Whirlwinds of the South

[whirlwind]

Suit yourself "As a thief in the night" is a type, a how ....not a time ..
Its a figure of speech meaning when least expected or least ready or watching thats why God gave a parable describing it.

The 7th trump starts the Lords day its a day of darkness not a night of darkness

The night is always dark and those of the night are children of darkness. Yes, the seventh trump begins the Lord's Day and, as written, the angel "sounds for days," and the sounding begins in the night for He comes...."as a thief in the night."

Amo 5:18Woe unto you that desire the day of the LORD! to what end [is] it for you? the day of the LORD [is] darkness, and not light.

Yes...that proves what I have been trying to show you. He comes as a thief in the night...the day of the Lord is darkness and not light.

Amo 5:20[Shall] not the day of the LORD [be] darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?

Isa 13:9Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the sinners thereof out of it.His wrath is the 7 last vials they are not poured until in his day the Lords Day the 7th trump

Eze 30:3 For the day [is] near, even the day of the LORD [is] near, a cloudy day; it shall be the time of the heathen.


Joe 1:15Alas for the day! for the day of the LORD [is] at hand, and as a destruction from the Almighty shall it come.

Thank you for the quotes. They don't have any bearing on the timing but thank you anyway. I will say, you should be more careful on adding your thoughts to the Bible quotes for it looks as if your words were added to His Words......"His wrath is the 7 last vials they are not poured until in his day the Lords Day the 7th trump."



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[avoice]

The night is always dark and those of the night are children of darkness. Yes, the seventh trump begins the Lord's Day and, as written, the angel "sounds for days," and the sounding begins in the night for He comes...."as a thief in the night."





Yes...that proves what I have been trying to show you. He comes as a thief in the night...the day of the Lord is darkness and not light.







Thank you for the quotes. They don't have any bearing on the timing but thank you anyway. I will say, you should be more careful on adding your thoughts to the Bible quotes for it looks as if your words were added to His Words......"His wrath is the 7 last vials they are not poured until in his day the Lords Day the 7th trump."



.

As I said suit yourself

However a Day is not a night and scripture never speaks of a night of lord every scripture I gave calls it a Day
.....reguardless if its dark cloudy or whatever

It is Always called a day and the word darkness can mean obsure or secret ...Just as thief in the night means you do not know when he comes
just as we are told in the parable and figure of speech means. ....

I believe the meaning of the word serves to re-enforce the parable but see it how you chose

darkness is choshek

1) darkness, obscurity

a. darkness

b.secret place

 

[whirlwind]

As I said suit yourself

However a Day is not a night and scripture never speaks of a night of lord every scripture I gave calls it a Day
.....reguardless if its dark cloudy or whatever

It is Always called a day and the word darkness can mean obsure or secret ...Just as thief in the night means you do not know when he comes
just as we are told in the parable and figure of speech means. ....

I believe the meaning of the word serves to re-enforce the parable but see it how you chose

darkness is choshek

1) darkness, obscurity

a. darkness

b.secret place

Please consider.....

Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. ​

The sequence of events is....

1. The tribulation
2. The sun is darkened, etc.
3. The sign of the Son of man appears, the tribes of the earth mourn.
4. Then the trumpet sounds and His elect are gathered.​

The sign of the Son of man appears BEFORE the seventh trumpet sounds. Or...we could say....He comes as a thief in the night.



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[avoice]

Please consider.....

Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. ​

The sequence of events is....

1. The tribulation
2. The sun is darkened, etc.
3. The sign of the Son of man appears, the tribes of the earth mourn.
4. Then the trumpet sounds and His elect are gathered.​

The sign of the Son of man appears BEFORE the seventh trumpet sounds. Or...we could say....He comes as a thief in the night.



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Thanks

I dont dispute this of course he come as a thief in the night .......Im saying thief in the night does not mean at night time during night time hours...

It means when you least expect it .....The thief does not come when you are watching for him

Had God intended us to believe this was literal night time hours ..he wouldnt have bothered to give us an entire parable to explain his "thief in the night" figure of speech"
There is wittness after wittness saying its a Day ...Theres wittness's
saying when its least expected,or we do not the hour, .... mathew 24:50

Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come

“But you, brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief.”

Jesus reminds and warns His followers that if they do not stay awake, His return will surprise them like a thief..

Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you (Revelation 3:3).

