Now I heard someone say, and I do not know if this is true, that the bible says you should kill any man that shares the bed with another man equal to a woman. Or in other words: kill homosexuals.I don't see any Christians doing that, some just reject homosexuals, some don't and think they are normal, however in other countries they get beaten up or even killed. But in a country like the one we live in, this would be illegal, therefore not suitable to be followed.
I realize you are an athiest so speak out of lack of knowlegde butYou are confusing believes of men, man made religions with being a ChristianTHEY ARE NOT THE SAMEReligion = a man made group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their god.All Religions other than Christain = A group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their god.Christian religions = To be called a christian religion you must first believe that Christ is the son of God. Then its, A group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their God.Christian = A person who believes Christ is the son of God.(the end that's all)If a person believes this they "may" want to study his Word.(not required) In the bible or at a church.You can not take the rules and beliefs of all Christian religions (made by men)and put them under the same umbrella or you will never make any sense out of it. You are mixing Gods word(the bible) with teachings, sayings, worship rules of men.You are trying to make sense of and judge being a christian based on religion (man made rules of worship) Some christian religions are good some are bad most fall in between.This site and many christians strive to leave the religion to others and just study Gods word the Bible. Now if you want to learn the Bible so you can make an educated desion about it, you are in the right place if you want to talk religion and make uneducated statements and judgements you might be happier somewhere else.I hope this makes sense to you I believe you stated somewhere else that you follow the ten commandments well you were right in saying that "IF" you believed that Christ was the son of God you would be a christain right now. just the way you are. Maybe even a better one, than some of those who claim to be christains or ones that are so confused and blined by their religions. They don't hear Gods words.

 

[Christina]

(Shingy;8514)
I agree, most Bible literalists do interpret the Bible which every way they want, but that's the beauty of these millenia old Holy books;One can believe they're real, and then interpret them to say whatever you want. The irony here is clear.
shingyyou are young and a self described new christian who is just learning. The fact that you tend to side with self described atheist before learning Gods word the Bible is not a very good way to start.Did you ever stop to think you agree with them because you do not have that much more knowledge than they do yet ? Once you learn more you will see the error of their thinking. You need to concentrate on your studies. If you have real questions we are here to help you. Be very careful encouraging non-believers who speak out of No knowledge of Gods word, you don't yet have enough knowledge to know if they are wrong or not.

 

[Hylke]

(kriss;8520)
You are confusing believes of men, man made religions with being a ChristianTHEY ARE NOT THE SAMEReligion = a man made group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their god.All Religions other than Christain = A group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their god.Christian religions = To be called a christian religion you must first believe that Christ is the son of God. Then its, A group of rules of worship, and/or beliefs based on mans understanding of their God.
Well that's a cultral thing, if you where a Muslim you'd say the same thing only this time about the followers of Muhammed versus 'other religions'.There are probably hundres of different religions on this tiny planet.And offcourse every single one of them claims that they are the only one who are right.Now personally I am an atheïst, which means I rely on truth given to be by what I can see. Now let's look at the philosophy og the philosopher Ludwig Wittgenstein: he says that you can only speak of that which you can see, speaking of things you cannot see doesn't have to be false, it can be true, perhaps there is a God, only it is pointless to speak of such thing.Imagine every thing that can exists, but you cannot see, now this number of things would be infinite, and each and everyone of them are just as likely as any God of any religion.Now I don't say there isn't a God, perhaps there is, but as long as I cannot see any evidence of this God I can savely assume that this God does not exist just as Fairies and Unicorns do not exist.Now believe what you want, but don't go claiming that your faith is undoubtly the only faith that is true, it is merely a possibility.

 

[HammerStone]

Hylke, people have a right to believe what they want. You're not an authority by any stretch of the imagination because you can quote a philosopher; secondly no authority on this planet can tell me what to believe in the way of my religion being the way. I've gathered from the rest of your threads and this one that you're either a very naive person or you're simply looking for a fight. And actually Hylke, your knowledge is already flawed. There is at least one religion I can think of that teaches all of the major world religions are right in their own way. This has been an increasing trend and will continue to be so. I guess Mr. Wittgenstein would be up a creek if he ever stopped breathing because he couldn't talk about air. Afterall, it's one of those unseen things that shouldn't be talked about.

 

[Hylke]

I misread Kriss, i have reread and wish to apologise, I thought he meant that Christian way of life was above other religions.But anyway: Not breathing air because you can't see it? You misread me as well.Offcourse with seeing I mean detecting, observing or whatever the word is, you can feel air, you can detect air molecules, and that makes it enough to speak about.With things that cannot be seen I mean the metaphysical, such as God, which fall beyond our 'sight'. And no I am not an authority, but Mr. Wittgenstein is, his philosophy is regarded as one of the greatest of modern times, and is generally accepted as true. And quite frankly I am suprised that you haven't ever heard of him.But basically, his most famous sentence is: "Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muß man schweigen" ("Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent"). ,through this he destroys the many attempts to proof God, and the entire metaphysical section of philosophy. And I find it strange that a person who seems to know so much about religion and beliefs doesn't know about what philosophers have said on these subjects.

 

[sevver]

I actually find that there is plenty of evidence concerning Christianity's plausibility out there. The Bible has been proven to have been unchanged for over 2200 years (OT), and there has been significant archeological discoveries that support Christianity, read The New Evidence That Demands a Verdict if you need more. Nothing in the Bible has ever been disproved, everything is factual, and accurate, there is really no reason to believe otherwise. I have spent alot of time studying, and even currently am researching a few books at a time.For years I also was more of an Agnostic, not necessarily an Athiest, although I may have portrayed myself as such at times, but I always sort of thought that there had to be something supernatural about how we came to be. Darwin introduced a theory that has been accepted as fact, but it always bothered me that there has never been found that "something" that represents "us" during our Evolution, nor anything else for that matter. So if the Theory of Evolution is incorrect, then I have to wonder...

 

[Christina]

hylkeI was simply trying to point out that all christians believe in Christ. but choose different ways/religions to express it. We don't all agree on the ways it is expressed because they are created by men.But we all agree that the Bible is Gods word. So when you make stupid statements about having to give away our T.V. sets. You are judging us on stupid untrue rumors that have nothing to do with being a christian. You hear one thing about one Christian religion and assume that we all believe it.I was just trying to show you that being a Christian doesn't mean following any certain christian religion. its about whats in your heart.Some people just choose to honor God by going to church but not for all of us.

 

[betchevy]

But basically, his most famous sentence is: "Wovon man nicht sprechen kann, darüber muß man schweigen" ("Whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent"). ,through this he destroys the many attempts to proof God, and the entire metaphysical section of philosophy. And I find it strange that a person who seems to know so much about religion and beliefs doesn't know about what philosophers have said on these subjects.Yes , we all speak several languages and study the major philosphers of all the world in them... you are way out of your league here....I 'm not saying in which direction..But I'll bet we can quote a lot more scripture than you can...nana..nana nana

 

[Hylke]

@krissYes yes I understand that now, I just misread you the first time