Yeshua Says

[Retrobyter]

Lo' shalom, daq.

It is not me that you refuse to believe but rather the Scripture, Word, and Doctrine of Messiah Yeshua! :lol:

Posted 04 September 2013 - 8:18 AM to 11:06 PM in one of the threads linked below:

Matthew 12:42
42. The queen of the south [Sheba] shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the ends of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

Revelation 13:1-6
1. And he stood upon the sand of the sea. And I saw a beast rising up out of the sea, having ten horns, and seven heads, and on his horns ten diadems, and upon his heads names of blasphemy.
2. And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his throne, and great authority.
3. And I saw one of his heads as though it had been smitten unto death; and his death-stroke was healed: and the whole earth wondered after the beast;
4. And they worshipped the dragon, because he gave his authority unto the beast; and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? And who is able to war with him?
5. And there was given to him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and there was given to him authority to continue forty and two months.
6. And he opened his mouth into blasphemies against God, blaspheming his name, and his tabernacle-tent, that is, them tabernacle-tented in the heaven.

2 Kings 2:23-24 KJV
23. And he went up from thence unto Bethel: and as he was going up by the way, there came forth little children out of the city, and mocked him, and said unto him, Go up, thou bald head; go up, thou bald head.
24. And he turned back, and looked on them, and cursed them in the name of the Lord. And there came forth two she bears out of the wood, and tare forty and two children of them.

Hosea 13:6-8 KJV
6. According to their pasture, so were they filled; they were filled, and their heart was exalted; therefore have they forgotten me.
7. Therefore I will be unto them as a lion: as a leopard by the way will I observe them:
8. I will meet them as a bear that is bereaved of her whelps, and will rend the caul of their heart, and there will I devour them like a lion: the wild beast shall tear them.

Jeremiah 13:23 LXX-Septuagint (Sir Lancelot C. L. Brenton 1851)
23. If the Ethiopian shall change his skin, or the leopardess her spots, then shall ye be able to do good, having learnt evil.
http://ecmarsh.com/lxx/Jeremias/index.htm

Daniel 4:11-14 LXX-Septuagint (Sir Lancelot C. L. Brenton 1851)
11. Cut down the tree, and pluck off its branches, and shake off its leaves, and scatter its fruit: let the wild beasts be removed from under it, and the birds from its branches.
12. Only leave the stump of its roots in the earth, and bind it with an iron and brass band; and it shall lie in the grass that is without and in the dew of heaven, and its portion shall be with the wild beasts in the grass of the field.
13. His heart shall be changed from that of man, and the heart of a wild beast shall be given to him; and seven times shall pass over him.
14. The matter is by the decree of the watcher, and the demand is a word of the holy ones; that the living may known that the Lord is most high over the kingdom of men, and he will give it to whomsoever he shall please, and will set up over it that which is set at nought of men.
http://ecmarsh.com/lxx/Daniel/index.htm

Daniel 7:1-8 LXX-Septuagint (Sir Lancelot C. L. Brenton 1851)
1. In the first year of Baltasar, king of the Chaldeans Daniel had a dream, and visions of his head upon his bed: and he wrote his dream.
2. I Daniel beheld, and, lo, the four winds of heaven blew violently upon the great sea.
3. And there came up four great beasts out of the sea, differing from one another.
4. The first was as a lioness, and her wings as an eagle’s; I beheld until her wings were plucked, and she was lifted off from the earth, and she stood on human feet, and a man's heart was given to her.
5. And, behold, a second beast like a bear, and it supported itself on one side, and there were three ribs in its mouth, between its teeth: and thus they said to it, Arise, devour much flesh.
6. After this one I looked, and behold another wild beast as a leopard, and it had four wings of a bird upon it: and the wild beast had four heads, and power was given to it.
7. After this one I looked, and behold a fourth beast, dreadful and terrible, and exceedingly strong, and its teeth were of iron; devouring and crushing to atoms, and it trampled the remainder with its feet: and it was altogether different from the beasts that were before it; and it had ten hours.
8. I noticed his horns, and behold, another little horn came up in the midst of them, and before it three of the former horns were rooted out: and, behold, there were eyes as the eyes of a man in this horn, and a mouth speaking great things.
http://ecmarsh.com/lxx/Daniel/index.htm

Luke 17:26-37 KJV
26. And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
27. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
28. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
29. But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
31. In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
32. Remember Lot's wife.
33. Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.
34. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
35. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
36. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
37. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.


Posted 04 September 2013 - 11:06 PM



Double minded man why do you inquire of me now and what do I owe you? :lol:




Oy Vey! And you call yourself a Jew? (Revelation 2:9 and Revelation 3:9). Too bad you cannot understand these words seeing how they are directed only toward your own fierce anthropon-countenance of `Az at this time, (each in his or her own appointed times and none shall be alone in his appointed times). When you see the south wind blow, which is a thing that cannot be seen with the eyes of the flesh, you say there will be heat and it comes to pass. Hypocrite, for seeing the face of the earth and the sky you interpret it; but how is it that seeing this appointed time you cannot discern? Why moreover what is from yourself can you not rightly judge?

Revelation 2:20-23 KJV
20. Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.
21. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not.
22. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds.
23. And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

Likewise there is a witness not from myself that these things I write not from myself:

Mene, Mene, Tekel, uwParacin: a lioness of gold and a twain silver she-bear.

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Lift up your head for your redemption draws nigh!​

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Once upon the consummation of an age there was a firstborn son of Belial who was ymiyniy-righthanded, just like his spiritual father, and his name was Sheba-Seven. One day Sheba saw an opportunity to steal the kingdom away for himself toward his own glory; and seizing the moment he went out blowing his own trumpet so as to turn all Yisrael away from the Great King, the True Father of above. And so it came to pass that every man of Yisrael began to harken to the bellowings, blowings, neighings, and empty words of hot air which came forth from the heart of Sheba; and the Great King sent forth an executioner to put an end to the subversive and destructive naysayings of the imposter Sheba. And soon enough the executioner caught up with Sheba-Seven, who then fled to the city of Abel; where he took refuge from the executioner within the city walls. So the executioner gathered his forces, and they came and besieged him in Abel of Beth-Maachah, and they cast up a bank against the city, which stood against the wall: and all the people that were with the messenger of the King battered the wall, to throw it down. Then cried a wise woman out of the city: Hear, hear! I pray you Sir, unto the messenger of the King, Please come near that I may speak with thee. And he obliged, and come near unto her, and the woman said; Art thou Yoab? And he answered, I am. Then she said unto him, Hear the words of thine handmaid! And he answered, I will hear. Then she spake, saying, They were wont to speak in old time, saying, They shall surely ask counsel at Abel: and thus shall they end the matter! I am one of them that are peaceable and faithful in Yisrael: you seek to destroy a city and a mother in Yisrael: why wilt thou swallow up the inheritance of the Most High? And Yoab answered and said; Far be it, far be it from me, that I should swallow up or destroy! Is it not so that the matter is that a man of mount Ephraim, Sheba the son of Bichri by name, hath lifted up his hand against the King? (also against king David)? Deliver him only, and I will depart from the city. And the wise woman said unto Yoab: Behold, his head shall be thrown to thee over the wall. Then the woman of the Covenant, Yerushalaim of Above, the mother of all the faithful in Yisrael, went unto all the people in her wisdom. And they KARATH-CUT-OFF the Sheba-Seven head and cast it out to Yoab. And he blew a trumpet, and they retired from the city, every man to his tent. :)

Here's the REAL story you've quoted. Shall we count how many changes you've made to the Holy Word of God? No, maybe not; there's too many to count!


2 Samuel 20:1-22
1 And there happened to be there a man of Belial, whose name was Sheba, the son of Bichri, a Benjamite: and he blew a trumpet, and said, We have no part in David, neither have we inheritance in the son of Jesse: every man to his tents, O Israel.
2 So every man of Israel went up from after David, and followed Sheba the son of Bichri: but the men of Judah clave unto their king, from Jordan even to Jerusalem.
3 And David came to his house at Jerusalem; and the king took the ten women his concubines, whom he had left to keep the house, and put them in ward, and fed them, but went not in unto them. So they were shut up unto the day of their death, living in widowhood.
4 Then said the king to Amasa, Assemble me the men of Judah within three days, and be thou here present.
5 So Amasa went to assemble the men of Judah: but he tarried longer than the set time which he had appointed him.
6 And David said to Abishai, Now shall Sheba the son of Bichri do us more harm than did Absalom: take thou thy lord's servants, and pursue after him, lest he get him fenced cities, and escape us.
7 And there went out after him Joab's men, and the Cherethites, and the Pelethites, and all the mighty men: and they went out of Jerusalem, to pursue after Sheba the son of Bichri.
8 When they were at the great stone which is in Gibeon, Amasa went before them. And Joab's garment that he had put on was girded unto him, and upon it a girdle with a sword fastened upon his loins in the sheath thereof; and as he went forth it fell out.
9 And Joab said to Amasa, Art thou in health, my brother? And Joab took Amasa by the beard with the right hand to kiss him.
10 But Amasa took no heed to the sword that was in Joab's hand: so he smote him therewith in the fifth rib, and shed out his bowels to the ground, and struck him not again; and he died. So Joab and Abishai his brother pursued after Sheba the son of Bichri.
11 And one of Joab's men stood by him, and said, He that favoureth Joab, and he that is for David, let him go after Joab.
12 And Amasa wallowed in blood in the midst of the highway. And when the man saw that all the people stood still, he removed Amasa out of the highway into the field, and cast a cloth upon him, when he saw that every one that came by him stood still.
13 When he was removed out of the highway, all the people went on after Joab, to pursue after Sheba the son of Bichri.
14 And he went through all the tribes of Israel unto Abel, and to Beth-maachah, and all the Berites: and they were gathered together, and went also after him.
15 And they came and besieged him in Abel of Beth-maachah, and they cast up a bank against the city, and it stood in the trench: and all the people that were with Joab battered the wall, to throw it down.
16 Then cried a wise woman out of the city, Hear, hear; say, I pray you, unto Joab, Come near hither, that I may speak with thee.
17 And when he was come near unto her, the woman said, Art thou Joab? And he answered, I am he. Then she said unto him, Hear the words of thine handmaid. And he answered, I do hear.
18 Then she spake, saying, They were wont to speak in old time, saying, They shall surely ask counsel at Abel: and so they ended the matter.
19 I am one of them that are peaceable and faithful in Israel: thou seekest to destroy a city and a mother in Israel: why wilt thou swallow up the inheritance of the Lord?
20 And Joab answered and said, Far be it, far be it from me, that I should swallow up or destroy.
21 The matter is not so: but a man of mount Ephraim, Sheba the son of Bichri by name, hath lifted up his hand against the king, even against David: deliver him only, and I will depart from the city. And the woman said unto Joab, Behold, his head shall be thrown to thee over the wall.
22 Then the woman went unto all the people in her wisdom. And they cut off the head of Sheba the son of Bichri, and cast it out to Joab. And he blew a trumpet, and they retired from the city, every man to his tent. And Joab returned to Jerusalem unto the king.
KJV

Only YOU would see all the FLUFF you've added to an otherwise historical scene in the life of David the king.

 

[daq]

Lo' shalom, daq.


Here's the REAL story you've quoted. Shall we count how many changes you've made to the Holy Word of God? No, maybe not; there's too many to count!


2 Samuel 20:1-22
1 And there happened to be there a man of Belial, whose name was Sheba, the son of Bichri, a Benjamite: and he blew a trumpet, and said, We have no part in David, neither have we inheritance in the son of Jesse: every man to his tents, O Israel.
2 So every man of Israel went up from after David, and followed Sheba the son of Bichri: but the men of Judah clave unto their king, from Jordan even to Jerusalem.
3 And David came to his house at Jerusalem; and the king took the ten women his concubines, whom he had left to keep the house, and put them in ward, and fed them, but went not in unto them. So they were shut up unto the day of their death, living in widowhood.
4 Then said the king to Amasa, Assemble me the men of Judah within three days, and be thou here present.
5 So Amasa went to assemble the men of Judah: but he tarried longer than the set time which he had appointed him.
6 And David said to Abishai, Now shall Sheba the son of Bichri do us more harm than did Absalom: take thou thy lord's servants, and pursue after him, lest he get him fenced cities, and escape us.
7 And there went out after him Joab's men, and the Cherethites, and the Pelethites, and all the mighty men: and they went out of Jerusalem, to pursue after Sheba the son of Bichri.
8 When they were at the great stone which is in Gibeon, Amasa went before them. And Joab's garment that he had put on was girded unto him, and upon it a girdle with a sword fastened upon his loins in the sheath thereof; and as he went forth it fell out.
9 And Joab said to Amasa, Art thou in health, my brother? And Joab took Amasa by the beard with the right hand to kiss him.
10 But Amasa took no heed to the sword that was in Joab's hand: so he smote him therewith in the fifth rib, and shed out his bowels to the ground, and struck him not again; and he died. So Joab and Abishai his brother pursued after Sheba the son of Bichri.
11 And one of Joab's men stood by him, and said, He that favoureth Joab, and he that is for David, let him go after Joab.
12 And Amasa wallowed in blood in the midst of the highway. And when the man saw that all the people stood still, he removed Amasa out of the highway into the field, and cast a cloth upon him, when he saw that every one that came by him stood still.
13 When he was removed out of the highway, all the people went on after Joab, to pursue after Sheba the son of Bichri.
14 And he went through all the tribes of Israel unto Abel, and to Beth-maachah, and all the Berites: and they were gathered together, and went also after him.
15 And they came and besieged him in Abel of Beth-maachah, and they cast up a bank against the city, and it stood in the trench: and all the people that were with Joab battered the wall, to throw it down.
16 Then cried a wise woman out of the city, Hear, hear; say, I pray you, unto Joab, Come near hither, that I may speak with thee.
17 And when he was come near unto her, the woman said, Art thou Joab? And he answered, I am he. Then she said unto him, Hear the words of thine handmaid. And he answered, I do hear.
18 Then she spake, saying, They were wont to speak in old time, saying, They shall surely ask counsel at Abel: and so they ended the matter.
19 I am one of them that are peaceable and faithful in Israel: thou seekest to destroy a city and a mother in Israel: why wilt thou swallow up the inheritance of the Lord?
20 And Joab answered and said, Far be it, far be it from me, that I should swallow up or destroy.
21 The matter is not so: but a man of mount Ephraim, Sheba the son of Bichri by name, hath lifted up his hand against the king, even against David: deliver him only, and I will depart from the city. And the woman said unto Joab, Behold, his head shall be thrown to thee over the wall.
22 Then the woman went unto all the people in her wisdom. And they cut off the head of Sheba the son of Bichri, and cast it out to Joab. And he blew a trumpet, and they retired from the city, every man to his tent. And Joab returned to Jerusalem unto the king.
KJV

Only YOU would see all the FLUFF you've added to an otherwise historical scene in the life of David the king.

