What's The Value Of Christian Visions?

[Hidden In Him]

Greetings all. Friends of Jesus posted the following link elsewhere, and it got us thinking about this particular question: What is the value in Christian visions, and I am asking this question with regard to both Old and New Testament visions as well as modern Christian ones.

I will post excerpts from the article just as food for thought, and we can take it from there.

God bless,
Hidden In Him
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A few famous Christians have had what might be called, in today’s world, an out-of-body experience, most notably the apostle Paul. He says in 2 Corinthians 12:1–4, “I must go on boasting. Although there is nothing to be gained, I will go on to visions and revelations from the Lord. I know a man in Christ who fourteen years ago was caught up to the third heaven. Whether it was in the body or out of the body I do not know—God knows. And I know that this man—whether in the body or apart from the body I do not know, but God knows—was caught up to paradise. He heard inexpressible things, things that man is not permitted to tell.” In the verses preceding this passage, Paul lists his “boasts” or the things that, if he were counting on works and good deeds to secure his salvation, would get him into heaven. Though he seems to be referring to someone else, scholars agree that he is speaking of himself in the third person. Paul includes this apparent out-of-body experience in his list of boasts. Out-of-body experiences are sensational, but, as Paul says, “There is nothing to be gained by it.” This does not mean that his out-of-body experience wasn’t real, only that he is not relying on it to really benefit himself or others in any way.

An involuntary out-of-body experience or a near-death experience should be treated in the same way as a dream in the life of a Christian—an unexplained phenomenon that may make a good story, but does not give us truth. The only place we find absolute truth is in the Word of God. All other sources are merely subjective human accounts or interpretations based on what we can discover with our finite minds...

Involuntary out-of-body experiences have made their way into some recent books and movies. One example is the popular book 90 Minutes in Heaven by Pastor Don Piper. Piper describes what is, in essence, an out-of-body experience he had after a severe car accident, during which he believes he died and went to heaven for ninety minutes. Whether or not Piper did actually see heaven or spend time there is debatable, and in the end nobody but God knows. However, there is a serious problem, theologically speaking, with the conclusion Piper draws from his experience. He tells the reader that, now that he has been to heaven, he can speak comfort to grieving people at funerals “with more authority” than he could previously. Piper’s motives are good: he wants to give people hope. However, it is dead wrong to say that his own subjective experience will give him more authority to administer the hope of heaven to others. Scripture, by itself, apart from our experience, is the authority.

In conclusion, an out-of-body experience will give us neither truth nor knowledge. If an involuntary out-of-body experience occurs in the life of a Christian, the best approach would be to consider it in the same category as a dream—interesting, perhaps, but not a reliable source of truth. Christians should not seek to have out-of-body experiences or practice astral projection. We are to find truth only in the words of God, as Jesus prays in John 17:17, “Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth.”
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I'm not actually familiar with John Piper's testimony personally, but I would agree with the title to this video ("Powerless Pulpits Deny The Existence Of Hell"), and I think it's one reason why visions today have value. The reality of things like Hell are being confirmed by them, and this is a doctrine well established in scripture and has been taught by the church from the very beginning. Yet many in more recent times have been questioning this, as if it actually isn't true. So God is sending some there to witness it and confirm that the long-held Christian doctrine is indeed a reality.

This would be my first response.

 

[Truman]

