What triggers Armageddon ?

[Douggg]

This is such an important point in understanding bible eschatology.

"Armageddon" is found in Revelation, Revelation 16:16, at the time of an angel pouring out the sixth vial of God's wrath. So it is at the very end of the Great Tribulation.

The secular world uses the term "Armageddon" in a different way than the bible. The secular world deems Armageddon as a final big war of all times, nations against nations.

But that is not what the bible says about Armageddon. The confrontation is the world against Jesus and His armies, at Jesus's Second Coming.

WHAT TRIGGERS ARMAGEDDON ?

It is the sign of the Son of man appearing in heaven. i.e. Jesus unexpectedly appearing in heaven, as the world gazes upward. Jesus they will see, sickle in hand. That is what triggers Armageddon.

The wicked of the world will be terrified at the appearance of Jesus above them. It will take the convincing of the beast, the false prophet, and Satan that the kings of the earth should make war on Jesus to prevent Him from executing judgment of the them. And thus the end begins.

 

[Davidpt]

The secular world uses the term "Armageddon" in a different way than the bible. The secular world deems Armageddon as a final big war of all times, nations against nations.

Something to factor in here I guess, in regards to what the secular world has decided what Armageddon is involving, would be this.

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows

IOW, if Armageddon is when the end happens, it can't be anything pertaining to man made wars, such as WW3, the fact that would plainly contradict what Jesus said in the verses above, that these things are the beginning of sorrows, that the end is not yet. One can't have it both ways, that it is the end and that it will be involving a man made war, such as WW3, when Jesus already told us, that things pertaining to man made wars, the end is not yet, but instead is the beginning of sorrows. Let's make up our mind here. Which is it then? The end? Or an event involving a man made war, such as WW3, thus not the end?

 

[TribulationSigns]

"Armageddon" is found in Revelation, Revelation 16:16, at the time of an angel pouring out the sixth vial of God's wrath. So it is at the very end of the Great Tribulation.

Indeed. Armageddon is the judgment of God upon His unfaithful bride, the church. Not a literal battle between the world and national Israel as you believe. "

But that is not what the bible says about Armageddon. The confrontation is the world against Jesus and His armies, at Jesus's Second Coming.

That is where you misunderstood. The spiritual battle of Armageddon is the conformation between the words of Satan's armies of false prophets and christs against the Word of Jesus Christ and His armies of true believers. If you are expecting a physical war in the Middle East, you will be disappointed and in risk of missing the true signs of Christ's return.

WHAT TRIGGERS ARMAGEDDON ?

Oh.. I am eagerly waiting to hear what you think will triggers armageddon. Who starts it?

It is the sign of the Son of man appearing in heaven. i.e. Jesus unexpectedly appearing in heaven, as the world gazes upward. Jesus they will see, sickle in hand. That is what triggers Armageddon.

LOL! No... seriously? Do you actually want us to believe that Jesus will come down holding a physical sickle?!? Come on! Do some homework and find what the sickle is spiritually used for. Look up in the Scripture instead of the Old Farmer's Almanac.

The wicked of the world will be terrified at the appearance of Jesus above them. It will take the convincing of the beast, the false prophet, and Satan that the kings of the earth should make war on Jesus to prevent Him from executing judgment of the them. And thus the end begins.

Sigh... so you believe that one-man antichrist, his false prophet from Rome, and all the world leaders will have their armies to point their guns, missiles, and lasers to Jesus Christ in the sky? What have you been doing? Watched some bad Left Behind movies?

 

[TribulationSigns]

Something to factor in here I guess, in regards to what the secular war has decided what Armageddon is involving, would be this.

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows

IOW, if Armageddon is when the end happens, it can't be anything pertaining to man made wars, such as WW3, the fact that would plainly contradict what Jesus said in the verses above, that these things are the beginning of sorrows, that the end is not yet. One can't have it both ways. One can't insist Armageddon is the end of this age and that it will be involving a literal war, such as WW3, when Jesus already told us, that things pertaining to man made wars, the end is not yet, but instead is the beginning of sorrows.

