Acts 2:38 has been abandoned by Christianity

[Bible Highlighter]

It is a phenomenon that cannot be explained.

Folks that claim to be Christians refuse the original new birth via Acts 2:38.

I am amazed at the power of the enemy over them, doing everything they can to dismiss this command by Peter.

It does not matter if one is trinity or unitarian, as they run from the first command by Peter to sinners on how to be saved....


37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


....as Christians say..."sorry Peter, I'll pass....".

In Acts of the Apostles 2:38: I believe Peter was speaking the correct words by the Spirit, but his understanding was not correct on what the word “baptize” meant for the New Covenant. Thus, Peter baptized with water (fulfilling OT pictures and symbols of the inward reality), but the Lord truly desired him to be more perfect on this matter and to simply baptize only with the Spirit (Which is not his own work alone, but the work of God). For at Pentecost: The 3,000 were indeed to be baptized but the real baptism was ultimately to be by the Spirit and not by water (Which was more fully realized by the apostle Paul). We have to understand that the disciples acted in obedience to the Lord's words in ways that were not always in perfect understanding. For example: Jesus told his disciples to buy a sword. While the Lord allowed their misunderstanding to fulfill prophecy, the real meaning of what our Lord meant was the spiritual sword (the Word of God, Scripture) because Jesus rebuked Peter for chopping off Malchus's ear. Jesus said that he that lives by the sword shall die by the sword. So Peter’s understanding was not perfect. But his words at Pentecost are 100% true.

Acts of the Apostles 2:38
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”

Repent means to seek forgiveness with the Lord by way of prayer to Him over your sins (To see the biblical proof that “repent” means to seek forgiveness with the Lord: See my write up here and here).

In fact, in Mark 1:4-5, it says John preached the "baptism of repentance" for the remission of sins (verse 4), and it then defines this "baptism of repentance" by saying they confessed their sins when they were baptized (verse 5).

Romans 6:4
“…we are buried with him by baptism into death…”

Romans 6:5
“…if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death,…”

We are buried with Christ in baptism - Romans 6:4.
But… this baptism is in the LIKENESS of his death (Meaning, it is a symbolic picture).

Jesus’ death washed away our sins literally with His death.
This applies to our life when we come to the Lord by faith or belief in Jesus as the Savior or believing the gospel message and or in seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ. It’s God’s grace and not works (Ephesians 2:8-9). Note: This does not mean there is not a secondary aspect of salvation that follows in living holy unto the Lord by the Spirit (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13).

But believers are Initially Saved by God’s grace without works (Ephesians 2:8-9) (Romans 4:3-5) (Titus 3:5).

Water baptism was a symbolic of Christ’s death and Christ’s death washed away sin. When a person seeks forgiveness of their sins with Jesus (Which is repentance), this is the sacrifice of Christ being applied to their life. They are being forgiven of their sin by trusting in what Christ did for us with His death, burial, and resurrection. So repentance (seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus) is the literal remittance of sin, and the baptism in water part in Acts 2:38 is the symbolic picture of what repentance by faith, and believing in the redemption of Christ accomplished. The act of baptism does not save because Peter basically says that baptism does now save us not for the filth of the flesh (sin), but as an answer of having an already cleansed conscience before God. They had a cleansed conscience by their confessing their sins to the Lord Jesus and trusting in His death, burial, and resurrection for salvation.

Why would I believe this way?
Well, if Acts of the Apostles 2:38 was the only verse in the Bible, then I probably would conclude as you do.
But there are other verses that flat out contradict Acts of the Apostles 2:38.
But we know God’s Word does not contradict itself and so we have to compare Scripture with Scripture to properly harmonize it.

I will attempt to explain my case in my next post to you why I believe Spirit baptism (Which is what automatically happens when a person accepts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior) had eventually replaced water baptism with the teaching by the apostle Paul.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

@Truther

Ephesians 4:5 says:
“One Lord, one faith, one baptism,”

I believe the one baptism mentioned above here in Ephesians 4:5 is Spirit baptism and not water baptism (Which refutes the idea that we must be water baptized to be initially saved).

While there are other verses, I believe the following verses are the strongest case for Spirit baptism being the one and only baptism mentioned in Ephesians 4:5.

#1. Paul says he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:17).
#2. Jesus says John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost (Acts of the Apostles 1:5).
#3. Cornelius and his household receive the Holy Spirit before being water baptized (Acts of the Apostles 10:34-45).
#4. Apollos only knew of John's baptism and he needed to be shown the way of God more perfectly (Acts of the Apostles 18:24-26).
#5. Paul had to Spirit baptize certain disciples at Ephesus who only knew of John's water baptism (Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7).​

If we approach these verses like a detective investigating a crime scene, we may be able to see something we may not have seen before.

