WHAT????? CHURCH FATHERS WERE PRETRIB ???

[rebuilder 454]

In the last part of the vid,we see a ton of reference to ancient pre trib rapture teaching.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Postribbers will be sad to know that all the years they propped up a false hope that Darby started the pretrib rapture doctrine

 

[WPM]

Postribbers will be sad to know that all the years they propped up a false hope that Darby started the pretrib rapture doctrine

More fake news. More twisting of history and facts.

 

[WPM]

In the last part of the vid,we see a ton of reference to ancient pre trib rapture teaching.

Instead of hiding behind these misleading videos. Can you quote and debate the ECF texts that support your claims?

All i see is a twisting of truth from these false teachers.

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

Instead of hiding behind these misleading videos. Can you quote and debate the ECF texts that support your claims?

All i see is a twisting of truth from these false teachers.

He never backs up anything he claims. He thinks just claiming something is true makes it true. It's ridiculous.

 

[WPM]

He never backs up anything he claims. He thinks just claiming something is true makes it true. It's ridiculous.

Welcome to Pretrib! They no longer have Scripture. Their extra-biblical views have been been repeatedly and solidly exposed over the years. They must now resort to misrepresenting the ECFs writings. This whole thing is a joke. They have never studied this for themselves. They just believe what they have been taught.

 

[Marty fox]

Welcome to Pretrib! They no longer have Scripture. Their extra-biblical views have been been repeatedly and solidly exposed over the years. They must now resort to misrepresenting the ECFs writings. This whole thing is a joke. They have never studied this for themselves. They just believe what they have been taught.

Yes true but I was in that same boat for years listening to preachers and then came the left behind books and I thought that I had it all figured out.

What changed for me was the Hank Hanagraph book the apocalypse code and Hank said that the code to the book of revelation is the other books of the bible.

I then was challenged by a Christian Jew to forget all that I was ever taught or heard and actually study what the bible actually said for myself. She showed me the Old Testament symbolic Jewish meaning of what I used to think were literal events in the New Testament and it was like blinders came off of my eyes and I saw the true meaning of the book of revelation

God honoured my own biblical investigation so let’s pray that these others will really want to seek the truth and not just prove their theory. Maybe they are just not there yet and on their own private journey to truth

 

[rebuilder 454]

Yes true but I was in that same boat for years listening to preachers and then came the left behind books and I thought that I had it all figured out.

What changed for me was the Hank Hanagraph book the apocalypse code and Hank said that the code to the book of revelation is the other books of the bible.

I then was challenged by a Christian Jew to forget all that I was ever taught or heard and actually study what the bible actually said for myself. She showed me the Old Testament symbolic Jewish meaning of what I used to think were literal events in the New Testament and it was like blinders came off of my eyes and I saw the true meaning of the book of revelation

God honoured my own biblical investigation so let’s pray that these others will really want to seek the truth and not just prove their theory. Maybe they are just not there yet and on their own private journey to truth

Yes that is correct.
I can, with a bible, defend easily, the pretrib rapture doctrine.
It is one of the easiest and solid doctrines of the bible.

Pretrrists need their own threads since their grand canyon leaps are for the very brave.

You have let men deceive you.

 

[rebuilder 454]

Ever noticed who the mockers and jokers are?
Preterists.
They can not hide that evil operating in them.

Like little pests buzzing in on others threads.
Unable to honestly defend their misguided "doctrine".

 

[rebuilder 454]

Welcome to Pretrib! They no longer have Scripture. Their extra-biblical views have been been repeatedly and solidly exposed over the years. They must now resort to misrepresenting the ECFs writings. This whole thing is a joke. They have never studied this for themselves. They just believe what they have been taught.

Lol
You don't even know what the video has as content.
You are just here to mindlessly troll.

The video DOES NOT ATTEMPT TO ESTABLISH ANY DOCTRINE.
But since you did not investigate your ignorance remains.

Go troll some other thread.
You and your clown buddies.

This Is big boy stuff here .

 

[rebuilder 454]

He never backs up anything he claims. He thinks just claiming something is true makes it true. It's ridiculous.

You can lie like that with a clear conscience?
You need to get saved.
Jesus will clean out all your lying spirits.

 

[Marty fox]

Yes that is correct.
I can, with a bible, defend easily, the pretrib rapture doctrine.
It is one of the easiest and solid doctrines of the bible.

Pretrrists need their own threads since their grand canyon leaps are for the very brave.

You have let men deceive you.

I wasn’t attacking your view I used to view the same myself, I was advising people to start fresh and investigate what the bible really says from the biblical language that it was originally written in and what the message was to the actual people it was originally written too.

It wasn’t written to us alive today it was written to them but it was for us

 

[Spiritual Israelite]

You can lie like that with a clear conscience?

It's the truth. You have never made a coherent argument to back up your claims even once in your life. That is a fact.

