NayborBear
Active Member
God sent Him!Did Jesus succeed, or fail, at his mission to be "the Saviour of the world."
He definitely succeeded!
To whomsoever will believe.
Does everyone believe?
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God sent Him!Did Jesus succeed, or fail, at his mission to be "the Saviour of the world."
They will.Does everyone believe?
AMEN!They will.
Anyone who has knees to bow and a tongue to speak, in heaven and
on earth and under the earth (in the realm of the dead), will whole-heartedly,
and without reservation, acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord.
No one can say that “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” you will be saved.
Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead
and the living. (the reason for the bodily resurrection) Scriptural support below.
Philippians 2:10-11
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
11 and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.
1 Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to know that no one who is speaking by the Spirit of God says,
“Jesus be cursed,” and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.
Romans 10:9
If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart
that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Romans 14:9
For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that
he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.
Note on "acknowledge" in Philippians 2:11 from Strong's Concordance
S1843 eksomologéō (from 1537 /ek, "wholly out from," intensifying 3670 /homologéō, "say the same thing about") – properly, fully agree and to acknowledge that agreement openly (whole-heartedly); hence, to confess ("openly declare"), without reservation (no holding back).
Further reading: Isaiah 45:23; Romans 14:11; Revelation 15:4
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Agree. The Strong's definition really helps. The confession is NOT forced.AMEN!
Dunno if all will believe. But ALL will (at the very least) acknowledge!
No. They rejected the church's understanding.Could it be that they leaned on their own understanding of Scripture rather than God's?
I think that's correct. The Church's understanding is God's understanding. They rejected that in favor of their own judgement.No. They rejected the church's understanding.
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I'm speaking of the pure conversion of Christ after repenting, with all things now of God.No because it is not biblical.
The repeated injunction not to sin found through the epistles tells us that the new Christians in the early church struggled with temptation and with sin.
Why does Paul tell us that there is a way of escapi g temptation?
Why does he talk about his current problem of doing what he doesn't want to do?
I've believe I've given the verse. (1 Peter 1:21)Why is it impossible?
You're preach your own religion and gospel. It's not the gospel and life Paul preaches.Paul was a normal human being with all the faults weaknesses and strength we all have.
The problem of Romans 7 is double hearted sinning against God and the knowledge of Jesus Christ.The passage reads as a current ongoing problem that Paul the human being had.
So did Peter. They did not write to Christians sinning by temptation, to encourage them that they are still saved and justified, while sinning against Christ.He wrote to encourage other people going through difficult ctemptations.
No man is immune to the troubles and tribulations of life. But only the newborn sons of God are enduring them like Jesus, yet without sin.He was not same sort of super saint, immune to the troubles of life.
That's a bold claim.The Church's understanding is God's understanding.
I don't recall that.Christ... has promised that it will never teach doctrinal error.
Barnes Bible Notes says:Jesus makes the natural seed mortal and corruptible naturally, which has nothing to do with sin.
And his disciples asked him, saying, Master, who did sin, this man, or his parents, that he was born blind?
Jesus answered, Neither hath this man sinned, nor his parents: but that the works of God should be made manifest in him.
Neither mortality nor deformity of flesh is from sin, nor does it make Christ sinful.
No it's not. It is an explanation of why everyone has sinned. As Paul wrote, Romans 3:10-12 (ESV):Your doctrine of making sinning natural, by being born with it naturally, is just an excuse for sinning against God.
The only verse you have quoted, as far as I can see, is Ezekiel 18:20 (WEB):Already offered Bible correction to this stuff. You ignore them.
Obviously. Jesus did not have a human father. Nobody else has been born by a virgin mother.In any case, I read God prepared a body for His Son. Nothing about this 'perfect' body of yours, which obviously you mean to be different than that of other men.
He had a human mother, so his body was created from human DNA, from one of Mary's eggs. God only supplied the Y chromosone so that he was born male, not female (see Unique blood of Jesus).You preach a christ coming with another kind of 'perfect' body than man. That's not Jesus Christ come in the flesh and blood of man.