Now, to be fair, on the other hand, I would say that there are several places in Scripture that may give a Bible reader pause on accepting that the one baptism in Ephesians 4:5 is Spirit baptism. In my opinion, it would be the following verses:

#1. Peter telling others to be baptized at Pentecost (Acts of the Apostles 2:38, Acts of the Apostles 2:41).
#2. Peter commands Cornelius and his household to be water baptized after they received the Holy Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 10:47-48).
#3. Saul (i.e. the apostle Paul) is baptized by Ananias (Acts of the Apostles 9:17-18).
#4. Philip baptizes the Ethiopian eunuch (Acts of the Apostles 8:35-38).​

Okay, so by looking at these verses (at first glance), it seems like an ironclad case against Spirit baptism being the one and only baptism in Ephesians 4:5. But if indeed the one and only baptism is Spirit baptism and Paul said he came to preach the gospel and not to baptize, etc., we have to reconcile both sets of verses. I believe one possibility here is that the Jews were steeped in their traditions in keeping the Old ways. Remember when Jesus said the following?

“He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.” (Matthew 19:8).

So God did not really want the Israelites to divorce, but they were permitted to divorce because of the hardness of their hearts. Could it be the same reason why the Jewish disciples of Christ were not able to see that water baptism had ended? Were their hearts stuck in the ways of the Old Law? Anyone can read Acts of the Apostles 19 and draw the conclusion that the Jewish Messianic elders were still stuck in wanting to follow the Law of Moses. Remember when Paul had to correct Peter in trying to compell the Gentiles to live as the Jews do (See: Galatians 2:11-14). So why would God allow for His Jewish apostles to misunderstand at a key important point in the origin of the church like Pentecost?
Well, in Luke 22:36-37, and Matthew 26:51-54, we learn that Jesus told His disciples to buy a sword, and they brought forth two swords, and yet Jesus rebuked Peter for using his sword and told him that this all happened that the Scriptures might be fulfilled. So it was by their misunderstanding that Scripture was fulfilled. We have to understand that salvation first went out to the Jews before it went out to the Gentiles. So it makes sense that God wanted to keep the pictures or types that are from the Old ways at the beginning of the church in love and honor of the Jew. For Jesus said salvation was of the Jews (John 4:22), and the way of the Jews was that they did things that were mere shadows or pictures that pointed to Jesus Christ or that which is spiritual. Seeing that Pentecost was a fulfillment of OT Scripture (See: Acts of the Apostles 2:14-21), it makes sense that some of the Old ways like water baptism were permitted by God (even though such things were no longer in effect). Most likely this was to fulfill the picture in how water baptism is a picture or symbol of the real baptism in the Holy Spirit when a person first accepts Jesus as their Savior. Although water baptism was not a binding command under the New Covenant, God wanted to fulfill the type or picture one last time to show forth the real meaning. The real meaning was that their heart would be cleansed (washed), and they are given new desires. The old man has been buried in the waters, and a new man has arisen out of the water. Again, this speaks of the cleansing work of the Spirit (the greater reality). For the Jews looked for a sign. They loved signs. This is exactly what God gave them (even though the Lord wanted the church to mature and move on to grow).

But once the time of reformation came, and the temple was destroyed, I believe the Jew had nowhere to turn but the Lord and to trust that their way of doing things had ended. For God created a New Covenant with New Commands.

 

[Truther]

I was baptized in the Holy Spirit then later in water as a testimony that my old, sinful man was dead.

Acts 2:38 is not water baptism. That is your false interpretation.

And stop with the BORING "Acts skipper" nonsense. Nobody skips Acts including me.

You clearly have a one-track mind. Can't you think of anything to say except the same old garbage, repeated ad nauseum!

It is BORING!!!

Okay, you think Peter said this...

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


This actually makes more sense than your Acts skipper idea of Acts 2:38....


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you IN WATER in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


But, Peter commanded the Acts skipper to repent and receive the Holy Ghost and ....he shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost...LOL

 

[Truther]

In Acts of the Apostles 2:38: I believe Peter was speaking the correct words by the Spirit, but his understanding was not correct on what the word “baptize” meant for the New Covenant. Thus, Peter baptized with water (fulfilling OT pictures and symbols of the inward reality), but the Lord truly desired him to be more perfect on this matter and to simply baptize only with the Spirit (Which is not his own work alone, but the work of God). For at Pentecost: The 3,000 were indeed to be baptized but the real baptism was ultimately to be by the Spirit and not by water (Which was more fully realized by the apostle Paul). We have to understand that the disciples acted in obedience to the Lord's words in ways that were not always in perfect understanding. For example: Jesus told his disciples to buy a sword. While the Lord allowed their misunderstanding to fulfill prophecy, the real meaning of what our Lord meant was the spiritual sword (the Word of God, Scripture) because Jesus rebuked Peter for chopping off Malchus's ear. Jesus said that he that lives by the sword shall die by the sword. Peter even wanted to prevent the Lord from going to the cross. Again, his understanding was not perfect. But the words are 100% true.