You need to get saved.

Judge not or you will be judged with the same measure that you are judging me. Don't put yourself in danger of hell fire by acting as if you are my Judge. You most certainly are not.

Jesus will clean out all your lying spirits.

Jesus wants you to accept the truth taught in His word, but as of now everything you believe related to end times doctrine is false teaching. Pre-trib dispensationalism is full of doctrines of demons.

 

[rebuilder 454]

I wasn’t attacking your view I used to view the same myself, I was advising people to start fresh and investigate what the bible really says from the biblical language that it was originally written in and what the message was to the actual people it was originally written too.

It wasn’t written to us alive today it was written to them but it was for us

Wrong.
The bible is a LIVING WORD.
INSPIRED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT.
IT IS A SPIRIT BOOK WRITTEN BY A SPIRIT MAN.
....TO HIS PEOPLE.
Your starting place is flawed.

 

[Nancy]

Yes true but I was in that same boat for years listening to preachers and then came the left behind books and I thought that I had it all figured out.

What changed for me was the Hank Hanagraph book the apocalypse code and Hank said that the code to the book of revelation is the other books of the bible.

I then was challenged by a Christian Jew to forget all that I was ever taught or heard and actually study what the bible actually said for myself. She showed me the Old Testament symbolic Jewish meaning of what I used to think were literal events in the New Testament and it was like blinders came off of my eyes and I saw the true meaning of the book of revelation

God honoured my own biblical investigation so let’s pray that these others will really want to seek the truth and not just prove their theory. Maybe they are just not there yet and on their own private journey to truth

I do not remember where I found this concise article showing the scriptures that IMHO disprove the PTR. I too was, for a couple of decades was also a proponent of it, and sadly taught others in it I now see it as an escapism theology.

"Why I no longer believe in a pretrib rapture...it isn't biblical:

Many people stop believing in the Pre-Tribulation Rapture (Pre-Trib) by seeing that scripture points to one return of Jesus, not two (Rapture then Second Coming), often citing that verses about the "last trumpet" (1 Cor 15:52) and meeting Christ in the air (1 Thess 4:17) describe the end of the tribulation, not before, with passages like Matthew 24 and Revelation 20 suggesting the resurrection and gathering of believers happens after tribulation, with the "falling away" (2 Thess 2:3) and revealing of the Antichrist happening before the Day of the Lord, meaning Christians will face the Great Tribulation as the "first resurrection" (Rev 20:5) is post-tribulation, challenging the idea of an imminent, secret escape before it. Here are key scripture-based reasons: One Return, Not Two: The Bible describes one single, visible return of Christ, not a secret rapture followed by a public second coming seven years later. Matthew 24:29-31: Says the coming of the Son of Man happens immediately after the tribulation, with the gathering of the elect. Revelation 20:5: Calls the resurrection of believers "the first resurrection," implying it occurs after the tribulation mentioned in the preceding chapters, not before. The Falling Away & Man of Sin: Scripture links the coming of the Lord with specific events that must happen first. 2 Thessalonians 2:3: "That day will not come unless the rebellion occurs and the man of lawlessness is revealed, the man doomed to destruction". This suggests the Antichrist must appear before the Day of the Lord. The Trumpet & Resurrection: The "last trumpet" and the gathering in the air are seen as happening at the end. 1 Corinthians 15:51-52: "In a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed". 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17: The voice, archangel, and trumpet sound as the Lord descends, bringing the dead with Him, consistent with a post-tribulation return, not a secret, pre-trib event. The "Taken" & "Left" in Matthew/Luke: These passages are often interpreted as the wicked being "taken" to judgment and believers "left" to face the coming King, the opposite of the Pre-Trib view. No Separate "Wrath" for Saints: The Bible teaches believers will go through the tribulation, enduring its hardships, rather than being removed from it, as seen in Revelation's seals and the warnings to persevere."

Now, I have many friends and family members who are huge proponents of the PTR and I love all of them dearly. My only objection is that those they teach this to (esp. their children) could be teaching them in error. What is so hard about looking at the other side of things and praying about what they should be teaching...especially those who are "certain" of this doctrine. Just teach both sides and let the chips fall where they may?

 

[Marty fox]

Wrong.
The bible is a LIVING WORD.
INSPIRED BY THE HOLY SPIRIT.
IT IS A SPIRIT BOOK WRITTEN BY A SPIRIT MAN.
....TO HIS PEOPLE.
Your starting place is flawed.

You misunderstand me, of course the bible is the spiritually inspired word of God but some the books are written and addressed to certain people at certain times for certain circumstance, some of the bible was to them not us but they are lessons and teaching for all of the church

 

[amigo de christo]

Yes true but I was in that same boat for years listening to preachers and then came the left behind books and I thought that I had it all figured out.

