Homosexuality

[Foreigner]

"I do not believe that ALL people who witness to homosexuals have the traits and characteristics you listed." - Aspen

-- Yet that is the only way you have described people who witness to homosexuals.
I say that not expecting you to agree, but for others to check for themselves and see I am correct.




"Of course we are called to speak with homosexuals. We are not called to convict them of personal sin." - Aspen

-- Of course WE don't convict them of personal sin. The Holy Spirit does....through the words we share via His instruction and direction.

But...
How can you say "of course we are called to speak to homosexuals"..... when you yourself have said that you don't do that.

You said you have four friends who are homosexuals but that - by your own words - you have never talked to them about Jesus or His love for them even once.

So, by your own admission, you are not doing what you yourself say we are called to do.





"You really believe the words are convicting the heart? That is crazy talk! Only the HS convicts the heart." - Aspen

-- LOL Of COURSE only the Holy Spirit convicts the heart.
And he uses Christians to provide His words with which to bring about that conviction.
"Faith cometh by hearing and hearing by the Word of God"

How is the Holy Spirit going to convict them and draw them to God if they have never heard God's Word?
God's great commission to Christians was because the lost need to hear God's Word so the Holy Spirit can draw them to Christ.
The Holy Spirit instructs Christians as to what should be shared with the lost that triggers the conviction in their heart.

Christianity 101.




"I model Christ's love during every interaction. Can you really imagine me being 'silent'? Com'mon foreigner! You know me better than that - I cannot shut up about God for 5 mins" - Aspen

-- Yet you say you have four gay friends with whom you have never talked about God or your faith. (You said one asked if you were a Christian and you said yes, but by your own admission that was the entire extent of the conversation.)

So the question is a simple one: Did you "misspeak" when you said that, or are "misspeaking" now?




"just because I am not handing out spiritual tracks to all my friends and bringing them to alter call services does not mean that I am "silent"." - Aspen

-- I laughed when I read this because I too have never handed out tracks. And I have never taken any one to a church service who hadn't already given their life to Christ or first hadn't asked me to take them.

So either this response of yours is pure hyperbole or you truly think that is the only way sinners interact with the lost.






.

 

[Duckybill]

Honestly Aspen, some of us are on to your anti-Bible and changing the subject tactics to avoid Biblical doctrine. That's pretty much what you are offering.

 

[FHII]

Hey aspen... You got 4 gay friends? Do you think they are blessed? I do. They know you! That makes them blessed!


I know Christ. That makes me blessed. And yes, anyone who knows me is blessed. Because I know Christ.

 

[Duckybill]

Hey aspen... You got 4 gay friends?

"A friend of the world is the enemy of God"

 

[aspen]

Hey aspen... You got 4 gay friends? Do you think they are blessed? I do. They know you! That makes them blessed!


I know Christ. That makes me blessed. And yes, anyone who knows me is blessed. Because I know Christ.

Thanks FHII!!

Yes, I have 4 close friends who are gay.....one is interested in discussing God with me - pretty exciting!

I like your post!

blessings

 

[Duckybill]

Thanks FHII!!

Yes, I have 4 close friends who are gay.....one is interested in discussing God with me - pretty exciting!

I like your post!

blessings

No wonder your religion is so worldly and anti-Bible.

James 4:4 ESV

You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.

 

[aspen]

Were you afraid I missed your first post warning me that I am being a friend of the world, Ducky? Don't worry I saw it. I think you might want to save your warnings for Jesus.....I am simply following His example of 'eating with sinners'. I figured you understood the difference between being friends with sinners and being Worldly.....

 

[Duckybill]

Were you afraid I missed your first post warning me that I am being a friend of the world, Ducky? Don't worry I saw it. I think you might want to save your warnings for Jesus.....I am simply following His example of 'eating with sinners'. I figured you understood the difference between being friends with sinners and being Worldly.....

Jesus was constantly preaching to those who were with Him. He wasn't their friends.

II Cor 6

14 Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership has righteousness with lawlessness? Or what fellowship has light with darkness? 15 What accord has Christ with Belial? Or what portion does a believer share with an unbeliever? 16 What agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; as God said, "I will make my dwelling among them and walk among them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. 17 Therefore go out from their midst, and be separate from them, says the Lord, and touch no unclean thing; then I will welcome you,

James 4

4 Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.

No wonder you defend homosexuals at every opportunity. You don't want to lose your friends.

 

[Foreigner]

"Of course we are called to speak with homosexuals. We are not called to convict them of personal sin." - Aspen

-- Of course WE don't convict them of personal sin. The Holy Spirit does....through the words we share via His instruction and direction.