There is no wittness or scripture to this meaning of... in the night time hours
in fact scripture puts all the emphasis on the "like a thief" and then explains that means when you are not watching or unexpected. As I pointed out darkness can mean secret or obscure

If you want to believe other wise thats fine by me I am not arguing what you believe ..
but what you are saying is personal interptation ..... It really doesnt matter what hour he comes

My only objection is that you cause confusion to others by talking about some obsure night of the Lord
thats never mentioned in the scriptures ...Or saying that thief in the night means something not written
God not being the author of confusion ....went the extra step to explain what the term means ..exactly so we wouldnt be confused about it.

So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him (Matthew 24:42-44).
Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour (Matthew 25:13).

No where did he tell us its an hour sometime during the nighttime

 

[whirlwind]

Thanks

I dont dispute this of course he come as a thief in the night .......Im saying thief in the night does not mean at night time during night time hours...

It means when you least expect it .....The thief does not come when you are watching for him

Had God intended us to believe this was literal night time hours ..he wouldnt have bothered to give us an entire parable to explain his "thief in the night" figure of speech"
There is wittness after wittness saying its a Day ...Theres wittness's
saying when its least expected,or we do not the hour, .... mathew 24:50

Therefore keep watch, because you do not know on what day your Lord will come

“But you, brothers, are not in darkness so that this day should surprise you like a thief.”

Jesus reminds and warns His followers that if they do not stay awake, His return will surprise them like a thief..

Remember, therefore, what you have received and heard; obey it, and repent. But if you do not wake up, I will come like a thief, and you will not know at what time I will come to you (Revelation 3:3).

There is no wittness or scripture to this meaning of... in the night time hours
in fact scripture puts all the emphasis on the "like a thief" and then explains that means when you are not watching or unexpected. As I pointed out darkness can mean secret or obscure

If you want to believe other wise thats fine by me I am not arguing what you believe ..
but what you are saying is personal interptation ..... It really doesnt matter what hour he comes

My only objection is that you cause confusion to others by talking about some obsure night of the Lord
thats never mentioned in the scriptures ...Or saying that thief in the night means something not written
God not being the author of confusion ....went the extra step to explain what the term means ..exactly so we wouldnt be confused about it.

So you also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him (Matthew 24:42-44).
Therefore keep watch, because you do not know the day or the hour (Matthew 25:13).

No where did he tell us its an hour sometime during the nighttime

The night is metaporic for Satan's time. What I have been saying, from the begining, is that the day of the Lord comes in the night...during Satan's time.

No one is now or has ever said that the day literally suddenly pops out in the middle of the night. Is that really what you thought was being discussed?


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[avoice]

The night is metaporic for Satan's time. What I have been saying, from the begining, is that the day of the Lord comes in the night...during Satan's time.

No one is now or has ever said that the day literally suddenly pops out in the middle of the night. Is that really what you thought was being discussed?

Yes :unsure: thats the way it comes across .....
Im sure babes are even more confused ...Thus is the pit falls of the typed word :blink:

Are you then suggesting the 7th trump sounds while the 6th is still going ?
If so I dont agree...I see it this way ....

During Satans time man is under the spirtual darkness of Satan on that I assume we agree
However Christ will never enter into that darkness IMO

When the 7th trump sounds the 6th is done, Period... over .....as is this age of man

We are in a new age the Lords Day ...

Its now then Satan who is in the darkness of the Lord Day .

And the Lords Day is only dark to those who do not follow him.


Amo 5:20[Shall] not the day of the LORD [be] darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?

This is the Lord's darkness upon Satan and those who follow him ....

Spiritual Darkness exists from the time Satan arrives on the scene until he is bound.
However its not all Satans darkness ......at the sound of the 7th trump it becomes the Lords darkness but not for us.

We of course are not the children of darkness so
the first thing we see the Lord do is gather his Elect and reap his bride ..... The Lords darkness is then poured out in his wrath an we are not appointed to his wrath

 

[whirlwind]

Yes :unsure: thats the way it comes across .....
Im sure babes are even more confused ...Thus is the pit falls of the typed word :blink:

Are you then suggesting the 7th trump sounds while the 6th is still going ?
If so I dont agree...I see it this way ....

During Satans time man is under the spirtual darkness of Satan on that I assume we agree
However Christ will never enter into that darkness IMO

When the 7th trump sounds the 6th is done, Period... over .....as is this age of man

We are in a new age the Lords Day ...

Its now then Satan who is in the darkness of the Lord Day .