I have not denied that this story concerns the history of David and for you to suggest I did is a lie.
However, you pretend it has no other value and thus you are in error concerning most of Tanak for the same reason.

2 Samuel 20:1 TUA
1. Wsham niqra' 'iysh bliya`al. Uwshmow Sheba`, ben-Bikriy, 'iysh {*} Ymiyniy. Wayitqa` bashopar. Wayo'mer, 'Eyn-lanuw cheleq b-Dawid! Wlo' nachlah- lanuw bben- Yishay!'Iysh l'ohalayw Yisra'el!

Original Strong's Ref. #7652
Romanized Sheba`
Pronounced sheh'-bah
the same as HSN7651; seven; Sheba, the name of a place in Palestine, and of two Israelites:
KJV--Sheba. #shabua`. See HSN7620

Original Strong's Ref. #1075
Romanized Bikriy
Pronounced bik-ree'
from HSN1069; youth-ful; Bikri, an Israelite:
KJV--Bichri.

Original Strong's Ref. # 1069
Romanized bakar
Pronounced baw-kar'
a primitive root; properly, to burst the womb, i.e. (causatively) bear or make early fruit (of woman or tree); also (as denominative from HSN1061) to give the birthright:
KJV--make firstborn, be firstling, bring forth first child (new fruit).

Original Strong's Ref. #1145
Romanized Ben-ymiyniy
Pronounced ben-yem-ee-nee'
sometimes (with the article inserted) Ben-ha-yminiy {ben-hah-yem-ee-nee'}; with HSN0376 inserted (1Sam.9v1) Ben-miysh Ymiyniy {ben-eesh' yem-ee-nee'}; son of a man of Jemini; or shortened (1Sam.9v4; Esth.2v5) 'Iysh Ymiyniy {eesh yem-ee-nee'}; a man of Jemini, or (2Sam.20v1) simply Yminiy {yem-ee-nee'}; a Jeminite; (plural Bniy Ymiyniy {ben-ay' yem-ee-nee'}; patron from HSN1144; a Benjaminite, or descendent of Benjamin:
KJV--Benjamite, of Benjamin.

2 Samuel 20:1 does not say "Ben-ymiyniy" but rather simply "Ymiyniy" which is to be "of the right hand side".

BDB - Strong's Hebrew Definition for #01145
01145 // ynymy-Nb // Ben-y@miyniy // ben-yem-ee-nee' // sometimes (with article inserted)
// ynymyh-Nb // Ben-ha-y@miniy // ben-hah-yem-ee-nee' // with 0376 inserted ( 1Sa 9:1 )
// ynymy vya-Nb // Ben-'Iysh Y@miyniy // ben-eesh' yem-ee-nee' // ; son of a man of Jemini; or short ( 1Sa 9:4; Es 2:5 )
// ynymy vya // 'Iysh Y@miyniy // eesh yem-ee-nee' // ; a man of Jemini, or ( 1Sa 20:1 ) simply
// ynymy // Y@miyniy // yem-ee-nee' // ; a Jeminite; (plur.
// ynymy ynb // B@niy Y@miyniy // ben-ay'yem-ee-nee' //
patron. from 01144 ; adj
AV - Benjamite 16, Benjamite + 01121 1, Benjamin 1; 18
Benjamite = "a son of the right hand"
1) one of the tribe of Benjamin
http://www.apostolic-churches.net/bible/strongs/ref/?stgh=hebrew&stnm=01145

2 Samuel 20:22 KJV
22. Then the woman went unto all the people in her wisdom. And they cut off [HSN#3772 karath] the head of Sheba the son of Bichri, and cast it out to Joab. And he blew a trumpet, And they retired from the city, every man to his tent. And Joab returned to Jerusalem unto the king.

And Yerushalaim of Above is the covenant mother of all the faithful according to the new understanding of the Word:

Galatians 4:22-26 KJV
22. For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman.
23. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman was by promise.
24. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar.
25. For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children.
26. But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all.

Therefore go back read page one of this thread because you are clearly a son of the right hand seeing that you refuse to cut off that which is an offense and allow the Master to reign in your heart, mind, thoughts, and soul; especially when it comes to your doctrine and understanding of Scripture. Yeshua makes it clear that the son of the right hand side is the offender:

Matthew 5:29-30 KJV
29. And if thy right eye offend thee, pluck it out, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.
30. And if thy right hand offend thee, cut it off, and cast it from thee: for it is profitable for thee that one of thy members should perish, and not that thy whole body should be cast into hell.

And likely for this very reason:

Zachariah 11:15-17 KJV
15. And the Lord said unto me, Take unto thee yet the instruments of a foolish shepherd.
16. For, lo, I will raise up a shepherd in the land, which shall not visit those that be cut off, neither shall seek the young one, nor heal that that is broken, nor feed that that standeth still: but he shall eat the flesh of the fat, and tear their claws in pieces.
17. Woe to the idol shepherd that leaveth the flock! the sword shall be upon his arm, and upon his right eye: his arm shall be clean dried up, and his right eye shall be utterly darkened.

The eye is the lamp which lights inside of the man: if therefore the light that is in you be darkness; how great is that darkness!

Sorry to inform you that there has been raised up an idol shepherd in your own land, (for the man is the land as you have already been forewarned) and that one is a spiritual Sodomite who forces himself and his will upon everyone else around him; even so much as to force the Word into his own paradigms and mindset. Your own right eye is utterly darkened and continues to blind the one good eye that you have left. The same double blind Bar-Timaeus son of Timaeus quickly becomes a false accuser of the brethren, such as you have once again revealed yourself to be; likewise there is murder in his heart, and it is revealed by the blasphemies that spew forth from his mouth as he attempts to silence anyone who disagrees with his flesh perspective, especially anyone that can prove by the Scripture that his claims are based in flesh and falsehood.

 

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, daq.

This account IS of David and, yes, it has NO OTHER VALUE than what we can learn NOT to do as either a Sheva` ("Sheba" the man) or a Yow`aav ("Joab," David's nephew). You are simply pretending that it DOES have some other value! You blow Galatians 4:24 WAY out of proportion and think that it applies to EVERYTHING in the Tanakh! IT DOES NOT! It was a SPECIFIC EXAMPLE, not some general principle! You've leaned so far in the opposite direction as to not just tip the scales but to knock the beam completely off its fulcrum!

Yes, "Ymiyniy" DOES mean "Of the right hand side," but you know (or at least, I think YOU of all people should know) that some individuals were named with a Hebrew phrase. Do you remember how "Benjamin" got his name?

Genesis 35:15-20

15 And Jacob called the name of the place where God spake with him, Bethel.
16 And they journeyed from Bethel; and there was but a little way to come to Ephrath: and Rachel travailed, and she had hard labour.
17 And it came to pass, when she was in hard labour, that the midwife said unto her, Fear not; thou shalt have this son also.
18 And it came to pass, as her soul was in departing, (for she died) that she called his name Ben-oni (Hebrew: "ben owniy" meaning "son of my sorrow"): but his father called him Benjamin (Hebrew: "ben yamiyn" meaning "son of my right hand side").
19 And Rachel died, and was buried in the way to Ephrath, which is Bethlehem.
20 And Jacob set a pillar upon her grave: that is the pillar of Rachel's grave unto this day.
KJV

So, Ya`aqov's son's name was a PHRASE replacing a phrase his dying mother had named him. As such, the PHRASE is "Ben Yamiyn." IF someone wanted to identify himself as a descendent of Ben-Yamiyn, he would add the normal, possessive ending, "-iy." (That's just a yod ending with the vowel pointing added for a chireq sound much later. This is the ending that the English translators often translated as "-ite," such as "Benjamite," or "Hittite" or "Levite," etc.) This gives the vowel change that corresponds to "Ymiyniy." That is why this `Amaasaa' ben Bikriy is so identified. It was a shortened form, but it was a common way to identify him from the tribe of Ben-Yamiyn or Binyamiyn. Thus, technically, the identifier, "Ymiyniy," should be translated as "of/belonging-to-(the-son)-of-my-right-hand." "Yhudiy," too, translated "Jew" or "Jehudite" or "Jewish," means "of/belonging-to-Yhudah" and if the name "Yhuwdaah" is also translated, "it means "of/belonging-to-celebration/praise/worship." However, one shouldn't take it any farther than that!

It becomes confusion if you then USE that translation as though it belonged IN the account in 2 Samuel 20!

Furthermore, the "firstborn" thing is of the DADDY'S name, not `Amaasaa' but Bikriy! And still more, since HIS name was the possessive, HIS name means "of/belonging-to-the-firstborn!" That makes the "firstborn" at the very latest his GRANDFATHER!

 

[daq]

Shalom, daq.

This account IS of David and, yes, it has NO OTHER VALUE than what we can learn NOT to do as either a Sheva` ("Sheba" the man) or a Yow`aav ("Joab," David's nephew). You are simply pretending that it DOES have some other value!

No, actually, I am not pretending anything and your false accusations are getting tiresome. It seems a shame that anyone in a Christian Forum such as this should feel the need to start reporting someone else for anything. You are simply flaming and harassing out of the hatred in your heart. And if you truly believe that Scripture has nothing but a surface meaning then why do you even need to be here when no one here needs you or anyone else to read for them? We can all read for ourselves. You are full of vitriolic hatred and I therefore have no desire to converse with you here. How can you not understand this? Perhaps not only your pride but your rage has also blinded you:

1 John 3:11-14 KJV
11. For this is the message that ye heard from the beginning, that we should love one another.
12. Not as Cain, who was of that wicked one, and slew his brother. And wherefore slew he him? Because his own works were evil, and his brother's righteous.
13. Marvel not, my brethren, if the world hate you.
14. We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
15. Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
How can you claim to be a follower of Messiah Yeshua and not believe the following statement?

John 6:62-63 KJV
62. What and if ye shall see the Son of man ascend up where he was before?
63. It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

Did Yeshua ascend back up to where he was before? We know and believe the answer is YES.
Therefore the flesh profits nothing: the words that Yeshua speaks are SPIRIT and they are LIFE.
The words you speak are of the flesh and death because that covering Cherub flesh has deceived you.

 

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, daq.

All I'll say is that you're putting words in my mouth and intents in my heart that aren't there. But, hey! You've got one WONDERFUL IMAGINATION!

 

[daq]

Shalom, daq.

All I'll say is that you're putting words in my mouth and intents in my heart that aren't there. But, hey! You've got one WONDERFUL IMAGINATION!

You have clearly shown your own intentions from the very beginning, within the first thread I posted in this forum upon arriving here, even til now when you say "Lo' shalom, daq" (which for those who do not know means "No peace to you, daq"). I have bad news for you Retrobyter: neither you nor any of your divisive-heretical counterparts can steal the peace of God from any disciple of Yeshua. Is it my fault you will not give heed to the Scripture and what it says within its own contexts? You have "demoted" Yeshua to the status of Cyrus king of Persia and likewise elevated Cyrus king of Persia to the status of Messiah Yeshua in your understanding of the Scriptures in question herein and elsewhere. When you call the Master "Yeshua HaMashiach", as you often do even after being told of these things, you place him on the same level as Cyrus whom the Father calls "My mashiyach" in Isaiah 45:1, and this was already shown to you but your pride would not allow you to confess that this is the truth:

Shalom, daq.


It's really quite simple. You are not allowing the Scriptures to speak for themselves; you ARREST them to say what YOU want them to say. That's how I know that YOU are the one who is "trying too hard."

