What is your hope in dark times of your life?

[Jackie D]

(Amira;41982)
Dear Jackie D,I do not think you have to be a member of a church to have religion (in your case some form of Christianity). Secondly, if you pray, praise and worship is that not devotional?Anyway, the point was that I meant any such belief system by religion. I agree, the differences of interpretation are very relevant to this discussion. Only to clarify what I meant.

God Bless

 

[Saint Gutfree]

(Thunder1;41660)
That's the question for non-believers.
Well, when people have died, I do what you've done: I've take comfort in the memories I have of that person and take the opportunity to strengthen bonds of friendship and family with the living. When I sliced open my knee in an accident, I took comfort in modern medicine and the skilled individuals who stitched me back together. I'm comforted that I don't live 100 years ago when an injury like the one I received meant I'd be walking with a cane for the rest of my life... or 200 years ago when such an injury would have meant amputation or death. Really, we're no so different. We do exactly the same things and feel the same way. You just attribute the things that you feel to god while I... having seen no evidence of god and considerable evidence for god to not exist... do not.

 

[Jackie D]

(Saint Gutfree;42019)
Well, when people have died, I do what you've done: I've take comfort in the memories I have of that person and take the opportunity to strengthen bonds of friendship and family with the living. When I sliced open my knee in an accident, I took comfort in modern medicine and the skilled individuals who stitched me back together. I'm comforted that I don't live 100 years ago when an injury like the one I received meant I'd be walking with a cane for the rest of my life... or 200 years ago when such an injury would have meant amputation or death. Really, we're no so different. We do exactly the same things and feel the same way. You just attribute the things that you feel to god while I... having seen no evidence of god and considerable evidence for god to not exist... do not.
there is a huge difference...though we may seek the same things such as modern medicine to help us in times of injury and sickness...we praise God that He created such things for us. Human beings will always fall short of the abilities of God. A doctor can apply the medicine yet it is not his hand that perfomrs the healing, it is God's. It is God's by His divine intervention or it is God's by design...it doesn't matter which occurs it belongs to God.When someone dies, we remember them and we praise God that they were in our lives. We still mourn of course, but we remain with something more than memory...we have God to take comfort in.So no we don't do exactly the same things, our feelings may be similar as we still experience pain, but we have a place to go and that is to our Father and Savior Jesus, those are what comforts us beyond human measure. There is absolutely NOTHING that can happen without God willing it to be so...

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;41974)
A person is capable of having hope in everlasting joy and still feel sorrow for the lost. In fact having that joy helps to get us through the dark days that are seen and experienced here in this cold, cruel and complicated place.
However if a person feels sorrow then they are not completely full of joy.As I said, for me that percentage of sorrow I would feel, would be much greater.

 

[Pildit]

(Richard_oti;41976)
While I agree with you Pildit. I think there are some things that for some of us, we are just completely unable to allow ourselves to forgive ourselves. I know for me, it was within the first hour that I believed, that sweet release came upon me...
I do understand that too, of course it really depends on what you did but there does come a point where you get on with your life as much as possible.Importantly (or more importantly depending on your view point of course), it's important to forgive yourself... again this really depends on what you've done of course but within a normal persons life - not in the extremes of murder and such like.You can only do the best you could at that time, if you did that then you couldn't have done anymore.I do realise what a release it is to know or think you know someone forgives you. I beat myself up about something for a long time last year, but it really did hit home when one of my friends said to me "I forgive you, why don't you forgive yourself?". They weren't involved in what I was beating myself up about, but all the same it made me feel better and hit home.
I know what you mean... only too well. I have been told those same things many times. I also spent some time in a place which sounds not too unlike where you are.
Nice to know you understand.
I agree they are not necessarily 'bad', regardless of choices. And I fully understand what you mean with regard to being happy while others are in pain. It is a hard thing. For myself, I have found that I am able to help those I care about, and even those I meet upon the street through being 'happy'. That does not mean that I am not serious when necessary though.
In life, I can help them though I'm with them but if God exists and they go to hell and I'm in heaven, there's nothing I can do. I just cannot be happy like that.
If you will allow me, I shall join in prayer to that effect Pildit.
Your prayers are welcome, of course understand I don't believe they necessaily work but at the very least I take it as another way of you (and others trying to help) - which is appreciated.
Yes it does get annoying. And you are right, it isn't a good reason to believe. Almost makes one feel sorry for them though... if that if all they really know.
Glad you understand this also.
May you be blessed Pilbit.
Thank you