I find visions to be an intimate experience with the Lord. I tell them sometimes to encourage. Hearing that others have experiences can build faith. I'm encouraged by them, though not led. If and when I do come to understand what they mean, it's usually in hindsight. Like a pre-confirmation.
I really enjoyed reading Rick Joyner books and once in awhile I actually get something out of them. I've never had visions like that.
The most important vision I've ever had was the one that enabled me to understand my Father's love for me.
My heart has been with Him ever since. He knows everything about me and accepts me unconditionally. Because of the faith that He gave me in what Jesus did. Some will think that sounds like a license to sin. Oh well.
I often refer back to things He's shown me, like the time He showed me His glory. "So I have seen You in the sanctuary and beheld Your power and glory." - Psalm 63:2 BSB
There's a song called, "Satisfied With You" that is about the above Psalm. I sing it while picking it on my guitar, thinking about my experience long ago, and for a few moments, I'm there. In this way, I'm spoiled...I know it.
He's the same God as the God of the people who wrote the bible! I find that amazing! I find Him amazing! I open my mouth and I talk about Him. To be honest, He's all that really matters to me anymore.
I have a horrible life. I've been ill, in pain, and alone for many years. And yet this is why I have the relationship I do with Him. I complain and can be miserable, but knowing Him makes it all worth while. And He's slowly healing my soul.
This life only matters to me because I know He wants to use me somehow. I'm ready to go home anytime. When it gets really hard, I think of His word and things like visions. Maybe I have visions because I need them.
I died in the hospital once and saw Jesus in the New Jerusalem. Then He restarted my heart.
No matter what happens in this life...I am on the road...to my home...in the New Jerusalem!
So you see, visions really help me. If they can somehow help someone else, great!

 

[TLHKAJ]

Proverbs 29:18
[18]Where there is no vision, the people perish: but he that keepeth the law, happy is he.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Let me post here a few visions from scripture that show the purpose of visions. One is to prove the existence of God, of Heaven, and of the angelic beings that surround Him about His throne. This comes from Ezekiel's vision:

Ezekiel’s Vision of God

1 Now it came to pass in the thirtieth year, in the fourth month, on the fifth day of the month, as I was among the captives by the River Chebar, that the heavens were opened and I saw visions of God. 2 On the fifth day of the month, which was in the fifth year of King Jehoiachin’s captivity, 3 the word of the Lord came expressly to Ezekiel the priest, the son of Buzi, in the land of the Chaldeans by the River Chebar; and the hand of the Lord was upon him there.4 Then I looked, and behold, a whirlwind was coming out of the north, a great cloud with raging fire engulfing itself; and brightness was all around it and radiating out of its midst like the color of amber, out of the midst of the fire. 5 Also from within it came the likeness of four living creatures. And this was their appearance: they had the likeness of a man. 6 Each one had four faces, and each one had four wings. 7 Their legs were straight, and the soles of their feet were like the soles of calves’ feet. They sparkled like the color of burnished bronze. 8 The hands of a man were under their wings on their four sides; and each of the four had faces and wings. 9 Their wings touched one another. The creatures did not turn when they went, but each one went straight forward.

10 As for the likeness of their faces, each had the face of a man; each of the four had the face of a lion on the right side, each of the four had the face of an ox on the left side, and each of the four had the face of an eagle. 11 Thus were their faces. Their wings stretched upward; two wings of each one touched one another, and two covered their bodies. 12 And each one went straight forward; they went wherever the spirit wanted to go, and they did not turn when they went. 13 As for the likeness of the living creatures, their appearance was like burning coals of fire, like the appearance of torches going back and forth among the living creatures. The fire was bright, and out of the fire went lightning. 14 And the living creatures ran back and forth, in appearance like a flash of lightning.

15 Now as I looked at the living creatures, behold, a wheel was on the earth beside each living creature with its four faces. 16 The appearance of the wheels and their workings was like the color of beryl, and all four had the same likeness. The appearance of their workings was, as it were, a wheel in the middle of a wheel. 17 When they moved, they went toward any one of four directions; they did not turn aside when they went. 18 As for their rims, they were so high they were awesome; and their rims were full of eyes, all around the four of them. 19 When the living creatures went, the wheels went beside them; and when the living creatures were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up. 20 Wherever the spirit wanted to go, they went, because there the spirit went; and the wheels were lifted together with them, for the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheels. 21 When those went, these went; when those stood, these stood; and when those were lifted up from the earth, the wheels were lifted up together with them, for the spirit of the living creatures was in the wheels.

22 The likeness of the firmament above the heads of the living creatures was like the color of an awesome crystal, stretched out over their heads. 23 And under the firmament their wings spread out straight, one toward another. Each one had two which covered one side, and each one had two which covered the other side of the body. 24 When they went, I heard the noise of their wings, like the noise of many waters, like the voice of the Almighty, a tumult like the noise of an army; and when they stood still, they let down their wings. 25 A voice came from above the firmament that was over their heads; whenever they stood, they let down their wings.