The Scripture verses you just quoted from Hoshea's (Hosea's) book are a good example: The word translated "savior" or "saviour" (its Brittish spelling) is the Hebrew word "mowshiya`" and simply means a "rescuer" or a "deliverer." It does NOT mean that this must be Yeshua`!

Furthermore, the beasts that are listed are meant to represent YHWH Himself! Not some fictional "beasts within ourselves."

What do you do? Play "Bible roulette?" Spin the Bible and open it at random and wherever it opens those Scriptures have to be related to what you are talking about?! This passage has absolutely NO connection to what we were talking about in Luke 17:20-22! Indeed, NONE of the Scriptures which you quoted or to which you alluded had ANYTHING to do with them!

Just stick to the one Scripture passage, please, and hash it out from there!

Yeshua` was talking to the PHARISEES when He said, "the kingdom of God is 'within you!'" However, He was not talking to them individually; He was talking to them AS A GROUP!!! The word translated "you" (which, in the English of the KJV, is plural as opposed to the "thee" or "thou," which is singular) is the Greek word "humoon," a PLURAL WORD! And, as I've already said, the Greek word "entos" can mean "AMONG" as much as it can mean "within," depending on the context! You noted that "entos" comes from the shorter preposition "en" meaning "in," and that's true, but that can also mean "in the GROUP!" And, in THIS particular context, it should have been translated "AMONG!" He was not saying "the kingdom of God is within (each of) you"; He was saying "the kingdom of God is AMONG y'all," speaking directly to those "sons of Belial," the PHARISEES! He was not "waxing mysterious" or "spiritual"; He was saying to them, "HEY, guys! The KINGDOM OF GOD is RIGHT HERE, because I , the KING, am RIGHT HERE!" That's why it didn't have to come with observation or visible proof! IT WAS ALREADY THERE!!! HE WAS ALREADY THERE!!! BUT, He was not going to stick around for long! They were rejecting Him; so, He was going to reject them ... and LEAVE them! And, He warned His students that He was going to LEAVE THEM, TOO, in the process!

Do you get it, yet? Can you understand this? I don't know how much clearer I can get! Get your head out of the clouds and get your feet back on the ground! The Scriptures should NOT be misused as you misuse them! Indeed, your misuse of the Scriptures is SO bad, that it borders on abnormal! Thus, you "misuse" borders on "ABUSE!"

I receive your statement as simply another accusation based in 2 Peter 3:16 of "wresting" the Scriptures. However, that is one of the very reasons I quote full passages of Scripture, (which apparently offends some here). If I take Scripture verses out of context then please show where? The matter of fact is that those not willing to post anything more than single line verses to support their theories are the ones wresting Scripture from its intended contexts so as to invent fanciful and imaginative new things for their "end of the world" scenarios. You and I appear to be from the two different aionos-ages; in my age ALL of the Scripture is in my thesaurus-treasury and comes forth both old and new. It appears you simply do not have enough Torah "in you" to understand what is being said. This is also the commandment concerning our partaking of the Pesach Lamb if indeed one will partake, (and before one may partake he must be "circumcised") and that is that you shall eat all of him, with both the good and the bitterness of the bitter herbs, and leave none of it till the "morning" come. Likewise the Pesach Lamb of YHWH is the WORD. Also "Mowshiya`" is transliterated "Messias" in the English reflection of the Greek but a "Meshiach" is simply an "anointed one" such as even Koresh was named, (the word Meshiach is of a "lesser status" than the word Mowshiya`). If only you and your counterparts would believe and understand such things you might likewise begin to understand the prophets and their writings, (i.e. Daniel 9:24-27 and the differences between "an anointed-meshiyach" and the Nagiyd-Commander of the Covenant). You want to speak of rightly dividing the Word but it appears that none of you do this when it comes to the most hotly debated passage in all of the prophetic writings; yet the Master himself explains why he is not the meshiyach of Daniel 9:24-27, and Paulos confirms this word. Even Strong's has it wrong in this respect because he, and most others now, have assumed that "Messias" comes from "meshiach" when it more likely comes from Mowshiya, (Mowshiya` is a form of Yesha`-Salvation which is Yeshua the right hand of the Father who is the only Salvation). Therefore when you say that Yeshua is Meshiach or when you write "Yeshua HaMeshiach" (HaMashiyach) you are unknowingly and unwittingly demoting the Master to a lesser status thinking yourself to be wise, (and the unbelieving Jews know this and laugh at you behind your back just so you know). :)

Was Koresh-Cyrus raised from the dead? Isaiah 45 concerns two different anointed ones: Koresh is merely an anointed-one-mashiyach. However the Tsemach-Tsedek, Branch of Righteouseness raised up in Tsdaqah-righteousness, is the Messias-Mowshiya`-Savior:

Isaiah 45:1-4
1. Thus saith YHWH to his mashiyach, to Kowresh, whose right hand I have holden, to subdue nations before him; and I will loose the loins of kings, to open before him the two leaved gates; and the gates shall not be shut;
2. I will go before thee, and make the crooked places straight: I will break in pieces the gates of brass, and cut in sunder the bars of iron:
3. And I will give thee the treasures of darkness, and hidden riches of secret places, that thou mayest know that I am YHWH, HaQowre' in the name of you, 'Elohey Yisra'el.
4. For the sake of Ya`aqob my servant, and Yisra'el mine elect, I have even called thee by thy name: I have surnamed thee, though thou hast not known me.

Isaiah 45:8-15
8. Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down tsedek-righteousness: let the earth open up, and let it bring forth the fruits of Yesha! and let tsdaqah-righteousness tsamach-sprout-shoots united; I YHWH did cut it down! [HSN#1254 bara']
9. Woe unto him that striveth with his Maker! Let the potsherd strive with the potsherds of the earth. Shall the clay say to him that fashioneth it, What makest thou? or thy work, He hath no hands?
10. Woe unto him that saith unto his father, What begettest thou? or to the woman, What hast thou brought forth?
11. Thus saith YHWH, the Holy One of Yisra'el and his Maker, Of things to come inquire ye concerning my sons? and concerning the work of my hands command ye me?
12. I have made the earth, and a man cut down [HSN#1254 bara'] upon it: I, even my hands, have stretched out the heavens, and all their host have I commanded.
13. I raised him up in tsdaqah-righteousness, and all his ways are straight: he shall build my city, and he shall let go my captives, not for price nor reward, saith YHWH Tsabaoth.
14. Thus saith YHWH, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, saying, Surely 'El is in thee; and there is none else, there is none [other] 'Elohiym!
15. Verily thou art the 'El that hidest thyself, O 'Elohay of Yisra'el, Mowshiya`.

Original Strong's Ref. #1254
Romanized bara'
Pronounced baw-raw'
a primitive root; (absolutely) to create; (qualified) to cut down (a wood), select, feed (as formative processes):
KJV--choose, create (creator), cut down, dispatch, do, make (fat).

Isaiah 45:1-15 Transliterated (Unaccented)
1. Koh- 'amar Yahweh limshiychow, l-Kowresh, 'sher-hechzaqtiy biymiynow lrad- lpanayw gowyim, Uwmatney mlakiym'pateach, liptoach lpanayw dlatayim uwsh`ariym lo'yicageruw:
2. 'Aniy lpaneyka 'elek. Wahrariym {*}'yasher {*}. Daltowt nchuwshah 'shaber ; uwbriychey barzel'gadea`.
3. Wnatatiy lka 'owtsrowt choshek, uwmaTmuneymictariym, lma`an teda` kiy- 'niy Yahweh, ha-Qowre' bshimka, 'Elohey Yisra'el.
4. Lma`an `abdiy, Ya`aqob, w-Yisra'el,bchiyriy, wa'eqra' lka bishmeka. 'Akanka, wlo' yda`taniy.
5. 'Aniy Yahweh. W'eyn `owd. Zuwlatiy 'eyn 'Elohiym! 'A'azerka, wlo' yda`taniy,
6. lma`an yed`uw mimizrach-shemesh uwmima`rabah kiy- 'epec bil`aday. 'Aniy Yahweh. W'eyn `owd!
7. Yowtser 'owr uwbowre' choshek, `oseh shalowmuwbowre' ra`. 'Aniy, Yahweh, `oseh kal- 'eleh.
8. Har`iypuw, shamayim mima`al ; uwshchaqiym yizluw-tsedeq! Tiptach- 'erets ; wyipruw- yesha`! Uwtsdaqahtatsmiyach yachad! 'Aniy, Yahweh, bra'tiyw!
9. Howy rab 'et- Yotsrow, cheres 'et- charsey 'adamah. Hyo'mar chomer lyotsrow, Mah- ta`seh? Uwpa`alka, 'eyn-yadayim low?
10. Howy 'omer l'ab, Mah- towliyd? Uwl'ishah,mah- tchiyliyn?
11. Koh- 'amar Yahweh -- Qdowsh Yisra'el, w-Yotsrow: Ha'otiyowt, sh'aluwniy `al- banay w`al- po`al yadayttsawuniy?
12. 'Anokiy `asiytiy 'erets w'adam `aleyha bara'tiy 'niy yaday naTuw shamayim. Wkal- tsba'amtsiweytiy.
13. 'Anokiy ha`iyrotihuw btsedeq. Wkal-drakayw 'yasher. Huw'- yibneh `iyriy wgaluwtiy yshaleach,lo' bimchiyr, wlo' bshochad, 'amar Yahweh tsba'owt.
14. Koh 'amar Yahweh: Ygiya` Mitsrayim uwcchar- Kuwsh, uw-Cba'iym 'anshey midah, `alayik ya`boruw wlak. Yihyuw'achrayik. Yelekuw baziqiym ; ya`boruw. W'elayik yishtachwuw'elayik. Yitpalaluw, 'Ak bak 'El! W'eyn `owd -- 'epec'lohiym!
15. 'Aken 'atah 'El mictater, 'Elohey Yisra'el, Mowshiya`.

Perhaps if you had heard the Word from Joshua you might understand that HSN#1254 bara', generally translated as "created" (and mistakenly translated as such here in Isaiah 45) also means "TO CUT DOWN" in the sense of "cutting down trees" (Joshua 17:15-18 KJV). :)

Desolation Abomination Post#49

You employ "Yeshua HaMashiach" as nothing more than a title which means: "Salvation the Anointed" or "the Salvation Anointed". Thus even your terminology does not properly and coherently acclimate into English as anything other than a title. And worse than this, as already stated, you have made it out to be as if there is no difference between mashiyach Koresh and mashiyach Yeshua himself. Even though both are "anointed ones" this is not the title which Yeshua claims for himself; for by his own statements concerning Yochanan the Immerser he calls him the mashiyach which was to be cut off for nought, (or to nothingness - having nothing) as it was written of Yochanan-Eliyahu in Daniel 9:26. Yeshua lost NOTHING of what is the most important thing in the world to the Father; and what is most important to the Father in the world are his people whom he loved so much that he gave his only begotten Son. Thus, the Scripture says, Yeshua lost nothing and Yochanan was karath, cut off, beheaded, and had nothing.

"Yeshua HaMashiach" = "the Salvation Anointed"
"Mowshiya` Yeshua = "Deliverer [of] Salvation" (the right arm of YHWH the only Savior).

Exodus 6:16-24 ASV
16. And these are the names of the sons of Levi according to their generations: Gershon, and Kohath, and Merari; and the years of the life of Levi were a hundred thirty and seven years.
17. The sons of Gershon: Libni and Shimei, according to their families.
18. And the sons of Kohath: Amram, and Izhar, and Hebron, and Uzziel; and the years of the life of Kohath were a hundred thirty and three years.
19. And the sons of Merari: Mahli and Mushi. These are the families of the Levites according to their generations.
20. And Amram took him Jochebed his father's sister to wife; and she bare him Aaron and Moses: and the years of the life of Amram were a hundred and thirty and seven years.
21. And the sons of Izhar: Korah, and Nepheg, and Zichri.
22. And the sons of Uzziel: Mishael, and Elzaphan, and Sithri.
23. And Aaron took him Elisheba, the daughter of Amminadab, the sister of Nahshon, to wife; and she bare him Nadab and Abihu, Eleazar and Ithamar.
24. And the sons of Korah: Assir, and Elkanah, and Abiasaph; [HSN#0023 'Abiy'acaph] these are the families of the Korahites.

Original Strong's Ref. #0023
Romanized 'Abiy'acaph
Pronounced ab-ee-aw-sawf'
from HSN0001 and HSN0622; father of gathering (i.e. gatherer); Abiasaph, an Israelite:
KJV--Abiasaph.

Original Strong's Ref. #0043
Romanized 'Ebyacaph
Pronounced eb-yaw-sawf'
contracted from HSN0023 ['Abiy'acaph] ; Ebjasaph, an Israelite:
KJV--Ebiasaph.