Acts of the Apostles 2:38
“Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.”

Repent means to seek forgiveness with the Lord by way of prayer to Him over your sins (To see the biblical proof: See my write up here and here).

In fact, in Mark 1:4-5, it says John preached the "baptism of repentance" for the remission of sins (verse 4), and it then defines this "baptism of repentance" by saying they confessed their sins when they were baptized (verse 5).

Romans 6:4
“…we are buried with him by baptism into death…”

Romans 6:5
“…if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death,…”

We are buried with Christ in baptism - Romans 6:4.
But… this baptism is in the LIKENESS of his death (Meaning, it is a symbolic picture).

Jesus’ death washed away our sins literally with His death.
This applies to our life when we come to the Lord by faith or belief in Jesus as the Savior or believing the gospel message and or in seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus Christ. It’s God’s grace and not works (Ephesians 2:8-9). Note: This does not mean there is not a secondary aspect of salvation that follows in living holy unto the Lord by the Spirit (2 Thessalonians 2:13) (Romans 8:13).

But believers are Initially Saved by God’s grace without works (Ephesians 2:8-9) (Romans 4:3-5) (Titus 3:5).

Water baptism was symbolic of Christ’s death and Christ’s death washed away sin.
When a person seeks forgiveness of their sins with Jesus (Which is repentance), this is the sacrifice of Christ being applied to their life. They are being forgiven of their sin by trusting in what Christ did for us with His death, burial, and resurrection.
So repentance (seeking forgiveness with the Lord Jesus) is the literal remittance of sin, and the baptism in water part in Acts 2:38 is the symbolic picture of what repentance by faith, and believing in the redemption of Christ accomplished. The act of baptism does not save because Peter basically says that baptism does now save us not for the filth of the flesh (sin), but as an answer of having an already cleansed conscience before God. They had a cleansed conscience by their confessing their sins to the Lord Jesus and trusting in His death, burial, and resurrection for salvation.

Why would I believe this way?
Well, if Acts of the Apostles 2:38 was the only verse in the Bible, then I probably would conclude as you do.
But there are other verses that flat out contradict Acts of the Apostles 2:38.
But we know God’s Word does not contradict itself and so we have to compare Scripture with Scripture to properly harmonize it.

I will attempt to explain my case in my next post to you why I believe Spirit baptism (Which is what automatically happens when a person accepts Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior) had eventually replaced water baptism with the teaching by the apostle Paul.

You just said Paul, without keys, replaced Peter with the keys.

This is what Acts skippers do.

Notice, you quoted Acts 2:38 and only elaborated on repentance.

You hit the brakes and ran sinners straight to the Epistles.

Here is what you do with sinners in a nutshell....

37......what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and....

9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.


Yep, you teach that to sinners.

Shame on you.

 

[Truther]

@Truther

I believe the one baptism in Ephesians 4:5 is Spirit baptism and not water baptism (Which refutes the idea that we must be water baptized to be initially saved).

While there are other verses, I believe the following verses are the strongest case for Spirit baptism being the one and only baptism mentioned in Ephesians 4:5.

#1. Paul says he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel (1 Corinthians 1:17).
#2. Jesus says John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost (Acts of the Apostles 1:5).
#3. Cornelius and his household receive the Holy Spirit before being water baptized (Acts of the Apostles 10:34-45).
#4. Apollos only knew of John's baptism and he needed to be shown the way of God more perfectly (Acts of the Apostles 18:24-26).
#5. Paul had to Spirit baptize certain disciples at Ephesus who only knew of John's water baptism (Acts of the Apostles 19:1-7).​

If we approach these verses like a detective investigating a crime scene, we may be able to see something we may not have seen before.

