What is the difference between the indwelling Spirit and the Baptism with the Holy Spirit?

[St. SteVen]

The Baptism of the Holy Spirit - Everyone who becomes born again from above through the saving Faith in Jesus Christ, receives the Holy Spirit of promise and is sealed until the day redemption; it is the invisible mark of God.

From the OP.

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit?
They were water baptized believers in the Lord Jesus.

- There was evidence that they were believers. (as stated in the text)
- There was evidence that they had been water baptized. (as stated in the text)
- There was, however, no evidence that they had received the Holy Spirit. (as stated in the text)

What evidence were the Apostles looking for?
"Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit." - Acts 8:17 NIV
("When they arrived, they prayed for the new believers there that they might receive the Holy Spirit," - vs 15)
This text doesn't tell us. We'll have to look elsewhere.

Let me restate...
I do not question whether the believers in Samaria had received the "indwelling" Spirit when they believed.
They were missing something else. That something else is the Baptism with the Holy Spirit. (the Spirit "on" them)

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[Rockerduck]

From the OP.

Why hadn't the baptized believers in Samaria received the Holy Spirit?
They were water baptized believers in the Lord Jesus.

- There was evidence that they were believers. (as stated in the text)
- There was evidence that they had been water baptized. (as stated in the text)
- There was, however, no evidence that they had received the Holy Spirit. (as stated in the text)

What evidence were the Apostles looking for?
"Peter and John placed their hands on them, and they received the Holy Spirit." - Acts 8:17 NIV
("When they arrived, they prayed for the new believers there that they might receive the Holy Spirit," - vs 15)
This text doesn't tell us. We'll have to look elsewhere.

Let me restate...
I do not question whether the believers in Samaria had received the "indwelling" Spirit when they believed.
They were missing something else. That something else is the Baptism with the Holy Spirit. (the Spirit "on" them)

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As a whole, all of Samaria did not get saved. Those who apparently were baptized by John, had not received the Holy Ghost. The Apostles had the power to bind or loose in Heaven, meaning they could lay hands on them to receive. You can't do that today. Imagine if a preacher baptized 20 people and they started saying, well, when do we get the Holy Spirit. Only the apostles had the power to do that.

 

[St. SteVen]

As a whole, all of Samaria did not get saved. Those who apparently were baptized by John, had not received the Holy Ghost. The Apostles had the power to bind or loose in Heaven, meaning they could lay hands on them to receive. You can't do that today. Imagine if a preacher baptized 20 people and they started saying, well, when do we get the Holy Spirit. Only the apostles had the power to do that.

You are taking the position of Cessationism. The manifestations of the Holy Spirit are alive and well today.
(or I should say, alive but not particularly well today, due to unbelief) Jesus had the same problem in His hometown.

Cessationism versus Continuationism - The fallacy of "Signs Gifts".

Cessationism claims that the miracle gifts of the Holy Spirit were signs to authenticate the early church. And consequently the miracle gifts disappeared when the Apostles did. Continuationism says that all the gifts were for the church and that all the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still...

www.christianityboard.com

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[Behold]

Baptism in the HS>........or Spiritual Baptism, that puts you "in Christ" as "one with God"......is the "washing of Regeneration".... = Born again.

Baptism WITH........ is an anionting of the Holy Spirit for some type of ministry or ministering.......its the God given POWER to perform it.

In the OT you had....."and the HS came upon them"...... or "the word came to them"... , and that is also.......what happened to Jesus, that John saw descend upon Him. Its a Holy Spirit anointing, and from that moment Jesus began His actual minstry, now being empowered by the anointing of the Holy Spirit.

Another case of this.....is Peter in Acts 2.........he was anointed to stand up and preach, and gifted also with at least one spiritual GIFT, as well.

The most common case is....to be called into a specific ministry.......as this is an "anointing" that is the Call of God., and that is when God calls someone to be a Missionary, or a Pastor, or Teacher, or Apostle, or Evangelist, or Prophet.

