Electing New Pope

[Truther]

Eph 3:5 Which in other ages was not made known unto the sons of men, as it is now revealed unto his holy apostles and prophets by the Spirit;

Apostolic authority!
God sent them apostles to teach them the truth revealed by Christ!
Matt 28:19 all the apostles
Philip an apostle acts 8
Peter an apostle acts 10

Jn 17:20 Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word;

Acts 22:15 For thou shalt be his witness unto all men of what thou hast seen and heard.


There is a big difference between the people, and the priesthood of Christ and the apostles!

Matthew 22:14
For many are called, but few are chosen.

Matt 13:11 He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but to them it is not given.

Jn 20:21 as the father sent me, I send you. And Jn 17:18 I send you!

(The apostles with the same mission, power, and authority)

The apostles received the kingdom.
Lk 22:29

The apostles administer the kingdom. Matt 16:18-19 & 18:18

The apostles govern the church.
Matt 28:19-20

The apostles hold office.
Acts 1:15-20

The apostles have authority to forgive sins. Jn 20:23

Apostles are the light of the world!
The church is an extension of Christ in time and space. Matt 5:14

The apostles are Christ’s successors!
They have authority to send others as well, apostle means one who is sent!

Therefore the apostles have authority to send more apostles or successors!
Apostolic succession!

The nations still need to be taught, disciples still need to be baptized and the church the new covenant kingdom of christ still needs to be governed!

Three fold ministry,

Teaching:
Sanctification:
Governing:

Keys of authority! And power to bind and loose! Matt 16:18 and Matt 18:18 matt 28:19 Isa 22:21-22

Moral authority:
(Teaching)
Necessity of being taught by Christ:
Two edge sword: defining truth and condemning errors, and Interpreting scripture.

Jurisdictional authority:
(Governing / administering)
Necessity of Peter and the apostles and their successors to govern the holy church.

Spiritual authority:
(Life of Grace)
Sanctifying thru the mass and Sacraments

God established order and peace and knowledge of truth in a hierarchical authority of Peter and the apostles!

There is a hierarchical authority in all that God has ordained!

The angelic kingdom!
The civil kingdom!
The church kingdom!
The family!

All are ordered with hierarchical and jurisdictional authority!






Jesus Christ founded the new covenant church for the salvation of all men! (Jn 1:16-17) Christ is the truth! (Jn 14:6) Christ and his church are one!
(Acts 9;4 eph 5:32)
The church is the pillar of truth
(1 Tim 3:15) that must teach all men (Matt 28:19) without error guided by the Holy Spirit
(Jn 16:13) Thru the grace of God in the sanctification of souls applied in the seven sacraments!

Sacramental life: Jn 1:16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace. Jn 10:10 The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Initiation into the new covenant must be ministered to you by the apostles!


There CANNOT be both!

Either Apostolic tradition in hierarchical authority which establishes truth, peace and order!

Or

Spiritual anarchy producing chaos and disorder!



Acts 16:17 The same followed Paul and us, and cried, saying, These men are the servants of the most high God, which shew unto us the way of salvation.

Men show is the way of salvation?

Just like BOL, you have not provided a verse saying we have sub priests.

 

[Truther]

Christ is high priest so there must be low priests!

Bingo! All believers are the low priests

 

[Truther]

1 Timothy 4:14
Neglect not the gift that is in thee, which was given thee by prophecy, with the laying on of the hands of the presbytery.

presbyter is a priest!

Lol

 

[Truther]

LOTS.
Jesus is our ONLY Mediator in that only HIS sacrifice can bring peace between us and the Father – but we are ALL called to mediate and intercede for one another.

As the BODY of Christ – we SHARE in the sufferings of Christ.
In case you forgot – Paul gives us a perfect example of this in Col. 12:4, when he writes:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

STUDY your Bible – don’t just quote it.

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.

Correct?

 

[Truther]

LOTS.
Jesus is our ONLY Mediator in that only HIS sacrifice can bring peace between us and the Father – but we are ALL called to mediate and intercede for one another.

As the BODY of Christ – we SHARE in the sufferings of Christ.
In case you forgot – Paul gives us a perfect example of this in Col. 12:4, when he writes:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

STUDY your Bible – don’t just quote it.

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.

correct?