Now, to be fair, on the other hand, I would say that there are several places in Scripture that may give a Bible reader pause on accepting that the one baptism in Ephesians 4:5 is Spirit baptism. In my opinion, it would be the following verses:

#1. Peter telling others to baptized at Pentecost (Acts of the Apostles 2:38, Acts of the Apostles 2:41).
#2. Peter commands Cornelius and his household to be water baptized after they received the Holy Spirit (Acts of the Apostles 10:47-48).
#3. Saul (i.e. the apostle Paul) is baptized by Ananias (Acts of the Apostles 9:17-18).
#4. Philip baptizes the Ethiopian eunuch (Acts of the Apostles 8:35-38).​

Okay, so by looking at these verses (at first glance), it seems like an ironclad case against Spirit baptism being the one and only baptism in Ephesians 4:5. But if indeed the one and only baptism is Spirit baptism and Paul said he came to preach the gospel and not to baptize, etc., we have to reconcile both sets of verses. I believe one possibility here is that the Jews were steeped in their traditions in keeping the Old ways. Remember when Jesus said the following?

“He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.” (Matthew 19:8).

So God did not really want the Israelites to divorce, but they were permitted to divorce because of the hardness of their hearts. Could it be the same reason why the Jewish disciples of Christ were not able to see that water baptism had ended? Were their hearts stuck in the ways of the Old Law? Anyone can read Acts of the Apostles 19 and draw the conclusion that the Jewish Messianic elders were still stuck in wanting to follow the Law of Moses. Remember when Paul had to correct Peter in trying to compell the Gentiles to live as the Jews do (See: Galatians 2:11-14). So why would God allow for His Jewish apostles to misunderstand at a key important point in the origin of the church like Pentecost?
Well, in Luke 22:36-37, and Matthew 26:51-54, we learn that Jesus told His disciples to buy a sword, and they brought forth two swords, and yet Jesus rebuked Peter for using his sword and told him that this all happened that the Scriptures might be fulfilled. So it was by their misunderstanding that Scripture was fulfilled. We have to understand that salvation first went out to the Jews before it went out to the Gentiles. So it makes sense that God wanted to keep the pictures or types that are from the Old ways at the beginning of the church in love and honor of the Jew. For Jesus said salvation was of the Jews (John 4:22), and the way of the Jews was that they did things that were mere shadows or pictures that pointed to Jesus Christ or that which is spiritual. Seeing that Pentecost was a fulfillment of OT Scripture (See: Acts of the Apostles 2:14-21), it makes sense that some of the Old ways like water baptism were permitted by God (even though such things were no longer in effect). Most likely this was to fulfill the picture in how water baptism is a picture or symbol of the real baptism in the Holy Spirit when a person first accepts Jesus as their Savior. Although water baptism was not a binding command under the New Covenant, God wanted to fulfill the type or picture one last time to show forth the real meaning. The real meaning was that their heart would be cleansed (washed), and they are given new desires. The old man has been buried in the waters, and a new man has arisen out of the water. Again, this speaks of the cleansing work of the Spirit (the greater reality). For the Jews looked for a sign. They loved signs. This is exactly what God gave them (even though the Lord wanted the church to mature and move on to grow).

But once the time of reformation came, and the temple was destroyed, I believe the Jew had nowhere to turn but the Lord and to trust that their way of doing things had ended. For God created a New Covenant with New Commands.

Real Christians start in Acts 2:38 and apply the teachings of Paul's epistles after that to their lives.

Fake Christians teach sinners to skip Acts 2:38 and read the Epistles to find non contextual verses to attempt to be saved without Acts, pitting Paul against Peter in their doctrinal process.

Fake Christians create contradiction and controversy in scripture.

True Christians figure out a way to apply it all.

True Christians teach sinners to obey Acts 2:38, then apply all of the Epistles to their lives.

Acts skippers steer sinners clear of this...


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

 

[brightfame52]

truther

Acts skippers steer sinners clear of this...


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

That scripture is so misunderstood, but Peter is here exhorting newly born again babes in Christ to repent, which only the born again can do, and then submit to the ordinance of water baptism as an evidence of genuine change of mind, in view of the fact, their sins have been forgiven by the blood of Christ. Their repentance proves they have forgiveness of sins, since Christ gives them both together Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Again Peter here in Acts 2:38 is not exhorting spiritually dead sinners to do something to get saved and get forgiveness, but newly spiritually awaken born again sinners, seeking as babes spiritual instruction at the outset of their new life in Christ.

Now to exhort spiritually dead sinners to get water baptized in Jesus name in order to get saved, to get forgiveness of sins, is nothing more than legalism works salvation !

 

[mailmandan]

… All because the Acts skipper disagrees with Acts 2:38.

You need to properly harmonize Acts 2:38 with (Acts 3:19; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 26:18). You skip over everything else in Acts except Acts 2:38. Your bias and flawed hermeneutics is obvious for everyone to see.