1 Chronicles 6:16-28 ASV
16. The sons of Levi: Gershom, Kohath, and Merari.
17. And these are the names of the sons of Gershom: Libni and Shimei.
18. And the sons of Kohath were Amram, and Izhar, and Hebron, and Uzziel.
19. The sons of Merari: Mahli and Mushi. And these are the families of the Levites according to their fathers' houses.
20. Of Gershom: Libni his son, Jahath his son, Zimmah his son,
21. Joah his son, Iddo his son, Zerah his son, Jeatherai his son.
22. The sons of Kohath: Amminadab his son, Korah his son, Assir his son,
23. Elkanah his son, and Ebiasaph [HSN#0043 'Ebyacaph] his son, and Assir his son,
24. Tahath his son, Uriel his son, Uzziah his son, and Shaul his son.
25. And the sons of Elkanah: Amasai, and Ahimoth.
26. As for Elkanah, the sons of Elkanah: Zophai his son, and Nahath his son,
27. Eliab his son, Jeroham his son, Elkanah his son.
28. And the sons of Samuel: the first-born Joel, and the second Abijah [HSN#0029 'Abiyah].

Original Strong's Ref. #0029
Romanized 'Abiyah
Pronounced ab-ee-yaw'
or prolonged 'Abiyahuw {ab-ee-yaw'-hoo}; from HSN0001 and HSN3050; father (i.e. worshipper) of Jah; Abijah, the name of several Israelite men and two Israelitesses:
KJV--Abiah, Abijah.

1 Samuel 1:1 ASV
1. Now there was a certain man of Ramathaim-zophim, of the hill-country of Ephraim, and his name was Elkanah, the son of Jeroham, the son of Elihu, the son of Tohu, the son of Zuph, and Ephraimite:
1 Samuel 8:1-2 ASV
1. And it came to pass, when Samuel was old, that he made his sons judges over Israel.
2. Now the name of his first-born was Joel; and the name of his second, Abijah: [HSN#0029 'Abiyah] they were judges in Beer-sheba.

1 Chronicles 9:19-20 KJV
19. And Shallum the son of Kore, [HSN#6981 Qowre'] the son of Ebiasaph, [HSN#0043 'Ebyacaph] the son of Korah, and his brethren, of the house of his father, the Korahites, were over the work of the service, keepers of the gates of the tabernacle: and their fathers, being over the host of the Lord, were keepers of the entry.
20. And Phinehas the son of Eleazar was the ruler over them in time past, and the Lord was with him.

1 Chronicles 26:1-3 KJV
1. Concerning the divisions of the porters: Of the Korhites was Meshelemiah the son of Kore, [HSN#6981 Qowre'] of the sons of Asaph.
2. And the sons of Meshelemiah were, Zechariah the firstborn, Jediael the second, Zebadiah the third, Jathniel the fourth,
3. Elam the fifth, Jehohanan [HSN#3076 Yochanan] the sixth, Elioenai the seventh.

Original Strong's Ref. #6981
Romanized Qowre'
Pronounced ko-ray'
or Qore' (1Chr.26v1) {ko-ray'}; active participle of HSN7121; crier; Kore, the name of two Israelites:
KJV--Kore.

Luke 1:5 ASV
5. There was in the days of Herod, king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abijah: [GSN#0007 Abia] and he had a wife of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth.
6. And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.
7. And they had no child, because that Elisabeth was barren, and they both were now well stricken in years.
8. Now it came to pass, while he executed the priest's office before God in the order of his course,
9. according to the custom of the priest's office, his lot was to enter into the temple of the Lord and burn incense.

Original Strong's Ref. #0007
Romanized Abia
Pronounced ab-ee-ah'
of Hebrew origin [HSN0029]; Abijah, the name of two Israelites:
KJV--Abia.

Levi, Kohath, Izhar, Korah, Abiasaph-Ebiasaph
Uriel, Samuel haNavi, Abijah, Kore-Qowre'
Meshelemiah, Zechariah, Yochanan . . .

Zacharias, Ioannes-haQowre'-mashiyach-Eliyahu the Immerser.

1 Samuel 2:26-35 KJV
26. And the child Samuel grew on, and was in favour both with the Lord, and also with men.
27. And there came a man of God unto Eli, and said unto him, Thus saith the Lord, Did I plainly appear unto the house of thy father, when they were in Egypt in Pharaoh's house?
28. And did I choose him out of all the tribes of Israel to be my priest, to offer upon mine altar, to burn incense, to wear an ephod before me? and did I give unto the house of thy father all the offerings made by fire of the children of Israel?
29. Wherefore kick ye at my sacrifice and at mine offering, which I have commanded in my habitation; and honourest thy sons above me, to make yourselves fat with the chiefest of all the offerings of Israel my people?
30. Wherefore the Lord God of Israel saith, I said indeed that thy house, and the house of thy father, should walk before me for ever: but now the Lord saith, Be it far from me; for them that honour me I will honour, and they that despise me shall be lightly esteemed.
31. Behold, the days come, that I will cut off thine arm, and the arm of thy father's house, that there shall not be an old man in thine house.
32. And thou shalt see an enemy in my habitation, in all the wealth which God shall give Israel: and there shall not be an old man in thine house for ever.
33. And the man of thine, whom I shall not cut off from mine altar, shall be to consume thine eyes, and to grieve thine heart: and all the increase of thine house shall die in the flower of their age.
34. And this shall be a sign unto thee, that shall come upon thy two sons, on Hophni and Phinehas; in one day they shall die both of them.
35. And I will raise me up a faithful priest, that shall do according to that which is in mine heart and in my mind: and I will build him a sure house; and he shall walk before mine mashiyach-anointed for ever.

Matthew 11:10-15 KJV
10. For this is he, of whom it is written, Behold, I send my messenger before thy face, which shall prepare thy way before thee.
11. Verily I say unto you, Among them that are born of women there hath not risen a greater than John the Baptist: notwithstanding he that is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
12. And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.
13. For all the prophets and the law prophesied until John.
14. And if ye will receive it, this is Elias, which was for to come.
15. He that hath ears to hear, let him hear.

 

[Retrobyter]

Ho hum. Okay, Shalom to you, my brother. Be at rest.

I will always appreciate you and love you anyway.

You need to understand, though, that there have ALWAYS been many messiahs, ever since Aharown was anointed to be the first Kohen haGadol, the first High Priest. The priests were anointed; the prophets were anointed; the kings were anointed. Yeshua` was simply the One prophesied who is the LAST One to be anointed of God (even if His own tribe didn't anoint Him as their King, as they should have done) as Isra'el's King and as a Priest forever after the order of Malkhiy-Tsedeq. Even foreigners were sometimes chosen (anointed) by God, such as Koresh (Cyrus), who was impressed by God to let His people go back to the Land! But read through the Scriptures: You will find that MANY were anointed: Aharown, all the high priests after him, Sha'uwl, Daveed, Smo, Eliyahu, Eliysha, all the sons of the prophets, all the rest of the kings of Y'hudah.... They were ALL "anointed ones!" God chose each and every one of them individually for their appointed tasks, and their "badge of service" was their anointing with the Holy Anointing Oil, which DID represent the Ruach HaQodesh Elohiym - the Holy Spirit of God.

 

[daq]

You need to understand, though, that there have ALWAYS been many messiahs, ever since Aharown was anointed to be the first Kohen haGadol, the first High Priest. The priests were anointed; the prophets were anointed; the kings were anointed. Yeshua` was simply the One prophesied who is the LAST One to be anointed of God (even if His own tribe didn't anoint Him as their King, as they should have done) as Isra'el's King and as a Priest forever after the order of Malkhiy-Tsedeq. Even foreigners were sometimes chosen (anointed) by God, such as Koresh (Cyrus), who was impressed by God to let His people go back to the Land! But read through the Scriptures: You will find that MANY were anointed: Aharown, all the high priests after him, Sha'uwl, Daveed, Smo, Eliyahu, Eliysha, all the sons of the prophets, all the rest of the kings of Y'hudah.... They were ALL "anointed ones!" God chose each and every one of them individually for their appointed tasks, and their "badge of service" was their anointing with the Holy Anointing Oil, which DID represent the Ruach HaQodesh Elohiym - the Holy Spirit of God.

Why do you speak to me as if I do not know what things I have already posted directly to you? This appears to be nothing more than an ego trip where you attempt to belittle people by speaking down to them as if they cannot possibly know what wonderful things you yourself think you know. In fact the following was already in the thread which I linked above where you quoted and responded to it:

Shalom Retrobyter, do you not realize that "Mowshiya`" is technically not even its own separate word? It is a form of HSN#3467 "yasha`" which has already been noted. And what I stated was that YHWH is the only Saviour and that Yeshua is his right hand of salvation, (go back and read it again). Just because I quoted Hosea 13 does not mean I brought up Mowshiya` from the Hebrew; you did that, and that is why I attempted to point the direction of your study to Isaiah 45 because it clearly reveals the differences in how they are employed in the Scripture itself. If some of you here would not bring up tangents then they would not be followed, (so "terry" why do you blame me for that?). If we are to allow the Scripture to interpret itself then other passages are going to be absolutely necessary, (for some of us that is a good thing). There are also multiple usages of nagiyd, (king David is called a nagiyd). Why limit your understanding by forcing mashiyach to mean Messiah when Mowshiya` is clearly superior in Isaiah 45 and that mashiyach is Cyrus with his typology of John? If one will not allow Scripture to interpret Scripture by it usages in its own contexts then the same will not understand.

Judges 3:9 KJV
9. And when the children of Israel cried unto the Lord, the Lord raised up a deliverer [HSN#3467 yasha`] to the children of Israel, who delivered them, even Othniel the son of Kenaz, Caleb's younger brother.

Original Strong's Ref. #3467
Romanized yasha`
Pronounced yaw-shah'
a primitive root; properly, to be open, wide or free, i.e. (by implication) to be safe; causatively, to free or succor:
KJV--X at all, avenging, defend, deliver(-er), help, preserve, rescue, be safe, bring (having) salvation, save(-iour), get victory.

Judges 3:9 TUA
9. Wayiz`quw bney- Yisra'el 'el- Yahweh. Wayaqem Yahweh mowshiya` libney Yisra'el wayowshiy`em -- 'et`Atniy'el ben- Qnaz, 'chiy Kaleb, haqaTon mimenuw.

Judges 3:15 KJV
15. But when the children of Israel cried unto the Lord, the Lord raised them up a deliverer, [HSN#3467 yasha`] Ehud the son of Gera, a Benjamite, a man lefthanded: and by him the children of Israel sent a present unto Eglon the king of Moab.

Judges 3:15 TUA
15. Wayiz`quw bney- Yisra'el 'el- Yahweh wayaqem Yahwehlahem mowshiya` -- 'et- 'Ehuwd ben- Gera', Ben-ha ymiyniy,'iysh 'iTer yad- ymiynow.

1 Samuel 10:19 KJV
19. And ye have this day rejected your God, who himself saved [HSN#3467 yasha`] you out of all your adversities and your tribulations; and ye have said unto him, Nay, but set a king over us. Now therefore present yourselves before the Lord by your tribes, and by your thousands.

1 Samuel 10:19 YUA
19. W'atem hayowm m'actem'et- 'Eloheykem 'sher- huw' mowshiya` lakem mikal-ra`owteykem wtsaroteykem. Wato'mruw low, Kiy- melek tasiym`aleynuw! W`atah hityatsbuw lipney Yahweh lshibTeykemuwl'alpeykem.

1 Samuel 10:19 LIT (Literal Bible with Vertical Strong's #s)
19.
|0859| But you
|3117| today
|3973| rejected
|0853| your
|0430| God
|0834| who
|1931| Himself {is}
|3467| deliverer
|0000| for you
|3605| from all
|7451| your calamities,
|6964| and your distresses
|0559| and you say
|0000| to him,
|3588| But
|4428| a king
|7760| set
|5921| over us!
|6258| And now
|3320| present yourselves
|6440| in the presence of
|3068| Yahweh
|7626| by your tribes
|0504| and by your families.

1 Samuel 14:39 KJV
39. For, as the Lord liveth, which saveth [HSN#3467 yasha`] Israel, though it be in Jonathan my son, he shall surely die. But there was not a man among all the people that answered him.

1 Samuel 14:39 TUA
39. Kiychay- Yahweh hamowshiya` 'et- Yisra'el, kiy 'im- yeshnowb-Yownatan, bniy, kiy mowt yamuwt! W'eyn `onehuw mikal-ha`am.

"YHWH HaMowshiya` 'et- Yisra'el" ~ "YHWH The Saviour to Yisra'el"

2 Kings 13:4-5 KJV
4. And Jehoahaz besought the Lord, and the Lord hearkened unto him: for he saw the oppression of Israel, because the king of Syria oppressed them.
5. (And the Lord gave Israel a saviour, [HSN#3467 yasha`] so that they went out from under the hand of the Syrians: and the children of Israel dwelt in their tents, as beforetime.

2 Kings 13:5 TUA
5. Wayiten Yahweh l-Yisra'el mowshiya`. Wayets'uw mitachat yad- 'Aram. Wayeshbuw bney-Yisra'el b'ahaleyhem kitmowl shilshowm.

