Bible alone

[theefaith]

Oy vey! Living in the Age of Grace does not mean we should violate the 10 Commandments every chance we get. Where did Paul say we should violate the 10 Commandments every chance we get? What verse did he say if we 'keep the law you have fallen from grace?'

He never said anything like this! Galatians 5:4 talks about attempting to achieve salvation by your own work, justify yourself through law keeping. I am not saying anything remotely like this!

I do not keep the Sabbath because I am under the law and my salvation depends on it. I keep holy the Sabbath Day to honor God and to humble myself. If God, Himself, rested after working 6 days, so should we all. Putting aside religion, I am a big believer in The 7 Habits of Highly Effective People. The 7th Habit, Sharpen the Saw, is a secular equivalent to resting on the Sabbath Day. That is, not only is it a commandment, it is also a prudent guiding principle to live by.

how do you keep the sabbath without being Jewish or a rabbi or a priest?

 

[theefaith]

I started a thread that differentiated:

1. Explicit Biblical teaching
2. Doctrine that is merely 'supported' by the Bible.

So, when you say 'doctrine' that is 'in' the Bible, which of these 2 do you mean? An EOC friend said one can 'support' almost any doctrine by claiming it is 'in' the Bible - if you lack guidance from the Holy Spirit.

Also, what do you mean by 'doctrine?' A leader of the CDL said dogma is something worth dying over, like following Christ. And doctrine are principles that the different denominations have. He says too many confuse dogma with doctrine and that leads to unproductive infighting that undermines our basic mission to bring people to Christ.

doctrine, dogma, divine revelation, catholic and divine faith, Christian truth are all the same

 

[theefaith]

There is no head of the church on earth.

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

 

[theefaith]

Sorry

Matt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

 

[Wrangler]

how do you keep the sabbath without being Jewish or a rabbi or a priest?

The thought never occurred to me that the 10 Commandments did not apply to me. When God says to do something, I usually just do it and don't claim 'not my job, man.'

 

[theefaith]

Paul wasn't. He got many revelations of the faith through Scripture--and so commended men to the Scripture to obtain the same education in the faith 2 Timothy 3:16.

Paul was an apostle

 

[theefaith]

The thought never occurred to me that the 10 Commandments did not apply to me. When God says to do something, I usually just do it and don't claim 'not my job, man.'

So what do you do for worship on Saturday?

 

[GracePeace]

Paul was an apostle

An Apostle who directed us to do the same thing he did to become wise unto salvation through faith in Jesus--read Scripture. "The faith" is taught in Scripture says the Apostle 2 Timothy 3.

 

[Wrangler]

Matt 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

So, in your estimation there is NO WAY 'this rock' Jesus is referring to is Peter's confession in the preceding verse 16 (that Jesus is the Messiah)? The only reference has to be the person of Peter and NOT the greatest reveal of the entire NT - the greatest reveal in the history of mankind - that Jesus is the long awaited Savior of the World?

I confess such an interpretation is baffling.

 

[theefaith]

An Apostle who directed us to do the same thing he did to become wise unto salvation through faith in Jesus--read Scripture. "The faith" is taught in Scripture says the Apostle 2 Timothy 3.

faith And the sacraments you mean?

 

[GracePeace]

faith And the sacraments you mean?

Why are you confused by such a simple commandment? You've been brainwashed, that's why. You can't believe God. You believe someone else. "This persuasion does not come from Him Who calls".

 

[theefaith]

So, in your estimation there is NO WAY 'this rock' Jesus is referring to is Peter's confession in the preceding verse 16 (that Jesus is the Messiah)? The only reference has to be the person of Peter and NOT the greatest reveal of the entire NT - the greatest reveal in the history of mankind - that Jesus is the long awaited Savior of the World?

I confess such an interpretation is baffling.

Christ founded the church on Peter!
And the apostles!
Matt 16:18 eph 2:20 Jn 20:21-23

18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.

19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

You CANNOT give the keys (authority) to a confession but to a person! Peter
Vs 19 unto thee (Peter) thou shalt bind (Peter) thou shalt loose (Peter)

Only the one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors and those members of Christ by faith and baptism United with them, the communion of the saints
Jn 16:10 matt 16:18 18:18 Jn 20:21-23
Jn 10:16

Ephesians 5:32
This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

The office of apostle that has the three fold office, to teach: to govern the church: and to sanctify by the sacraments or sacred oaths (promises) of the father! Acts 2:38-39 with ez 36:25-27 Heb 8:6

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments

Jn 8:12
Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

Jn 9:5
As long as I am in the world, I am the light of the world.

Matt 5:14
Ye (the apostles/ the church) are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.
(There is only one church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors!) matt 16:18 Jn 10:16 eph 2:20

Only Peter and the apostles and their successors have the teaching authority of Christ with the guarantee of the Holy Spirit! Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Jn 8:32 Jn 16:13

Fathers have care of their children, spiritual fathers care for our souls!