I don't understand that sentence.And your christ is even different for another christ, that comes with a different immortal flesh, than that of man.
Well Jesus said, "I am he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore" (Revelation 1:18, KJV). If he was dead, then he had died, so he was not immortal. He is now immortal ("I am alive for evermore"), as true Christians will eventually be (1 John 3:2, Philippians 3:21).Your christ's body is 'perfect' but mortal. Their christ's body is perfect and immortal.
"Go with" what the Bible says! Jesus was mortal; he died giving his soul as a sacrifice; God raised him to life, giving him the immortal divine nature; God has promised the same for Christians, who will become adopted sons of God (John 1:12).If I weren't believing and loving Jesus Christ, who had the same flesh and blood as me, then I'd go with the the perfect immortal body of their christ, not yours.
You have not given any Bible quotes to support your idea that angels are immortal. I quoted 1 Timothy 6:16 to show that they are not (as indeed Jesus was not - see above).We'll just leave out your ignorance about the nature of angels' bodies being made immortal spirit by God.
That says nothing about the mortality of angels.And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire.
Angels can take on a flesh human body in order to communicate with humans. Nowhere in the Bible does it state that they appear with immortal human bodies. You have shared no evidence for that claim.And you're not believing the Bible where angels have and still do come temporarily with immortal flesh at the will of God.
Utter nonsense! What did you quote earlier? Wasn't it (post #585) Ezekiel 18:20 - "The soul that sinneth, it shall die."Mortal souls are the same as no souls.
I gave a dictionary definition of the word immortal. Your statement is not the Bible meaning of immortality. It sounds like you believe Satan's original lie that we won't really die. I believe God.Your own definition for your own beliefs apart from the Bible. Immortality in the Bible is conscious knowledge and self-awareness forever.
As usual you give no supporting Scriptures for men and angels being immortal. Nobody is currently immortal except God (YHVH) and Jesus. Resurrected Christians will be changed (they will no longer be human) and become immortal (a future event). The remaining humans and angels have not, nor will not have, the opportunity of becoming immortal.The immortal existence of angels and men is either in the light with Christ, or in darkness without God's Spirit of life.
That's Jude 1:12-13 (why can't you give the reference and save us time and effort?). Those verses are not talking about the angels that it referred to in verse 6, it is talking about men, going back to verse 4:The angels that sinned, and the men that sin unto the grave, will be immortality in darkness without God forever.
These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.
1 John 3:5 (WEB):Where does the Bible say Jesus the man was perfect?
In the type the sacrificial lamb had to be perfect and without blemish. Leviticus 22:20-21 (ESV):Only God in heaven is perfect, where He cannot even be tempted to sin. All men on earth are tempted to sin, including Jesus. But only Jesus was without sinning, and only those in Christ Jesus are not sinning like Him.
Once again. You're use of 'perfect human being' is meaningless and something of your own making.
You intermix a little Bible into your abundance of personal stuff.
Wrong, as you have already shown - "The soul that sins, it shall die.", Ezekiel 18:20 (MKJV).All flesh is mortal. All souls made in the image of God are immortal as God. Especially God the Word.
Yes.Oh wait. You're saying souls are mortal, and angels are mortal, and now Jesus Christ was mortal.
No, Jesus did not come in a supernatural body, he came in a human body - Hebrews 2:14 (WEB):You're teaching a created christ angel come in a 'perfect' body different from men! Now, it makes sense. It's the pagan pantheon of mythical heroes, where certain men came in supernatural bodies born of the gods, and then were deified with the gods for their heroic god-born deeds!
No it hasn't. God told Adam that if he disobeyed God's command that Adam would die. God never said that if Adam sinned that Adam would live forever in darkness, nor that Adam would become immortal.The opportunity to gain immortality in darkness forever, has been around since God commanded Adam not to disobey Him.
Genesis 2:7 (WEB):You teach men are like all beasts with mortal bodies only, without souls. (Or with 'mortal' souls, which is a pseudo distinction without a difference.) Theologians saying the souls of men are 'mortal', is like natural men saying the mortal bodies of men are souls.