In addition to this and the many other places wherein we have already discussed some of these things, (which you now say that I still "need to understand") there is likewise the case in point concerning the word "nagiyd" which is employed more than forty times in the Hebrew. Even king David calls himself the nagiyd-commander-ruler of the people of God, (2 Samuel 6:21) and was chosen by God himself to be the nagiyd-commander-ruler over the people of God after Sha'ul was rejected. Of course there were mowshiya`-deliverers as shown in the book of Judges already; of course Moshe and all of the priests, kings, and prophets were anointed as anointed ones; of course there were nagiyd-commanders, rulers, and sariym-princes: and for the same reasons displayed herein you are lost in all of this because one may not know who is who, or what is what, unless and until he believe the words, parables, doctrines, and teachings of Yeshua which you refuse to accept as applicable when it comes to your flesh-minded interpretive theories. You act as if you are a "strictly literal" reader and interpreter of the Word but in fact you have no backbone when it comes to being strict about truly being a disciple of the Word. It is yourself who is the imaginative one playing word definition games with Scripture so as to force it into your westernized dogmatic mindset. You shall receive your pound of flesh but it will be the death of you, (yet all things work together for good to them that love God; to them who are the called according to his purpose). :)

 

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, daq.

The difference is simple: Whether I brought up Mowshiya` or not is irrelevant since I don't have a problem with Yeshua` being a Mowshiya` (which is rather redundant, "Yeshua`" and "Mowshiya`" stemming from the same root). The problem is that you don't recognize that Yeshua` is also a Mashiyach! He IS God's Anointed!

See, I'm okay with Yeshua` being BOTH!

 

[daq]

Shalom, daq.

The difference is simple: Whether I brought up Mowshiya` or not is irrelevant since I don't have a problem with Yeshua` being a Mowshiya` (which is rather redundant, "Yeshua`" and "Mowshiya`" stemming from the same root). The problem is that you don't recognize that Yeshua` is also a Mashiyach! He IS God's Anointed!

See, I'm okay with Yeshua` being BOTH!

And worse than this, as already stated, you have made it out to be as if there is no difference between mashiyach Koresh and mashiyach Yeshua himself. Even though both are "anointed ones" this is not the title which Yeshua claims for himself; for by his own statements concerning Yochanan the Immerser he calls him the mashiyach which was to be cut off for nought, (or to nothingness - having nothing) as it was written of Yochanan-Eliyahu in Daniel 9:26. Yeshua lost NOTHING of what is the most important thing in the world to the Father; and what is most important to the Father in the world are his people whom he loved so much that he gave his only begotten Son. Thus, the Scripture says, Yeshua lost nothing and Yochanan was karath, cut off, beheaded, and had nothing.

Luke 11:24-26 KJV
24. When the unclean spirit is gone out of a man, he walketh through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he saith, I will return unto my house whence I came out.
25. And when he cometh, he findeth it swept and garnished.
26. Then goeth he, and taketh to him seven other spirits more wicked than himself; and they enter in, and dwell there: and the last state of that man is worse than the first.

Proverbs 6:16-19 KJV
16. These six things doth the Lord hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
17. A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
18. An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
19. A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

 

[Retrobyter]

Shalom, daq.


Romans 14:4
4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
KJV

Good grief, Charlie Brown! What are you, king of the grudge-holders?! For someone who claims ...



OT:1851 daq (dak); from OT:1854; crushed, i.e. (by implication) small or thin: -dwarf, lean [-fleshed], very little thing, small, thin.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

... for his handle, you don't exhibit a very "daq"-like humility.

Frankly, there IS NO difference between mashiyach Koresh and mashiyach Yeshua`, just as there is no difference between mashiyach Daveed haMelekh and mashiyach Yeshua`! A mashiyach is a mashiyach! ANYONE who is chosen by God and so anointed by one of His priests or prophets (or by God Himself) IS GOD'S ANOINTED! Get over it! Furthermore, there is nothing in the anointing to suggest that the anointed is necessarily righteous! Consider the following:


1 Kings 19:13-17
13 And it was so, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle, and went out, and stood in the entering in of the cave. And, behold, there came a voice unto him, and said, What doest thou here, Elijah?
14 And he said, I have been very jealous for the Lord God of hosts: because the children of Israel have forsaken thy covenant, thrown down thine altars, and slain thy prophets with the sword; and I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away.
15 And the Lord said unto him, Go, return on thy way to the wilderness of Damascus: and when thou comest, anoint Hazael to be king over Syria:
16 And Jehu the son of Nimshi shalt thou anoint to be king over Israel: and Elisha the son of Shaphat of Abel-meholah shalt thou anoint to be prophet in thy room.
17 And it shall come to pass, that him that escapeth the sword of Hazael shall Jehu slay: and him that escapeth from the sword of Jehu shall Elisha slay.
KJV

Simply read the history of this King Hazael, king of Syria, in 1 Kings 8-13, and you will see that this was not a godly man, although he was doing EXACTLY what YHWH wanted him to do!

Yeshua` was no one special because He was the Anointed One, the Mashiyach (the Messiah), the Christos (the Christ); it was because He was the Anointed One OF PROPHECY, the One chosen by YHWH to be the FINAL King of Isra'el as YHWH'S Representative as well as being the One chosen by YHWH to be Kohen haGadol, the High Priest, forever after the order of Malkhiy-Tsedeq! He was born the King of the Jews (Matt. 2:2), He will be the King of all Isra'el (Luke 1:30-33), and He will be the King of Kings (the World Emperor, see Ezra 7:12, Ezekiel 26:7, and Daniel 2:37 compared to 1 Timothy 6:13-16, Revelation 17:14, and Revelation 19:16)!

So, mashiyach Koresh (Cyrus) may not have been on the same par as the Mashiyach Yeshua`, but he was STILL an "anointed one" of YHWH, doing YHWH'S bidding, because it was through HIM that the captives were returned to the Land and the city and the Temple were rebuilt, as prophesied!

Oh, and Yeshua` DID admit that He was the Mashiyach, the Christos!


John 4:25-26
25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
26 Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
KJV

 

[daq]

Shalom, daq.


Romans 14:4
4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.
KJV

Good grief, Charlie Brown! What are you, king of the grudge-holders?! For someone who claims ...



OT:1851 daq (dak); from OT:1854; crushed, i.e. (by implication) small or thin: -dwarf, lean [-fleshed], very little thing, small, thin.

(Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary. Copyright © 1994, 2003, 2006 Biblesoft, Inc. and International Bible Translators, Inc.)

... for his handle, you don't exhibit a very "daq"-like humility.

Frankly, there IS NO difference between mashiyach Koresh and mashiyach Yeshua`, just as there is no difference between mashiyach Daveed haMelekh and mashiyach Yeshua`! A mashiyach is a mashiyach! ANYONE who is chosen by God and so anointed by one of His priests or prophets (or by God Himself) IS GOD'S ANOINTED! Get over it! Furthermore, there is nothing in the anointing to suggest that the anointed is necessarily righteous! Consider the following:


1 Kings 19:13-17
13 And it was so, when Elijah heard it, that he wrapped his face in his mantle, and went out, and stood in the entering in of the cave. And, behold, there came a voice unto him, and said, What doest thou here, Elijah?
14 And he said, I have been very jealous for the Lord God of hosts: because the children of Israel have forsaken thy covenant, thrown down thine altars, and slain thy prophets with the sword; and I, even I only, am left; and they seek my life, to take it away.
15 And the Lord said unto him, Go, return on thy way to the wilderness of Damascus: and when thou comest, anoint Hazael to be king over Syria:
16 And Jehu the son of Nimshi shalt thou anoint to be king over Israel: and Elisha the son of Shaphat of Abel-meholah shalt thou anoint to be prophet in thy room.
17 And it shall come to pass, that him that escapeth the sword of Hazael shall Jehu slay: and him that escapeth from the sword of Jehu shall Elisha slay.
KJV

Simply read the history of this King Hazael, king of Syria, in 1 Kings 8-13, and you will see that this was not a godly man, although he was doing EXACTLY what YHWH wanted him to do!

Yeshua` was no one special because He was the Anointed One, the Mashiyach (the Messiah), the Christos (the Christ); it was because He was the Anointed One OF PROPHECY, the One chosen by YHWH to be the FINAL King of Isra'el as YHWH'S Representative as well as being the One chosen by YHWH to be Kohen haGadol, the High Priest, forever after the order of Malkhiy-Tsedeq! He was born the King of the Jews (Matt. 2:2), He will be the King of all Isra'el (Luke 1:30-33), and He will be the King of Kings (the World Emperor, see Ezra 7:12, Ezekiel 26:7, and Daniel 2:37 compared to 1 Timothy 6:13-16, Revelation 17:14, and Revelation 19:16)!

So, mashiyach Koresh (Cyrus) may not have been on the same par as the Mashiyach Yeshua`, but he was STILL an "anointed one" of YHWH, doing YHWH'S bidding, because it was through HIM that the captives were returned to the Land and the city and the Temple were rebuilt, as prophesied!

Oh, and Yeshua` DID admit that He was the Mashiyach, the Christos!


John 4:25-26
25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things.
26 Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
KJV

As already stated you have "demoted" the Master to a lesser status which you now freely admit, (bold-red-italics-times-new-roman within your own quote herein above). And now suddenly you speak like a dragon, asking for sympathy, while in the same breath once again casting accusations and attacking my character? I have been broken, and smashed, and crushed, and my testimony is posted, and my name which you ridicule I received having been written in a white stone, and you will likely never understand the half of this until it is too late because your pride is even worse than my own was when such things came to pass upon myself. There is much more to a name than a word and a spelling: every time you ridicule myself and others here at this site you ridicule the character and faith of the saints; and when it just so happens that you run across the path of those having been tabernacled in the heaven then you not only blaspheme them but you likewise blaspheme the One who sanctifies them in heaven, whose throne is in heaven. You have already made yourself out to be the beast of a man that you are; no different from the one found written in Revelation 13:6 who opens his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them tabernacled in the heavens. And now, because of your own mouthy tongue, your own appointed times have commenced which will come down upon your own head in the due times, (and none shall be alone in his appointed times). In your End you too will receive either a white stone with a new name having been written therein; or the black stone of the blackness of darkness forever, for again the kingdom of heaven is like a net whether you believe this applies to yourself or not. As I said to you in the beginning; you and I are not of the same aionos-age, and likewise you too will be required to acquit yourself like a man, so my suggestion to you is to begin the process of repentance and full immersion into the Word immediately. This is not the Charlie Brown weekend warrior prophecy buff happy hour radio show that you seem to be most familiar with; these things are real, and they are coming at you in such a way that the natural flesh-minded man cannot see them coming because he is trained from the cradle to see only the physical natural signs of the flesh. In addition what happened to that new book you felt so compelled to boast about? I thought you said you did not have time for this place anymore because you had a manuscript to complete?

As for the rest of your comments Yeshua is the one who does the anointing because he alone is directly anointed from the Father at the immersion of Yochanan, (so that all righteousness be fulfilled) and for the same reason you will not read that Eliyahu actually anointed Jehu, not even Elisha, but rather a "third generation" prophet from that time, (Yonah who was a young man of sons of the prophets and this is because Yonah also had the Spirit of Eliyahu mashiyach-anointing upon him).

You speak from confusion while I continue speaking of Daniel 9:24-27. Here is it for the THIRD TIME in this thread:

How is it written of the Son of man? That he should be cut off and set to nothingness?​

Daniel 9:26 Westminster Leningrad Codex
http://biblos.com/daniel/9-26.htm

וְאַחֲרֵ֤י הַשָּׁבֻעִים֙ שִׁשִּׁ֣ים וּשְׁנַ֔יִם יִכָּרֵ֥ת מָשִׁ֖יחַ וְאֵ֣ין לֹ֑ו וְהָעִ֨יר וְהַקֹּ֜דֶשׁ יַ֠שְׁחִית עַ֣ם נָגִ֤יד הַבָּא֙ וְקִצֹּ֣ו בַשֶּׁ֔טֶף וְעַד֙ קֵ֣ץ מִלְחָמָ֔ה נֶחֱרֶ֖צֶת שֹׁמֵמֹֽות׃

יִכָּרֵ֥ת מָשִׁ֖יחַ וְאֵ֣ין לֹ֑ו
"yikaret mashiyach w'eyn low"
"shall be cut off an anointed [one], and [there is] not-nothing to-for-of him"​

Original Strong's Hebrew Ref. #3772
Romanized karath
Pronounced kaw-rath'
a primitive root; to cut (off, down or asunder); by implication, to destroy or consume; specifically, to covenant (i.e. make an alliance or bargain, originally by cutting flesh and passing between the pieces):
KJV--be chewed, be con-[feder-]ate, covenant, cut (down, off), destroy, fail, feller, be freed, hew (down), make a league ([covenant]), X lose, perish, X utterly, X want.

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Hebrew Definition for #03772
03772 // trk // karath // kaw-rath' //
a primitive root; TWOT - 1048; v
AV - cut off 145, make 85, cut down 23, cut 9, fail 6, destroy 4, want 3, covenanted 2, hew 2, misc 9; 288
1) to cut, cut off, cut down, cut off a body part, cut out, eliminate, kill, cut a covenant
1a) (Qal)
1a1) to cut off
1a1a) to cut off a body part, behead
1a2) to cut down
1a3) to hew
1a4) to cut or make a covenant
1b) (Niphal)
1b1) to be cut off
1b2) to be cut down
1b3) to be chewed
1b4) to be cut off, fail
1c) (Pual)
1c1) to be cut off
1c2) to be cut down
1d) (Hiphil)
1d1) to cut off
1d2) to cut off, destroy
1d3) to cut down, destroy
1d4) to take away
1d5) to permit to perish
1e) (Hophal) cut off

Original Strong's Hebrew Ref. #369
Romanized 'ayin
Pronounced ah'-yin
as if from a primitive root meaning to be nothing or not exist; a non-entity; generally used as a negative particle:
KJV--else, except, fail, [father-]less, be gone, in[-curable], neither, never, no (where), none, nor, (any, thing), not, nothing, to nought, past, un(-searchable), well-nigh, without. Compare HSN0370.