Sorry, but you are wrong to think the verses are talking about literal battles with guns and missiles. No.

Matthew 24 prophesies about the New Testament congregation of Israel, the church, prior to the Second Coming. It is spiritual Judea where spiritual Jews (believers) are found. Not national Israel in the Middle East. The verses describe a time of war and rumors of wars between the words of Satan through false prophets and christs, and the Word of God through the Two Witnesses (Elect) in the church. There will be spiritual famines where the Word of God has been silenced in the church, and spiritual sickness (pestilences) where people cannot find Christ in order to be healed. The earthquakes represent the shaking of the church's foundation as God is no longer found in her. This is only the beginning of sorrows, as it is a great tribulation for the Elect during this apostasy of the church.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

This is such an important point in understanding bible eschatology.

"Armageddon" is found in Revelation, Revelation 16:16, at the time of an angel pouring out the sixth vial of God's wrath. So it is at the very end of the Great Tribulation.

The secular world uses the term "Armageddon" in a different way than the bible. The secular world deems Armageddon as a final big war of all times, nations against nations.

But that is not what the bible says about Armageddon. The confrontation is the world against Jesus and His armies, at Jesus's Second Coming.

WHAT TRIGGERS ARMAGEDDON ?

It is the sign of the Son of man appearing in heaven. i.e. Jesus unexpectedly appearing in heaven, as the world gazes upward. Jesus they will see, sickle in hand. That is what triggers Armageddon.

The wicked of the world will be terrified at the appearance of Jesus above them. It will take the convincing of the beast, the false prophet, and Satan that the kings of the earth should make war on Jesus to prevent Him from executing judgment of the them. And thus the end begins.

Well many people have differing ideas as to what triggers Armageddon. but biblically what triggers Armageddon initially is:

Revelation 16:12-14

King James Version

​

12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

 

[Davidpt]

Sorry, but you are wrong to think the verses are talking about literal battles with guns and missiles. No.

Matthew 24 prophesies about the New Testament congregation of Israel, the church, prior to the Second Coming. It is spiritual Judea where spiritual Jews (believers) are found. Not national Israel in the Middle East. The verses describe a time of war and rumors of wars between the words of Satan through false prophets and christs, and the Word of God through the Two Witnesses (Elect) in the church. There will be spiritual famines where the Word of God has been silenced in the church, and spiritual sickness (pestilences) where people cannot find Christ in order to be healed. The earthquakes represent the shaking of the church's foundation as God is no longer found in her. This is only the beginning of sorrows, as it is a great tribulation for the Elect during this apostasy of the church.

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.


Per this context I do not see it being reasonable that Jesus didn't have literal man made wars in mind. Why not? It's not like there is no such thing as literal man made wars.

 

[Davidpt]

Sorry, but you are wrong to think the verses are talking about literal battles with guns and missiles. No.

Matthew 24 prophesies about the New Testament congregation of Israel, the church, prior to the Second Coming. It is spiritual Judea where spiritual Jews (believers) are found. Not national Israel in the Middle East. The verses describe a time of war and rumors of wars between the words of Satan through false prophets and christs, and the Word of God through the Two Witnesses (Elect) in the church. There will be spiritual famines where the Word of God has been silenced in the church, and spiritual sickness (pestilences) where people cannot find Christ in order to be healed. The earthquakes represent the shaking of the church's foundation as God is no longer found in her. This is only the beginning of sorrows, as it is a great tribulation for the Elect during this apostasy of the church.

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

These same wars Jesus is talking about in Matthew 24:6-8, do you then also have, via your interpretation of things, Armageddon involving these same type of wars? Do you agree or disagree that Armageddon is the end? If you agree but also have Armageddon involving the same type of wars that you have Matthew 24:6-8 involving, you too have contradicted what Jesus said in Matthew 24:6-8, that the end is not yet, but instead, is the beginning of sorrows. An obvious easy way to resolve the contradiction your interpretation causes would be thus. Matthew 24:6-8 is pertaining to literal man made wars, Armageddon isn't. And just like that, the contradiction goes away altogether. But who cares, though? Right? IOW, contradictions are more desirable than no contradictions, since we can make the former fit our interpretations, while the latter does the opposite, it contradicts our interpretations.

