Witnessing to a Jehovah Witness

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BARNEY BRIGHT

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So, "Christendom" denies that God came in the Flesh??? Well my friend, that's new one on me as I have NEVER heard anything close to this. All I had said is that I believe JW's believe that Jesus Christ was Michael the Archangel...and I heard that a few times over the years.
You don't believe in the trinity, or that Jesus WAS God so...of course your religion has to come up with something else like...an angel.

Did you actually read what I posted? I didn't say that Christendom denies that God came in the flesh. I know Christendom believes that God came in the flesh. I said Christendom denies that it was the Only Begotten Son of God that came in the flesh. That's why I got out of Christendom because they believe that God came in the flesh, therefore they're denying it was the Only Begotten Son of God that came in the flesh. In other words Christendom never believed that The Only True God has, nor ever has had, an Only Begotten Son, that he sent to mankind to save mankind. You either believe that God has an Only Begotten Son that he sent to mankind to save mankind, or you don't.
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

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MICHAEL
The only holy angel other than Gabriel named in the Bible, and the only one called “archangel.” (Jude 9) The first occurrence of the name is in the tenth chapter of Daniel, where Michael is described as “one of the foremost princes”; he came to the aid of a lesser angel who was opposed by “the prince of the royal realm of Persia.” Michael was called “the prince of [Daniel’s] people,” “the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people.” (Da 10:13, 20, 21; 12:1) This points to Michael as the angel who led the Israelites through the wilderness. (Ex 23:20, 21, 23;32:34; 33:2) Lending support to this conclusion is the fact that “Michael the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was disputing about Moses’ body.”—Jude 9.

Scriptural evidence indicates that the name Michael applied to God’s Son before he left heaven to become Jesus Christ and also after his return. Michael is the only one said to be “the archangel,” meaning “chief angel,” or “principal angel.” The term occurs in the Bible only in the singular. This seems to imply that there is but one whom God has designated chief, or head, of the angelic host. At 1 Thessalonians 4:16 the voice of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ is described as being that of an archangel, suggesting that he is, in fact, himself the archangel. This text depicts him as descending from heaven with “a commanding call.” It is only logical, therefore, that the voice expressing this commanding call be described by a word that would not diminish or detract from the great authority that Christ Jesus now has as King of kings and Lord of lords. (Mt 28:18; Re 17:14) If the designation “archangel” applied, not to Jesus Christ, but to other angels, then the reference to “an archangel’s voice” would not be appropriate. In that case it would be describing a voice of lesser authority than that of the Son of God.

There are also other correspondencies establishing that Michael is actually the Son of God. Daniel, after making the first reference to Michael (Da 10:13), recorded a prophecy reaching down to “the time of the end” (Da 11:40) and then stated: “And during that time Michael will stand up, the great prince who is standing in behalf of the sons of [Daniel’s] people.” (Da 12:1) Michael’s ‘standing up’ was to be associated with “a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a nation until that time.” (Da 12:1) In Daniel’s prophecy, ‘standing up’ frequently refers to the action of a king, either taking up his royal power or acting effectively in his capacity as king. (Da 11:2-4, 7, 16b, 20, 21) This supports the conclusion that Michael is Jesus Christ, since Jesus is Jehovah’s appointed King, commissioned to destroy all the nations at Har–Magedon.—Re 11:15; 16:14-16.

The book of Revelation (12:7, 10, 12) specifically mentions Michael in connection with the establishment of God’s Kingdom and links this event with trouble for the earth: “And war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled. And I heard a loud voice in heaven say: ‘Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the accuser of our brothers has been hurled down . . . On this account be glad, you heavens and you who reside in them! Woe for the earth and for the sea.’” Jesus Christ is later depicted as leading the heavenly armies in war against the nations of the earth. (Re 19:11-16) This would mean a period of distress for them, which would logically be included in the “time of distress” that is associated with Michael’s standing up. (Da 12:1) Since the Son of God is to fight the nations, it is only reasonable that he was the one who with his angels earlier battled against the superhuman dragon, Satan the Devil, and his angels.