 

[Truther]

truther



That scripture is so misunderstood, but Peter is here exhorting newly born again babes in Christ to repent, which only the born again can do, and then submit to the ordinance of water baptism as an evidence of genuine change of mind, in view of the fact, their sins have been forgiven by the blood of Christ. Their repentance proves they have forgiveness of sins, since Christ gives them both together Acts 5:31

31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

Again Peter here in Acts 2:38 is not exhorting spiritually dead sinners to do something to get saved and get forgiveness, but newly spiritually awaken born again sinners, seeking as babes spiritual instruction at the outset of their new life in Christ.

Now to exhort spiritually dead sinners to get water baptized in Jesus name in order to get saved, to get forgiveness of sins, is nothing more than legalism works salvation !

No he is not.

Peter is COMMANDING the murderers of Jesus to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins.

No verse shows them saved before obeying Acts 2:38.

Not a single verse....


36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


Now, show me what part of this they were saved before obeying Acts 2:38?

 

[Truther]

You need to properly harmonize Acts 2:38 with (Acts 3:19; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 26:18). You skip over everything else in Acts except Acts 2:38. Your bias and flawed hermeneutics is obvious for everyone to see.

I do.

Acts 2:38 is seen also in chapters 8, 10 and 19....covering 17 chapters consistently.

This is why Acts skippers must eliminate the book of Acts to use the Epistles to strategically have Paul steal Peter's keys.

They teach that Paul took the keys from Peter and ended Acts 2:38, by quoting a letter to the Acts 2:38 obeying saints of Rome, as a new way to be saved.


One thing for certain, as Romans 10:9 is misquoted as a new form of salvation aside from Acts 2:38, Acts skippers only confess and believe to be saved one time in their life, when we Acts 2:38 adherers, do it daily.

Thank God we have enough sense to know Romans 10:9 was written to affirm the saved saints continuing faith.

 

[brightfame52]

No he is not.

Peter is COMMANDING the murderers of Jesus to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins.

No verse shows them saved before obeying Acts 2:38.

Not a single verse....


36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


Now, show me what part of this they were saved before obeying Acts 2:38?

I have already explained my pov, they were spiritually awakened sinners, who were seeking spiritual instruction. Now for you teach that Peter is speaking to the unregenerate, and instructing them to get water baptized in order to get saved, you are advocating salvation and forgiveness by your works.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Okay, you think Peter said this...

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


This actually makes more sense than your Acts skipper idea of Acts 2:38....


38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you IN WATER in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


But, Peter commanded the Acts skipper to repent and receive the Holy Ghost and ....he shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost...LOL

First, somebody can tell you that you are a Genesis skipper if you don’t build an Ark to avoid a global flood, but that would not be correct of them to say that because we know that such a command applied only to Noah and his family, and not to us Christians today.

Second, do you believe all of the spiritual gifts of the Holy Spirit apply today? (See: Romans 12:6-8) (1 Corinthians 12:4-11) (1 Corinthians 12:28).

Three, do you believe you have to reconcile with your brother first before offering an animal sacrifice according to the teaching of Jesus at the sermon on the Mount?

Matthew 5:24 EXB says:
“leave your gift [offering; sacrifice] there at the altar. Go and make peace [be reconciled] with that person [first], and then come and offer your gift [present your offering/sacrifice].”

Granted, I am not saying that the other teachings of Jesus at the Sermon on the Mount do not apply to us believers today (they do), but the point here is that we have to rightly divide the Scriptures.

Four, did Cornelius and his family receive the gift of the Holy Spirit by being baptized?
Yes, or no?
If no… then water baptism is not the prerequisite to receiving the Holy Spirit as a gift.

Five, a common mistake is applying things that were given to the Jews in Scripture as if they applied to Gentiles in every case. When John the Baptist was leading people to repent (i.e. to confess of one’s sins to the Lord) and then he baptized them in water… this was in the region of the Jews and Jesus first called the Jew and not the Gentile. It was a call to the Israelite to come back to the Lord before the Messiah comes. Israel was a nation that already believed in God. So John’s water baptism was not an Initial call to salvation. The same is true with Pentecost. Every Jew there at Pentecost was already a believer in God and the OT Scriptures. At Pentecost, these were not Gentiles having no clue as to God at all and they needed to be initially saved. Israel needed to seek forgiveness with the Lord for having strayed and to accept the Messiah who has come. Pentecost was not about Initial Salvation. It was to the Jew who needed to come back to the Lord and recognize their Messiah. Acts 10 involving Peter telling Cornelius the gospel was a big deal because it made clear to Peter and the other apostles that Gentiles were now accepted into God’s program.

