What triggers Armageddon ?

[Douggg]

Hello,

Has anyone considered Israel's attempt to rebuild the Temple knot having the means to complete this task?

I don't get what you are driving at, Jay ? I think there is another thread questioning the building of another temple....

Will the Jews build a Third Temple?

The site where the Temple stood, is dominated by two structures which keep Jews from any chance to build or restore, which are the al-Aqsa Mosque and the Dome of the Rock, near the center of the temple mount, which is seem as one of the holiest Islamic structure in the world. The temple mount...

www.christianityboard.com

Armageddon is 2300 days after a temple is built and animal sacrifices started again - which the little horn person will eventually stop.

The Gog/Magog event will take place, removing the Muslim presence on the temple mount, making way for the Jews to built a temple to start the animal sacrifices again. And once started again, it will be 2300 days to Armageddon.

 

[Zao is life]

Armageddon is not an event that is "triggered". It is commonly used that way but it's misleading.

Armageddon is an English translation of a Hebrew word pronounced Har-Megiddon. It's a place roughly 66 miles north of Jerusalem where some OT battles were fought and where two armies face, one of the Earth and one of Heaven. Jesus single-handedly kills every member of the enemy army and casts the beast and false prophet into the lake of fire.

The 6th vial enables the beast, false prophet and satan to have the kings of the world to gather their armies at Armageddon for the battle against the great God almighty, Rev 16:14.

This is a one-sided battle or war because one army is unharmed while the other army is completely destroyed.

The "event" of this is the war/killing that takes place, not the arrival of the first army, nor the leaving of the second and only surviving army. Only the fighting is what we would call "Armageddon".

Yes. The Battle of Waterloo, which took place near the city of Waterloo in present-day Belgium (then part of The Kingdom of the Netherlands), was a decisive battle in which Napoleon was defeated in 1815.

It was not in Waterloo but near Waterloo where the battle took place.

Megiddo was a town situated on the Western edge of the Valley of Jezreel, the valley in which a decisive battle was fought when the Northern Kingdom of Israel, a.k.a the House of Israel, was judged by God and handed over to be conquered by Sargon II of Assyria in the day when they ceased being considered a nation before God, and became exiled (722 B.C).

"Armageddon" in Revelation 16:16 is the same as saying "Waterloo of the nations" and "Valley of Jehoshaphat" (the Valley of "God will judge the nations", as in Joel 3:12).

The word "Armageddon" like the word "Waterloo" is symbolic for a decisive battle which will take place in Jerusalem according to Zechariah chapters 12 through 14.​

Tel Megiddo: The ruins of Megiddo. The symbol of the decisive battle (a.k.a "Armageddon") which Zechariah chapters 12 through 14 tell us will take place in Jerusalem:

 

[Zao is life]

I don't disagree that Jerusalem will be the focal point. But because to the size of the armies, they will sprawl the 200 mile north to south length of Israel because of what it says in Revelation 14.16-20

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. [Jesus given a sickle, and he destroys those armies that will be in the vicinity surrounding Jerusalem ]

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. [an angel was given a sickle as well]

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

20 And the winepress was trodden without the city, and blood came out of the winepress, even unto the horse bridles, by the space of a thousand and six hundred furlongs.

So the angel also given a sickle will destroy those armies beyond the vicinity of Jerusalem but still packed into Israel norlth to south - and the blood them will flow 1600 furlongs - 200 miles, the north-south length of Israel.

So the destruction of the armies of the nations will be in two parts.

1. first, the armies in the vicinity of Jerusalem will be destroyed by Jesus in Zechariah 14, and Revelation 19:21.
2. then immediately after those armies die, the armies beyond the vicinity of Jerusalem, but still sprawled across Israel, will be killed by the angel, given a sickle, especially appointed for that task.

The above is not what scripture says:

Zechariah 12
7 YHVH also shall save the tents of Judah first, that the glory of the house of David and the glory of the inhabitants of Jerusalem do not magnify themselves against Judah.