In his prehuman existence Jesus was called “the Word.” (Joh 1:1) He also had the personal name Michael. By retaining the name Jesus after his resurrection (Ac 9:5), “the Word” shows that he is identical with the Son of God on earth. His resuming his heavenly name Michael and his title (or name) “The Word of God” (Re 19:13) ties him in with his prehuman existence. The very name Michael, asking as it does, “Who Is Like God?” points to the fact that Jehovah God is without like, or equal, and that Michael his archangel is his great Champion or Vindicator.
 
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Joseph77

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Those teachings from jws are not by themselves the only ones in error.

There's been shown many more, especially by Bercot in "Will the Real Heretics " ... still available as far as I know.....
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

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BG
The JW don't believe Jesus is God.
So the formula would be missing:
Mathew 28:19

How could it be valid??

Yes, unlike you and others in Christendom we believe as the scriptures say Jesus is, that he is, the Only Begotten Son of God. Something that you and Christendom denies.
 

Joseph77

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Misrepresenting Jesus, and Scripture, like this, has been going on for many generations, hasn't it ?

Yes, ....we believe as the scriptures say Jesus is, that he is, the Only Begotten Son of God. .

jws are outside of Jesus, regardless of what others do. If others sin, they pay for their sin, as written. Since jws remain outside Jesus,
EXCEPT for those who repent, like BERCOT , who then got kicked out of the jws for getting truly saved,
therefore jws ought to start seeking truth,

outside of jws false teachings, which teachings and practices (of jws) cannot ever save a soul.
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

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Misrepresenting Jesus, and Scripture, like this, has been going on for many generations, hasn't it ?



jws are outside of Jesus, regardless of what others do. If others sin, they pay for their sin, as written. Since jws remain outside Jesus,
EXCEPT for those who repent, like BERCOT , who then got kicked out of the jws for getting truly saved,
therefore jws ought to start seeking truth,

outside of jws false teachings, which teachings and practices (of jws) cannot ever save a soul.

The scriptures are very clear that those who exercise faith that God gave his Only Begotten Son because of his love for mankind are the ones who will be saved. JW have always believed this.
 

Joseph77

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Sorry, no.
Those who did get saved were kicked out of the jws, and the explanation from those who did get saved is that so much is wrong in the jws, that jws cannot save anyone.
The scriptures are very clear that those who exercise faith that God gave his Only Begotten Son because of his love for mankind are the ones who will be saved. JW have always believed this.
 
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tigger 2

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"By this the love of God was manifested in us, that God has sent His only begotten Son into the world so that we might live through Him." - 1 John 4:9, NASB.
 
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theefaith

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If he was baptized correctly it is valid baptism and cannot be baptized again eph 4:5
 

BARNEY BRIGHT

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If a Jehovah Witness claims to have been baptised in water, and then subsequently comes to the Biblical knowledge of Jesus and gets saved - should that person be baptised in water a second time?

Those who believe that the Biblical knowledge of Jesus to be God, that he, meaning Jesus is God in the flesh because they believe that John 1:14 means that the Word is God therefore they believe it was God who became flesh/human isn't biblical knowledge just because they believe that's what the scriptures are saying. Those who believe that Jesus is God in the flesh because they believe the Word is God are denying that the Word is the Only Begotten Son of God and so are denying that it was the Only Begotten Son who is the Word who became flesh/human. John 3:16 says it was God who sent his Only Begotten Son to the world of mankind. 1 John 4:9-11 says that God sent his Only Begotten Son to the World of mankind and here at 1John 4:9-11 the phrase, "Only Begotten Son" isn't used in reference to when the Only Begotten Son became human but the Word was the Only Begotten Son of God before he became human, this is confirmed by Jesus own statements at John 8:38, 42 and John 17:5, 24 as well as other statements in the scriptures such as Romans 8:3 and Galatians 4:4, so it's the Only Begotten Son of God who is the Word who became flesh/human, that's what biblical knowledge is.
 
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