As I wrote, the KJV says in its footnote for Genesis 2:17 that in the Hebrew it states "dying thou shalt die", just as the YLT translates it as "dying thou dost die". This is not hijinks, it is study of God's word. It is not a lying translation.And so once again back to original languages hijinks. A lying translation for a false doctrine.
I have not changed anything. I'm just reporting the facts to you.The lie of course is partly 'Dying'. The exact same word and tense is used each time, which is the definitive, not participle. You change the word in one of them to change the translation to change the commandment warning of God.
I don't know of any translation that translates it like that.Other possible translations are "Thou shalt die, surely be dead." Thou shalt be dead, surely dead."
Why are you calling the KJV and the YLT corrupt translations? The TLV (translated by Jews, who understand the Hebrew language) translates it as:That's what your corrupt trasnlation certainly means. And the reason is obvious.
What has God asking them what they had done got to do with God providing "a way of escape from sinning in the garden"? Adam and Eve gave truthful answers as to what happened. God did not ask if they were sorry for what thay had done; He immediately announced their punishment. Show me where in the Bible you claim it says that "God made a way of escape from sinning in the garden. It's called repentance unto confession with godly sorrow. He gave that way to Adam, and even to Cain, and has been commanding men to repent ever since". And where does it say that God calls men to repent? Where are the Bible references for that? John the Baptist called people to repent, but where in the Old Testament does it say that God calls people to repent? I can't find any such calls from God.If you can't see God seeking an honest confession from both them, before condemning them, then quoting anything won't help. He didn't give the serpent that chance.
I have not corrupted any translations. I have just shown you the evidence. You seem to want to dismiss it rather than properly investigate what the Scriptures really says.You have no interest in what the Bible really says, as proven by your willingness to even corrupt translation to teach something else.
It appears to me that you're not sticking exactly to what the Bible teaches!We both know we are at the point of no agreement. For me, it is only another exercise of disciplined Bible correction with any new stuff you bring in.
So far, it's been interesting and fun. I learned long ago, that some of the best perfecting of knowledge in the Bible, is from needing to accurately correct the errors. By seeing so many ways of how not to teach the Bible, I learn better how to stick exactly to the Bible and teach only that.
That's a little "lighter" then what I was thinking.......That's a bold claim.
Is God subordinate to the Church? (capital C)
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I think God is much more tolerant of diversity in faith than that.Ya see? Today's "churches" have fallen into the same "disfavor" with God as Israel had before the birth of Christ.
Those traditions of men and precepts of men which make void the Word of God!
Do better how?Admittedly however, some denominations do better then others, depending on the location of "a" church in a given financial/social "strata" of a community.
Thankfully, I have never had that experience.How many churches have you gone to dressed in rags, and upon entering, are given the "what in the world are YOU doing here?" Look, or perhaps even been spoken to like "We don't appreciate the likes of your kind in attendance here!"
Was there a question that I missed?......asking for a friend!
It seems as you are under an auspices that God doesn't know what He's doing when He picked you (or us all for that matter) to be born through your parents into whichever (for lack of a better use of terminology here) scenario we found ourselves in, whether male or female, before our coming of age so to speak, WHEN at that time?I think God is much more tolerant of diversity in faith than that.
My experience with God would have been much different if I had been raised in a Catholic home.
I was raised Protestant evangelical. God found me in that situation and worked with it.
Had I been raised Catholic, God would have worked with that.
Makes me wonder how God works when one is raised under another one of the world religions.
And there are testimonies of people leaving Catholicism to be Protestant,
and people leaving Protestantism to be Catholic.
We have this perverted idea that God only works through the "true" church.
Which we define as OUR church. How convenient.
Do better how?Admittedly however, some denominations do better then others, depending on the location of "a" church in a given financial/social "strata" of a community.
Thankfully, I have never had that experience.How many churches have you gone to dressed in rags, and upon entering, are given the "what in the world are YOU doing here?" Look, or perhaps even been spoken to like "We don't appreciate the likes of your kind in attendance here!"
Was there a question that I missed?......asking for a friend!