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Hebrew Definition for #0369
0369 // Nya // 'ayin // ah'-yin //
as if from a primitive root meaning to be nothing or not exist;
TWOT - 81; subst n neg adv w/prep
AV - except, faileth, fatherless, incurable, infinite, innumerable, neither, never, no, none, not, nothing, nought, without; 29
1) nothing, not, nought
n
1a) nothing, nought
neg
1b) not
1c) to have not (of possession)
adv
1d) without
w/prep
1e) for lack of

Mark 9:12-13 ASV
12. And he said unto them, Elijah indeed cometh first, and restoreth all things: and how [GSN#4459 pos] is it written of the Son of man, that he should suffer many things and be set at nought? [GSN#1847 exoudenoo]
13. But [GSN#235 alla] I say unto you, that Elijah is come, and they have also done unto him whatsoever they would, even as it is written of him.

The first underlined word translated "how" is pos which is an interrogative and implies that what follows is given in the form of a question, (which will then be answered by the Teacher himself). When posed indirectly the interrogative pos basically implies a query in the form of in what manner? in what way? how can it be? can it be true? etc., etc.

Original Strong's Greek Ref. #4459
Romanized pos
Pronounced poce
adverb from the base of GSN4226; an interrogative particle of manner; in what way? (sometimes the question is indirect, how?); also as exclamation, how much!:
KJV--how, after (by) what manner (means), that. [Occasionally unexpressed in English].

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Greek Definition for #04459
4459 // pwv // pos // poce //
adverb from the base of 4226 , an interrogative particle of manner; particle
AV - how 99, by what means 2, after what manner 1, that 1; 103
1) how, in what way

The next underlined word in the text above is the compound ex-oudenoo and while it is translated in the KJV as "set at nought" a deeper prophetic meaning is revealed through the meaning of one of its compounds which is oudeis meaning NOTHING.

Original Strong's Greek Ref. #1847
Romanized exoudenoo
Pronounced ex-oo-den-o'-o
from GSN1537 and a derivative of the neuter of GSN3762; to make utterly nothing of, i.e. despise:
KJV--set at nought. See also GSN1848.

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Greek Definition for #01847
1847 // exoudenew // exoudenoo // ex-oo-den-o'-o //
from 1537 and a derivative of the neuter of 3762 ; v
AV - be set at nought 1; 1
1) to hold and treat as of no account, utterly to despise
2) to set at nought, treat with contempt

Original Strong's Greek Ref. #3762
Romanized oudeis
Pronounced oo-dice'
including feminine oudemia {oo-dem-ee'-ah}; and neuter ouden {oo-den'}; from GSN3761 and GSN1520; not even one (man, woman or thing), i.e. none, nobody, nothing:
KJV--any (man), aught, man, neither any (thing), never (man), no (man), none (+ of these things), not (any, at all, -thing), nought.

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Greek Definition for #03762
3762 // oudeiv // oudeis // oo-dice' // including feminine
// oudemia // oudemia // oo-dem-ee'-ah // and neuter
// ouden // ouden // oo-den' //
from 3761 and 1520 ; pron
AV - no man 94, nothing 68, none 27, no 24, any man 3, any 3, man 2, neither any man 2, misc 13; 236
1) no one, nothing

The last underlined word at the opening of Mark 9:13 is alla which in many places should more likely be rendered as CONTRARIWISE. And this is especially true when the Teacher poses an interrogatory to his talmidim-disciples and intends to give them an answer which they were not expecting to hear; for his answer is CONTRARY to what he knew they would be thinking.

Original Strong's Greek Ref. #235
Romanized alla
Pronounced al-lah'
neuter plural of GSN0243; properly, other things, i.e. (adverbially) contrariwise (in many relations):
KJV--and, but (even), howbeit, indeed, nay, nevertheless, no, notwithstanding, save, therefore, yea, yet.

Brown, Driver, Briggs (BDB)
Strong's Greek Definition for #0235
235 // alla // alla // al-lah' //
neuter plural of 0243 ; conj
AV - but 573, yea 15, yet 11, nevertheless 10, howbeit 9, nay 4, therefore 3, save 2, not tr 2, misc 8; 637
1) but
1a) nevertheless, notwithstanding
1b) an objection
1c) an exception
1d) a restriction
1e) nay, rather, yea, moreover
1f) forms a transition to the cardinal matter

Mark 9:12-13 GNT Morph
12 ὁ δὲ ἔφη αὐτοῖς Ἠλίας μὲν ἐλθὼν πρῶτον ἀποκαθιστάνει πάντα καὶ πῶς γέγραπται ἐπὶ τὸν υἱὸν τοῦ ἀνθρώπου ἵνα πολλὰ πάθῃ καὶ ἐξουδενηθῇ ?
13 ἀλλὰ λέγω ὑμῖν ὅτι καὶ Ἠλίας ἐλήλυθεν καὶ ἐποίησαν αὐτῷ ὅσα ἤθελον καθὼς γέγραπται ἐπ’ αὐτόν

Mark 9:12-13 TUA (Transliterated Unaccented)
12. Ho de efe autois, "Elias men elthon proton apokathistanei panta. Kai pos gegraptai epi ton Huion tou Anthropou hina polla pathe kai exoudenethe?
13. Alla lego humin hoti kai Elias eleluthen, kai epoiesan auto hosa ethelon, kathos gegraptai ep auton."^

In what manner is it written of the Son of man? Was Yeshua to be cut off to utter nothingness? To be cut off and not be? To not exist if even temporarily? To be cut off and have nothing to-for-of himself? To be brought to utter nothingness? Paulos writes in 1 Corinthians 12:3 that "No one speaking by the Spirit of God says; "Yeshua Anathema", which is to say that Yeshua was "cut off" or "excommunicated" even if for an instant or moment.

Mark 9:12-13
12. And he said unto them, "Elias verily comes first restoring all things. And how is it written concerning the Son of man? that he should suffer many things and be set to utter nothingness?
13. Contrariwise, I say unto you, that also Elias has come; and they have done unto him whatsoever they desired, as it is written concerning him." (Re: Daniel 9:26)

Luke 1:13-17 ASV
13. But the angel said unto him, Fear not, Zacharias: because thy supplication is heard, and thy wife Elisabeth shall bear thee a son, and thou shalt call his name John.
14. And thou shalt have joy and gladness; and many shall rejoice at his birth.
15. For he shall be great in the sight of the Lord, and he shall drink no wine nor strong drink; and he shall be filled with the Holy Spirit, [a mashiyach anointed one] even from his mother's womb.
16. And many of the children of Israel shall be turn unto the Lord their God.
17. And he shall go before his face in the spirit and power of Elijah, [mashiyach-anointing of Eliyahu] to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the disobedient to walk in the wisdom of the just; to make ready for the Lord a people prepared for him.

Daniel 9:24-26 TUA - Transliteration
24. Shabu`iym shib`iym nechtak `al- `amka w`al- `iyrqadsheka lkale' hapesha`, uwlhatem {*} chaTa't {*},uwlkaper `awon, uwlhabiy' tsedeq `olamiym, wlachtom chazownwnabiy', wlimshoach qodesh qadashiym.
24. Seventy weeks-generations are decreed upon thy people and upon thy holy city: to finish the transgression; and to make an end of sins; and to atone for iniquity; and to bring in righteousness everlasting; and for the closing of the vision and prophecy; and for to anoint holy holies.
25. Wteda` wtaskel min- motsa' dabar lhashiyb wlibnowt Yruwshalaim, `ad- mashiyach, nagiyd, shabu`iym shib`ah. Wshabu`iym shishiym uwshnayim tashuwb wnibntah rchowbwcharuwts uwbtsowq ha`itiym.
25. Know therefore and understand: From the going forth of the Word, for the return and the building of Jerusalem; unto-until a mashiyach, [Yochanan the Immerser ha-Qowre' Eliyahu] a nagiyd, [Yeshua Nagiyd of the Brit-Covenant] shall be seven weeks-generations. And sixty and two weeks-generations shall return-repent; and the broad place shall be built, and the tough digging, even in the troubles of the times.
26. W'achrey hashabu`iymshishiym uwshnayim yikaret Mashiyach w'eyn low. Wha`iyrwhaqodesh yashchiyt `am nagiyd haba'. Wqitsow basheTep, w`adqets milchamah -- nechretset shomemowt.
26. And after the weeks-generations sixty and two shall mashiyach [Yochanan ha-Qowre'] be cut off, and there is nothing to-for him. And the city and the qodesh-holy-sanctuary shall be corrupted: the people of the Nagiyd to come; and his end [Yeshua Nagiyd of the Brit-Covenant] is in a flood, [Daniel 11:22] and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.
27. Whigbiyr briytlarabiym shabuwa` 'echad. Wachtsiy hashabuwa` yashbiytzebach uwminchah. W`al knap shiquwtsiym mshomem, w`ad- kalahwnechratsah titak `al- shomem.
27. And he [Yeshua Nagiyd] shall strengthen-confirm the Covenant for the many week one ['echad - the first and only shabuwa` literal week]. And in the midst of the week he shall cause to cease the sacrifice and oblation. And for the overspreading of abominations it shall be desolated; even unto the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Was it Yeshua haNagiyd Commander of the Covenant that was cut off and set to nought-nothingness?
Says Yeshua Moshiya: Contrariwise, it was Yochanan ha-Qowre' mashiyach-anointed Eliyahu!
Yeshua Nagiyd Brit was Crucified but of those given to him of the Father he lost none . . . :)

Isaiah 42:1-6 KJV
1. Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.
2. He shall not cry, nor lift up, nor cause his voice to be heard in the street.
3. A bruised reed shall he not break, and the smoking flax shall he not quench: he shall bring forth judgment unto truth.
4. He shall not fail nor be discouraged, till he have set judgment in the earth: and the isles shall wait for his law.
5. Thus saith God the Lord, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:
6. I the Lord have called thee in righteousness, and will hold thine hand, and will keep thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, for a light of the Gentiles;

Isaiah 55:1-4 KJV
1. Ho, every one that thirsteth, come ye to the waters, [Re: John 7:37-38] and he that hath no money; come ye, buy, and eat; yea, come, buy wine and milk without money and without price.
2. Wherefore do ye spend money for that which is not bread? and your labour for that which satisfieth not? hearken diligently unto me, and eat ye that which is good, and let your soul delight itself in fatness.
3. Incline your ear, and come unto me: hear, and your soul shall live; and I will make an everlasting covenant with you, even the sure mercies of David.
4. Behold, I have given him for a witness to the people, a leader [HSN#5057 nagiyd] and commander to the people.

Original Strong's Ref. #5057
Romanized nagiyd
Pronounced naw-gheed'
or nagid {naw-gheed'}; from HSN5046; a commander (as occupying the front), civil, military or religious; generally (abstractly, plural), honorable themes:
KJV--captain, chief, excellent thing, (chief) governor, leader, noble, prince, (chief) ruler.

Lukos 17:12-14
12. And as he entered into a certain village, there met him ten men that were lepers, which stood afar off:
13. And they lifted up their voices, and said, Yeshua, Epistates-Commander, have mercy on us!
14. And when he saw them, he said unto them, "Go shew yourselves unto the priests." And it came to pass, that, as they went, they were cleansed.

---

Psalm 82
82:1 Elohim standeth in the congregation of El; he judgeth among the elohim.
82:2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
82:3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
82:4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
82:5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
82:6 I have said, Ye are elohim; and all of you are children of the most High.
82:7 But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
82:8 Arise, O Elohim, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations.
http://yahushua.net/scriptures/psa082.htm

Shirot `Olat ha-Shabbat - 4Q403(ShirShabbd)
Courtesy of the Israel Antiquities Authority
30. By the instructor. Song of the sacrifice of the seventh
Sabbath on the sixteenth of the month. Praise the God of
the lofty heights, O you lofty ones among all the
31. elim of knowledge. Let the holiest of the godlike ones
sanctify the King of glory who sanctifies by holiness
all His holy ones. O you chiefs of the praises of
32. all the godlike beings, praise the splendidly
praiseworthy God. For in the splendor of praise
is the glory of His realm. From it comes the praises
of all
33. the godlike ones together with the splendor of all His
majesty. And exalt his exaltedness to exalted heaven,
you most godlike ones of the lofty elim,
and exalt His glorious divinity above
34. all the lofty heights. For He is God of gods of all
the chiefs of the heights of heaven and King
of kings of all the eternal councils.
35. At the words of His mouth come into
being all the lofty angels; at the utterance
of His lips all the eternal spirits; by the intention
of His knowledge all His creatures
36. in their undertakings. Sing with joy, you who rejoice
in His knowledge with rejoicing among the wondrous
godlike beings. And chant His glory with the
tongue of all who chant with knowledge;
and chant His wonderful songs of joy
37. with the mouth of all who chant of Him. For He is
God of all who rejoice {in knowledge}
forever and Judge in His power of all the
spirits of understanding.
http://www.ibiblio.org/expo/deadsea.scrolls.exhibit/Library/songs.html

A ten-foot stalk of Egyptian grain once said that the Teacher of Righteousness was no different as Mashiyach than any other mashiyach. One of the greatest miracles of all creation is the grain of seed and how it springs back to life when it is sprinkled with living water from the heavens above.