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42021)
there is a huge difference...though we may seek the same things such as modern medicine to help us in times of injury and sickness...we praise God that He created such things for us. Human beings will always fall short of the abilities of God. A doctor can apply the medicine yet it is not his hand that perfomrs the healing, it is God's. It is God's by His divine intervention or it is God's by design...it doesn't matter which occurs it belongs to God.
Then why go to the doctor at all? Why not just pray or ask to be healed?
There is absolutely NOTHING that can happen without God willing it to be so...
So the reason why a girl was raped is becuase God willed it?

 

[Jackie D]

Pildit;42096 Then why go to the doctor at all? Why not just pray or ask to be healed?
prayer for healing happens all the time...God never told us however from where the form of healing would happen. This doesn't mean that it is not real, but not everything that happens by the hand of God is in the form of some way outlandish supernatural occurance, however there are many unexplained occurances in within the medical profession regarding people who should have died, were fervantly prayed over and they lived quite often the illness being totally wiped away without a trace that it ever existed leaving medical scientists in a quandry....As for bad things happening to people. God allows things to happen. You want a very good example of such a process read the book of Job in the OT. Job was a righteous man and yet God still allowed for bad things to happen to him....but I'm not going to tell you the story, I'll let you do the foot work on that one. Again, all things happen by the hand and will of God. ALL things......

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42097)
As for bad things happening to people. God allows things to happen. You want a very good example of such a process read the book of Job in the OT. Job was a righteous man and yet God still allowed for bad things to happen to him....but I'm not going to tell you the story, I'll let you do the foot work on that one. Again, all things happen by the hand and will of God. ALL things......
For someone of high morals such a God, he above all knowing right from wrong and also he the one who can provent it, it leaves God to be quite evil for allowing such things to happen.

 

[Jackie D]

Another point I would like to make Pildit, is that God takes all things and turns them to the good of His purpose. Especially the bad stuff...compassion is taught in the NT and it is spoken in the NT that those who have suffered pains of life learn great compassion for those who are hurting, in this day and age compassion is a much needed commodity. How can one be compassionate toward another human being if they have never experienced painful things in life, they cannot.I started using drugs and alcohol at the age of 15, lost custody of all three of my children by the age of 31 due to heavy crack cocaine addiction...the life I've led the things I know, have made me, I believe, the person God would have me be. I do not regret having lived the life I lived before coming to Him nor would I ask for my life to have been different so that I would not have had to suffer the horrors I suffered. The very things that I have experienced in life God uses and leads me to people who live in a life of dark hopelessness and through me the Lord pulls them out.

 

[Jackie D]

(Pildit;42098)
For someone of high morals such a God, he above all knowing right from wrong and also he the one who can provent it, it leaves God to be quite evil for allowing such things to happen.
God bless you Pildit..............instead of accusing God why don't you read Job?

 

[Jackie D]

one other thing...suffering does not have to dictate the entirety of people's lives and decisions. We have the ability to let things go and not base each and every thing on that experience. Sometimes, we need to get over our hurts and ourselves and grow up....life and people deal unfair hands often, those who are dealt the hand can either wallow in self-pity all of their lives or they can stand up, brush the dust off of them and move on.....blessings

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42101)
God bless you Pildit..............instead of accusing God why don't you read Job?
I have red it before, albeit a few years ago. I just skipped over it again to remind myself.That's evil, sorry but God and Satan having a bet with a mans life. Is evil.(Jackie D;42102)
one other thing...suffering does not have to dictate the entirety of people's lives and decisions. We have the ability to let things go and not base each and every thing on that experience. Sometimes, we need to get over our hurts and ourselves and grow up....life and people deal unfair hands often, those who are dealt the hand can either wallow in self-pity all of their lives or they can stand up, brush the dust off of them and move on.....blessings
Which has nothing to do with God. People can do this without God, by themselves or with friends around them.And terms like "grow up" and "wallow in self-pity" aren't terms of compassion either. Of course it doesn't have to dictate their entire life but people do react differently and it will take different periods of time for them to recover.