But...
How can you say "of course we are called to speak to homosexuals"..... when you yourself have said that you don't do that.

You said you have four friends who are homosexuals but that - by your own words - you have never talked to them about Jesus or His love for them even once.

So, by your own admission, you are not doing what you yourself say we are called to do.

-- You yourself have said that there is no need for Christians to talk to homosexuals because homosexuals know, from media, etc. where God stands on them.
Still waiting for you to clarifiy which of your statements is true and which is false.

"I model Christ's love during every interaction. Can you really imagine me being 'silent'? Com'mon foreigner! You know me better than that - I cannot shut up about God for 5 mins" - Aspen

-- Yet you say you have four gay friends with whom you have never talked about God or your faith. (You said one asked if you were a Christian and you said yes, but by your own admission that was the entire extent of the conversation.)

So the question is a simple one: Did you "misspeak" when you said that, or are "misspeaking" now?

-- And now you suddenly "one is interested in discussing god" with you.
As the Church Lady says, "How conveeeeeeeeeeeeeenient."

You are going to have a pretty tough time getting person to understand that you believe that anyone who opposes gay marraige is - as per you - "violating the civil rights of homosexuals".......but that homosexuality is a sin and they need to repent in order to know Jesus and be saved.

Hopefully the Holy Spirit will be able to speak out of both sides of your mouth.

 

[[email protected]]

The issue of gay pride, gay marriage, gay behavior or anything gay is an exercise in academic discussion. The church has given up on any organized opposition to the gay political agenda. In fact, the church has even given up on calling sin a sin; gay or otherwise.

GOD HATES SINNERS.

Period. Is sin cast into hell or are SINNERS cast into hell? If God has this attitude about SIN, why does the church ignore it and call it something it is not?

For years the church has been attacked and ridiculed by the gay community for "holding them back". In point of fact, nothing of the sort has happened. Has ANYONE read or seen ANY organized Christian opposition to gay behavior at all? The truth is that gay leaders MUST use the church as a scapegoat in order to focus support for their agenda. If there were no Christian scapegoat then who would they blame?

Gays blame Christians in the same way that protestants have blamed Catholics, Catholics blamed protestants, Hitler blamed the Jews, and Muslims blame everybody else. Gay Christian bashing is a political tool to reinforce support for an otherwise morally and naturally abhorrent and bankrupt political agenda.

But don't fret, brothers and sisters. Islam is on the ascendancy world wide and they have already made it THEIR AGENDA to kill all homosexuals outright.
Enjoy your sick games, gay folks. Your day will not last much longer.

Sin is sin and sinners have only two choices; repent or die.

 

[aspen]

-- You yourself have said that there is no need for Christians to talk to homosexuals because homosexuals know, from media, etc. where God stands on them.
Still waiting for you to clarifiy which of your statements is true and which is false.






-- And now you suddenly "one is interested in discussing god" with you.
As the Church Lady says, "How conveeeeeeeeeeeeeenient."

You are going to have a pretty tough time getting person to understand that you believe that anyone who opposes gay marraige is - as per you - "violating the civil rights of homosexuals".......but that homosexuality is a sin and they need to repent in order to know Jesus and be saved.

Hopefully the Holy Spirit will be able to speak out of both sides of your mouth.

Not sure how you can claim that I am trying to trap you with a 'gotcha' post........are you projecting?

 

[Foreigner]

You still haven't clarified for me which of the contradictory statements you made was true and which was your lie.

I encourage you to try the truth. You might find it refreshing.

 

[aspen]

You still haven't clarified for me which of the contradictory statements you made was true and which was your lie.

I encourage you to try the truth. You might find it refreshing.

Since when have been required to participate in your false dichotomies? The fact is, you fail to recognize that I witness all the time without words - until you choose to recognize this fact, you will continue to find contradictions where there are none.

[font="arial][size="2"]"Preach the Gospel always—use words if necessary" - St. Francis[/size][/font]
[font="arial] [/font]
[font="arial][size="2"]BTW, I am not sure why you are devoting so much time trying to prove that I am a hypocrite - I am a sinner, and have no problem admitting it.[/size][/font]

 

[Foreigner]

"BTW, I am not sure why you are devoting so much time trying to prove that I am a hypocrite - I am a sinner, and have no problem admitting it." - Aspen

-- I appreciate you coming clean on your dishonesty.
Hopefully,that will make you more tolerant of others.