6 In that day will I make the governors of Judah like an hearth of fire among the wood, and like a torch of fire in a sheaf; and they shall devour all the people round about, on the right hand and on the left: and Jerusalem shall be inhabited again in her own place, even in Jerusalem.

8 In that day shall Yhwh defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David shall be as God, as the angel of Yhwh before them.

9 And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will seek to destroy all the nations that come against Jerusalem.

It's the Jewish leaders (leaders of Judah) defending the people of Jerusalem, and Judah (the regions of Israel surrounding Jerusalem) will be saved first.

 

[ewq1938]

The word "Armageddon" like the word "Waterloo" is symbolic for a decisive battle which will take place in Jerusalem according to Zechariah chapters 12 through 14.​

The battle of Armageddon is not fought in or even near Jerusalem as it is 66 miles away from that city. The battle of Armageddon is also not found in Zechariah chapters 12 through 14 but rather Rev 19.

 

[Zao is life]

The battle of Armageddon is not fought in or even near Jerusalem as it is 66 miles away from that city. The battle of Armageddon is also not found in Zechariah chapters 12 through 14 but rather Rev 19.

Armageddon is merely a symbolic word with the same meaning as Waterloo of the nations, and it's referring to the time Christ will set his feet on the Mount of Olives and go out and fight against the nations that will have gathered against Jerusalem.

Anyone who imagines that Armageddon is a literal battle that will be fought at Tel Megiddo 66 miles away from Jerusalem is showing ignorance of scripture and a lack of understanding of the spiritual battle taking place, brought about by what comes out of the mouths of the beast, false prophet and dragon, and how these armies that come against Jerusalem as a result will be destroyed by the sword that proceeds out of the mouth of Christ.

 

[ewq1938]

Anyone who imagines that Armageddon is a literal battle that will be fought at Tel Megiddo 66 miles away from Jerusalem is showing ignorance of scripture and a lack of understanding of the spiritual battle taking place, brought about by what comes out of the mouths of the beast, false prophet and dragon, and how these armies that come against Jerusalem as a result will be destroyed by the sword that proceeds out of the mouth of Christ.

Anyone who imagines that Armageddon is a symbolic battle that will not be fought at Tel Megiddo 66 miles away from Jerusalem is showing ignorance of scripture and a lack of understanding of the literal battle taking place.

 

[Zao is life]

Anyone who imagines that Armageddon is a symbolic battle that will not be fought at Tel Megiddo 66 miles away from Jerusalem is showing ignorance of scripture and a lack of understanding of the literal battle taking place.

Anyone who does not provide passages in the books of the prophets or in the Revelation that says that the battle will be fought at Tel Megiddo isn't getting his ideas from scripture.

@ewq1938 .. and I didn't say the battle is symbolic. I said the name given to it - Armageddon - is symbolic ​

 

[Jay Ross]

I don't get what you are driving at, Jay ? I think there is another thread questioning the building of another temple....

The attempt of the Jews trying to rebuild the Temple in around 20 years' time will trigger Armageddon.

I thought that I was speaking very plainly.

Your problem is that your bias towards your "theories" are stopping you from considering an alternative answer.

 

[Stumpmaster]

So what God is talking about is a time of darkness and silence that the tongue of the wicked no longer speak the Gospel

Speaking of Revelation 16 and the biting of tongues, it should be noted that the ability of the ungodly to curse God and His Name is not missing.

 

[Douggg]

The attempt of the Jews trying to rebuild the Temple in around 20 years' time will trigger Armageddon.

I thought that I was speaking very plainly.

Your problem is that your bias towards your "theories" are stopping you from considering an alternative answer.

Hi Jay, thanks for the clarification of what you meant.

Do you really think that the Jews rebuilding (or try to rebuild in your opinion) is 20 years away ?

And why would that trigger Armageddon ? Israel does not have that big of a military that it would take all of the nations of the world to counter them.

 

[Jay Ross]

Hi Jay, thanks for the clarification of what you meant.

Do you really think that the Jews rebuilding (or try to rebuild in your opinion) is 20 years away ?

And why would that trigger Armageddon ? Israel does not have that big of a military that it would take all of the nations of the world to counter them.