Pope, papa, father, yes spiritual father!

Isa 22 father

Christ is the head of the church!
Peter is appointed by Christ as the head of the church on earth!
Supreme pastor and teacher of the faithful!

Matt 10:2
First apostle Peter:

Matt 17:27
Jesus and Peter are one:
Jesus even works a miracle to make this point. 27 Notwithstanding, lest we should offend them, go thou to the sea, and cast an hook, and take up the fish that first cometh up; and when thou hast opened his mouth, thou shalt find a piece of money: that take, and give unto them for me and thee.

Mt 16:18 Peter received the keys of the kingdom: (jurisdictional authority of the universal church) and the power to bind and loose:

Lk 22:32
Peter commanded to confirm his breathren:

Lk 22:32
Jesus prays for Peter:

Jn 21:17
Peter commanded to Feed my sheep:

Matt 10:2
Peter is the prince of the apostles, head of the universal church on earth!

Jn 6:68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.

69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

Jn 20:21-23
Peter and the apostles receive the Holy Spirit and the power to forgive sins:

Acts 1:15 1:17 1:26
Peter declares Judas office of apostle valid and vacant and chooses a successor:

Acts 2:14
Peter preaches the first sermon on Pentecost:

Acts 2:38
Peter requires baptism as the outward sign and initiation into the new covenant!

Acts 4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel,
(Peter guided by the Holy Spirit guides the church)

Acts 5 authority of the apostles verified by them being stricken dead by God verifying Matt 16:18 matt 18:18 whatsoever you bind on earth is bound in heaven and the apostles have the light of the Holy Spirit!


1 Tim 1 Paul is Timothy’s spiritual father.
1 Jn 2:1 little children are adult Christians, John is their spiritual father.

Apostles have Care for our souls
(Acts 20:28 Jn 21:17 Heb 13:17)

 

[theefaith]

An Apostle who directed us to do the same thing he did to become wise unto salvation through faith in Jesus--read Scripture. "The faith" is taught in Scripture says the Apostle 2 Timothy 3.

1 Tim 1 Paul is Timothy’s spiritual father.
1 Jn 2:1 little children are adult Christians, John is their spiritual father.

Apostles have Care for our souls
(Acts 20:28 Jn 21:17 Heb 13:17)

 

[theefaith]

Why are you confused by such a simple commandment? You've been brainwashed, that's why. You can't believe God. You believe someone else. "This persuasion does not come from Him Who calls".

mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 acts 8
Faith and baptism

 

[theefaith]

The promise (sacred oath or sacrament) of the Father acts 2:38-39 with reference to ez 36:25-27

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Jn 3:5 born again by water and the spirit.

Heb 7:21 For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec
(Oath = sacrament)

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. Based on Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:



A promise is a sacred oath or sacrament!
Baptismal regeneration is the promise of the Father for union in the new covenant!

The church and the seven sacraments are necessary for salvation

Better covenant on better promises

2 Timothy 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

Life of supernatural grace merited by Christ in His passion and death!

An oath to sacramental life in the new covenant in union with the mediator and communion with God, and the saints!

Promise of the Father acts 2:23-39
Promise is an oath and an oath is a sacrament! This promise of the sacrament of baptism refers to ez. 36:25-27

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.


1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)

 

[GracePeace]

1 Tim 1 Paul is Timothy’s spiritual father.
1 Jn 2:1 little children are adult Christians, John is their spiritual father.

Apostles have Care for our souls
(Acts 20:28 Jn 21:17 Heb 13:17)

... and the faith is taught in Scripture which is why Paul had so many doctrines to teach us--he was the lawyer or scribe Jesus mentioned converting who brings forth from his treasury things both new and old. Scripture is where the New Testament faith came from.

 

[GracePeace]

mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 acts 8
Faith and baptism

Irrelevant. I'm saying Scripture teaches the holy faith.

 

[theefaith]

... and the faith is taught in Scripture which is why Paul had so many doctrines to teach us--he was the lawyer or scribe Jesus mentioned converting who brings forth from his treasury things both new and old. Scripture is where the New Testament faith came from.

Not from scripture

Jn 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

 

[theefaith]

Irrelevant. I'm saying Scripture teaches the holy faith.

the church is the pillar and ground of truth
1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

acts 2:42 apostles doctrine

matt 28:19 teach
Lk 1:4 instructed

 

[GracePeace]

Not from scripture

Jn 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.

So yeah Paul disagrees and directs you to God's Word to find out what God says about His Son. Absolutely shocking and flabberghasting that that could be where God puts His Words to us--in His Word--yet, there we have it. I guess we just have to receive it as an article of faith since it makes no sense that God's Word would be in His Word. Just by chance, do you know what "faith" is? It's when God says something and you believe it--hence the phrase "faith toward God" Hebrews 6.