 

[Jackie D]

(Pildit;42106)
I have red it before, albeit a few years ago. I just skipped over it again to remind myself.That's evil, sorry but God and Satan having a bet with a mans life. Is evil.
you don't seem to be sorry about your statement, but then if you don't love God how can you possibly care whether calling Him evil hurts Him, or the people who love Him for that matter.
Which has nothing to do with God. People can do this without God, by themselves or with friends around them.
can they? have you?
And terms like "grow up" and "wallow in self-pity" aren't terms of compassion either. Of course it doesn't have to dictate their entire life but people do react differently and it will take different periods of time for them to recover.
I disagree with you on that point for this reason...wallowing in self-pity and refusing to get over themselves and grow up are two of the most selfish and self-centered things people can do. People who refuse to get over things, use it to keep others at a distance, they use their past pains against others and use it to blame their pitiful lives on....So, I may listen to the woes of another for a time, but after a time and nothing has changed and they are still so wrapped up in the moment of the past, I am going to be compassionate enough to say get over it and get life. Enabling another to live in their misery, is the furthest thing from compassion that there is...in fact it is playing the devil's advocate.

 

[Jackie D]

added to the statements regarding Job and his trialsildit,You seem to forget that once Job had gone through his trials and tribulations God replaced/restored all things taken from him during the trials ten-fold. The complete purpose of the trials and tribulations were to stretch and test the faith Job so clearly had in the Lord, a good parent will do the same for their children..are parents evil because they let their children grow up and make mistakes on their own?

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42108)
you don't seem to be sorry about your statement, but then if you don't love God how can you possibly care whether calling Him evil hurts Him, or the people who love Him for that matter.
I wasn't apologising to God. Because I said "that's evil". I'm apologising to you knowing full well you don't see it.How can he possibly care if he bets with someones life like that?
can they? have you?
Yes they can and Yes I have.
I disagree with you on that point for this reason...wallowing in self-pity and refusing to get over themselves and grow up are two of the most selfish and self-centered things people can do. People who refuse to get over things, use it to keep others at a distance, they use their past pains against others and use it to blame their pitiful lives on....
So they can't move on, they're depressed and really struggling and you go and assume, label them as self centred and tell them they're using it to blame others.Everyone has their own pace of healing.
So, I may listen to the woes of another for a time, but after a time and nothing has changed and they are still so wrapped up in the moment of the past, I am going to be compassionate enough to say get over it and get life. Enabling another to live in their misery, is the furthest thing from compassion that there is...in fact it is playing the devil's advocate.
Saying "Get over it and get a life" isn't compassionate at all. Of course people need to hear sometimes that its time to over on, but there are much better ways. "[insert name here] it's time to move on, it won't be easy but I'll help you to do" for example which is a lot nicer, more compassionate and better than saying "get over it and get a life". All that person learns from you saying that is that they can no longer trust you.

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42111)
added to the statements regarding Job and his trialsildit,You seem to forget that once Job had gone through his trials and tribulations God replaced/restored all things taken from him during the trials ten-fold. The complete purpose of the trials and tribulations were to stretch and test the faith Job so clearly had in the Lord, a good parent will do the same for their children..are parents evil because they let their children grow up and make mistakes on their own?
I haven't forgotten Jackie, but parents don't test the faith their children have for them by betting with their lives. A parent will do whatever is in their power to protect their child from harm, hurt and danger whilst still exercising that the child hast to make their own mistakes... they do not and/or should not PUT them in danger.Children make their own mistakes and should be allowed to do so, but Job was blameless... just a victim of betting.