I know a certain One who keeps the seedlings of many different and beautiful species for his garden. Each year before springtime the various specimens of dried seedlings are brought forth from the storehouse, sown in their given places in the garden, and plentifully watered all according to the pleasure of the Planter.

Once upon a time, times, and half a time there was a talmid-disciple of the Teacher of Righteousness. One day the talmid came to the Sukkah, for to study with the Teacher, and he noticed that there was a brown paper packet, full of old dried seeds, placed upon the table where the two had reclined to immerse in discourse and Word. And it came to pass that in his carelessness the talmid accidentally knocked over a cup of cool water which had been placed beside him at the table. And so the water splashed and flowed out across the table, yet not soaking, but slightly splattering several small drops of moisture upon the brown paper packet of old dried seeds. Unfazed, as if knowing this would eventually occur, the Teacher of Righteousness snatched up the packet in his hand and quickly took the seeds outside to sow them in the garden. As the talmid watched the Teacher, somewhat stunned by the preeminence given to this matter over and above the study time, he realized that the seeds must have been stored and kept by the Master for a very long time; yet the moment at hand was now become their moment to shine. And so, not understanding exactly how seeds work, the young talmid inquired of the Master what was the reason for the sudden immediacy? And the Gardener replied: Because the seeds are not dead but merely sleeping; and as soon as they receive any moisture whatsoever they are awakened, no matter how long they have been sleeping:

Because their worm never dies . . .

And then the talmid began to understand the true miracle of the seed, and the Word spoke to me and said: "Whoso of all the families of the earth that will not come up to the holy city of above to worship the King, upon them shall be no rain." And I understood that all of the grains with hardened shells which repel the water of the Word will not open up in their due seasons: like Autumn trees which have past their appointed times and still no fruit to be seen. And the mighty ten-foot Egyptian wheat stalks, with the other similar tares, they too shall fall to the ground. And while their worms shall receive no rain, yet they also shall never forget the words of the Master, and neither shall their worm die, nor the fire be quenched; for the Word of the Father through his Son shall never pass away. All we are like seeds according to the Scripture. These things were taught for thousands of years before we as a modern society were somehow convinced that it would be wise to be herded into great mega-city concrete jungles.

The Father gives the seed a body accordingly as it pleases Him:

1 Corinthians 15:35-44
35. But some man will say, How are the dead raised up? and with what body do they come?
36. Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, except it die:
37. And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
38. But the Theos giveth it a body as it hath pleased him, and to every seed his own body.
39. All flesh is not the same flesh: but there is one kind of flesh of men, another flesh of beasts, another of fishes, and another of birds.
40. There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another.
41. There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory.
42. So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43. It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44. It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

If we understand that the holy city Yerushalaim is the heavenly Yerushalaim of above and in Mount Zion the mount which cannot be touched with physical hands, as it is written in Galatians 4:25-31 and Hebrews 12:22-24, and that, like Daniel, we can open the doors of our windows toward Yerushalaim of above anytime and go there on our knees in all of the appointed times so as to keep the feasts of Yisrael; then perhaps we might understand the statement concerning the RAIN in Zecharyah:

Zecharyah 14:17-18
17. And if any of the families of the earth do not go up to Yerushalaim [of above] to worship the King, YHWH Sabaoth, there will be no rain upon them.
18. And if the family of Egypt do not go up and present themselves, then upon them shall come the plague with which YHWH afflicts the nations that do not go up to keep the Feast of Sukkot.
19. This shall be the punishment to Egypt and the punishment to all the nations that do not go up to keep the Feast of Sukkot.

All of it is symbolism through the totality of Scripture: Egypt are those who walk according to the belly of the flesh, live according to the mind of the flesh, interpret and understand the Holy Spirit Word according to the eyes and ears of the flesh, and therefore shall receive no rain in the End meaning no resurrection into life everlasting. However, there are those which do receive a resurrection of shame and damnation.

Markos 9:43-48
43. And if thy hand offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter into life maimed, than having two hands to go into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
44. Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
45. And if thy foot offend thee, cut it off: it is better for thee to enter halt into life, than having two feet to be cast into hell, into the fire that never shall be quenched:
46. Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.
47. And if thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: it is better for thee to enter into the kingdom of the Theou with one eye, than having two eyes to be cast into hell fire:
48. Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched.

Mattityahu 13:24-30
24. Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
25. But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
26. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
27. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
28. He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
29. But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
30. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Mattityahu 13:36-43
36. Then Yeshua sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and his disciples came unto him, saying, Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field.
37. He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38. The field is the kosmos-world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39. The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the consummation of the aionos-age; and the reapers are the angels.
40. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the consummation of this aionos-age.
41. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42. And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

And the Master said to the talmid; The seedling is like the soul of the man having been planted in the tilled garden of the 'adamah-soil of the heart: yet out in the badlands of the 'erets-countryside the tares abound in the fields, so the fields therefore must needs be burned. And I understood that the 'adamah-soil is the heart, which pumps the blood and maintains the soul; yet the 'erets-land is the outer commons of the flesh, like the outer court profane-commons round about the perimeter of the holy Temple.

And I remembered back to a time when I had fancied myself to be a mighty one, already having been "saved" and crowned; but every hailstone crown is about the weight of a talent of gold. And in my pride I had not perceived how it was that my crowning was more like the crowning of the king of Rabbah the city of waters in the land of Moab; and when I went forth conquering and to conquer, breathing out fire on those whom I perceived to be my enemies; what my vain imagination had thought to be my "white horse" was more of a white cloud, and my weapon of choice, the bow in my hand, was more like a scythe; and the seed that I had once upon a time sown was corrupted, being full of the leaven of my pride.

And then I realized why it was that my fields had a need to be burned in the first place; and how it is, and why it is, and to whom be the glory for ever and ever that even now I do sit here; having been clothed, and in my right mind.

 

[Purity]

And the Master said to the talmid; The seedling is like the soul of the man having been planted in the tilled garden of the 'adamah-soil of the heart: yet out in the badlands of the 'erets-countryside the tares abound in the fields, so the fields therefore must needs be burned. And I understood that the 'adamah-soil is the heart, which pumps the blood and maintains the soul; yet the 'erets-land is the outer commons of the flesh, like the outer court profane-commons round about the perimeter of the holy Temple.

Comment:

So put away all filth and evil excess and humbly welcome the message implanted within you, which is able to save your souls (lives). (Jas 1:21)

The seed (Word) enters through the ears into the mind where its takes control of our senses - when we die we are nothingness! And the last breath is exhaled and returned to the Father.

We are not forgotten Heb 11:40

 

[daq]

And the Master said to the talmid; The seedling is like the soul of the man having been planted in the tilled garden of the 'adamah-soil of the heart: yet out in the badlands of the 'erets-countryside the tares abound in the fields, so the fields therefore must needs be burned. And I understood that the 'adamah-soil is the heart, which pumps the blood and maintains the soul; yet the 'erets-land is the outer commons of the flesh, like the outer court profane-commons round about the perimeter of the holy Temple.

Comment:

So put away all filth and evil excess and humbly welcome the message implanted within you, which is able to save your souls (lives). (Jas 1:21)

The seed (Word) enters through the ears into the mind where its takes control of our senses - when we die we are nothingness! And the last breath is exhaled and returned to the Father.

We are not forgotten Heb 11:40

We are pictured as seeds in resurrection but this is not the same analogy as the seed-Word planted in the soil of the heart:

The Blood, the Water, and the Spirit testify that the Word is the Truth.
The nephesh-soul is in the blood which was poured out and fell into the earth.
The Water of Life heals the earth and causes the seedlings to spring forth.
The Breath is Testimony-Spirit and was committed to the Father:

Luke 23:46 YLT
46. and having cried with a loud voice, Jesus said, 'Father, to Thy hands I commit my spirit;' and these things having said, he breathed forth the spirit.

Follow the blood at the following link, (entire thread) from where this quote is derived:

It all depends on where YOU are. If you happen to be in the Upper Room then take the southern Essene Gate out of the city and walk east as you exit the second gate from the Essene Quarter. Follow the brook of Kidron northward taking the same route which king David took when he fled from Absalom which is also the same route Yeshua took with his talmidim immediately after the Pesach Seder when they went up to Mount Olivet Moriah. When you get to the north fork in the Kidron take the one which goes westward toward the setting sun where you will find the Israel Pool and the Sheep Pool. Immerse in these two pools and as you come up out of immersion there you will be refreshed for the journey up the Ascent to Olivet at the top of Moriah. This route walks out at fifteen stadion, (just under two miles at about 9000 feet) just as the Scripture states in John 11:18. :)

However, if you are in the northern quarters of the city then take the Damascus Gate, (also known as the Fish Gate). This Hodos-Way is called "holding the Shabbat Way" ("Sabbatou echon hodon", Acts 1:12) because the highest point of holy Mount Moriah, and Golgotha the Place of the Skull, and Gan Gath-shemeni, and the empty Garden Tomb, and Bethany-Bethphage are all together in that location less than a half mile from the Damascus Gate, (within 2000 cubits) and thus a "Sabbath Day's" journey. Also of note is the fact that "Bethphage" means "the house of green-figs" and is where Yeshua raised Lazarus out of the dead, (see Song of Solomon 2:13) the same Bethphage is Bethany according to the Scripture.

Christ will come again - Post#128

John 19:34-35 KJV
34. But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water.
35. And he that saw it bare record, and his record is true: and he knoweth that he saith true, that ye might believe.

So I took up my cross from the Essene Quarters, going up through the midst of the city, and exited by the Damascus-Fish Gate which faces toward the north. And when I had ascended Olivet and come to the place of the crucifixion the Word says to me; You followed the Blood into the Bay of Abraham so why then did you not follow the Living Waters down the Mountain? So I followed the stream of Living Waters down side of Moriah Olivet toward the east and came to the Sheep Pool where the stream ran across the surface of the waters of the pool. Going through the Sheep Pool then I continued following the stream of Living Waters and soon came to the Pool of All Yisrael which is adjacent to the Sheep Gate next to the Temple. This was now about a thousand cubits from the Cross of Messiah at the summit of Moriah Olivet where the stream of Living Waters had commenced. The Living Waters of the stream entered into the Pool of All Yisrael at about a thousand cubits from the summit where father Abraham had likewise shown the willing heart even to the point of offering up his only son. The waters of the All Yisrael Pool were placid and calm when a messenger came down and stirred the waters; so I stepped into the pool in faith, and the waters were at the level of the ankles, and my ankles received strength in the waters. Then I continued roundabout the pinnacle of the Temple and followed the brook as it strengthened and widened flowing down the eastern side of the Temple through the valley of Kidron. At the distance of another thousand cubits I came to the Gihon Spring where Zadok the priest and Nathan the prophet had anointed Solomon king of Yisrael. The Living Waters where then at the level of the waist so I continued onward in the Brook of Life and after yet another thousand cubits I found myself at the fountain which is called En Rogel. The waters here were at the level of the neck, and fearful, yet there were only two choices of direction to which one might go: if then I would exit the waters, in fear, then I would must needs exit to the west and into the Valley of Hinnom, (Gehenna) otherwise one must take the river from that point to the east and go wheresoever the River of Life takes him because in the next thousand cubits it becomes a river which cannot be crossed by any man. So I took the River of Life toward the east; and it flowed down some four thousand feet in elevation from the height of its commencement into the Sea of Salt. Everything along the Way to the Sea of Salt was healed, alive, and living; on either side of the River of Life were men walking to and from between Yerushalaim and Damascus-Qumran, (this is the Way to Damascus) and the men were like trees walking, preaching the Gospel of Messiah; like crosses of life with their arms out preaching the Truth all along the Way: even like trees with healing in their foliage for the nations and every one producing his fruits according to his months. And when I arrived at the outlet into the Sea of Salt I saw that one could go either to the south or to the north; to the south is En Gedi where there were fishers of men spreading their nets, and further south of En Gedi was Sodom with her sisters which had been healed when Yerushalaim was likewise healed of all her abominations. To the north from the Living Wadi-Nahal Kidron was the remainder of the Way to Damascus-Qumran where the Zadokite Priests and Scribes of the Kingdom of Heaven wrote the manuscripts. :)

 

[Retrobyter]

Shabbat shalom, daq.

Man, reading through your posts is like hearing the "Most Holy Words" of the Yangs in "The Omega Glory" episode (second season) of the old Star Trek series! You read the Scriptures and read "Ee plebneesta norcolum for cum perfec tunum," and I feel like Kirk trying to wave the cobwebs aside to get back to the simple words, "We the people of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union!"

What you come up with from the Scriptures is COMPLETE GOBBLEDYGOOK!

(And, "Purity," you're no help at all. You're just serving to add to the confusion.)