And the Lords Day is only dark to those who do not follow him.


Amo 5:20[Shall] not the day of the LORD [be] darkness, and not light? even very dark, and no brightness in it?
This is the Lord darkness upon Satan and those who follow him .... We of course are not the children of darkness so
the first thing we see the Lord do is gather his Elect and reap his bride ..... The Lords darkness is then poured out in his wrath an we are not appointed to his wrath

Please remember:

1. The tribulation
2. The sun is darkened, etc.
3. The sign of the Son of man appears, the tribes of the earth mourn.
4. Then the trumpet sounds and His elect are gathered.


The day of the Lord begins during Satan's time, as a thief in the night.



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[avoice]

Please remember:

1. The tribulation
2. The sun is darkened, etc.
3. The sign of the Son of man appears, the tribes of the earth mourn.
4. Then the trumpet sounds and His elect are gathered.


The day of the Lord begins during Satan's time, as a thief in the night.



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No its not quite like that

1.Its tribulation (Satans darkness)

2. Immediatly after the tribulation (after what the tribulation of Satan thats now done )

3.Then the sun is darkened (some say by the brigness of his coming) either way
we are now seeing the darkness of the Lords Day ..and Ibelieve this is when the 7th trump blows trumps hearld the action.

 

[veteran]

I've tried to explain this before concerning the signs of the end we're given in God's Word, of how quickly the events of the day of The Lord will happen.

Because of the detail we're given about that day, it can appear that it takes a lot more time for it to happen than we think. Because of wanting to be careful to mark all the events we're given, we can come to think it will last a lot longer than it actually does.

I compare that to an analogy of being given great detail as to how something operates, like a car engine, or a Swiss watch. Covering the detail of all the moving parts and their purpose can make it seem like a lot of time is needed for it to work. But in actuality, all the parts move together to happen rapidly.

 

[veteran]

Zechariah 14:3-4 Then shall the LORD go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. And His feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

We are really in disagreement about this Veteran. First, there is no mention of an earthquake in that passage. Also, from the above we see that the feet of Christ stand on the mount of Olives. Those "feet" are us, those He walks in.....

2 Corinthians 6:16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.​

​

I have to disagree strongly that we are Christ's 'feet' per that Scripture. Acts 1 declares Christ will come back to this earth in like manner as He ascended into Heaven, and it was the literal area of the Mount of Olives where He ascended to Heaven from. Not everything in God's Word is applied symbolically, which is what rightly dividing The Word of God is about.

Luke 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence.

​

I think that great valley, great gulf, is the valley of the shadow of death. On one side are those of the first resurrection while on the other are those that will be taught during the millennium.

The great valley that will be formed in Jerusalem with the Mount of Olives splitting in two is that great earthquake of Rev.11:13 and Rev.16:18. It was referred to in Zech.14 with the following...

Zech 14:5
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with Thee.
(KJV)

There is only one harlot city...and that isn't Jerusalem. He tells us specifically that the great city is Babylon.

Again, rightly divide. Babylon is symbolically applied to endtime Jerusalem, as also with Sodom and Egypt in Revelation 11:8. The Babylon harlot of Revelation 17 is about a certain 'city' like the last verse declares.

Rev 17:18
18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.
(KJV)

I think we can depend on the order given Veteran. It is written, second, third, etc. for a reason. And, also for a reason the one we first read of is shown as.....

Revelation 6:1 And I saw when the Lamb opened one of the seals, and I heard, as it were the noise of thunder, one of the four beasts saying, Come and see.​

It isn't numbered for a reason but is shown as "one of the seals."

Whether one believes that rider on the white horse of Rev.6 is the pseudo-Christ, or our Lord Jesus, we know neither will come until later in the order of events, near the very last two signs as a matter of fact. That's why that first event given in Rev.6:1-2 is not named the first seal. That is pointing to the revealing of information about the 7 signs, and does not set the order of the signs like the 7 trumpets do.

The idea of The Lamb opening of the 7 seals back in Rev.5 was to show us that only Christ Jesus is worthy to open them up to our understanding. The very first sign of the end our Lord Jesus gave in His Olivet Discourse was to not allow any man to deceive us. That's what the sign of Rev.6:1-2 is about, a fake messiah coming on a white horse to deceive, trying to appear like our Lord Jesus coming on a white horse per Rev.16 & 19. Once one understands the 7 signs of the end they should realize our Lord Jesus gave that first sign in Rev.6 and in His Olivet Discourse to point out that is the MAIN warning for the end, to not fall away to the "strong delusion" by bowing to the coming final Antichrist.