 

[Truther]

Subordinate mediators is because of the the ONE mediatorship of Christ, not contrary to it. You create a false dichotomy trying to justify the abolishment of the New Testament Priesthood, which can't be defended.
1 Tim 2:1-2 – because Jesus Christ is the one mediator between God and man (1 Tim. 2:5), many Protestants deny the Catholic belief that the saints on earth and in heaven can mediate on our behalf. But before Paul’s teaching about Jesus as the “one mediator,” Paul urges supplications, prayers, intercessions, and thanksgivings be made for all people. Paul is thus appealing for mediation from others besides Christ, the one mediator. Why?

1 Tim 2:3 – because this subordinate mediation is good and acceptable to God our Savior. Because God is our Father and we are His children, God invites us to participate in Christ’s role as mediator.

1 Tim. 2:5 – therefore, although Jesus Christ is the sole mediator between God and man, there are many intercessors (subordinate mediators).

1 Cor. 3:9 – God invites us to participate in Christ’s work because we are God’s “fellow workers” and one family in the body of Christ. God wants His children to participate. The phrase used to describe “fellow workers” is “sunergoi,” which literally means synergists, or cooperators with God in salvific matters. Does God need fellow workers? Of course not, but this shows how much He, as Father, loves His children. God wants us to work with Him.

Mark 16:20 – this is another example of how the Lord “worked with them” (“sunergountos”). God cooperates with us. Out of His eternal love, He invites our participation.

Rom. 8:28 – God “works for good with” (the Greek is “sunergei eis agathon”) those who love Him. We work as subordinate mediators.

2 Cor. 6:1 – “working together” (the Greek is “sunergountes”) with him, don’t accept His grace in vain. God allows us to participate in His work, not because He needs our help, but because He loves us and wants to exalt us in His Son. It is like the father who lets his child join him in carrying the groceries in the house. The father does not need help, but he invites the child to assist to raise up the child in dignity and love.

Scriptures have been cited repeatedly. Ministerial priests share the same common priesthood as I have, the difference is I am not ordained, but still I am a priest in the common sense. The elimination of a sacrificial, ministerial priesthood is a man made tradition and has no defense.

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.
Correct?

 

[BreadOfLife]

Just like BOL, you have not provided a verse saying we have sub priests.

Ummmmm, RE-READ post #276, Einstein where I listed the verses . . .

 

[BreadOfLife]

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.
correct?

Sooooo, Explain what Paul means here:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

 

[Illuminator]

So his Apostles are allowed to skip Acts 2:38 these days?

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This has always been the teaching of the historic Church. It didn't need to be "re-discovered".

 

[Blue Dragonfly's]

Can you answer my question first?

Romans 5, Galatians 2, as two examples.

You first asked if I knew how the OT was canonized. Can you answer your own question that you asked first?

 

[BreadOfLife]

You first asked if I knew how the OT was canonized. Can you answer your own question that you asked first?

No.

Back in post #272 - I asked YOU if you knew how Protestants got their OT Canon - and you have YET to give me an answer.
WHY would I answer my own question without hearing from YOU first? This is a coonversation - not a sermon.

If you don't kow the answer - just admit it and I'll explain.
I'll waith for your answer about the OT Canon first.

 

[BreadOfLife]

Romans 5, Galatians 2, as two examples.

You gave me 2 entire chapters of Scripture.
Can you whittle it down to specific text to present your argument?

The question was:
Can you show me ANY place in ALL of Scripture where “Faith alone”(Sola Fide) is advocated?

 

[Truther]

Ummmmm, RE-READ post #276, Einstein where I listed the verses . . .

Nothing you listed mentions that we are each other's priests.

If you remove your RCC bias, you will realize that all believers that have obeyed Acts 2:38 are priests unto their God.

We don't "priest" man.

We all go straight to God as the OT priest went to God in the tabernacle as we obey Acts 2:38.

The priest addressed the brazen altar(representing the future repentance per Acts 2:38).

The priest addressed the brazen laver(representing the future water baptism in the name of Jesus for the remission of our sins).

The priest addressed the Holy of Holies(representing the future when we receive the Holy Ghost).

I mean, since you are ashamed to go before God because of your Acts 2:38 skipping etc, you should find yourself a priest to do it for you, right?

 

[Truther]

Sooooo, Explain what Paul means here:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.
...correct?

.....which is my question that you cannot answer.

It says ONE mediator.

Not two, ten or a hundred etc per the RCC.

Every doctrine you guys invent is corrupt.

 

[Truther]

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This has always been the teaching of the historic Church. It didn't need to be "re-discovered".

Not a single Catholic obeys Acts 2:38.