 

[Rockerduck]

You are taking the position of Cessationism. The manifestations of the Holy Spirit are alive and well today.
(or I should say, alive but not particularly well today, due to unbelief) Jesus had the same problem in His hometown.

Cessationism versus Continuationism - The fallacy of "Signs Gifts".

Cessationism claims that the miracle gifts of the Holy Spirit were signs to authenticate the early church. And consequently the miracle gifts disappeared when the Apostles did. Continuationism says that all the gifts were for the church and that all the gifts of the Holy Spirit are still...

www.christianityboard.com

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How can I be a cessationist when I have the gifts of the Holy Spirit? I talk to God and He to me. I have dreams and visions

 

[St. SteVen]

How can I be a cessationist when I have the gifts of the Holy Spirit? I talk to God and He to me. I have dreams and visions

That's a good question.
And to be clear, I said you were taking the position of a Cessationist.

Did an Apostle lay hands on you to receive the gifts? In post #62 you inferred that was the only way.
Perhaps I misunderstood you? Please clarify your position, thanks.

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[Rockerduck]

That's a good question.
And to be clear, I said you were taking the position of a Cessationist.

Did an Apostle lay hands on you to receive the gifts? In post #62 you inferred that was the only way.
Perhaps I misunderstood you? Please clarify your position, thanks.

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You or I cannot lay hands on someone to receive the Holy Spirit. That is the Job for Jesus now. But Jesus gave the power to His apostles only, to impute the Holy Spirit. But the gifts of the Holy Spirit are continued to this day, although some say it stopped at the Apostles. Yesterday, I delivered a message from Jesus to a pastor that he was going to die. He was praying for a miracle, but Jesus wanted him to know that a healing miracle was not going to happen.

 

[St. SteVen]

Jesus gave the power to His apostles only, to impute the Holy Spirit.

We disagree on this point.

Any believer today has the authority to do kingdom business. IMHO
God still does the work, we are a conduit.
If we can lay hands on the sick or injured, we can impart the Holy Spirit.

To clarify, the Holy Spirit is unpredictable, He may work of His own accord.
(without our hands-on assistance)

You recall the conversion of Saul on the road to Damascus.
Ananias, who was not an Apostle, laid hands on him.

Acts 9:17 NIV
Then Ananias went to the house and entered it. Placing his hands on Saul,
he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord—Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you were coming here—
has sent me so that you may see again and be filled with the Holy Spirit.”

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[St. SteVen]

Baptism in the HS>........or Spiritual Baptism, that puts you "in Christ" as "one with God"......is the "washing of Regeneration".... = Born again.

That's not what Jesus said about it. See below.
Weren't those in the outpouring at Pentecost already "born again"?
It seems you are conflating the Baptism with the Holy Spirit and conversion.

Acts 1:4-5 NIV
On one occasion, while he was eating with them, he gave them this command:
“Do not leave Jerusalem, but wait for the gift my Father promised, which you have heard me speak about.
5 For John baptized with[a] water, but in a few days you will be baptized with[b] the Holy Spirit.”

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[Behold]

Weren't those in the outpouring at Pentecost already "born again"?

Here are the : "those" you are talking about.

So then......the "upper room" group during Pentecost = the bible does not tell us when any of them actually trusted in Christ, .....but here is the thing..
You can't be born again, until the Holy Spirit causes it......and He was not given until that Day of Pentecost.
THis is why Jesus told them to "go there and wait".

Now Notice this verse carefully.., Reader.

"He that hath not the Spirit of God, is NONE of HIS = "God's"............. So, if you look at Jn 20:22, you see that Risen Jesus gave the remaining apostles the Holy Spirit......so that qualifies them as Christians before the day of Pentecost.
However, all those in the upper room, were not there in Jn 20:22.........so, its unknown when THEY in fact received the Holy Spirit, but it can be understood that they received it that very day during Pentecost, as that is when they received at least one Spiritual Gift.

It seems you are conflating the Baptism with the Holy Spirit and conversion.

I posted = Baptism "IN" the Holy Spirit, as when you are baptized you are immersed "INTO" ......

