The Flesh & The Spirit

[Alethos]

I've thought about this alot. I've researched and thought of what I was going to say. There's so many scriptures and books upon books have written about it from both sides. I even checked out a Muslim forum. It's odd they use the same argument about Jesus being God.

I thought that I would write some sort of thesis with scriptures and studies and provide references and such.

The many who have argued against the point that Jesus is not God, and that Jesus could've sinned, have done a great job. There's not much more I can add to this conversation.

I will leave this conversation with the following as my final statement.

At one time, I thought that Jesus could've sinned. I thought that was the point of His temptation and His prayer to God to stop His death. Someone on the radio of all places explained that if Jesus is God, there was no chance for Him to sin because God can't sin. That was easy for me to accept because I knew Jesus was God. I was surprised that I never made any different connections.

As a human we all know we have several different parts. We know we have a brain that controls the rest of the body and that the body does what the brain says. We also know that the rest of the body communicates with the brain and the brain acts accordingly to keep the whole thing running smooth. It's a mystery to us how exactly this works although we can explain things by way of chemicals and neurons that process them along with the nervous system and the vast aray of capilaries. We know this and accept this. Not one of us asks if one part of our body is truely our body. Lose a finger and you'll quickly understand that your are not complete anymore. You're missing something that you needed and used everyday. You're very well aware that a finger is your body.

As a Human we understand and accept that we have a mind, a body, and a soul. Each seperate, yet each part of one or the other. Scientists often debate over the mind as being a series of chemical and nervous reactions that creat thought or the mind being a seperate entity from the brain that requires no chemicals or nervous system to act. We also as believers accept that we have a soul that is seperate from our body, yet somehow contained within as a very real part of us.

All of these are easily accepted by even those who don't believe God has different manifestations of Himself. That's interesting. God has revealed 3 seperate manifestations of Himself to us. God the Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit.

People that don't believe Jesus is God often site presidence that Jesus prayed to God, and called God His Father. But, those same often times read scriptures that says the "Holy Sprit intercedes for us with groans......." That's accepted and rarely subjected to such scrutiny as the diety of Jesus Christ. We also accept that the Spirit of God can be in millions of people at the same time in millions of different places. No scrutiny there.

At one time I was trying to understand some of the deeper mysteries of God such as this one. I asked God and the reply was simply, "You don't have to understand all of this. Let me worry about it." I then felt a sense of relief! And, I haven't concerned myself to much depth any of these things. God says they are and I take it and run with it. I don't need to understand that God's Spirit communicates with Him, so why wouldn't the fleshly manifestation of God communicate with Him and vice versa? These are mysteries of an all knowing all powerful imortal creator.

We have yet to fully understand the mysteries that are God's written word and come to a whole hearted agreement, what are we really trying to do when we try to explain or understand the deeper charictaristics of God's physical manifestations?

However, it is important on many levels to understand who Jesus was/is. Once accepted that the "HOW'S" are simply a mystery we can move from that point.

The one scripture I'm going to leave, (in which there may be man more) is the one that I believe speaks more powerfully, clearly and with no misunderstandings is

Acts 20:28
Take heed therefore to yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost has made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he has purchased with his own blood.

WhiteKnuckle,

With all due respect how can you provide an answer to such a question as the God head without using key verses such 1 Cor 11:3? And other such verses in the Bible.

Please dont fall on your own understanding, but allow the Bible to lead you to truth...the flesh is always wanting to reason upon its own desires, and often the Spirit is hard to follow...we must crucify those desires to follw the Spirit. Gal 5:24

Key verse example:

The Bible is the inspired Word of God: we go to 2 Tim 3:16 which is the most powerful and plain speaking verse on the subject.

I am sure you would agree.

We must learn how to open up the Word, its like onoins :) it has layers. God has hidden truth within His Word and its our dutie to reveal it.

[sup]Pro 1:7 [/sup]He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous Compare Col 2:3

Go and find what that word "Layeth" means? maybe check Layeth

If you are willing why not rewrite your comments but place Scriptures to support your thoughts.

i.e God manifest's Himself through the son is one such above comment.

Where can we go to prove that Jesus is not God BUT God was "in" Christ reconciling the world to Himself. 2 Cor 5:19

Whiteknuckle, by reasoning out the matter with Scripture your arguments and beliefs will be more point of fact, as the Apostle example clearly revealed.

I hope this makes some sense.

Alethos

 

[WhiteKnuckle]

WhiteKnuckle,

With all due respect how can you provide an answer to such a question as the God head without using key verses such 1 Cor 11:3? And other such verses in the Bible.