The end of the 2,300 years of the Little Horn being given armies to trample God's Sanctuary and His Earthly Hosts will end in around 20 years' time at the end of the sixth age of mankind and the end of the visitation of the iniquities of the Israelite fathers at the end of the fourth age/generation of the Israelites. The gathering of the Gentile kings and their armies at Armageddon will end up being after the completion of the allotted time for the Little Horn to Trample God's Sanctuary and His earthly hosts.

What follows is Isaiah 24:21-22 when the heavenly hosts will be judged in heaven and at the same time the kings of the earth will be judged on the earth, and the heavenly hosts and the Gentile kings of the earth will gather together and imprisoned in a cistern/pit for many days to await the time of their punishment.

Daniel 7:9-12 describes the judgement of the four winds of heavenly, i.e., the four beasts, and the Little Horn. Satan is also included among the heavenly hosts that will be judged at this time as well.

I would also humbly suggest that: -

1. Rev 19:11-16 is also describing the time of this judging of the kings of the earth, and
2. Luke 14:31-32 is presenting another picture of this time of judgement of the kings of the earth,

is describing the events that will be occurring at Armageddon. At this time, the leaders of Israel know that they cannot beat the army coming down from heaven and will instead seek Jesus' terms for peace. Israel will not be attempting to enter into a fight with the kings and their armies gathered at Armageddon at this time.

Goodbye

 

[Douggg]

The end of the 2,300 years of the Little Horn being given armies to trample God's Sanctuary and His Earthly Hosts will end in around 20 years' time at the end of the sixth age of mankind and the end of the visitation of the iniquities of the Israelite fathers at the end of the fourth age/generation of the Israelites. The gathering of the Gentile kings and their armies at Armageddon will end up being after the completion of the allotted time for the Little Horn to Trample God's Sanctuary and His earthly hosts.

What follows is Isaiah 24:21-22 when the heavenly hosts will be judged in heaven and at the same time the kings of the earth will be judged on the earth, and the heavenly hosts and the Gentile kings of the earth will gather together and imprisoned in a cistern/pit for many days to await the time of their punishment.

Daniel 7:9-12 describes the judgement of the four winds of heavenly, i.e., the four beasts, and the Little Horn. Satan is also included among the heavenly hosts that will be judged at this time as well.

I would also humbly suggest that: -

1. Rev 19:11-16 is also describing the time of this judging of the kings of the earth, and
2. Luke 14:31-32 is presenting another picture of this time of judgement of the kings of the earth,

is describing the events that will be occurring at Armageddon. At this time, the leaders of Israel know that they cannot beat the army coming down from heaven and will instead seek Jesus' terms for peace. Israel will not be attempting to enter into a fight with the kings and their armies gathered at Armageddon at this time.

Goodbye

Jay, I am not able to follow any kind of logic that changes the 2300 days in Daniel 8:14 to 2300 years.

I am aware that SDA does, but if I recall correctly that you said you are not SDA. So what is your reason to change what the text says ?

Also who are you saying the little horn in Daniel 8 that he should span 2300 years ?

 

[Jay Ross]

Also who are you saying the little horn in Daniel 8 that he should span 2300 years ?

The Little Horn is not a human entity, but rather is a heavenly entity. As such, being a heavenly entity, the little horn exists over a very long period of time, with no definitive statement as to how long the Little Horn will exists for.

Scripture suggests that the Little Horn appears around the time that Alexandra's kingdom is divided between Alexandra's the Great's four generals, and when they the four little horn rise up in place oof the initial single horn they pay "homage" to the Four Winds of Heaven. (Dan 8:8). Since Alexandra the Great die around 323 BC and the breaking up of Alexandra's kingdom into four separate empires occurred over a number of years. Now since the Little Horn came out of one of the horns, the Little Horn had influence over that particular horn such that the trampling of God's sanctuary and His earthly hosts began around 250-260 BC.

Now we learn that the Little Horn will even rise up against Christ during His first Advent which means that the Little Horn is not a person from the human race, but is, in reality, a wicked fallen heavenly Host. Now if this time period of some 280 to 290 years is true then the 2,300 days would only represent a period of approximately 6.3 years, which is a much less that the 280-290 years as suggested above.