 

[aspen]

"BTW, I am not sure why you are devoting so much time trying to prove that I am a hypocrite - I am a sinner, and have no problem admitting it." - Aspen

-- I appreciate you coming clean on your dishonesty.
Hopefully,that will make you more tolerant of others.

Help me understand - who am I being intolerant of?

 

[Foreigner]

Do you really need an example?

How about, "Those that vote in opposition of gay marraige are violating the civil rights of homosexuals."

If you were to look over a number of our interactions with an honest eye, you yourself would have the examples you seek.

 

[aspen]

Do you really need an example?

How about, "Those that vote in opposition of gay marraige are violating the civil rights of homosexuals."

If you were to look over a number of our interactions with an honest eye, you yourself would have the examples you seek.

I think we are all blinded to our sins at times - insight comes in waves. Honesty is really not the issue - it is blindness - that is why humility is really important because we continue in our negative behaviors without insight all the time. I may have mentioned this before, I was taped counseling people throughout my graduate program - it provided a lot of insight into behaviors I was blind to - the Johari Window model explains this.

I believe that gay people should be allowed to marry - I believe it is an issue of civil rights - voting against it is a violation of homosexual rights. I am sharing my opinion about the vote, not the people who are voting; however, to be clear, I strongly disagree with the people who vote against gay marriage because I think they are asserting their ideals over real world situations.

 

[Foreigner]

I think we are all blinded to our sins at times - insight comes in waves. Honesty is really not the issue - it is blindness - that is why humility is really important because we continue in our negative behaviors without insight all the time.

-- I would agree with all you have said.

I believe that gay people should be allowed to marry - I believe it is an issue of civil rights - voting against it is a violation of homosexual rights. I am sharing my opinion about the vote, not the people who are voting; however, to be clear, I strongly disagree with the people who vote against gay marriage because I think they are asserting their ideals over real world situations.

-- I had one issue and one bout of confusion about your statement on gay marraige and civil rights.
The way you presented it was robust with indignation and anger, appearing to stand in judgement of those who would not agree with you on this topic.

The confusion I had - and still have - is, how voting against gay marraige based on your moral beliefs or what is right and wrong is "asserting ideals over real world situations," but advocating for gay marraige based on your personal beliefs of what is right and wrong.....isn't?

 

[aspen]

-- I had one issue and one bout of confusion about your statement on gay marraige and civil rights.
The way you presented it was robust with indignation and anger, appearing to stand in judgement of those who would not agree with you on this topic.

The confusion I had - and still have - is, how voting against gay marraige based on your moral beliefs or what is right and wrong is "asserting ideals over real world situations," but advocating for gay marraige based on your personal beliefs of what is right and wrong.....isn't?

I cannot remember the conversation - all I can say is that if there was emotion behind the words it was based on the conversation, not the issue. I think that voting against gay marriage, based on a principle hurts gay people and doesn't affect Christians at all. Voting for gay marriage affects gay people for the better and does not affect Christians at all.

I think you might see the issue differently if the law was against a Christian principle that affected Christian people.

I think the difference is that my opinion usually falls on the side of inclusion. I think that makes Christians mad because they often fall on the side of doctrine, no matter what and failure to do so is seen as hostile. I think this might be one of the reasons I am seen as arrogant - I am not perceived as a team player.

I am not sure if I answered your question or not.

 

[marksman]

Can I correct something that Highlight said and a lot of people believe.

No one is born homosexual...or heterosexual. We are born asexual. Children have no notion of heterosexuality or homosexuality or sexuality full stop. They just are. What is important to them is love, food, warmth, sleep and cuddles.

The development of our sexuality is determined by our environment which includes our family situation. If that were not the case, the people who benefit the most from abortion Planned Parenthood, would not need to push their anti-family, anti-morality agenda to influence teenagers into promiscuous sex.

If a child/teenager has a destructive relationship with a parent, it is obviously going to colour their approach to relationships and it is going to affect negatively their emotional development. It is this sort of thing that produces a SSA as the child is trying to make sense of who he is and what is normal.

The development of a SSA is something that most people do not have control over for the reasons I have stated. Their response to that attraction is a choice as no one is forced to have sex with anyone except in the case of rape.

At the same time, the scriptures make it clear that any sex outside of God ordained marriage is sin. What every homosexual needs is not to know that is how he was born so get used to it. He needs to know that he is no different to anyone else and needs salvation from sin through repentance and letting God change his responses to sin so that he no longer is a slave to sin.

Love is always wedded to truth. It is not love to not tell someone the truth that their way of life is totally destructive and will lead to degredation and despair. I told a homosexual just this and he is forever grateful. Now 20 years later he is married, has four kids and is in leadership of a church.