26 And above the firmament over their heads was the likeness of a throne, in appearance like a sapphire stone; on the likeness of the throne was a likeness with the appearance of a man high above it. 27 Also from the appearance of His waist and upward I saw, as it were, the color of amber with the appearance of fire all around within it; and from the appearance of His waist and downward I saw, as it were, the appearance of fire with brightness all around. 28 Like the appearance of a rainbow in a cloud on a rainy day, so was the appearance of the brightness all around it. This was the appearance of the likeness of the glory of the Lord. So when I saw it, I fell on my face, and I heard a voice of One speaking. (Ezekiel 1:1-28)

Another purpose is to reveal prophecy, as can be seen in Daniel's and John's visions:

1 In the first year of Belshazzar king of Babylon, Daniel had a dream and visions of his head while on his bed. Then he wrote down the dream, telling the main facts. 2 Daniel spoke, saying, “I saw in my vision by night, and behold, the four winds of heaven were stirring up the Great Sea. 3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, each different from the other. 4 The first was like a lion, and had eagle’s wings. I watched till its wings were plucked off; and it was lifted up from the earth and made to stand on two feet like a man, and a man’s heart was given to it. 5 “And suddenly another beast, a second, like a bear. It was raised up on one side, and had three ribs in its mouth between its teeth. And they said thus to it: ‘Arise, devour much flesh!’ 6 “After this I looked, and there was another, like a leopard, which had on its back four wings of a bird. The beast also had four heads, and dominion was given to it. 7 “After this I saw in the night visions, and behold, a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, exceedingly strong. It had huge iron teeth; it was devouring, breaking in pieces, and trampling the residue with its feet. It was different from all the beasts that were before it, and it had ten horns. 8 I was considering the horns, and there was another horn, a little one, coming up among them, before whom three of the first horns were plucked out by the roots. And there, in this horn, were eyes like the eyes of a man, and a mouth speaking pompous words.

9 “I watched till thrones were put in place, And the Ancient of Days was seated; His garment was white as snow, And the hair of His head was like pure wool. His throne was a fiery flame, Its wheels a burning fire; 10 A fiery stream issued And came forth from before Him. A thousand thousands ministered to Him; Ten thousand times ten thousand stood before Him. The court was seated, And the books were opened. 11 “I watched then because of the sound of the pompous words which the horn was speaking; I watched till the beast was slain, and its body destroyed and given to the burning flame. 12 As for the rest of the beasts, they had their dominion taken away, yet their lives were prolonged for a season and a time.
13 “I was watching in the night visions, And behold, One like the Son of Man, Coming with the clouds of heaven! He came to the Ancient of Days, And they brought Him near before Him. 14 Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom, That all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion, Which shall not pass away, And His kingdom the one Which shall not be destroyed. 15 “I, Daniel, was grieved in my spirit within my body, and the visions of my head troubled me. 16 I came near to one of those who stood by, and asked him the truth of all this. So he told me and made known to me the interpretation of these things: 17 ‘Those great beasts, which are four, are four kings which arise out of the earth. 18 But the saints of the Most High shall receive the kingdom, and possess the kingdom forever, even forever and ever.’ (Daniel 7:1-18)

Both these purposes for visions are still being fulfilled today, though not everyone puts as much faith in modern witnesses as they do the Biblical ones, and understandably so. We can trust the Biblical accounts with certainty, whereas sometimes the accounts that are given in our time prove to be fanciful or fraudulent. Nevertheless, the Lord still reveals supernatural realities like Heaven and Hell, God and Satan, demons and angels, and 2nd Heaven and 3rd Heaven to the faithful today, as well as prophecy through visions of what is soon coming upon the earth.

 

[Truman]

I don't understand how someone can read v. 13 and not know who it is.
I think the first vision is God's mobile throne, isn't it?
I'd love to see that vision!
Either one, actually!
The second vision reminds me of a vision in 1 Enoch.
Poor Ezekiel! Lol