Matthew 13 (outside of the first parable) has NO FULFILLMENT AT ALL in the Present! It will be fulfilled WHEN YESHUA` IS LITERALLY REIGNING FROM YERUSHALAYIM, ISRA'EL, during the first 1,000 years of His EARTHLY reign!! And, you CANNOT use the words of Matthew 13 to "prove" anything because one's interpretation of Matthew 13 is DEPENDENT UPON how one interprets the fundamentals of Scripture, whether figuratively/allegorically or grammatically/historically, and no map or twist of words is going to change that!

Without a clear understanding of how to interpret God's Word, you are DOOMED to misunderstand the Scriptures in EVERY location! And, you've taken your allegorical method of interpretation of the Scriptures to the Nth DEGREE, compounding the errors exponentially!

For all your disdain for the "fleshy" way of seeing the Scriptures, it's the ONLY way that makes SENSE! Furthermore, let's call a spade a spade, shall we? Your disdain/avoidance/hatred/contempt for the "flesh" boils down to nothing more than FEAR. You're AFRAID that you might be wrong in your interpretation of the Scriptures, and it jumps out as HATRED for that which God created (the earth and its sky and the human bodies that inhabit them), for that which God called "VERY GOOD!" So, you've GOT to have a scenario for the future that does not contain that which you contemn and condemn so much!

On the other hand, I believe we should EMBRACE the promises for a LITERAL, BODILY RESURRECTION and NEVER fear them! It will be a HAPPY occasion when Yeshua` returns and resurrects those who are dead and transforms our bodies into bodies that have "flesh and bones" as He has! It will be a JOYOUS VICTORY!!! It's HOLLYWOOD that twists the victorious Resurrection of our flesh into tales of vampires and zombies! Fear and disdain Hollywood, but DON'T fear or disdain the Resurrection!

Toma (Thomas) had to have the opportunity to put his finger in Yeshua`s hands and his hand in Yeshua`s side to believe, but it is better if one can believe without such an opportunity. "Seeing is believing," and being from Missouri, the "Show me" state, is good when it comes to dealing with deceitful human beings, but remember Yeshua`s words:

John 20:29

29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
KJV

I still love you as a brother, but we may NEVER see eye-to-eye until we stand IN OUR FLESH in the Kingdom of our Lord.

 

[daq]

Shabbat shalom, daq.

Man, reading through your posts is like hearing the "Most Holy Words" of the Yangs in "The Omega Glory" episode (second season) of the old Star Trek series! You read the Scriptures and read "Ee plebneesta norcolum for cum perfec tunum," and I feel like Kirk trying to wave the cobwebs aside to get back to the simple words, "We the people of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union!"

What you come up with from the Scriptures is COMPLETE GOBBLEDYGOOK!

(And, "Purity," you're no help at all. You're just serving to add to the confusion.)

Matthew 13 (outside of the first parable) has NO FULFILLMENT AT ALL in the Present! It will be fulfilled WHEN YESHUA` IS LITERALLY REIGNING FROM YERUSHALAYIM, ISRA'EL, during the first 1,000 years of His EARTHLY reign!! And, you CANNOT use the words of Matthew 13 to "prove" anything because one's interpretation of Matthew 13 is DEPENDENT UPON how one interprets the fundamentals of Scripture, whether figuratively/allegorically or grammatically/historically, and no map or twist of words is going to change that!

Without a clear understanding of how to interpret God's Word, you are DOOMED to misunderstand the Scriptures in EVERY location! And, you've taken your allegorical method of interpretation of the Scriptures to the Nth DEGREE, compounding the errors exponentially!

For all your disdain for the "fleshy" way of seeing the Scriptures, it's the ONLY way that makes SENSE! Furthermore, let's call a spade a spade, shall we? Your disdain/avoidance/hatred/contempt for the "flesh" boils down to nothing more than FEAR. You're AFRAID that you might be wrong in your interpretation of the Scriptures, and it jumps out as HATRED for that which God created (the earth and its sky and the human bodies that inhabit them), for that which God called "VERY GOOD!" So, you've GOT to have a scenario for the future that does not contain that which you contemn and condemn so much!

On the other hand, I believe we should EMBRACE the promises for a LITERAL, BODILY RESURRECTION and NEVER fear them! It will be a HAPPY occasion when Yeshua` returns and resurrects those who are dead and transforms our bodies into bodies that have "flesh and bones" as He has! It will be a JOYOUS VICTORY!!! It's HOLLYWOOD that twists the victorious Resurrection of our flesh into tales of vampires and zombies! Fear and disdain Hollywood, but DON'T fear or disdain the Resurrection!

Toma (Thomas) had to have the opportunity to put his finger in Yeshua`s hands and his hand in Yeshua`s side to believe, but it is better if one can believe without such an opportunity. "Seeing is believing," and being from Missouri, the "Show me" state, is good when it comes to dealing with deceitful human beings, but remember Yeshua`s words:

John 20:29

29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
KJV

I still love you as a brother, but we may NEVER see eye-to-eye until we stand IN OUR FLESH in the Kingdom of our Lord.

As already stated you will indeed get your "pound of flesh" but in the End it will be the death of you:

Romans 8:1-9 KJV
1. There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
2. For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
3. For what the law could not do, in that it was weak through the flesh, God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh:
4. That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.
5. For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit.
6. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
8. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
9. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Perhaps this is the reason why you, while claiming to be a Jew, cannot see that I have been following Sukkot this Week.
In fact this Shabbat just now having passed was the very day wherein Yeshua went into the Temple and taught:

John 7:2-14 KJV
2. Now the Jews' feast of tabernacles was at hand.
3. His brethren therefore said unto him, Depart hence, and go into Judaea, that thy disciples also may see the works that thou doest.
4. For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world.
5. For neither did his brethren believe in him.
6. Then Jesus said unto them, My time is not yet come: but your time is alway ready.
7. The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.
8. Go ye up unto this feast: I go not up yet unto this feast; for my time is not yet full come.
9. When he had said these words unto them, he abode still in Galilee.
10. But when his brethren were gone up, then went he also up unto the feast, not openly, but as it were in secret.
11. Then the Jews sought him at the feast, and said, Where is he?
12. And there was much murmuring among the people concerning him: for some said, He is a good man: others said, Nay; but he deceiveth the people.
13. Howbeit no man spake openly of him for fear of the Jews.
14. Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught.

THIS VERY DAY IN THE MIDST OF SUKKOT CUTS THE DANIEL 9:27 WEEK IN HALF

And what does the Master proclaim in the Last and Great Day of the Feast?

John 7:37-39 KJV
37. In the last day, that great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, If any man thirst, let him come unto me, and drink.
38. He that believeth on me, as the scripture hath said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living water.
39. (But this spake he of the Spirit, which they that believe on him should receive: for the Holy Ghost was not yet given; because that Jesus was not yet glorified).

The word "given" in John 7:39 above is not in the text but rather added by the translators. The Holy Spirit Testimony of Yeshua was not yet completed because Yeshua was not yet glorified and stood up at the Cross of Golgotha wherein he drew all men to himself. When the Master surrenders up his final breath and commends his Spirit into the hands of the Father it is only then that the Holy Spirit Testimony of Yeshua is complete:

John 7:37-39 YLT (Young's Literal Bible Translation)
37. And in the last, the great day of the feast, Jesus stood and cried, saying, 'If any one doth thirst, let him come unto me and drink;
38. he who is believing in me, according as the Writing said, Rivers out of his belly shall flow of living water;'
39. and this he said of the Spirit, which those believing in him were about to receive; for not yet was the Holy Spirit, because Jesus was not yet glorified.

Ezekiel 47:1-12 KJV
1. Afterward he brought me again unto the door of the house; and, behold, waters issued out from under the threshold of the house eastward: for the forefront of the house stood toward the east, and the waters came down from under from the right side of the house, at the south side of the altar.
2. Then brought he me out of the way of the gate northward, and led me about the way without unto the utter gate by the way that looketh eastward; and, behold, there ran out waters on the right side.
3. And when the man that had the line in his hand went forth eastward, he measured a thousand cubits, and he brought me through the waters; the waters were to the ancles.
4. Again he measured a thousand, and brought me through the waters; the waters were to the knees. Again he measured a thousand, and brought me through; the waters were to the loins.
5. Afterward he measured a thousand; and it was a river that I could not pass over: for the waters were risen, waters to swim in, a river that could not be passed over.
6. And he said unto me, Son of man, hast thou seen this? Then he brought me, and caused me to return to the brink of the river.
7. Now when I had returned, behold, at the bank of the river were very many trees on the one side and on the other.
8. Then said he unto me, These waters issue out toward the east country, and go down into the desert, and go into the sea: which being brought forth into the sea, the waters shall be healed.
9. And it shall come to pass, that every thing that liveth, which moveth, whithersoever the rivers shall come, shall live: and there shall be a very great multitude of fish, because these waters shall come thither: for they shall be healed; and every thing shall live whither the river cometh.
10. And it shall come to pass, that the fishers shall stand upon it from Engedi even unto Eneglaim; they shall be a place to spread forth nets; their fish shall be according to their kinds, as the fish of the great sea, exceeding many.
11. But the miry places thereof and the marishes thereof shall not be healed; they shall be given to salt.
12. And by the river upon the bank thereof, on this side and on that side, shall grow all trees for meat, whose leaf shall not fade, neither shall the fruit thereof be consumed: it shall bring forth new fruit according to his months, because their waters they issued out of the sanctuary: and the fruit thereof shall be for meat, and the leaf thereof for medicine.

Revelation 22:1-4 KJV
1. And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2. In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
3. And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
4. And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.

Revelation 22:14 KJV
14. Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

Revelation 22:14 ASV
14. Blessed are they that wash their robes, that they may have the right to come to the tree of life, and my enter in by the gates into the city.

Revelation 22:15-17 KJV
15. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
16. I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
17. And the Spirit and the bride say, Come. And let him that heareth say, Come. And let him that is athirst come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

God sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, and for sin, condemned sin in the flesh: that the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. For they that are after the flesh do mind the things of the flesh; but they that are after the Spirit the things of the Spirit. For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God. But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Holy Spirit Testimony of Messiah Yeshua, he is none of his. Therefore if one has not the Testimony of Yeshua then the same has not Holy Spirit. :)

 

[daq]

Man, reading through your posts is like hearing the "Most Holy Words" of the Yangs in "The Omega Glory" episode (second season) of the old Star Trek series! You read the Scriptures and read "Ee plebneesta norcolum for cum perfec tunum," and I feel like Kirk trying to wave the cobwebs aside to get back to the simple words, "We the people of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union!"

What you come up with from the Scriptures is COMPLETE GOBBLEDYGOOK!

For all your disdain for the "fleshy" way of seeing the Scriptures, it's the ONLY way that makes SENSE! Furthermore, let's call a spade a spade, shall we? Your disdain/avoidance/hatred/contempt for the "flesh" boils down to nothing more than FEAR. You're AFRAID that you might be wrong in your interpretation of the Scriptures, and it jumps out as HATRED for that which God created (the earth and its sky and the human bodies that inhabit them), for that which God called "VERY GOOD!" So, you've GOT to have a scenario for the future that does not contain that which you contemn and condemn so much!

On the other hand, I believe we should EMBRACE the promises for a LITERAL, BODILY RESURRECTION and NEVER fear them! It will be a HAPPY occasion when Yeshua` returns and resurrects those who are dead and transforms our bodies into bodies that have "flesh and bones" as He has! It will be a JOYOUS VICTORY!!! It's HOLLYWOOD that twists the victorious Resurrection of our flesh into tales of vampires and zombies! Fear and disdain Hollywood, but DON'T fear or disdain the Resurrection!

Yeshua says: "Me fobeisthe them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fobeisthe him which is able to destroy both soul and body in Gehenna. Are not two tsipporim sold for an assarion? And the one from them shall not fall into the earthen without your Father!" And again Yeshua says: "I will forewarn you whom ye shall fobethe-reverence: fobethe-reverence him, which after he hath killed hath power to cast into Gehenna; Yea, I say unto you, Fobethe-Reverence Him!" :)

Yeshua says, in the song of Moses the servant of God, and in the song of the Lamb: "Great and marvelous are thy works, YHWH Elohim Almighty; righteous and true are thy ways thou King of nations! Who shall not fobethe-reverence thee, O Adonai, and glorify thy name? For thou alone art holy: for all nations shall come and worship before thee; for thy righteousness-judgments are made manifest." :)

The beginning of wisdom is the fobos-reverence of YHWH, (Psalms 111:10) :)

The fobos-reverence of YHWH is clean; enduring forever, (Psalms 19:9) :)

The fobos-reverence of YHWH is the beginning of knowledge, (Proverbs 1:7) :)

The fobos-reverence of YHWH is to hate evil, pride, arrogance, and the evil way, (Proverbs 8:13) :)

The beginning of wisdom is the fobos-reverence of YHWH, (Proverbs 9:10) :)

And when Mariam the Magdalena together with the other Maria went forth from the empty sepulcher, so as to inform the talmidim that the body of Yeshua was missing and that they had seen a vision of angels, Yeshua then met them in the Way, saying, "Chairete!" which is to say, "Cheerful Greetings!" And they came and held him at the feet, and worshipped him. Then says Yeshua unto them: "Me fobeisthe!" which is to say, "Do not reverence!" :)