 

[whirlwind]

No its not quite like that

1.Its tribulation (Satans darkness)

2. Immediatly after the tribulation (after what the tribulation of Satan thats now done )

3.Then the sun is darkened (some say by the brigness of his coming) either way
we are now seeing the darkness of the Lords Day ..and Ibelieve this is when the 7th trump blows trumps hearld the action.

The words of the Lord:


Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


1. The tribulation. 2.AFTER the tribulation the sun is darkened, etc. 3.THEN shall appear the sign of the Son of man coming in the clouds when the tribes mourn. 4. AND then the trumpet sounds and He gathers His elect.


The Day of the Lord comes "as a thief in the night," the night being Satans time.



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[avoice]

The words of the Lord:


Matthew 24:29-31 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together His elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.


1. The tribulation. 2.AFTER the tribulation the sun is darkened, etc. 3.THEN shall appear the sign of the Son of man coming in the clouds when the tribes mourn. 4. AND then the trumpet sounds and He gathers His elect.


The Day of the Lord comes "as a thief in the night," the night being Satans time.



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Your not seeing this as its written because you have drawn a conclusion not written and will not see what Christ says ...

you have the right puzzel piece but your trying to force it in upside down
you just need to turn over ...you are leading instead of letting God do the leading ...He tells you many times What that figure of speech means
He comes at a secret time when least expected so we are not to caught sleeping but watching.

You either accept his word or follow your own conclusion ..Good heavens google the term every kid on the block gets it.

The 6th ends the 7th begins. Just that simple God isnt the author of confusion ..and that exactly what he says
2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation

 

[whirlwind]

[/indent]
I have to disagree strongly that we are Christ's 'feet' per that Scripture. Acts 1 declares Christ will come back to this earth in like manner as He ascended into Heaven, and it was the literal area of the Mount of Olives where He ascended to Heaven from. Not everything in God's Word is applied symbolically, which is what rightly dividing The Word of God is about.

Yes, He returns as He left. The question is...do we know in what form He was when He left?


Acts 1:2-5 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen: To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God: And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

1:8-12 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

The great valley that will be formed in Jerusalem with the Mount of Olives splitting in two is that great earthquake of Rev.11:13 and Rev.16:18. It was referred to in Zech.14 with the following...

Zech 14:5
5 And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with Thee.
(KJV)




Again, rightly divide. Babylon is symbolically applied to endtime Jerusalem, as also with Sodom and Egypt in Revelation 11:8. The Babylon harlot of Revelation 17 is about a certain 'city' like the last verse declares.

Rev 17:18
18 And the woman which thou sawest is that great city, which reigneth over the kings of the earth.​

Babylon is not Jerusalem nor is she Rome nor is she New York.

Whether one believes that rider on the white horse of Rev.6 is the pseudo-Christ, or our Lord Jesus, we know neither will come until later in the order of events, near the very last two signs as a matter of fact. That's why that first event given in Rev.6:1-2 is not named the first seal. That is pointing to the revealing of information about the 7 signs, and does not set the order of the signs like the 7 trumpets do.

It was the only seal not given in numerical sequence. That is the only one we need question.

The idea of The Lamb opening of the 7 seals back in Rev.5 was to show us that only Christ Jesus is worthy to open them up to our understanding. The very first sign of the end our Lord Jesus gave in His Olivet Discourse was to not allow any man to deceive us. That's what the sign of Rev.6:1-2 is about, a fake messiah coming on a white horse to deceive, trying to appear like our Lord Jesus coming on a white horse per Rev.16 & 19. Once one understands the 7 signs of the end they should realize our Lord Jesus gave that first sign in Rev.6 and in His Olivet Discourse to point out that is the MAIN warning for the end, to not fall away to the "strong delusion" by bowing to the coming final Antichrist.

I agree but don't see what bearing it has on the topic.​

 

[whirlwind]

Your not seeing this as its written because you have drawn a conclusion not written and will not see what Christ says ...

Did I not provide the EXACT quote of Scripture and did I not place them in the same sequence as written? If the answer is yes then I must ask...who is not seeing?

you have the right puzzel piece but your trying to force it in upside down
you just need to turn over ...you are leading instead of letting God do the leading ...He tells you many times What that figure of speech means
He comes at a secret time when least expected so we are not to caught sleeping but watching.