 

[TribulationSigns]

12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.

It is when God has removed the protective wall for His Church as a judgment of the whore. God was not talking about literal river in the Middle East but symbolically a spiritual protection between His Church and the world. The river was established so that God could build His church for the past 2,000 years. After that, when all Elect is secured (Revelation 7:1-4), God will remove his restraining hand out of the way with the water (signifies gospel) to dry up to allow the enemies to coming into the church where they think there is no walls and bars (protection). This is how God loosened Satan for this purpose, and HE is the one who triggered Armageddon because He is the one who decides when to bring Satan and his armies come into His unfaithful Congregation, a valley, for judgment by deceiving those who have not yet sealed by God.

Joe 3:12-14
(12) Let the heathen be wakened, and come up to the valley of Jehoshaphat: for there will I sit to judge all the heathen round about.
(13) Put ye in the sickle, for the harvest is ripe: come, get you down; for the press is full, the fats overflow; for their wickedness is great.
(14) Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision.

Rev 14:14-19
(14) And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
(15) And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.
(16) And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.
(17) And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.
(18) And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.
(19) And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.

Rev 8:3-4
(3) And another angel came and stood at the altar, having a golden censer; and there was given unto him much incense, that he should offer it with the prayers of all saints upon the golden altar which was before the throne.
(4) And the smoke of the incense, which came with the prayers of the saints, ascended up before God out of the angel's hand.

See, the souls of the Saints are under the altar, the altar is in the temple, and the Temple is in heaven. Not rocket science! Moreover, if you had just not ignored the CONTEXT of the souls under the altar, you would know this. The point of exegesis is to discover God's Truth, not our own.

What the verses are saying is that it was the prayers of the souls (and prayers of all saints) under the altar that the Lord started His judgment upon his unfaithful congregation who is responsible for the blood of the Prophets and the Saints. So the battle of Armggeddon is really about God's gathering all professed Christians, false prophets and false christs to THIS PLACE which is the congregations all over the world as a judgment for their wickedness.

This has nothing to do with physical war with national Israel, or bringing armies from all over the world to the Middle East.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.

These same wars Jesus is talking about in Matthew 24:6-8, do you then also have, via your interpretation of things, Armageddon involving these same type of wars? Do you agree or disagree that Armageddon is the end? If you agree but also have Armageddon involving the same type of wars that you have Matthew 24:6-8 involving, you too have contradicted what Jesus said in Matthew 24:6-8, that the end is not yet, but instead, is the beginning of sorrows.

The battle of Armageddon begun with the loosening of Satan and the gathering of false prophets and christs into the church where the testimony of Two Testimony is eventually silenced. This is just the beginning of sorrow for the end is not here... yet. Then the three and half days of Two Witnesses' death represents a period of time where false prophets and christs can exchange gifts (false doctrines) as they like without any resistance from True Saints. For example, the proliferation of homosexual pastors, women as pastors, divorce and remarriage as we like, worldly entertainment, getting involved with politics, etc. to the time that the SPirit of Life comes upon Two Witnesses for them to stand up and prophesy that the judgment has come and flee from apostate church to avoid her plagues. This is when Christ actually comes but not yet revealed because he is judging his church FIRST. This is what the signs in the sun, moon and stars, points to! It is Christ who has caused His unfaithful church to desolate as a judgment. After this symbolic "one hour" judgment of the whore is finished, Christ shall then reveal in the air at the Last Trump where the Saints shall be gathered together with him. So the battle of Armaggeddon is really not a battle on the "last day" but a period of time from the time God loosened Satan (after He finish building his church 1,260 days) and to abomination of desolation of the church (1,290 days), and finally the Second Coming (1,335 day). All symbolic days.

 

[ScottA]

This is such an important point in understanding bible eschatology.

"Armageddon" is found in Revelation, Revelation 16:16, at the time of an angel pouring out the sixth vial of God's wrath. So it is at the very end of the Great Tribulation.

