Saying you are without sin verses in 1 John

[1stCenturyLady]

Before you start advising people I would suggest you learn to read the bible as one cohesive whole, and ask for discernment to understand the letter you selectively quote.

These posts are not 1000 pages long. We must teach precept by precept. Otherwise, the ignorant can't learn if they are overwhelmed.

 

[savedbygrace1]

As though you understand it? Obviously your chronic negative attitude clearly shows that you've wasted your time reading the Bible.

Try not to be so hurt at what I have stated regarding the majority on these kind of websites. Your anger is obvious from your posts to me

 

[savedbygrace1]

These posts are not 1000 pages long. We must teach precept by precept. Otherwise, the ignorant can't learn if they are overwhelmed.

You cant help people much if all you can do is selectively quote the letter. The bible cannot be understood that way. You have ended up with contradictions all over the place

 

[1stCenturyLady]

Try not to be so hurt at what I have stated regarding the majority on these kind of websites. Your anger is obvious from your posts to me

Then don't provoke to anger.

 

[Jim B]

Here is the definition of an internet troll: "In Internet slang, a troll is a person who posts inflammatory, insincere, digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses, or manipulating others' perception."

This clearly applies to savedbygrace1.

 

[savedbygrace1]

Then don't provoke to anger.

He wanted to chat to me, not the other way around.

 

[Jim B]

Then don't provoke to anger.

Great post! See my previous post #533.

 

[savedbygrace1]

Here is the definition of an internet troll: "In Internet slang, a troll is a person who posts inflammatory, insincere, digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, with the intent of provoking readers into displaying emotional responses, or manipulating others' perception."

This clearly applies to savedbygrace1.

Well if you are correct, and not bearing false witness ask the mods to ban me

 

[1stCenturyLady]

You cant help people much if all you can do is selectively quote the letter. The bible cannot be understood that way. You have ended up with contradictions all over the place

If you see contradictions, then you have some errors in definitions. That is why I asked you before do define grace. What you wrote was correct, but a result, not a definition. So if you committed murder, would God see it as murder, or not see it at all if you had faith in Christ?

 

[savedbygrace1]

If you see contradictions, then you have some errors in definitions. That is why I asked you before do define grace. What you wrote was correct, but a result, not a definition. So if you committed murder, would God see it as murder, or not see it at all if you had faith in Christ?

I've already responded about murder, scroll back. I see your contradictions all over the place. Quoting the selected letter is not enough to understand the cohesive whole. And quoting the letter and inferring you perfectly without deviation follow it is not being honest, But, this is the internet after all

 

[1stCenturyLady]

He wanted to chat to me, not the other way around.

I was just making a statement when you said he was being angry towards your posts. You should know that you can be a mud-slinger. I try not to "react" in anger. That is called self-control. It is a fruit of the Spirit.

 

[1stCenturyLady]

I've already responded about murder, scroll back. I see your contradictions all over the place. Quoting the selected letter is not enough to understand the cohesive whole. And quoting the letter and inferring you perfectly without deviation follow it is not being honest, But, this is the internet after all

You have shown me none. I think you attempted to once, but it was all in your mind, there was no contradiction.

Thank you for a very entertaining day. But I still haven't had my morning coffee. That's what I get for going straight for the computer instead of the kitchen. LOL

 

[savedbygrace1]

I was just making a statement when you said he was being angry towards your posts. You should know that you can be a mud-slinger. I try not to "react" in anger. That is called self-control. It is a fruit of the Spirit.

My dear, there is no fruit of the Spirit being shown if someone quotes the letter and likes to infer they perfectly at all times follow it in relation to not committing sin. We all fail, you can then accuse me of excusing sin if you like, but I prefer to be honest

 

[savedbygrace1]

You have shown me none. I think you attempted to once, but it was all in your mind, there was no contradiction.