Six, binding and loosing (Peter and the other apostles having the keys to the kingdom) does not mean Peter and the others were infallible and nor does it mean baptism saves. Peter himself said baptism does not save us for the putting away of the filth of the flesh (sin) (or it is not an outward cleansing that saves us), but baptism saves us for answering the call of having an already cleansed conscience (1 Peter 3:21). One is cleansed or saved by confessing their sins to the Lord. Water baptism merely followed as an outward symbol or picture of what just happened prior (i.e. Confessing one’s sins to the Lord). Binding and loosing (the keys of the kingdom) does not mean Peter did not have misunderstandings. Paul rebuked Peter for the fact that he ate with the Gentiles and yet he separated himself from the Gentiles when those of the circumcision had appeared (Galatians 2:11-16). Binding and loosing was Peter and the others being able to have authority as apostles to be able to tell if others in general if they obeyed the gospel message and to tell others and that they were obeying God’s commands and or walking in the Spirit. In other words, the apostles could declare to others the authority if their heart was right with God by whether or not they correctly obeyed the teachings of Jesus (Because they were chosen disciples to Jesus’ teachings). This is not that they could just declare to others that they were forgiven like the Catholic Church falsely does. They are only forgiven by seeking forgiveness with Jesus. When they do that, the apostles could declare that they were forgiven or saved. But that does not mean they were infallible 100% of the time. At one point in time: Peter did not walk according to the truth of the gospel according to Paul. Also, there was a time when the Spirit did not come upon a group of new converts in Samaria (by Philip’s preaching). So Peter and John were sent to investigate and resolve the matter. It turned out that Simon the sorcerer’s heart was not right with God. This proves that not everything fits into a perfect cookie cutter mold of our way of thinking.

Seven, Paul was an apostle chosen by the Lord Jesus Christ himself, and Paul also had the authority to judge other believers on whether they obeyed God’s message or not correctly. We learn in 1 Corinthians 3, that the Corinthians believers justified the sins of strife and envy and Paul was able to tell them that they basically were not saved by doing so. Only in 2 Corinthians we learn that the Corinthians later sought forgiveness of these sins with God (i.e. they repented). But the point here is that you are not dealing with the words of Paul that follow later and have more weight because Paul taught Gentile believers (Which would be us), and Paul gave us important teachings on baptism AFTER Pentecost.

Eight, you need to deal with the words of Paul and properly reconcile them with a good conscience or a pure heart. 1 Corinthians 1:17 makes it clear by the apostle Paul that he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel. So if baptism was for salvation, then Paul would be saying… I come not to save you with the act of baptism, but to preach the gospel. This would not make any sense for Paul to say this if baptism equated with salvation. Paul did not request other apostles to come baptize new converts so that the Corinthians could be saved along with Paul preaching the gospel. That would be nonsense because that does not jive with Paul’s words or the rest of Scripture. We don’t see another apostle on hot stand by with Paul dunking them in water as he preached the gospel. Why didn’t Paul say that another was to baptize by his side for salvation while he preached the gospel? This is what has to be in 1 Corinthians 1 if 1 Corinthians 1:17 is to be believed.

 

[Truther]

I have already explained my pov, they were spiritually awakened sinners, who were seeking spiritual instruction. Now for you teach that Peter is speaking to the unregenerate, and instructing them to get water baptized in order to get saved, you are advocating salvation and forgiveness by your works.

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


Highlight the part of this passage that shows these murderers were instantaneously saved before the command of Acts 2:38 please?

 

[Truther]

First, somebody can tell you that you are a Genesis skipper if you don’t build an Ark to avoid a global flood, but that would not be correct of them to say that because we know that such a command applied only to Noah and his family, and not to us Christians today.

Second, do you believe all of the spiritual gifts of the Holy Spirit apply today? (See: Romans 12:6-8) (1 Corinthians 12:4-11) (1 Corinthians 12:28).

Three, do you believe you have to reconcile with your brother first before offering an animal sacrifice according to the teaching of Jesus at the sermon on the Mount?

Matthew 5:24 EXB says:
“leave your gift [offering; sacrifice] there at the altar. Go and make peace [be reconciled] with that person [first], and then come and offer your gift [present your offering/sacrifice].”

Granted, I am not saying that the other teachings of Jesus at the Sermon on the Mount do not apply to us believers today (they do), but the point here is that we have to rightly divide the Scriptures.

Four, did Cornelius and his family receive the gift of the Holy Spirit by being baptized?
Yes, or no?
If no… then water baptism is not the prerequisite to receiving the Holy Spirit as a gift.