Even today, the Little Horn is being given armies with which to trample God's earthly hosts, right around the world. Because the trampling of Israel is still continuing today and it will not end until another 20 or so years have passed for the completion of the Daniel 8:13-14 prophecy's completion. It is for this reason that I believe that the Dan 8:13-14 prophecy should be understood to be over a time span of 2,300 years.

Douggg your premise that the Little Horn is a man and that the trampling will only occur over a 2,300 day period is flawed.

Goodbye

 

[Douggg]

Douggg your premise that the Little Horn is a man and that the trampling will only occur over a 2,300 day period is flawed.

Jay, I never said that the trampling of the sanctuary and the host is over a 2300 days period - but within the 2300 day activities of the little horn.

The little horn, the Antichrist at the time he commits the transgression of desolation, will stop the daily sacrifice around 3 years into the 7 year 70th week.

The vision of the little horn and his activities is time of the end, Daniel 8:17 - not 2300 years ago - but 2300 days at the time of the end.

You are the one who has changed the text from 2300 days to 2300 years to come up with your interpretation.

The little horn in Daniel 7:23-25 will arise among 10 end times kings. Once the little horn stops the daily sacrifice, in Daniel 8:25, he will wear down the saints for a time, times, half time.

I show everything on my chart below. The temple that the Jews will build will be downsized initially in order to get the daily sacrifices going again as quickly as possible.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

You are right. "god" wants you to think to take the book of Revelation literally. And no "God" does not inspire the book to be understood literally or physically. Unless you agree that there is a human woman floating in space over moon.

That is your myopic rule and not any rule of literal hermeneutics

LOL. Show me an example, Ronald. What is the symbolic for beast, horns, river, sea, frogs, locusts, etc. Take your time.

Well first off these are the symbols

But beast is defined in Daniel 7&9, Matt. 24, Thesselonians and Revelation
The horns are defined in Daniel as kings
The river is a river and not symbolic.
Sea when used symbolically refers to the gentiles

There are not frogs!
Revelation 16:13
And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

JOhn himself by using the comparative word "like" tells us they are not literal

Also there are no locusts in revelation!

Revelation 9

King James Version

​

9 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.
7 And the shapes of the locusts were like unto horses prepared unto battle; and on their heads were as it were crowns like gold, and their faces were as the faces of men.
8 And they had hair as the hair of women, and their teeth were as the teeth of lions.
9 And they had breastplates, as it were breastplates of iron; and the sound of their wings was as the sound of chariots of many horses running to battle.

Once again JOhn compares these creatures to locusts. But simply reading the plain language he used, one knows they are not normal everyday locusts.

I have done this but you did not receive it well. But for now, let hear your understanding of God's definitions in the book of Revelation.

Look one reply above on this answer

Example please.

Lorraine Boettner of the Presbyterian church

Not mine but God's.

says you . God wrfote something different than how you reinterpret His Word.

Show me the example of how you understand God's definition on symbols in Revelation.

I will use the horns.

Revelation 13

King James Version

​

13 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.

Daniel 7:19-24

King James Version

​

19 Then I would know the truth of the fourth beast, which was diverse from all the others, exceeding dreadful, whose teeth were of iron, and his nails of brass; which devoured, brake in pieces, and stamped the residue with his feet;
20 And of the ten horns that were in his head, and of the other which came up, and before whom three fell; even of that horn that had eyes, and a mouth that spake very great things, whose look was more stout than his fellows.
21 I beheld, and the same horn made war with the saints, and prevailed against them;
22 Until the Ancient of days came, and judgment was given to the saints of the most High; and the time came that the saints possessed the kingdom.
23 Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth, which shall be diverse from all kingdoms, and shall devour the whole earth, and shall tread it down, and break it in pieces.
24 And the ten horns out of this kingdom are ten kings that shall arise: and another shall rise after them; and he shall be diverse from the first, and he shall subdue three kings.

As for the beast itself?

