Why was there a reformation?

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theefaith

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matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail

man attack on the church is an attack on Christ
I see that you simply cannot get off your hobby horse. The Reformation was both necessary and beneficial because the Catholic church has been totally corrupt and full of errors. Since you support that corruption, you will never find the truth.

Not scripture sorry

matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Matt 18:17 hear the truth from the church
1 Tim 3:15 the church is the pillar and ground of truth


The evidence of true faith is humble subjection and obedience to Christ & His holy church!

The rule of faith for Christians is Jesus Christ Jn 14:6 and His church! Matt 18:17 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15

Truth is revealed by God thru Christ to His church (the apostles) Jude 1:3 then proposed by the church! Matt 28:19

Rejection of the one true church or its teaching is rejection of Christ and God!
 

Truman

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I know many Catholics...including relatives. We disagree and whatever. We talk about what we agree on.
 
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JohnPaul

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more than your pope. The authority was from Jesus who said to go out and spread the gospel. That is what they did, unlike you catholics and your fake “truth.”
Brother don’t speak like that, it’s not nice saying you Catholics, he’s our Christian brother, pray that he sees the way and not with a tone of hatred.
 

Truman

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man attack on the church is an attack on Christ


Not scripture sorry

matt 16:18-19 shall not prevail
Matt 18:17 hear the truth from the church
1 Tim 3:15 the church is the pillar and ground of truth


The evidence of true faith is humble subjection and obedience to Christ & His holy church!

The rule of faith for Christians is Jesus Christ Jn 14:6 and His church! Matt 18:17 acts 2:42 1 Tim 3:15

Truth is revealed by God thru Christ to His church (the apostles) Jude 1:3 then proposed by the church! Matt 28:19

Rejection of the one true church or its teaching is rejection of Christ and God!
Don't you ever get tired of hearing yourself talk...I know I do. You, that is. Perhaps you're A.I.
 

theefaith

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I know many Catholics...including relatives. We disagree and whatever. We talk about what we agree on.

it’s all good

I prefer what we disagree on
Mix it up
Share wisdom and insights and spiritual gifts
 
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theefaith

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Don't you ever get tired of hearing yourself talk...I know I do. You, that is. Perhaps you're A.I.

no but I did start a thread in the praise and also the unorthodox thread about God and thanksgiving but never mentioned Mary, the church or the apostles authority lol
 
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Truman

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no but I did start a thread in the praise and also the unorthodox thread about God and thanksgiving but never mentioned Mary, the church or the apostles authority lol
I might have to check them out!
 

Lifelong_sinner

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This person is obsessed with arguing. They keep sending me personal messages about the same topic. I must really have gotten under his skin with the reformation month thing.
 

theefaith

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This person is obsessed with arguing. They keep sending me personal messages about the same topic. I must really have gotten under his skin with the reformation month thing.

just sharing
Jude 1:3 contend for thee faith

btw “thee faith” is found 31 times in the New Testament
 

Lifelong_sinner

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Brother don’t speak like that, it’s not nice saying you Catholics, he’s our Christian brother, pray that he sees the way and not with a tone of hatred.

dude… i get that, but that person has been unrelenting on us all concerning being a catholic. Theres no hatred on my part towards them, but they do need a new song and dance.
 

theefaith

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No offense
Truth matter

and there is only one truth

the truth is not something but somebody Jesus Christ Jn 14:6
 

JohnPaul

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dude… i get that, but that person has been unrelenting on us all concerning being a catholic. Theres no hatred on my part towards them, but they do need a new song and dance.
I was once Catholic, baptized shortly after birth, did all my sacraments and praised the Pope, then one day all of a sudden I literally saw the light, just like that, I just couldn’t do it anymore so I stopped and am just plain Christian.

All one needs to do is read the Bible and the truth will penetrate that easily, it did for me.

The only time I go to a Catholic Church is when I have a wedding, my family is Catholic, other than that I don’t go to any Church, I rely on the words of God to guide me.
 

JohnPaul

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@theefaith you are Catholic correct? And you have read the Bible, I mean the real Bible not the Catholic book they have in back of the pews.
 

Jane_Doe22

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just sharing
Jude 1:3 contend for thee faith

btw “thee faith” is found 31 times in the New Testament

When somebody says “no thank you”, and you keep pushing the matter anyways, that’s not sharing. That’s spamming.
 