1John3:5-9 & Paul believing the coirinthians were the church of God. And, in Paul's first letter to them he believed they had the Holy Spirit. Your rigid quoting of the letter brings you into contradiction with other scripture

 

[1stCenturyLady]

My dear, there is no fruit of the Spirit being shown if someone quotes the letter and likes to infer they perfectly at all times follow it in relation to not committing sin. We all fail, you can then accuse me of excusing sin if you like, but I prefer to be honest

I prefer to believe that you learned from your mistake and are smart enough not to repeat it. We are all babies at first, even when I was 30 when I received the Holy Spirit. But even babies are given the power of grace to live up to the light they have, Phil 3:16. That doesn't mean they have all they will ever get.

Talk to you later, and welcome to the forums.

 

[savedbygrace1]

I prefer to believe that you learned from your mistake and are smart enough not to repeat it. We are all babies at first, even when I was 30 when I received the Holy Spirit. But even babies are given the power of grace to live up to the light they have, Phil 3:16.

Talk to you later, and welcome to the forums.

The power of sin is the law 1Cor15:56
The power in grace is knowing you have no righteousness of obeying the law. The Holy Spirit can only grow in your life, and help you fully as you accept the truth

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Then Jesus lied:
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. John 14:16&17

You should be very careful before you make such statements

I know that the Spirit is given to those who obey Him.

Acts of the Apostles 5:32
“And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.”

 

[savedbygrace1]

I prefer to believe that you learned from your mistake and are smart enough not to repeat it. We are all babies at first, even when I was 30 when I received the Holy Spirit. But even babies are given the power of grace to live up to the light they have, Phil 3:16. That doesn't mean they have all they will ever get.

Talk to you later, and welcome to the forums.

Thank you for your welcome. I would suggest our discussion has run its course. I hope you find others to chat to

 

[Bob Estey]

Many misinterpret the first chapter of 1 John completely, so here is a way to understand John more clearly, to undo this very common mistake. Read chapter two first, and notice the difference between talking the talk (SAY), and walking the walk. Open your minds.

1 John 2:

3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who SAYS, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who SAYS he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.

9 He who SAYS he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. 10 He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. 11 But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes.

Now read chapter 1 and see if you can comprehend what is actually being said.

1 John 1:

5 God is light and in Him is no darkness at all.

6 If we SAY that we have fellowship with Him, and walk in darkness, we lie and do not practice the truth. 7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

8 If we SAY that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. 9 If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

10 If we SAY that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.

Once understanding enlightens your mind, then chapter 3 is not so impossible. But you may also realize the importance of praying for the baptism of the Holy Spirit which causes the old man of sin to be crucified. Romans 8:6-7. Many Christians today have never been born again. Don't be one of them. I was a slave to sin for the first 30 years of going to church!!! But once I was baptized in the Spirit, my life took on supernatural spiritual qualities unlike any plain ole' human possesses. A human being doesn't have the powerful gifts of the Holy Spirit. They only think with a natural mind. Read what happens when the Spirit takes over. 1 Corinthians 2:9-16

9 But as it is written:

“Eye has not seen, nor ear heard,
Nor have entered into the heart of man
The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.”

10 But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. 11 For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God.

13 These things we also speak, not in words which man’s wisdom teaches but which the Holy Spirit teaches, comparing spiritual things with spiritual. 14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is rightly judged by no one. 16 For “who has known the mind of the Lord that he may instruct Him?” But we have the mind of Christ.

Do you want the same power of God in your life?

Luke 11:9-13
9 “So I say to you, ask, and it will be given to you; seek, and you will find; knock, and it will be opened to you. 10 For everyone who asks receives, and he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks it will be opened. 11 If a son asks for bread from any father among you, will he give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will he give him a serpent instead of a fish? 12 Or if he asks for an egg, will he offer him a scorpion? 13 If you then, being evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask Him!”

Acts 1:8
8 But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be witnesses to Me in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the end of the earth.”

Does your life shine with the light of God within you, or are you more like the world?

There are many truths that are lost in many denominations plagued with misinterpretations of scripture and false doctrine. That goes for the Bible translators that try to add practice to scriptures, which changes the meaning to self willpower, not the power of God. If you are alive, there is still time to make your election sure.

2 Peter 1:2-11
2 Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, 3 as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, 4 by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

5 But also for this very reason, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue, to virtue knowledge, 6 to knowledge self-control, to self-control perseverance, to perseverance godliness, 7 to godliness brotherly kindness, and to brotherly kindness love. 8 For if these things are yours and abound, you will be neither barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ. 9 For he who lacks these things is shortsighted, even to blindness, and has forgotten that he was cleansed from his old sins.