The secular world uses the term "Armageddon" in a different way than the bible. The secular world deems Armageddon as a final big war of all times, nations against nations.

But that is not what the bible says about Armageddon. The confrontation is the world against Jesus and His armies, at Jesus's Second Coming.

WHAT TRIGGERS ARMAGEDDON ?

It is the sign of the Son of man appearing in heaven. i.e. Jesus unexpectedly appearing in heaven, as the world gazes upward. Jesus they will see, sickle in hand. That is what triggers Armageddon.

The wicked of the world will be terrified at the appearance of Jesus above them. It will take the convincing of the beast, the false prophet, and Satan that the kings of the earth should make war on Jesus to prevent Him from executing judgment of the them. And thus the end begins.

That's all good, but it must be understood correctly, by "rightly dividing" what is written. Without dividing what is "of this world", from what is rather of the kingdom of God and "not of this world", it can and has lead many to believe a false interpretation. Much of what is written in the book of Revelation, does not occur in this world, but in heaven.

This is one of those topics that if, like this passage, shows: "the Lord opened the eyes of the young man, and he saw. And behold, the mountain was full of horses and chariots of fire all around Elisha" 2 Kings 6:17--much is not actually seen. That is what the title refers to: The "Revelation" of many things otherwise unseen to this world.

 

[TribulationSigns]

Matthew 24:6 And ye shall hear of wars and rumours of wars: see that ye be not troubled: for all these things must come to pass, but the end is not yet.
7 For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places.
8 All these are the beginning of sorrows.


Per this context I do not see it being reasonable that Jesus didn't have literal man made wars in mind. Why not? It's not like there is no such thing as literal man made wars.

Spiritual discernment.

Our battle is spiritual. Not physical.

Eph 6:12
(12) For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

The church is the New Testament representation of God's Kingdom on this side of the Cross. It is a battle between God's Saints and Satan's false prophets and christs for the control of the kingdom prior to Second Coming. First she was ruled by Christ's kings of the earth, the Saints. But in the time of the end, it is the false prophets and christs who did not had a kingdom as of yet, but have agreed to give this kingdom to Satan. Therefore, Satan rules in the Church THROUGH his false propehts and christs where they are the one who came with lying signs and wonders. Thus is why they hates the church for who she once was with truthful testimony and has turned her into an harlot with abominations:

Rev 17:15-18
(15) And he saith unto me, The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues.
(16) And the ten horns which thou sawest upon the beast, these shall hate the whore, and shall make her desolate and naked, and shall eat her flesh, and burn her with fire.
(17) For God hath put in their hearts to fulfil his will, and to agree, and give their kingdom unto the beast, until the words of God shall be fulfilled.
(18) And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.

Because of these abominations and rebellion, God allowed them to turn over His kingdom (church) to Satan's rule for a short season before Christ returns.

Selah.

 

[Keraz]

What triggers Armageddon, is God helping all the ungodly peoples to gather so He can dispose of them.
Jesus will have just Returned and gathered His people to Him. Matthew 24:30-31, and as only they will go with Him into the Millennium, those who oppose Him must be got rid of.
The Lord will use some kind of plague, as Zechariah 14:13-15 tells us. Similar to what killed the 185,000 Assyrians in King Hezakiah's time.

 

[Marty fox]

This is such an important point in understanding bible eschatology.

"Armageddon" is found in Revelation, Revelation 16:16, at the time of an angel pouring out the sixth vial of God's wrath. So it is at the very end of the Great Tribulation.

The secular world uses the term "Armageddon" in a different way than the bible. The secular world deems Armageddon as a final big war of all times, nations against nations.

But that is not what the bible says about Armageddon. The confrontation is the world against Jesus and His armies, at Jesus's Second Coming.

WHAT TRIGGERS ARMAGEDDON ?

It is the sign of the Son of man appearing in heaven. i.e. Jesus unexpectedly appearing in heaven, as the world gazes upward. Jesus they will see, sickle in hand. That is what triggers Armageddon.

The wicked of the world will be terrified at the appearance of Jesus above them. It will take the convincing of the beast, the false prophet, and Satan that the kings of the earth should make war on Jesus to prevent Him from executing judgment of the them. And thus the end begins.