Desire Of All Nations

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The first speaker(@0:01) is absolutely wrong when he says the true gospel was restored in the 16th century. Aside from some doctrinal changes, Martin Luther and the other Reformers' only accomplishment was starting Catholic offshoot churches as Rev. 17:5 plainly shows. Matt. 17:10-11 is the only place in the Bible that prophecies knowledge of the true gospel was going to be recovered and taught throughout the world. It most certainly did not happen with the Reformation.

The second speaker(@0:47) is extremely wrong when he implies obeying God is an attempt on someone's part to justify themselves. The "gospel" he talks about being recovered in the wake of the Reformation is nothing more than a lawless gospel that mirrors 1st century Gnosticism a lot more than it does apostolic Christianity.

One of the many problems with Protestants is that they don't realize how illogical and contradictory their beliefs are. They argue that Jesus didn't establish the Catholic Church, but their adoration of the Reformation is based on the idea that the Catholic Church was given knowledge of the true gospel and lost it. In order for this church to have lost that knowledge, Jesus would've logically had to establish this church and give it the knowledge.

The last speaker(@2:56) raised an interesting point where he talks about the gospel being shoved to the side for pop psychology and entertainment. However, what he fails to realize is that the true gospel won't be found in any Sunday-keeping church because they all reject God's commandments. The formula for understanding the true gospel(as well as any other doctrine in the Bible) is that the understanding comes as a result of obeying God's commandments(Psa. 111:10).
There are many different beliefs because there are many different persons in the world. We aren’t clones.

And there will forever continue to be thus, even if we were to live in a theocracy where all other views were visablly suppressed ( which would just hide the other views).
The Bible disagrees with you.The OT Millennial prophecies concerning what will be taught all say there will only be 1 gospel being taught through out the world, and that gospel will be the message Christ and the other 1st century apostles declared concerning the Kingdom of God. There will be 0 false gospels being taught or tolerated like they are in Orthodox Christianity. Yes, Christians aren't clones, and yes they have different personalities, but that doesn't null Paul's words at all when he said the members of God's Church are completely united in doctrine, judgement, and traditions.
 

Cassandra

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You can ask i
dude… i get that, but that person has been unrelenting on us all concerning being a catholic. Theres no hatred on my part towards them, but they do need a new song and dance.

If someone is sending you personal messages, you can tell them to stop. According to the forum rules, they have to.

[*]If a member requests the cessation of all personal contact, then please respect that member's wish.
 
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Jane_Doe22

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The first speaker(@0:01) is absolutely wrong when he says the true gospel was restored in the 16th century. Aside from some doctrinal changes, Martin Luther and the other Reformers' only accomplishment was starting Catholic offshoot churches as Rev. 17:5 plainly shows. Matt. 17:10-11 is the only place in the Bible that prophecies knowledge of the true gospel was going to be recovered and taught throughout the world. It most certainly did not happen with the Reformation.

The second speaker(@0:47) is extremely wrong when he implies obeying God is an attempt on someone's part to justify themselves. The "gospel" he talks about being recovered in the wake of the Reformation is nothing more than a lawless gospel that mirrors 1st century Gnosticism a lot more than it does apostolic Christianity.

One of the many problems with Protestants is that they don't realize how illogical and contradictory their beliefs are. They argue that Jesus didn't establish the Catholic Church, but their adoration of the Reformation is based on the idea that the Catholic Church was given knowledge of the true gospel and lost it. In order for this church to have lost that knowledge, Jesus would've logically had to establish this church and give it the knowledge.

The last speaker(@2:56) raised an interesting point where he talks about the gospel being shoved to the side for pop psychology and entertainment. However, what he fails to realize is that the true gospel won't be found in any Sunday-keeping church because they all reject God's commandments. The formula for understanding the true gospel(as well as any other doctrine in the Bible) is that the understanding comes as a result of obeying God's commandments(Psa. 111:10).
The Bible disagrees with you.The OT Millennial prophecies concerning what will be taught all say there will only be 1 gospel being taught through out the world, and that gospel will be the message Christ and the other 1st century apostles declared concerning the Kingdom of God. There will be 0 false gospels being taught or tolerated like they are in Orthodox Christianity. Yes, Christians aren't clones, and yes they have different personalities, but that doesn't null Paul's words at all when he said the members of God's Church are completely united in doctrine, judgement, and traditions.
I said that there are many beliefs.
That is different than saying there are many Gospels- obviously there is only 1 Gospel.

However, because humans are sinners, they are always going to have different beliefs, yes with many bad docterines thrown in there. There’s no point in bemoaning that- it is how it is and it would be unethical to try to force others to believe as you do. Share your beliefs and pray that others embrace them, yes. But not force.
 