Please dont fall on your own understanding, but allow the Bible to lead you to truth...the flesh is always wanting to reason upon its own desires, and often the Spirit is hard to follow...we must crucify those desires to follw the Spirit. Gal 5:24

Key verse example:

The Bible is the inspired Word of God: we go to 2 Tim 3:16 which is the most powerful and plain speaking verse on the subject.

I am sure you would agree.

We must learn how to open up the Word, its like onoins :) it has layers. God has hidden truth within His Word and its our dutie to reveal it.

[sup]Pro 1:7 [/sup]He layeth up sound wisdom for the righteous Compare Col 2:3

Go and find what that word "Layeth" means? maybe check Layeth

If you are willing why not rewrite your comments but place Scriptures to support your thoughts.

i.e God manifest's Himself through the son is one such above comment.

Where can we go to prove that Jesus is not God BUT God was "in" Christ reconciling the world to Himself. 2 Cor 5:19

Whiteknuckle, by reasoning out the matter with Scripture your arguments and beliefs will be more point of fact, as the Apostle example clearly revealed.

I hope this makes some sense.

Alethos

It's not my own understanding. That's the point I was making. I feel the verse provided is sufficient and no more discussion is needed from my side. After prayer those were the words I was given. I had planned to use more as you ask, but apparently that's not supposed to happen.

 

[Alethos]

At one time I was trying to understand some of the deeper mysteries of God such as this one. I asked God and the reply was simply, "You don't have to understand all of this. Let me worry about it." I then felt a sense of relief! And, I haven't concerned myself to much depth any of these things. God says they are and I take it and run with it. I don't need to understand that God's Spirit communicates with Him, so why wouldn't the fleshly manifestation of God communicate with Him and vice versa? These are mysteries of an all knowing all powerful imortal creator.

I place this up initially for others to read and weigh in the balances.

I have come across such reasoning’s before and find them totally in opposition to apostolic teaching, but rather than contend these here and now, I would value others opinions/insight into this statement...which is claimed to be "of God".

Alethos

 

[justaname]

Truth I wonder if you have lost focus. I have given you Genesis Chapter 1 and John Chapter 1. Do you not see the complete relationship? God breathed His Word and said let us create in our image.
Now you need to understand the relationship between Jesus and us.

<div><br></div><div>From your point of view you say God can create a plan to fail. &nbsp;In my understanding of the Almighty he can not. &nbsp;Are we not all potshards speaking of the Maker? &nbsp;Look at it this way. &nbsp;Allow Christ to place His feet in your head, so your head is Christ, as Jesus let God <i>his</i> head. &nbsp;We do not glorify the flesh but the Spirit. &nbsp;One flesh is glorified above all to be our Leader in the flesh, whose head is God.</div>

 

[justaname]

Truth I wonder if you have lost focus. I have given you Genesis Chapter 1 and John Chapter 1. Do you not see the complete relationship? God breathed His Word and said let us create in our image. Now you need to understand the relationship between Jesus and us.

From your point of view you say God can create a plan to fail. In my understanding of the Almighty he can not. Are we not all potshards speaking of the Maker? Look at it this way. Allow Christ to place His feet in your head, so your head is Christ, as Jesus let God his head. We do not glorify the flesh but the Spirit. One flesh is glorified above all to be our Leader in the flesh, whose head is God.

Hope this helps.

 

[Robbie]

My word is as much me as any part of my body even though it leaves me and enters into relationship with those I'm in relationship with... and my word is in fact how I have relationship with others... it's no wonder it's the same with God since we're made in His image... ever trip out on how powerful our voice/word is at communicating compared to our flesh? I mean someone can be a million miles away and if you can talk to them on the phone you're in relationship with them way more so than if their body was in front of your face and they were asleep...

Without hearing someone's word you have no relationship which is why Christ coming to earth reestablished our relationship with the Father... because He is God's Word manifested in the flesh... that's why when we're taught by Him we're taught by God...

 

[epostle1]

"...Another element which led to the adulteration of the Truth was the teaching of the Judaizers (Acts 15:1; Gal 5:1-3; Rev 2:9). Catholicism today is very much in the same spirit as Judaism (law & tradition based), which was expressly warned against by Paul (Gal 1:6-9; 1 Ti 1:4-7)..."

ah..hem.....wrong. Catholicism teaches the law of Christ, and Paul commands us to obey Tradition, (that predate the canon of the Bible) which you don't understand. Catholicism is NOT in the same spirit of Judaism, she is the FULFILLMENT of Judaism, something you cannot claim for yourself. hmm... I just noticed your account has been disabled....little point in talking to a wall...