So, the "washing of Regeneration", or the "quickening" of the spirit is the new birth happening = Born again... and that is am immersion INTO the Spirit of God, which is why the verses explain it as becoming : 'IN Christ", and "One WITH God".

See, "God is A Spirit" = The Holy Spirit, and "Christ is THAT Spirit".....= the Holy Spirit........so, "Christ IN YOU"< is The Holy Spirit in the Believer, or....its understood as ....to become "the temple OF the Holy Spirit".

 

[St. SteVen]

So then......the "upper room" group during Pentecost = the bible does not tell us when any of them actually trusted in Christ, .....but here is the thing..

Evidence indicates that the outpouring at Pentecost didn't happen in the upper room.
More likely in the Temple courts were they met. People from 14 languages heard them
declaring the wonders of God in their own tongue. Is that possible from the upper room?

Acts 2:5-12 NIV
Now there were staying in Jerusalem God-fearing Jews from every nation under heaven.
6 When they heard this sound, a crowd came together in bewilderment,
because each one heard their own language being spoken.
7 Utterly amazed, they asked: “Aren’t all these who are speaking Galileans?
8 Then how is it that each of us hears them in our native language?
9 Parthians, Medes and Elamites; residents of Mesopotamia, Judea and Cappadocia, Pontus and Asia,[a]
10 Phrygia and Pamphylia, Egypt and the parts of Libya near Cyrene; visitors from Rome
11 (both Jews and converts to Judaism); Cretans and Arabs—
we hear them declaring the wonders of God in our own tongues!”
12 Amazed and perplexed, they asked one another, “What does this mean?”

Acts 2:46 NIV
Every day they continued to meet together in the temple courts.
They broke bread in their homes and ate together with glad and sincere hearts,

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[Behold]

Evidence indicates that the outpouring at Pentecost didn't happen in the upper room.

I didnt state that the outpouring happend in the upper room.
The NT does not state where........it just begins with that day, and the events.

What it does tell us is the end result of the outpouring in Acts 2.

More likely in the Temple courts were they met. People from 14 languages heard them
declaring the wonders of God in their own tongue. Is that possible from the upper room?

The Acts 2 outpouring happened.........and the unsaved Jews heard it.
That is what is clear.

because each one heard their own language being spoken.

There is a cult that teaches that the "Hearing" is the Miracle... and there is one of those on THIS forum (Charasmatic Lady) who teaches that nonsense.. and that heresy is not true, as all of this is related to "Spiritual Gifts", and you wont find "the gift of Hearing", in Paul's list of 9 spiritual gifts..

Also, God only gives the Gifts to Christians......not to unbelievers... and there is a member here (RitaJanice) who teaches that God gives spiritual gifts to Christ Rejectors.. Unbelievers.......which is also heresy and a cult teaching. (Calvinism)
So. those JEWS Hearing Peter speak in their language, in Acts 2... were still unbelievers, at that time, they heard him.

Acts 2:46 NIV
Every day they continued to meet together in the temple courts.
They broke bread in their homes and ate together with glad and sincere hearts,

This is the beginning of the Body of Christ, = your verse.
We had no TV Ministries, or Jets, or Internet, or 30,00O seat auditoriums.........we only had some new converts who needed a place to go and be with the same, and learn some things about God and faith, and discipleship.
So, "local churches" at that time, were in somebody's house..

 

[St. SteVen]

There is a cult that teaches that the "Hearing" is the Miracle...

Wow.
What is the name of the cult?

So, anyone who disagrees with your opinion is in a cult? - LOL

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[Behold]

Wow.
What is the name of the cult?

So, anyone who disagrees with your opinion is in a cult?

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The Spiritual Gifts, listed by Paul, are clearly defined in the NT.......There are 9 of them @St. SteVen ........including the "Gift of Tongues".
There is no "gift of hearing"... There is no "gift of Universalism".

So, if you teach that The ACTs 2 Jew's ""hearing """ is the miracle, then you are denying that the Gift of Tongues is the Miracle......and that is what she is doing.

What Cult teaches this?
Its a Charismatic Group.