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theefaith

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I was once Catholic, baptized shortly after birth, did all my sacraments and praised the Pope, then one day all of a sudden I literally saw the light, just like that, I just couldn’t do it anymore so I stopped and am just plain Christian.

All one needs to do is read the Bible and the truth will penetrate that easily, it did for me.

The only time I go to a Catholic Church is when I have a wedding, my family is Catholic, other than that I don’t go to any Church, I rely on the words of God to guide me.

DIY religion!

Nowhere does the Bible say to read and make doctrine for yourself?

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4
Eph 5:32 Jn 15:1-5

Saul was persecuting the church, and Christ said “why persecute me”? Acts 9:4

Rebellion and rejection of the church or apostles or council or teaching of church or apostles or council is rebellion and rejection of Christ!

Christ and his church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

Jn 15:1-5 Christ united to his apostles (the church) bearing fruit! (The salvation of souls)

The church and the apostles exist by his commands and authority! Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 20:21-23

An attack on the church is an attack on Christ!

There is an unbreakable union between Christ and His Holy Church!

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Lk 10:16 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20

Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Gates of hell shall NOT PREVAIL!

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors, it is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 16:18 One fold
Jn 10:16 the household of faith! Gal 6:10

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Christ and His church are one, what Christ did the church continues to do, the church is an extension of Christ!
To attack the church is to attack Christ!
Acts 9:4 Jn 20:21-23

Eph 5: 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Prophecy of the new covenant church fulfilled in the apostles union with Christ!

Dan 2: 44 And in the days of these kings (Roman Caesars) shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom, which shall never be destroyed: and the kingdom shall not be left to other people, but it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand for ever.

Isaiah 2:2
And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the Lord's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.

Micah 4:1
But in the last days it shall come to pass, that the mountain of the house of the Lord shall be established in the top of the mountains, and it shall be exalted above the hills; and people shall flow unto it.

Lk 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:

33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.

Matthew 5:14
Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

What authority does Christ have?
What power does Christ have?
What mission / ministry does Christ have?

Peter, the apostles and their successors have the same authority, power, and mission! Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, even so send I you!

Lk 10:16
He who hears you hears me...

John 13:20
Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that receiveth whomsoever I send receiveth me; and he that receiveth me receiveth him that sent me.

Jn 20:21 as my father sent me, so send in you. (The apostles) posses the same power mission and authority as Christ!
Peter, the apostles and their successors!

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18
matt 28:19 Jn 20:21-23 Isa 22:21-22
eph 2:20

Ephesians 5:24
Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ...

The church is the ark of salvation, to attack the church is to attack salvation!

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors, it is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 16:18 One fold
Jn 10:16 the household of faith! Gal 6:10





but the church is an extension of Christ

Christ and His church are one! Acts 9:4

Saul was persecuting the church, and Christ said “why persecute me”? Acts 9:4

Rebellion and rejection of the church or apostles or council or teaching of church or apostles or council is rebellion and rejection of Christ!

Christ and his church are one! Acts 9:4 eph 5:32

The church and the apostles exist by his commands and authority! Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18 Jn 20:21-23

An attack on the church is an attack on Christ!

There is an unbreakable union between Christ and His Holy Church!

Jesus Christ continues HIS ministry in His new covenant church thru Peter, the apostles, and their successors with the same mission, power, and authority!
Mt 16:18 Mt 28:19 Lk 10:16 Jn 13:20 Jn 15:5 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20

Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.

Gates of hell shall NOT PREVAIL!

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors, it is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 16:18 One fold
Jn 10:16 the household of faith! Gal 6:10

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Christ and His church are one, what Christ did the church continues to do, the church is an extension of Christ!
To attack the church is to attack Christ!
Acts 9:4 Jn 20:21-23


Eph 5: 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body.

24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word,

27 That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.

28 So ought men to love their wives as their own bodies. He that loveth his wife loveth himself.

29 For no man ever yet hated his own flesh; but nourisheth and cherisheth it, even as the Lord the church:

30 For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones.

31 For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and shall be joined unto his wife, and they two shall be one flesh.

32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
 

theefaith

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You cannot be united to Christ apart from His new covenant church!
@theefaith you are Catholic correct? And you have read the Bible, I mean the real Bible not the Catholic book they have in back of the pews.

what’s a real bible? KJV where according to the tradition of men they deleted may books and chapters?

ever read Daniel 13 about Susana and her faith?