Why I'm not going to Heaven

[domenic]

Obviously a couple of Jehovah's witnesses here. Unfortunately the 144,000 theory does not hold up to scripture. The offer of the indwelling presence of THE Holy Spirit is not limited to just 144.000. If it is, then I am one of them, as I have the Holy Spirit, and have been used on occasion in a gift or two, not the least of which is the gift of tongues. I could not pray in tongues before I was filled. One could question the source if they want, but Jesus assured us that if we asked God for bread, we would not receive a stone. "How much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to they who ask?" Here is the part you should note. One can ask. And according to several sources, HE (the Holy Spirit) is given as a guarantee of our inheritance.
So I suspect that you do not have a guarantee within you. But rather than assume, I will ask you...do you expect to live forever?

I don't know who you are addressing, but as for me...do I expect to live forever? I have no idea? I do not serve God for the reward of life, or for bread. I serve him because I love him, As to your speaking in tongues, those in the Bible who did that, crowds of people all heard the speaker in their own tongue. Those who speak in tongues today...nobody understands a word their are saying...that is not from God. People who serve God do it because their heart wants nothing in return...they do it because they have a burning love for God...If God wanted me not to live forever...that would be fine with me. I would still serve him as long as I am alive.

 

[JB_Reformed Baptist]

Obviously a couple of Jehovah's witnesses here. Unfortunately the 144,000 theory does not hold up to scripture. The offer of the indwelling presence of THE Holy Spirit is not limited to just 144.000. If it is, then I am one of them, as I have the Holy Spirit, and have been used on occasion in a gift or two, not the least of which is the gift of tongues. I could not pray in tongues before I was filled. One could question the source if they want, but Jesus assured us that if we asked God for bread, we would not receive a stone. "How much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to they who ask?" Here is the part you should note. One can ask. And according to several sources, HE (the Holy Spirit) is given as a guarantee of our inheritance.
So I suspect that you do not have a guarantee within you. But rather than assume, I will ask you...do you expect to live forever?

I tell the JW's this every time they visit.

 

[7angels]

i would like to understand how you came up with these views please.

Howie, I apologize if my post sounded harsh, or like a bark…it was not meant to be so. Let me explain what I was saying a different way. Most people take the word sin, to mean something bad. The true meaning of the word means, “Falling short of the marks.,” or, “Putting something that was right, wrong.”
Adam and Eve were perfect. The act they did made them imperfect. They did something that was passed on to you, and me…death. Finding what that something was is not that difficult. Convincing others is.
this i believe i understand what you are referring to here.
Here are facts , and questions I have gathered;
1)The angels in Heaven rebelled after God commanded them to serve man.
where do you get your information/reasoning to support this so-called fact?
2)Throughout the Bible, when God commands someone do something, and they refuse, he forces the to do it, with consequences.
this is wrong but i believe i already know how you came to your conclusion because of phoaroh right? if not please enlighten me.
3) There had to be a reason Satan wanted Adam and Eve to sin. What could be gained?
how about ownership of the earth that God gave to man?
4) Adam called Eve women, and after the birth of Cain, called her Eve.
i don't know what you are trying to infer here.
5) The word Eve meant, giver of life. (seed.) This means it was not Adams seed?
on what basis do you come up with this view?
6) Genesis 5. Here we see the name of Adams first child, Seth. Cain and Able are not in this list. The Birth os Seth was some 130 years after the birth of Cain and Able.
here i believe cain lost his identity because of what happened with able so that is why seth starts out the lineage from adam.
7) Genesis 4. Adam had sex with Eve, and she became pregnant. In time she gave birth to Cain. This goes against Genesis 5? Something is wrong here. It is a fact some changes have been made in the Bible. I believe this is one.
i believe the bible has no contradictions but rather are mysteries we have yet to solve. otherwise God's Holy Word is not infalliable thus there is no real reason to believe in it and follow it.
8) Angels have no seed to reproduce. They do not reproduce.
this is contrary to the Word but i understand how you have come to believe in it.
9) Genesis 3:15. God is talking to Satan about Satan’s seed? Somehow Satan has a seed, and did something with it? This verse is also about Jesus and his seed.
the old seed time and harvest explains this verse along with the capital S for her Seed.
10) Genesis 3:14. God is saying to a serpent, (this word is used for Satan, but in this case I don’t think it is Satan. I believe it is a different angel.) ‘because you have done this, you are the cursed one of all the domestic animals, and out of all the wild beast of the field.” Angels are not animals? Why is God calling an angel an animal?
i don't think he is refering to an angel but to the snake itself. if you look at a skeleton of a snake you will see where at one time it could of had feet.
11) Satan was not cast down to serve man. He went back and forth between Heaven, and Earth. The angels that were cast down, could not go back and forth.
according to the bible there are 3 heavens. also things were different under the old covenant and the new convenant we are now under now.
12) There are two sets of Scrolls. One was used to write the Bible I will call “A.” The other set are much older. These older ones are the Dead Sea Scrolls I will call “B.” Sections in Genesis did not match.
When parts of the dead Sea Scrolls were translated they were released. There was a difference found; Scrolls “A.” Eve gives birth to Cain, and says, “I have gotten a man from the Lord.” Scrolls “B” reads, “I have gotten a man from the angel of the Lord Samuel.”
Someone stopped the release of the translations of the Dead Sea Scrolls. A short time later, a new release of Genesis from the dead Sea Scrolls was released that matched Scroll “A“?
this i know very little about. it will require research on my part to understand better.
13) All the trees in the Bible are symbolic trees. Why are the two trees in the Garden not referred to as symbolic trees?
maybe they are literal and symbolic. all i know for sure is that every book of the bible speaks of Christ and redemption in one form or another.
14) Why would God not want Adam and Eve to know right from wrong? The complete Bible we have teaches us right from wrong? I have heard it said, God wanted to be the one to tell them right from wrong…I have seen nothing in the Bible to prove that out.
we can find this out of by looking at the character of God. God never changes so his character will never change either.
15) Some things in Genesis have been changed. Over history, men have been burned at the stake for making changes to the Bible.
i don't know what you are trying to say here.
16) Animals always aged, and died.
Is a picture emerging here for you? It has for me. Here is what I believe:
The angels who refused to serve man, were cast down in a form lower than man, but higher than animal. Somewhat of a man like animal…more of the animal tree, than the human tree. Satan used one of these, (Samuel) and had sex with Eve. She gave birth to Cain, and Abel. These two children, not from Adam, had animal seed. This animal seed is passed on to the whole human family…it is why we die.
Satan’s plan to gather followers? Free the angels from having to serve man, by getting man to disobey God.
I know there are some who will never believe the Bible has been changed. It has been proven many times over that some sections have been. Even today, different religious groups have their own Bible which some things read different from the Bibles of other groups. Look at the Catholic Bible verses the KJ.