Five, a common mistake is applying things that were given to the Jews in Scripture as if they applied to Gentiles in every case. When John the Baptist was leading people to repent (i.e. to confess of one’s sins to the Lord) and then he baptized them in water… this was in the region of the Jews and Jesus first called the Jew and not the Gentile. It was a call to the Israelite to come back to the Lord before the Messiah comes. Israel was a nation that already believed in God. So John’s water baptism was not an Initial call to salvation. The same is true with Pentecost. Every Jew there at Pentecost was already a believer in God and the OT Scriptures. At Pentecost, these were not Gentiles having no clue as to God at all and they needed to be initially saved. Israel needed to seek forgiveness with the Lord for having strayed and to accept the Messiah who has come. Pentecost was not about Initial Salvation. It was to the Jew who needed to come back to the Lord and recognize their Messiah. Acts 10 involving Peter telling Cornelius the gospel was a big deal because it made clear to Peter and the other apostles that Gentiles were now accepted into God’s program.

Six, binding and loosing (Peter and the other apostles having the keys to the kingdom) does not mean Peter and the others were infallible and nor does it mean baptism saves. Peter himself said baptism does not save us for the putting away of the filth of the flesh (sin) (or it is not an outward cleansing that saves us), but baptism saves us for answering the call of having an already cleansed conscience (1 Peter 3:21). One is cleansed or saved by confessing their sins to the Lord. Water baptism merely followed as an outward symbol or picture of what just happened prior (i.e. Confessing one’s sins to the Lord). Binding and loosing (the keys of the kingdom) does not mean Peter did not have misunderstandings. Paul rebuked Peter for the fact that he ate with the Gentiles and yet he separated himself from the Gentiles when those of the circumcision had appeared (Galatians 2:11-16). Binding and loosing was Peter and the others being able to have authority as apostles to be able to tell if others in general if they obeyed the gospel message and to tell others and that they were obeying God’s commands and or walking in the Spirit. In other words, the apostles could declare to others the authority if their heart was right with God by whether or not they correctly obeyed the teachings of Jesus (Because they were chosen disciples to Jesus’ teachings). This is not that they could just declare to others that they were forgiven like the Catholic Church falsely does. They are only forgiven by seeking forgiveness with Jesus. When they do that, the apostles could declare that they were forgiven or saved. But that does not mean they were infallible 100% of the time. At one point in time: Peter did not walk according to the truth of the gospel according to Paul. Also, there was a time when the Spirit did not come upon a group of new converts in Samaria (by Philip’s preaching). So Peter and John were sent to investigate and resolve the matter. It turned out that Simon the sorcerer’s heart was not right with God. This proves that not everything fits into a perfect cookie cutter mold of our way of thinking.

Seven, Paul was an apostle chosen by the Lord Jesus Christ himself, and Paul also had the authority to judge other believers on whether they obeyed God’s message or not correctly. We learn in 1 Corinthians 3, that the Corinthians believers justified the sins of strife and envy and Paul was able to tell them that they basically were not saved by doing so. Only in 2 Corinthians we learn that the Corinthians later sought forgiveness of these sins with God (i.e. they repented). But the point here is that you are not dealing with the words of Paul that follow later and have more weight because Paul taught Gentile believers (Which would be us), and Paul gave us important teachings on baptism AFTER Pentecost.

Eight, you need to deal with the words of Paul and properly reconcile them with a good conscience or a pure heart. 1 Corinthians 1:17 makes it clear by the apostle Paul that he came not to baptize but to preach the gospel. So if baptism was for salvation, then Paul would be saying… I come not to save you with the act of baptism, but to preach the gospel. This would not make any sense for Paul to say this if baptism equated with salvation. Paul did not request others to come baptize so that the Corinthians could be saved along with Paul preaching the gospel. That would be nonsense because that does not jive with Paul’s words or the rest of Scripture. We don’t see another apostle on hot stand by with Paul dunking them in water as he preached the gospel. Why didn’t Paul say that another was to baptize by his side for salvation while he preached the gospel? This is what has to be in 1 Corinthians 1 if 1 Corinthians 1:17 is to be believed.

You got off the subject and started preaching.

Now, you believe it means this, correct?...

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

 

[Truther]

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This is how Joe Biden reads Acts 2:38...LOL

 

[mailmandan]

I do.

Acts 2:38 is seen also in chapters 8, 10 and 19....covering 17 chapters consistently.

Not your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38.

This is why Acts skippers must eliminate the book of Acts to use the Epistles to strategically have Paul steal Peter's keys.

I have cited Acts 3:19; 10:43-47; 11:17,18; 15:8,9; 26:18 numerous times in our discussions. All you do is cite Acts 2:38 and skip the rest.

They teach that Paul took the keys from Peter and ended Acts 2:38, by quoting a letter to the Acts 2:38 obeying saints of Rome, as a new way to be saved.

There is not more than one plan of salvation in scripture. Salvation has always been through FAITH/BELIEF. (John 3:15,16,18; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31; Romans 1:16; 3:24-28; 4:2-6; Ephesians 2:8 etc..).