Yes He does come when He is not expected and yes we should not be caught sleeping. Why? Because He "comes as a thief in the night."

You either accept his word or follow your own conclusion ..Good heavens google the term every kid on the block gets it.

I accept His Words....both written and spiritually given. As for all the kids on the block.....

1 Corinthans 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

1 Corinthians 3: 1-3 And I, brethren, could not speak unto you as unto spiritual, but as unto carnal, even as unto babes in Christ. I have fed you with milk, and not with meat: for hitherto ye were not able to bear it, neither yet now are ye able. For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?​

If we are able to bear it then we must put away childish things. We must see.

The 6th ends the 7th begins. Just that simple God isnt the author of confusion ..and that exactly what he says
2Pe 1:20
Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation

First...that means that all written Scripture is not given by man's interpretation. It is all divinely inspired by our Father.

Second....I did not interpret when He arrives...there is no need to for He is very explicit on His details. It is "as a thief in the night."



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[avoice]

Yes he does arrive as a thief in the night I never said differnt
it just doesnt mean what you say it means

It means what Christ said in the parable and many other places
but you can suit yourself and believe what you like.

 

[veteran]

Yes, He returns as He left. The question is...do we know in what form He was when He left?


Acts 1:2-5 Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen: To whom also he shewed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God: And, being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me. For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.

1:8-12 But ye shall receive power, after that the Holy Ghost is come upon you: and ye shall be witnesses unto me both in Jerusalem, and in all Judaea, and in Samaria, and unto the uttermost part of the earth. And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. Then returned they unto Jerusalem from the mount called Olivet, which is from Jerusalem a sabbath day's journey.

John 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you.

Our Lord Jesus was in His Resurrected Body when He ascended to Heaven from the Mount of Olives per Acts 1. That's the kind of body He will return with also. It's simple.

Babylon is not Jerusalem nor is she Rome nor is she New York.

You're right, the Revelation Babylon is not Rome, nor New York, nor any city in Europe. It is pointing to Jerusalem in a fallen condition, because that's where Bible prophecy has revealed the final Antichrist is going to appear and rule from.

I agree but don't see what bearing it has on the topic.

The Rev.5 opening of the 'seals' by Christ represents the opening of understanding for the rest of His Book of Revelation. That none other was worthy to open the seals but Christ reveals we all must go through Christ Jesus to get that understanding, especially in His Book of Revelation.

The seven seals of Rev.6 are given to match how our Lord Jesus gave the seven signs for the end in Matt.24 and Mark 13 while upon the Mount of Olives with His disciples. The first sign He gave upon the Mount of Olives was to not allow any man to deceive us. The timing for that event of deception is especially about a later sign He gave there with the abomination of desolation and the pseudochristos of Matt.24:24 and Mark 13:22. So the events of Rev.6 have some things slightly out of time order.

 

[whirlwind]

Our Lord Jesus was in His Resurrected Body when He ascended to Heaven from the Mount of Olives per Acts 1. That's the kind of body He will return with also. It's simple.

He showed He was alive "by many infallible proofs."

You're right, the Revelation Babylon is not Rome, nor New York, nor any city in Europe. It is pointing to Jerusalem in a fallen condition, because that's where Bible prophecy has revealed the final Antichrist is going to appear and rule from.

Jerusalem isn't Babylon. Babylon is the great city, the spiritual city:

Revelation 11:8 And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.

Revelation 18:10 Standing afar off for the fear of her torment, saying, Alas, alas that great city Babylon, that mighty city! for in one hour is thy judgment come.
:​

The Rev.5 opening of the 'seals' by Christ represents the opening of understanding for the rest of His Book of Revelation. That none other was worthy to open the seals but Christ reveals we all must go through Christ Jesus to get that understanding, especially in His Book of Revelation.

I agree and it is His Spirit that reveals this allowing us to understand.

The seven seals of Rev.6 are given to match how our Lord Jesus gave the seven signs for the end in Matt.24 and Mark 13 while upon the Mount of Olives with His disciples. The first sign He gave upon the Mount of Olives was to not allow any man to deceive us. The timing for that event of deception is especially about a later sign He gave there with the abomination of desolation and the pseudochristos of Matt.24:24 and Mark 13:22. So the events of Rev.6 have some things slightly out of time order.

Only one is not listed properly.



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