 

[BreadOfLife]

thh

Nothing you listed mentions that we are each other's priests.
If you remove your RCC bias, you will realize that all believers that have obeyed Acts 2:38 are priests unto their God.
We don't "priest" man.

We all go straight to God as the OT priest went to God in the tabernacle as we obey Acts 2:38.
The priest addressed the brazen altar(representing the future repentance per Acts 2:38).
The priest addressed the brazen laver(representing the future water baptism in the name of Jesus for the remission of our sins).
The priest addressed the Holy of Holies(representing the future when we receive the Holy Ghost).
I mean, since you are ashamed to go before God because of your Acts 2:38 skipping etc, you should find yourself a priest to do it for you, right?

Then, you're even moe dense than I thought.
You don't even understand the function of a priet - DO you?
Time for another Bible Lesson . . .

I think we can agree that there is ONE High Pruest - and that is our Lord Jesus Christ (1 Tim. 2:5, Heb. 7:22-25).

The purpose of a priest is to offer SACRIFICE.
Paul's sacrifice of his very SELF is a PRIESTLY sacrifice - the SAME sacrifice we are ALL called to do this as part of the royal priesthood of Christ (1 Prt. 2:9). We ALL partake in the sufferings of Christ for the sake of the Church.
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

But we're NOT all called to be Ministerial Priests as we see in James 5.
This is a TEXTBOOK example of a priestly duty:
James 5:13-15
Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing praise. Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer of faith will SACE the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven.

WHY would there be a need to call for the Presbyters to pray over a sick person and ANOINT them with oil?
According to YOU - all YOU need is your OWN petitions to God. According to this berse - those prayers SAVE the sick person if they have sinned.

The Body of Christ is NOT about "Me and Jesus" and nobody else.
It is a FAMILY setting - and we are ALL part of that ONE Body and ALL parts are in need of each other, as Paul explains in 1 Cor. 12.

STUDY your Bible - don't just "quote" it.

 

[BreadOfLife]

For there is one God and one mediator between God and man, the man Christ Jesus.
...correct?

.....which is my question that you cannot answer.

It says ONE mediator.

Not two, ten or a hundred etc per the RCC.

Every doctrine you guys invent is corrupt.

I already explained it.
And anybody who actually READS post #297 will get my Biblical answer.

My related question that YOU have NOT been able to answer is:
Explain what Paul means in this verse:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

Why are you so afraid to answer this?

 

[Illuminator]

Romans 5, Galatians 2, as two examples.

You first asked if I knew how the OT was canonized. Can you answer your own question that you asked first?

The OT was canonized with the same authority that the NT was canonized.

 

[Truther]

thh
Then, you're even moe dense than I thought.
You don't even understand the function of a priet - DO you?
Time for another Bible Lesson . . .

I think we can agree that there is ONE High Pruest - and that is our Lord Jesus Christ (1 Tim. 2:5, Heb. 7:22-25).

The purpose of a priest is to offer SACRIFICE.
Paul's sacrifice of his very SELF is a PRIESTLY sacrifice - the SAME sacrifice we are ALL called to do this as part of the royal priesthood of Christ (1 Prt. 2:9). We ALL partake in the sufferings of Christ for the sake of the Church.
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

But we're NOT all called to be Ministerial Priests as we see in James 5.
This is a TEXTBOOK example of a priestly duty:
James 5:13-15
Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing praise. Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord. And the prayer of faith will SACE the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven.

WHY would there be a need to call for the Presbyters to pray over a sick person and ANOINT them with oil?
According to YOU - all YOU need is your OWN petitions to God. According to this berse - those prayers SAVE the sick person if they have sinned.

The Body of Christ is NOT about "Me and Jesus" and nobody else.
It is a FAMILY setting - and we are ALL part of that ONE Body and ALL parts are in need of each other, as Paul explains in 1 Cor. 12.

STUDY your Bible - don't just "quote" it.

I see what you think. Every single person you asked to pray for you becomes your priest. You are a mess.

 

[Truther]

I already explained it.
And anybody who actually READS post #297 will get my Biblical answer.

My related question that YOU have NOT been able to answer is:
Explain what Paul means in this verse:
Col. 12:4
Now I rejoice in my sufferings for your sake, and in my flesh I am filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions for the sake of his body, that is, the church

Why are you so afraid to answer this?

Again, how many mediators are there between God and man? I mean scripturally. 100 mediators. 1000 mediators.