One thing for certain, as Romans 10:9 is misquoted as a new form of salvation aside from Acts 2:38, Acts skippers only confess and believe to be saved one time in their life, when we Acts 2:38 adherers, do it daily.

You confess daily to get saved over and over again daily?

Thank God we have enough sense to know Romans 10:9 was written to affirm the saved saints continuing faith.

Romans 10:9,10 refutes your biased interpretation of Acts 2:38.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You got off the subject and started preaching.

Now, you believe it means this, correct?...

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

I made excellent points with Scripture that refute your thinking here. If you don’t want to deal with the verses, then by all means.
But 1 Corinthians 1:17 cannot be believed by you in good conscience or with a pure heart if you believe Acts of the Apostles 2:38 is speaking in entirely in literal terms. Repentance (seeking forgiveness with the Lord) is what causes one to have their sins remitted (i.e. salvation to enter the Kingdom), and the baptism part only remitted sin in a symbolic sense (Pointing symbolically or to the likeness of Christ’s death upon the cross - See again Romans 6:3, and compare it with Romans 6:5).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

You got off the subject and started preaching.

Now, you believe it means this, correct?...

36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you BY THE HOLY GHOST for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

Did Cornelius and his family receive the gift of the Holy Spirit before they were baptized?

According to Scripture… the answer is yes. They received the Spirit before they were water baptized (Thus proving you don’t need to be water baptized to receive the gift of the Spirit).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

This is how Joe Biden reads Acts 2:38...LOL

Well, he is Catholic. So he takes the Catholic interpretation.
In fact, this would mean he believes in infant baptism (Which is not biblical).
But Biden is not a good Catholic, for he defends abortion (Which is something the Catholic Church condemns). Granted, Catholicism itself is crazier than a bag of cats and is highly unbiblical in many ways. Their traditions attempt to undo the Word of God in many ways.

 

[Jim B]

No he is not.

Peter is COMMANDING the murderers of Jesus to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus for the remission of sins.

No verse shows them saved before obeying Acts 2:38.

Not a single verse....


36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.

37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?

38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.


Now, show me what part of this they were saved before obeying Acts 2:38?

So Peter is talking to the Roman soldiers? They were the ones who murdered Jesus, not the Jews. That is a blatant anti-Semitic lie that needs to be put to rest once and for all. You obviously forget that Jesus was a Jew, as were all twelve of the apostles. All of Scripture -- both testaments -- was written by Jews, with one exception: Luke.

I have finally reached the end of my tolerance for your twisted interpretation of the Gospel. I am putting you on "ignore" so I only have to read your garbage when I feel like it (which I assure you will be infrequently). Your single-minded interpretation of God's word is tragic and clearly wrong.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The three things that let me know that water baptism has ended are these:

#1. Hebrews 9:10 says, “Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation.” The word “washings” is the Greek word “baptismos” (βαπτισμός) (Check out here for the Strong’s definition). In other words, Hebrews 9:10 is saying that diverse baptisms (washings) were imposed on believers until the time of reformation. Meaning, water baptism will give way or pass away until the time of reformation (Which means that Spirit baptism is now the one and only true baptism for today).

#2. 1 Corinthians 1:17 says, “For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.” If water baptism is what places us into Christ, then why is Paul teaching against it here? This must mean that the true baptism is Spirit baptism and that the baptism that Paul was not sent by Christ to put forth was water baptism. For the apostles were commissioned to baptize in Matthew 28:19, and yet, Paul was an apostle.

#3. John the Baptist said, “I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:” (Matthew 3:11). This is why Jesus did not water baptize anyone. The way Jesus' baptizes is by Spirit baptism. Jesus stated: “For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.” (Acts of the Apostles 1:5).
Side Note: This baptism of the Holy Ghost took place at Pentecost for the Jewish believers (See: Acts of the Apostles 2), and it happened for the Gentiles with Cornelius and his family in Acts 10 (Also see: Acts 11 about Peter’s recollection of this event; For Peter recalls the words of Jesus in Acts of the Apostles 1:5 when Cornelius and his family experienced the baptism of the Spirit after the gospel was preached to them) (Note: In Acts 10-11: I believe Peter was just first learning of the baptism of the Spirit and he did not know yet that water baptism had ended at this point in his life). If water baptism was necessary to receive the Spirit, then the Spirit would wait until Peter water baptized them. But the Holy Spirit came upon them without any water baptism. Thus, this is the true baptism. This is the one baptism of Ephesians 4:5. It is the baptism of the Holy Spirit (i.e. the transformation of the heart, and the receiving of the Hoy Spirit).