Actually, the bible doesn't say that Armageddon is the confrontation of the world against Jesus and His armies at Jesus's Second Coming.

The term Armageddon is only mentioned in revelation chapter 16 and its the defeat of Babylon the great by the beast and the kings which is confirmed in Revelation chapter 17.

Revelation chapter 19 is the confrontation between the world, beast and the false prophet against Jesus and His armies. The term Armageddon isn't even mentioned in revelation chapter 19 and either is Babylon the great. Revelation chapter 19 also shows the defeat of the beast and the false prophet by Jesus.

Chapters 16 & 19 are two different confrontations between different participants with different outcomes thus the bible shows that they are not the same events.

What triggers Armageddon is the verse below the persecution of the saint by Babylon the great.

Revelation 18
20 “Rejoice over her, you heavens!
Rejoice, you people of God!
Rejoice, apostles and prophets!
For God has judged her
with the judgment she imposed on you.”

 

[Jay Ross]

@Douggg please demonstrate that the 7th Bowl Judgement has not already played out in full and that the 6th Bowl judgement is not unfolding before us now..

 

[Douggg]

@Douggg please demonstrate that the 7th Bowl Judgement has not already played out in full and that the 6th Bowl judgement is not unfolding before us now..

The bowls, vials in some translations, contain God's wrath. None of them have taken place yet because the rapture/resurrection has not taken place yet.

In 1Thessalonians5:3 ,the world will be saying "peace and safety" right before the Day of the Lord begins when God's wrath is poured out. Prior to the beginning of the Day of Lord and God's wrath is the rapture/resurrection in verses 8-11.

6 Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.

8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.

9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.

So the comfort is Christians don't have to experience the Day of God's wrath, because of the rapture/resurrection (of the wake, the living in Christ and of the sleep, the dead in Christ) will happen before then.

 

[Duck Muscles]

I think we can speculate on this topic and have, for centuries.

God does all that he pleases.

The answer to the question of what triggers Armageddon is, God.

This world is precisely how God wants it to be.

 

[ewq1938]

Armageddon is not an event that is "triggered". It is commonly used that way but it's misleading.

Armageddon is an English translation of a Hebrew word pronounced Har-Megiddon. It's a place roughly 66 miles north of Jerusalem where some OT battles were fought and where two armies face, one of the Earth and one of Heaven. Jesus single-handedly kills every member of the enemy army and casts the beast and false prophet into the lake of fire.

The 6th vial enables the beast, false prophet and satan to have the kings of the world to gather their armies at Armageddon for the battle against the great God almighty, Rev 16:14.

This is a one-sided battle or war because one army is unharmed while the other army is completely destroyed.

The "event" of this is the war/killing that takes place, not the arrival of the first army, nor the leaving of the second and only surviving army. Only the fighting is what we would call "Armageddon".

 

[Jay Ross]

The bowls, vials in some translations, contain God's wrath. None of them have taken place yet because the rapture/resurrection has not taken place yet.

The "rapture" or more strictly speaking, the meeting of the saints with Christ in the air", that are still alive at the time Christ's return with all of the heavenly hosts, does not happen until after that disposal of the beast, the False Prophet and Satan into the Lake of fire, Then the final judgement of the peoples of the earth will commence.

Why do you make it more complicated that it really needs to be?

Your logic is screwed up.

 

[Marty fox]

Post number 13 is what the bible shows and the Bible is the authority

 

[Douggg]

The "rapture" or more strictly speaking, the meeting of the saints with Christ in the air", that are still alive at the time Christ's return with all of the heavenly hosts, does not happen until after that disposal of the beast, the False Prophet and Satan into the Lake of fire, Then the final judgement of the peoples of the earth will commence.

Why do you make it more complicated that it really needs to be?

Your logic is screwed up.

So you think that Christians are appointed to go through the time of God's wrath - in spite of what it says in 1Thessalonians5:8-11. That's not comforting to know, verse 11 - besides being incorrect.

8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.

9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,

10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.

11 Wherefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also ye do.