What changed for me was the Hank Hanagraph book the apocalypse code and Hank said that the code to the book of revelation is the other books of the bible.

I then was challenged by a Christian Jew to forget all that I was ever taught or heard and actually study what the bible actually said for myself. She showed me the Old Testament symbolic Jewish meaning of what I used to think were literal events in the New Testament and it was like blinders came off of my eyes and I saw the true meaning of the book of revelation

God honoured my own biblical investigation so let’s pray that these others will really want to seek the truth and not just prove their theory. Maybe they are just not there yet and on their own private journey to truth

What caused me to realize what was true and what was false , WAS GOD
and HE PUT ME INTO ONE BOOK known as and called the HOLY BIBLE .
Reading JUST that book by the Guidance of the SPIRIT called the HOLY SPIRIT
caused me to quickly realize , WOA , we got folks in pulpits DECIEVING the heck outta this people .
How simple it could have been , IF ONLY , If only this people had returned to just the bible
and had learned for themselves . pre trib , ITS A HOAX , and it aint the ONLY hoax either .

 

[amigo de christo]

You wanna hear something scary .
And it proves that , yes sometimes we get caught up in the wrong stuff .
Way , way back as a new baby christain
i got caught up into the i have to vote for mcain against obama .
Now i seen the dangers in obama due to his change , change change
And yeah i thought it was my duty to v ote mcain . EVEN THOUGH i had zero hope in him .
But not long after i was totally pulled from any kind of politics .
FOR pete sakes , WHEN IS THIS PEOPLE g onna repent . i understand folks can get caught up
in things . BUT ITS TIME to PULL OUT , TIME to repent
TIME TO FLEE THE ENTIRE REALM of politics and NOW
and its time to get the heck out of anything ecumenincal NOW .
Its real easy . IF ON E is in error , if one has been supporting such men
REPENT of it . TURN from it . TURN TO GOD , GET IN THE BIBLE and let our TRUST AND HOPE BE IN GOD
IN CHRIST ALONE . many are not gonna make it . this leaders have went from bad
to worse . few seem to even care that JESUS has been trod un der foot
That there men are TIED INTO INTERFAITH .
ALL they care about is their leader , WHOM THEY THINK can give them their best life now .
AND THAT IS WHY they are all going down ON THE DAY OF THE LORD .
TIME for an all out exodus from these earthen govts . TIME for all to simply
PUT ALL HOPE and TRUST IN GOD , IN CHRIST AGAIN , and get in that bible AGAIN .

 

[Truth7t7]

In the last part of the vid,we see a ton of reference to ancient pre trib rapture teaching.

The orthodox early church fathers were "Post Tribbers", Justin Martyr, Iranaeus, Hippolytus, Tertullian, Victorinus, taught of a literal human man to be (The Little Horn/Man Of Sin/The Beast) they taught of a future AOD and Great Tribulation from their 2nd, 3rd, 4th century lives

All the above of which Reformed Preterist Eschatology denies, this Is a Farse In False Teachings

1.) Daniel's AOD is future

2.) The Great Tribulation is future

3.) (The Little Horn/Man Of Sin/The Beast) will be a future literal human man

Didache (AD 100) "then shall appear the world-deceiver as Son of God, and shall do signs and wonders, and the earth shall be delivered into his hands, (Didache - Chapter 16)

Justin Martyr (AD 100-168) "O unreasoning men! understanding not what has been proved by all these passages, that two advents of Christ have been announced: the one, in which He is set forth as suffering, inglorious, dishonoured, and crucified; but the other, in which He shall come from heaven with glory, when the man of apostasy, who speaks strange things against the Most High, shall venture to do unlawful deeds on the earth against us the Christians (First Apology of Justin, Chapter 110)

Irenaeus (AD 140-202) "he who is to come shall slay three, and subject the remainder to his power, and that he shall be himself the eighth among them. And they shall lay Babylon waste, and burn her with fire, and shall give their kingdom to the beast, and put the Church to flight. After that they shall be destroyed by the coming of our Lord." (Against Heresies V, XXVI, 1)

Tertullian (AD 150-220) "that the city of fornication may receive from the ten kings its deserved doom, Revelation xviii and that the beast Antichrist with his false prophet may wage war on the Church of God; (On the Resurrection of the Flesh, Chapter 25)

Victorinus (AD 269-271) "He shall cause also that a golden image of Antichrist shall be placed in the temple at Jerusalem, and that the apostate angel should enter, and thence utter voices and oracles... The Lord, admonishing His churches concerning the last times and their dangers, ... three years and six months, in which with all his power the devil will avenge himself under Antichrist against the Church." (Commentary on the Apocalypse, 20:1-3)

 

[covenantee]

All the above of which Reformed Preterist Eschatology denies, this Is a Farse In False Teachings

None of the Reformers was preterist. They were all historicist.

The word you're trying to spell is "farce".

You're welcome.