It is the final iteration of the gentile kingdoms of the times of the gentiles.

1. It will devourt the whole earth (one world govt.
2. Next ten kings will rule the world.
3. 11th horn (antichrist) arises and subdues three kings

 

[TribulationSigns]

That is your myopic rule and not any rule of literal hermeneutics

Does not apply to the Book of Revelation.

Well first off these are the symbols

(applauding)

But beast is defined in Daniel 7&9, Matt. 24, Thesselonians and Revelation

Show me and explain it yourself to see if you know what God actually talked about.

The horns are defined in Daniel as kings

Indeed, God declared that "horns" represent kings. However, the horns in Scripture are a symbol representing power.

Here is biblical lessons for you:
For example, in Psalms 8:21 or 2nd Samuel 22:3, saying "horn of my salvation" is the same as God declaring His Power of salvation because the horn is the symbol in the Bible of "Power". Not a physical king. So we can see why simply by looking at the natural world. The horns of a bull are his power, those objects that men are most afraid of. The horns of an animal are looked upon as its power even today. God used horns symbolically this way, which is why there were horns on the Altar of Israel. The altar is for the administration of the strength of sacrifice, which represented Christ. In understanding this we can readily see why God says "Horn of my Salvation," because all throughout the Bible we see it does illustrate they are used as a "figure" or symbol of the power or strength of whatever is in view. Let me give you some example to show how you compare Scripture to understand what horn really means:

Psalms 89:17

• "For thou art the glory of their strength: and in thy favour our horn shall be exalted"

People don't literally have a horn to be lifted up of course, but the horn is used here to convey the sense of believers being exalted in the glory of "His strength." We are lifted up in His strength (Psalms 46:1; 81:1) rather than our own. e.g.:

Lamentations 2:3

• "He hath cut off in his fierce anger all the horn of Israel: he hath drawn back his right hand from before the enemy, and he burned against Jacob like a flaming fire, which devoureth round about."

To cut off the horn of Israel is to break their "power" so that they will be defeated. Again, this illustrates that their horn is a symbol of their strength and power.

Deuteronomy 33:17

• "His glory is like the firstling of his bullock, and his horns are like the horns of unicorns: with them he shall push the people together to the ends of the earth: and they are the ten thousands of Ephraim, and they are the thousands of Manasseh."

Here again, the horn is used to symbolize the object of the power and strength of the Bull that enables him to push against the people.

Lamentations 2:17

• "The LORD hath done that which he had devised; he hath fulfilled his word that he had commanded in the days of old: he hath thrown down, and hath not pitied: and he hath caused thine enemy to rejoice over thee, he hath set up the horn of thine adversaries."

In this passage, God uses the horn to signify that he has taken away the strength or power of Israel as judgment, and has exalted the horn (or Power) of their adversaries to overcome her. In other words, while (verse 3) cutting off the horn of Israel means they no longer had power to stand against their enemies, setting up the horn of their adversaries (verse 17) means that the enemies now had the Power to conquer or overcome Israel. Clearly the horns there signify Power or strength. We see that when a horn is broken or cut off, it is symbolism that one's power has been broken or cut off. Whether used in conjunction with a crown, where it's man's ability to rule (as a king), or for something to be unable to stand or have strength before an enemy, that signified the cutting off of power. E.g.:

Daniel 8:7

• "And I saw him come close unto the ram, and he was moved with choler against him, and smote the ram, and brake his two horns: and there was no power in the ram to stand before him, but he cast him down to the ground, and stamped upon him: and there was none that could deliver the ram out of his hand."

When the horn was broken, there was no more "power" in him to stand before the he goat. This is what those broken "horns" symbolized! Not about "king" in this picture. And the same with the power of evil when it was broken.

Daniel 8:8

• "Therefore the he goat waxed very great: and when he was strong, the great horn was broken; and for it came up four notable ones toward the four winds of heaven."

The great horn allowed him to push with power so that the Ram could not stand before him. For example, it 'symbolized' his great power. And likewise, when his horn was broken, it symbolizes his power being broken or taken away.