your explaination of satan, angels, cain, and able requires even more faith to believe in and has even fewer scriptures to back up the claim that i know of.

God bless

 

[Guestman]

Obviously a couple of Jehovah's witnesses here. Unfortunately the 144,000 theory does not hold up to scripture. The offer of the indwelling presence of THE Holy Spirit is not limited to just 144.000. If it is, then I am one of them, as I have the Holy Spirit, and have been used on occasion in a gift or two, not the least of which is the gift of tongues. I could not pray in tongues before I was filled. One could question the source if they want, but Jesus assured us that if we asked God for bread, we would not receive a stone. "How much more will your Father in heaven give the Holy Spirit to they who ask?" Here is the part you should note. One can ask. And according to several sources, HE (the Holy Spirit) is given as a guarantee of our inheritance.
So I suspect that you do not have a guarantee within you. But rather than assume, I will ask you...do you expect to live forever?

First off, domenic is not one of Jehovah's Witnesses, but I am. There is a difference between receiving the holy spirit and being anointed with holy spirit. All who are obedient can receive holy spirit (Luke 11:13), but only a select number of 144,000 from among imperfect mankind are anointed with holy spirit, telling them that they have the "heavenly calling".(Heb 3:1)

That is why the apostle Paul wrote to the Ephesians, that "by means of him also (Jesus), after you believed, you were sealed with the promised holy spirit, which is a token in advance of our inheritance."(Eph 1:13, 14) These are "assigned as heirs" with Christ Jesus.(Eph 1:11) These are the "things....in the Christ" (Eph 1:10) that are being gathered as the "nation" producing the "fruits" of God's kingdom (Matt 21:43), displaying the "fruitage of the spirit" as an example for others to follow.(Gal 5:22, 23)

Most who call themselves "Christian" never give consideration to Jesus words: "Blessed are the meek: for they shall inherit the earth."(Matt 5:5) Jesus was quoting from David's words at Psalms 37:11. The trend within most who say they are "Christian" is to think that "all good people go to heaven", feeling that they are among the ones going.

Yet, only a few can grasp what it means to be "kings and priests" of the heavenly kingdom (Rev 1:6), why the need for priests if "all good people go to heaven", why Jesus is called "the Christ" or "anointed one", why others are chosen to serve with him as "joint heirs with Christ" (Rom 8:17), why Jesus and these form "the kingdom of God", in which 144,000 are selected from among mankind who are "without blemish".(Rev 14:1, 5)

The word "anoint" comes from the Hebrew mashach (from which the word Messiah comes), meaning "to set aside as holy or for a special purpose". Hence, since the time Jesus revealed the "kingdom" that was "the sacred secret which has been kept in silence for long-lasting times"(Rom 16:25), when a person is anointed with holy spirit, they are set aside by Jehovah God for a special holy purpose of ruling as "kings and priests", ruling "over the earth."(Rev 5:10)

These are the "little flock" that "your Father has approved of giving you the kingdom."(Luke 12:32) Hence, the "little flock" of 144,000 are small in comparison to the unnumbered "other sheep" that will live on an earthly paradise and be ruled over by the the "little flock" that comprises the "kingdom of God".(John 10:16)