 

[Jackie D]

(Pildit;42112)
I wasn't apologising to God. Because I said "that's evil". I'm apologising to you knowing full well you don't see it.How can he possibly care if he bets with someones life like that?
yes well Job's wife told him to curse God and die and he refused. How can that sanctimonious question about betting with someone's life even be justfied by an answer...each and every day, we take bets on our own lives and the lives of others...but it is God you call evil because he puts a righteous man to the test? Not only is the question sanctimonious it is hypocritical.
Yes they can and Yes I have.
You have? then why do you keep blaming others for your lack of perserverance to stay with God?
So they can't move on, they're depressed and really struggling and you go and assume, label them as self centred and tell them they're using it to blame others.Everyone has their own pace of healing.
of course they do if you noticed I didn't say that I would say such things to someone who had just endured something terrible. You aren't listening to me, you are the one making assumptions here...I have qualified these statements. Please read thoroughly before you do that.But I tell you if it comes to the place after years of hearing their woeful and pitiful excuses why they are still stuck then you bet it is time to get real, cut out the cotton candy love and be straight forward with them.
Saying "Get over it and get a life" isn't compassionate at all. Of course people need to hear sometimes that its time to over on, but there are much better ways. "[insert name here] it's time to move on, it won't be easy but I'll help you to do" for example which is a lot nicer, more compassionate and better than saying "get over it and get a life". All that person learns from you saying that is that they can no longer trust you.
sure it is...I would never say that to someone without speaking the way you suggest first....Christ was very compassionate and at the same time after being with the crowds of people for years even spoke, how long must I put up with you? This didn't just come from out of the blue at the very beginning, it was after years of saying and doing the same things with them over and over and they still were stuck in their ways. Ways which were self destructive and futile.Self pity is nothing but the enemy holding a person down. The best way to defeat the enemy is head on and speak the truth.

 

[Jackie D]

(Pildit;42113)
I haven't forgotten Jackie, but parents don't test the faith their children have for them by betting with their lives. A parent will do whatever is in their power to protect their child from harm, hurt and danger whilst still exercising that the child hast to make their own mistakes... they do not and/or should not PUT them in danger.Children make their own mistakes and should be allowed to do so, but Job was blameless... just a victim of betting.
whatever, you still look for any reason to accuse God instead of looking at the final product. And God did protect him, as is shown in the beginning chapters of the book, He would not let the enemy take the life of Job!!

 

[Pildit]

(Jackie D;42114)
You have? then why do you keep blaming others for your lack of perserverance to stay with God?
Insult #1. I've blamed no-one, no "others".
whatever, you still look for any reason to accuse God instead of looking at the final product.
Insult #2.I look at this from all angles, including how cruel of a thing that is to do. I have looked at the final product. Job was a rich man in the first place, but afterwards he got many thousands of animals, a 7 sons and 3 daughters. He lived 140 years after all this.I won't be replying again if this continues in this manner. If you wish to dicuss these things with me however; that's fine.

 

[Jackie D]

(Pildit;42120)
Insult #1. I've blamed no-one, no "others".
I'm not trying to insult you....you yourself in many posts have used the old excuse that it was people and God who have caused you to walk away from having faith.
Insult #2.I look at this from all angles, including how cruel of a thing that is to do. I have looked at the final product. Job was a rich man in the first place, but afterwards he got many thousands of animals, a 7 sons and 3 daughters. He lived 140 years after all this.
again, not trying to insult you at all...so what if he was a rich man in the first place, he was taken down to nothing, remained righteous and was restored. What appears to be evil in the eyes of man quite often has a hidden purpose until the end when God's glory shines through...so no, you aren't looking at the entire thing. Your focus is on accusing God of being evil and giving yourself leave to stay distanced from Him, IMO
I won't be replying again if this continues in this manner. If you wish to dicuss these things with me however; that's fine.
I could say the same regarding the fact that you continually insult me by calling God evil, though you said that you were apologizing to me for it. I'm just being real with you Pildit. This matter to me has more importance for your life than whether you think I'm being compassionate about feelings that cannot be relied upon. Let go of the feelings you have about what has happened in the past and look for things that He would give you, such as real belief. He will give you what you are asking for, if you go to Him for it. You are looking for God it is obvious, you have not denied it....the problem is, you are looking to people to provide what has already been shown to you and they have proven to you that they cannot do it. Only God can...where you need to be looking is in prayer and in reading the bible with an open mind and heart. I'm saying this with complete and total compassion for you. Ask God to help and stop looking for reasons to dispute His reality. Man is never going to be able to prove God to you as God can.....with much love and blessings for you...