Likewise in Revelation chapter 17 where we see that the dragon had ten horns. Here the number ten signifies fullness of whatever is in view, and the horns signify power. So this imagery is to illustrate the fullness of time these kings have "power" to rule along with the Beast.

Revelation 17:12

• "And the ten horns which thou sawest are ten kings, which have received no kingdom as yet; but receive Power as kings one hour with the beast."

The horns signify the "power" the "kings" had to rule with the beast for this short period.

1st Kings 22:11

• "And Zedekiah the son of Chenaanah made him horns of iron: and he said, Thus saith the LORD, With these shalt thou push the Syrians, until thou have consumed them."

Here God uses the imagery of horns of iron to illustrate the great power of them by which they could push the Syrians and defeat them.

The recurring theme of horns is that they symbolize the power of whatever is in view. Likewise, the lamb of Revelation 5:6 has seven horns depicting its power. The number seven illustrates the completeness or totality of whatever is in view, and thus this represents complete power. This signifies the lamb which was slain, was the appointed sacrifice and had complete or total power. Even as Christ illustrated Himself.

Matthew 28:18

• "And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth."

1st Peter 3:22

• "Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him."

So the Lamb with 7 horns signifies Jesus Christ, with complete power of God in the atonement. This of course is also witnessed by God speaking of the power of the sacrifice in the imagery of the 4 or universal horns of the altar.

Leviticus 4:7

• "And the priest shall put some of the blood upon the horns of the altar of sweet incense before the LORD, which is in the tabernacle of the congregation; and shall pour all the blood of the bullock at the bottom of the altar of the burnt offering, which is at the door of the tabernacle of the congregation."

Or in breaking the power of idolatry in breaking off the horns of the altar.

Amos 3:14

• "That in the day that I shall visit the transgressions of Israel upon him I will also visit the altars of Bethel: and the horns of the altar shall be cut off, and fall to the ground."

By this God is illustrating that he is taking away its power or strength.

The horns of the Dragon and the horns of the Lamb are related only in the sense that The Dragon is the substitute Christ or "Anti-christ" which mimics the true. The spirit of Satan the antithesis of the Spirit of Christ. He is truly the Pseudo christ. e.g.,

Revelation 13:11

• "And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth, and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon."

Horns "like" a lamb. This is the substitute or Pseudo Christ who mimics the Lamb of God, but is truly the Antichrist. He comes looking like the "Power" of Christ, but his words are what gives him away. For they are not the words of God, they are the words of men, the words of nullification, compromise, and lawlessness. The word of God is what the man of God will come with, but the words of Antichrist is what the man of lawlessness (sin) would come with. Satan's greatest deception is that he comes "looking like" the power of God and as a minister of righteousness (2nd Corinthians 11:14-15). He comes saying Peace, Peace, he comes with healings, he comes saying God loves you, because he is the great deceiver. This is his M.O. or Modus Operandi. In this sense that horns represent power. It is power no matter whose it is (Satan's or Christ's).

How's that for Biblical hermeneutics, Ronald??

 

[ewq1938]

Horns "like" a lamb. This is the substitute or Pseudo Christ who mimics the Lamb of God, but is truly the Antichrist.

That doesn't come from that verse though. All it says is he had the horns of a lambkin (two little horns of a young lamb), not that he acts or even looks like a lamb.

 

[TribulationSigns]

The river is a river and not symbolic.

Really? For example:
Rev 9:14-15
(14) Saying to the sixth angel which had the trumpet, Loose the four angels which are bound in the great river Euphrates.
(15) And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for to slay the third part of men.

Do you even understand what this river signifies where the four angels were bound? Literal, you say? Can a physical river hold the spirits?
Think again. How about this?

Rev 16:3-4
(3) And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea; and it became as the blood of a dead man: and every living soul died in the sea.
(4) And the third angel poured out his vial upon the rivers and fountains of waters; and they became blood.

Do you think God was talking about the pacific ocean as a sea to turn into the blood of men? How do you understand what the rivers, and foundations of waters represents when they become blood? What does the blood signifies? Let hear this from you, Mr. Literal Interpreater.