10 Therefore, brethren, be even more diligent to make your call and election sure, for if you do these things you will never stumble; 11 for so an entrance will be supplied to you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.

We've all sinned, but we've been instructed to stop.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The power of sin is the law 1Cor15:56
The power in grace is knowing you have no righteousness of obeying the law. The Holy Spirit can only grow in your life, and help you fully as you accept the truth

1 John 3:7 says, “Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.”

So does that mean John and Paul disagreed? No.

Paul was referring to the Old Law or the 613 Laws of Moses given to Israel. Paul was attacking the heresy of which I call, “Circumcision Salvationism” that was trying to invade the church. For if a person thought they had to first be circumcised in order to be saved, they would be making a Law or work (circumcision) the entrance gate and foundation of their salvation. It would be disregarding salvation by God’s grace when we first come to the Lord. It would be disregarding the foundation of grace, as well (if one were to believe in Circumcision for salvation). It would be Law Alone Salvationism (Without God’s grace).

In Acts 15, we learn that certain Jews were trying to deceive Gentile Christians into thinking they had to be circumcised to be saved and to keep the Law of Moses (the 613). The council said they gave the Gentile Christians no such commandment (See: Acts of the Apostles 15:1, Acts of the Apostles 15:5, Acts of the Apostles 15:24).

We read in Galatians 5:2, whereby Paul says if you seek to be circumcised, Christ will profit you nothing. Then in Galatians 5:4, Paul says whosoever of you are justified by the Law has fallen from grace. Obviously Paul is not referring to all forms of Law here, but the Old Law. For circumcision was a command first given to Abraham and then later to Moses, and not the church. For Paul says we are to serve in newness of spirit and not in the oldness of the letter (Romans 7:6). Paul says he is not without the Laws of God because he is under the Law(s) of Christ (See: 1 Corinthians 9:21).

Anyways, Paul is battling against those who were trying to disregard grace in exchange for going back to circumcision and the 613 Laws of Moses.
So in 1 Corinthians 15:56, when Paul says the power of sin is the Law, he is attacking the idea of those believers who were being deceived by “Circumcision Salvationism” and going back to the Old Law instead of focusing on first being saved by God’s grace and making that your foundation. Paul is not referring to all forms of Law like the laws of Christ.

In fact, Paul gives his account of his past life experience as a Pharisee who was under the Law with no grace from Jesus Christ in Romans 7:14-24. He struggled to keep the Old Law because he did not have Jesus Christ in his life yet.

But Romans 8:2 says, “For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.”

So keeping one law makes him free from keeping another law.
The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus (A New Covenant Law) has made him free from the Law of Sin and Death (The Old Covenant Law).
For the Old Law was called the law of sin and death because you could be stoned (killed) for breaking certain aspects of it.

Hebrews 7:12 says the Law has changed.

So Paul is not advocating lawlessness or disobedience because he says,

“That the righteousness of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.” (Romans 8:4).

What is the righteousness of the Law [i.e. the righteous aspect or part of the Law]?

It’s loving your neighbor.

For Romans 13:8-10 says,
“Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.”

For he that loves his neighbor fulfills the Law (i.e. the Old Law).
But this does not undo our new obligations or commands given to us in the New Covenant (after we are saved by God’s grace).

Jesus says,
“A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.” (John 13:34).

So we are to love the brethren in the same way Jesus loved the brethren. So we need to figure out what ways Jesus loved the brethren and do the same thing. This is a new commandment that we are to follow that is not a part of the Old law and the Jews who followed it who did not believe in being saved by God’s grace through faith in Jesus Christ.

In other words, you have to look at the whole counsel of God’s Word, and keep these things in perspective when reading Paul. If not, you are going to see a license to sin on some level (Which of course is wrong because God cannot agree with anyone justifying sin because He is holy, and good).

Grace is no more a license to sin than the existence of the tooth fairy.
For shall we continue in sin so that grace may abound? God forbid (Romans 6:1-2).