Are Hyper-dispensationalists right ??

[dan p]

Hi to all and , and mant call me a Hyper-dispensationalist and do not even know what word means and will set the record straight , because I am AMUSED by this accusation .

In the Dispensational theology , there are the following views as to where Dispensationalist are found .

#1 , Ther are some that call themselves Acts 2 , Dispensationalist , BUT are not dispensational , because they begin the Body of Christ NOT in Pauline letters , BUT in Jewish theology , and on a Jewish Feast Day , The Day of Pentecost .

All , the rest of the Dispensaionalist , begin it with Paul.

#2 , There are the Acts 9 , because Saul was the first one saved by Grace in Rom 1:1 and 1 Cor 15:8 and 1 Tim 1:15 and 16 , prove my point .

#3 , Then there are the Acts 13 .

#4 , The Acts 11 , people .

#5 , Those DREADED Acts 28er or Hyper Dispensationalist and more or less , hold to the following .

a , Believe that there are 2 Bodies of Christ , one before Eph and one after Eph .

b , Believe in Soul Sleep , after death .

c , Do not believe in the Rapture , as outlined in 1 Cor 15:51-58 , and other verse .

d , Believe that Saul was saved under the Gospel of the Kingdom .

e , Believe in One Baptism .

f , Believe in only the Gospel of the Grace of God for today .

g , Believe that the first 7 books that Paul wrote were NOT to the Body of Christ .

h ,Believe there is a DIFFERENCE between Israel and the Body of Christ .


Luke 13:6-9 REFUTES the Acts 28er position as Jesus ministry of the Gospel of the Kingdom lasted 4 years and then when to the Cross and then , LATER in Acts 28 , Israel was set aside and that means that a lot of their VIEWS are MOOT AND HOLD NO WATER .

The Gospel of the Kingdom lasted for 4 years as per Luke 13:6-9 , and after Acts 15 , NOTHING is heard from Peter and James has taken over Peter position as the leader as Acts 21:18 reveals .

dan p

 

[tomwebster]

Hi to all and , and mant call me a Hyper-dispensationalist and do not even know what word means ....
dan p

Your definitions are totally different from anything I have read. Where do you find your information dp?

 

[biggandyy]

The answer the topic question: No. As to the tomfoolery presented as evidence... I am have no comment since Angie would delete it

 

[dan p]

Your definitions are totally different from anything I have read. Where do you find your information dp?

Hi , and in our assembly were some Acts 28er and also in another assembly that I attend in L.A. , and I receive some Acts 28 material and have some of Bullingers books to study , You may be reading from a Acts 2 writers ?

You can google an Acts 28 , site and look for Bullinger and Welch and their is a group called RIGHT DIVISION in Indiana , and it pays to go straight to the Horses mouth .

Please , keep in mind the there is a man called Robert C Brock also called RIGHT DIVISION bit is in Fla that is a Pauline dispensationalist , dan p

 

[prism]

I don't consider mid Acts 'hyper' maybe 'hyper moderate' dispensationalists.But whatever the name the issue is...is it true? This goes for the other 38000 or so Christian denominations as well..

 

[RichardBurger]

#5 , Those DREADED Acts 28er or Hyper Dispensationalist and more or less , hold to the following .

a , Believe that there are 2 Bodies of Christ , one before Eph and one after Eph . ---- wrong

b , Believe in Soul Sleep , after death . ----- wrong

c , Do not believe in the Rapture , as outlined in 1 Cor 15:51-58 , and other verse . ---- wrong

d , Believe that Saul was saved under the Gospel of the Kingdom . ----- wrong

e , Believe in One Baptism . --- yes, the baptism of the Holy Spirit

f , Believe in only the Gospel of the Grace of God for today . ---- yes

g , Believe that the first 7 books that Paul wrote were NOT to the Body of Christ . -----wrong, All of Paul's writing are to the believers in the body of Christ.

h ,Believe there is a DIFFERENCE between Israel and the Body of Christ . ---- Yes

This is how I see it.

 

[lawrance]

Doctrines of men thats all th
ey are.
The Body of Christ is Israel. as you can't be one or the other.
Grace was always there but with Christ it abound.
God does not make up things like the ten commandments and then reject it or some rubbish like an age of grace and another age of etc etc ? as it grows ?

 

[Prentis]

Kinda goes against the fact that the law was their to BRING Israel to Christ... And that he came to draw all men to himself. God doesn't need a plot to save men. Rather God desires them to be conformed to him, and so he trains them, prepares them, and then empowers them.

All is going in the same direction... Christ.

 

[bling]

Acts 2: 38 is the start of the Body of Christ and the true Isael.