Sea when used symbolically refers to the gentiles

You are getting closer, but no, it is the wicked sea making up all unsaved people, so think about it as why God turn that sea into blood. Read the verses above. What does the blood of a deaf man refers to? Literal?

There are not frogs!
Revelation 16:13
And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.

The frogs has spiritual implications. yes, they are spirit LIKE frogs so why do you think God pictured the spirit as frogs. The frogs back in Exdous were literal fulfillment but has spiritual implications for Revelation so who do you think God sees frogs as? And why do they come out of the mouths of the beast, false prophet and dragon? You need to spiritually understand what God talk about. Of course not literally! Selah! Now tell us, who do you think the frogs represent here?

JOhn himself by using the comparative word "like" tells us they are not literal

Well duh. Like as to what? Like I said, take your time and do your homework first.

Also there are no locusts in revelation!

Like the frogs, who do you think God see the locusts as? The one with spirt that block the sun and the air. Do you even know what the sun and the air represent as?

​

9 And the fifth angel sounded, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth: and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit.
2 And he opened the bottomless pit; and there arose a smoke out of the pit, as the smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit.
3 And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth: and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.
4 And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth, neither any green thing, neither any tree; but only those men which have not the seal of God in their foreheads.
5 And to them it was given that they should not kill them, but that they should be tormented five months: and their torment was as the torment of a scorpion, when he striketh a man.
6 And in those days shall men seek death, and shall not find it; and shall desire to die, and death shall flee from them.

Do you understand verse 4-6? Why did God commanded the locusts that they can only hard those men without seal of God? nd what does torment of a scorpion means? Do you understand? Its in the Scripture so let see if you can figure this out with comparing Scirpture with Scirpture.
And what death is this when men try to seek it but cannot find it or desire to die but it flee from them. Why? This obviously requires spiritual understanding, not massive suicide attempts

Once again JOhn compares these creatures to locusts. But simply reading the plain language he used, one knows they are not normal everyday locusts.

LOL.. What creatures are these really?

God wrfote something different than how you reinterpret His Word.

Unlike you, I have quoted Scripture where God has defined it. I did not reinterpret his Word, Its His.

I will use the horns.

And? My previous post refute yours on horns.

As for the beast itself?

Yeah and what is God's definition for the beast, exactly? A literal animal or your fantasy one-man antichrist or certain country/empire?

1. It will devourt the whole earth (one world govt.

Oh? The beast as one world government? Where does God's Word confirm that exactly?

2. Next ten kings will rule the world.

Oh? ten literal men who will rule the world? Good luck with that.

3. 11th horn (antichrist) arises and subdues three kings

Oh? The 11th horn is a man that will remove three kings in order to take over power?

Ahem...

 

[TribulationSigns]

That doesn't come from that verse though. All it says is he had the horns of a lambkin (two little horns of a young lamb), not that he acts or even looks like a lamb.

You were not reading carefully or refusing to receive the love of the Truth. Earlier I have shown God's Word that the horn = power. Period.

The number two in Scripture is a signifcation for agreement, and by implication, truth. God has declared that the Church is the pillar and ground of the Truth (1st Timothy 3:15). This number is also often used in association with it. It is the numerical symbolism of a faithful (truthful) witness or testimony. Look at the TWO WITNESSES of Revelation 11 as an example. God did NOT talk about two literal supernatural walking around in physical city of Jersualem. Rather the two witnesses represent believers who come with truthful testimony, preaching gospel!

Another good example is when Jesus sent the seventy out TWO BY TWO. The number 70 (10 x 7) represents the totality of the church. And the number 2 to signifies that they come with Truth. Spiritual picture!

Therefore, the second beast of Revelation 13 represents body of false prophets and christs who pretend to come as Christians with power of Gospel Truth but their doctrine is of the devil. Selah!

 

[ewq1938]

Therefore, the second beast of Revelation 13 represents body of false prophets and christs who pretend to come as Christians with power of Gospel Truth but their doctrine is of the devil. Selah!

No, he is but one man known by many names but in Rev called a beast and false prophet.