 

[dan p]

Acts 2: 38 is the start of the Body of Christ and the true Isael.

Hi , and where in the CONTEXT of Acts 2:38 , is the Body of Christ mentioned ??

dan p

 

[RichardBurger]

Doctrines of men thats all th
ey are.
The Body of Christ is Israel. as you can't be one or the other.
Grace was always there but with Christ it abound.
God does not make up things like the ten commandments and then reject it or some rubbish like an age of grace and another age of etc etc ? as it grows ?

You really need to read Romans 11. The body of Christ has not replaced Israel.

 

[bling]

Hi , and where in the CONTEXT of Acts 2:38 , is the Body of Christ mentioned ??

dan p

From acts 2: 38 on you have the "Body of Christ being discribed. The "Body of Christ" was never ment to be a title like all the othe words used to discripe the people of the way, but it is a discriptive term.

 

[lawrance]

You really need to read Romans 11. The body of Christ has not replaced Israel.

Not replaced but we in Christ are Israel.

 

[dan p]

Not replaced but we in Christ are Israel.

Hi , and I have heard this many times , so where is a verse that confirms it ?

I have a verse that Positively , refutes that is Num 23:9 , For Israel SHALL DWELL ALONE and not reckoned among the NATIONS/ETHNOS /GENTILES , what a verse , dan p

 

[jiggyfly]

One of the things that helps in these discussions is to know what God's goal is, what He has designed His plan to accomplish, and like many plans there are different stages , so it helps to know the different stages. But if you don't know what the goal is then the a stage can be confused with the goal.

20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
1 Cor 15:20-28 (KJV)

 

[dan p]

One of the things that helps in these discussions is to know what God's goal is, what He has designed His plan to accomplish, and like many plans there are different stages , so it helps to know the different stages. But if you don't know what the goal is then the a stage can be confused with the goal.

20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept. 21 For since by man came death, by man came also the resurrection of the dead. 22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive. 23 But every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward they that are Christ's at his coming. 24 Then cometh the end, when he shall have delivered up the kingdom to God, even the Father; when he shall have put down all rule and all authority and power. 25 For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death. 27 For he hath put all things under his feet. But when he saith all things are put under him, it is manifest that he is excepted, which did put all things under him. 28 And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.
1 Cor 15:20-28 (KJV)

Hi m, and what Num 23:9 , is that Israel is Israel and not to be mixed with Gentiles , but Gentiles can join Israel , BUT Gentiles have to follow the Law Moses , dan p

 

[veteran]

Israel has dwelt alone (separate), per the sense of the Numbers 23:9 verse.


IKing 8:51-53
51 For they be Thy people, and Thine inheritance, which Thou broughtest forth out of Egypt, from the midst of the furnace of iron:
52 That Thine eyes may be open unto the supplication of Thy servant, and unto the supplication of Thy people Israel, to hearken unto them in all that they call for unto Thee.
53 For Thou didst separate them from among all the people of the earth, to be Thine inheritance, as Thou spakest by the hand of Moses Thy servant, when Thou broughtest our fathers out of Egypt, O Lord GOD.
(KJV)


2 Cor 6:16-18
16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
17 Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,
18 And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be My sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty.
(KJV)

 

[jiggyfly]

Hi m, and what Num 23:9 , is that Israel is Israel and not to be mixed with Gentiles , but Gentiles can join Israel , BUT Gentiles have to follow the Law Moses , dan p

Dan p, not sure how your post relates to mine can you elaborate?

 

[RichardBurger]

Hi m, and what Num 23:9 , is that Israel is Israel and not to be mixed with Gentiles , but Gentiles can join Israel , BUT Gentiles have to follow the Law Moses , dan p

You are a continuation of the Judiazers that kept trying to get the Gentiles to go back under the Law of Moses.

In the age of the "kingdom Gospel" a Gentiles could become a Jewish prosylite by keeping the Law of Moses.

In this age of God's grace a Jew can become a member of the body of Christ by forsaking the Law of Moses and placing his/her faith in the work of Jesus on the cross. (the flip side) In this age of grace there is no difference in the Jew and the Gentile because both (all) have become very sinful.

 

[Episkopos]

Hyper-dispensationalism is heresy of the first order. It seeks to belittle the truth and bring division. Those divisive ones should be cast out of the church...as per the bible warning.

There is only one gospel and that is the gospel of the kingdom.

Act 19:8 And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.
Act 19:9 But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus.
Act 19:10 And this continued by the space of two years; so that all they which dwelt in Asia heard the word of the Lord Jesus, both Jews and Greeks.

Hyper-dispensationalists are hardened and believe not. They speak evil of the Way of Christ.