22 major reasons to abandon the Premil doctrine

[Truther]

“Spare the rod, spoil the premillennialist.”

Spank the preterists with the rod.

 

[Truther]

No sign language whatsoever, it's a Metaphor

We're the parables also sign language

Last response to this sign craziness

What is crazy is saying that the word of God per the book of Revelations is a metaphor, which is totally in the changing of the word described at the end of the book. Calling it a metaphor will send you straight to hell according to Revelation 22. It is a literal book with a few signs. That is your safe bet. Don’t be crazy and say these words and verses mean something other than what we are reading. No adding or subtracting.

 

[Truth7t7]

Explain 2 World Wars then? They all were not consumed by fire from heaven when attacking Jerusalem. There are wars being fought this very minute. How is Satan currently bound but wars have still raged on over the last 1992 years?

It appears your reading comprehension is lacking, Satan is "Specifically" bound from deceiving the nations to the future battle of Armageddon, perhaps you need to read the post again "Real Slow"

 

[WPM]

The devil reigns over the sinners of the earth. Jesus reigns over his saints. Jesus reigns over the devil who reigns over the sinners. Now you know what it’s all about. The devil roams to and fro seeking whom he may devour which you deny. That is what Preterists do best.

Your BIG-devil-and-small-Jesus theology is erroneous. Read 1 Peter 5:8: “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour.” The very next verse 1 Peter 5:9 affirms, “whom resist stedfast in the faith.”

The true Church of Jesus Christ is a resistance movement. While Satan resists us, the Bible says we have power to resist him, and subjugate his purposes against us. We resist the lawlessness and evil encroachments of the devil around us.

In fact, James 4:7 tells us what happens when you do resist, “Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.”

This is incredible! You resist, he must flee. This word “flee” in the original means to escape, flee away or vanish. Now think about it. When you resist, he must disappear. The conflict today for the Church is not an earthly battle to possess an earthly territory but a spiritual battle to possess spiritual territory.

By resisting Satan, standing upon the Word of God, and staying steadfast, we have enormous individual impact upon the kingdom of darkness; we curtail the expansion of its evil designs.

 

[WPM]

Jesus ruling with a rod of iron is not my opinion, but it is in the Bible. I just agree with it.

What does the Greek word for "rule" mean? If you would have checked this out it might have help you understand what it is talking about.

 

[WPM]

So you agree that future national Israel is who is a promise to the fathers is originally for and we are expanded into this promise?

The old is gone. The new covenant doesn't contain such. Where is it in the NT?

 

[David Boyer]

Who invented that redefinition of English in Rev chapter 1?

What redefinition? Greek is the language, not English.

 

[David Boyer]

Are the devils going forth below to gather the Nations to (World War I ) or (World War II) "NO"

As you have been clearly shown, "Deceive The Nations To Battle" is specific to the future final battle at "Armageddon"

Satan Is Loosed At The End Of The Tribulation When The 6th Vial Is Poured Out As Seen In (Revelation) 16:12 below, The Deception Is Devils In False Miracles Going Forth To The Kings Of The Earth, To Gather Them To The Final Battle

(Revelation) 16:12-17KJV
12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and the water thereof was dried up, that the way of the kings of the east might be prepared.
13 And I saw three unclean spirits like frogs come out of the mouth of the dragon, and out of the mouth of the beast, and out of the mouth of the false prophet.
14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
15 Behold, I come as a thief. Blessed is he that watcheth, and keepeth his garments, lest he walk naked, and they see his shame.
16 And he gathered them together into a place called in the Hebrew tongue Armageddon.
17 And the seventh angel poured out his vial into the air; and there came a great voice out of the temple of heaven, from the throne, saying, It is done.

Nothing in your response indicates that the nature of the restraint of the Devil is solely to "Deceive The Nations To Battle".
That is just what Satan does when released.
Some remedial English lessons would do wonders for your understanding.

 

[Truther]

Your BIG-devil-and-small-Jesus theology is erroneous. Read 1 Peter 5:8: “Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour.” The very next verse 1 Peter 5:9 affirms, “whom resist stedfast in the faith.”

The true Church of Jesus Christ is a resistance movement. While Satan resists us, the Bible says we have power to resist him, and subjugate his purposes against us. We resist the lawlessness and evil encroachments of the devil around us.

In fact, James 4:7 tells us what happens when you do resist, “Resist the devil, and he will flee from you.”

This is incredible! You resist, he must flee. This word “flee” in the original means to escape, flee away or vanish. Now think about it. When you resist, he must disappear. The conflict today for the Church is not an earthly battle to possess an earthly territory but a spiritual battle to possess spiritual territory.

By resisting Satan, standing upon the Word of God, and staying steadfast, we have enormous individual impact upon the kingdom of darkness; we curtail the expansion of its evil designs.

Only the saint can withstand the devil or demons by first obeying Acts 2:38, then resisting sin.

The rest of the world is a sitting duck for their taskmaster.

 

[Truther]

What does the Greek word for "rule" mean? If you would have checked this out it might have help you understand what it is talking about.

The KJV works just fine for me. I don't seek "Greek" redefinitions to attempt to debunk the KJV by some goofy guy like Strong.

 

[WPM]

The KJV works just fine for me. I don't seek "Greek" redefinitions to attempt to debunk the KJV by some goofy guy like Strong.

I use the KJV also. But the word "rule" means "shepherd." Christ will shepherd over the nations at the end. He will shepherd over the sheep and goats and will separate them. That is what the word rendered reign/rule in the KJV actually means in the original Greek. There is nowhere in Scripture that says that He will rule over them with the rod of iron for 1000 years. That is a Premil invention.

The word poimaino shows us that Christ is going to divide at the end between the sheep and the goats like a shepherd. You avoid the key destructive detail contained in the Greek and Hebrew words that show the destruction of the nations. For example: The original Greek in Revelation 19:15 states “he should (patasso ho ethnos kai autous poimaino autous) smite the nations, and shepherd them with a rod of iron.”

The coming of Christ is not to high-five sin and mollycoddle sinners. It is to judge sinners and banish sin from the earth forever. Premil ushers countless mortal rebels unto the new earth, but Scripture shows they are all totally destroyed. The new earth is incorrupt! Only the incorrupt can possess it. Your argument conflicts with clear and repeated Scripture.

Here we see the Savior revealed who was brought forth to shepherd. Interesting, the man-child was caught up to His throne from where He now currently sovereignly shepherds the nations.

 

[Truther]

The old is gone. The new covenant doesn't contain such. Where is it in the NT?

The old covenant is not gone, because sin is not gone.

The Law describes sin and judges it today.

The Law will judge sinners and is the standard for sinners at Rev 20(the books).

Only the saint has obtained Grace and is free from the Law.

This means, there is a way out of wrath and judgement for those that obey Acts 2:38 and walk in the Spirit.

 

[Truther]

What redefinition? Greek is the language, not English.

Modernists redefine(correct) the KJV and retranslate new bibles with phony redefinitions.

 

[WPM]

Only the saint can withstand the devil or demons by first obeying Acts 2:38, then resisting sin.

The rest of the world is a sitting duck for their taskmaster.

God has got restraining power over the devil, so has the Church.In Matthew 12 we see the religious Jews rejecting Christ. Matthew 12:14-22 records, “Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against him, how they might destroy him. But when Jesus knew it, he withdrew himself from thence: and great multitudes followed him, and he healed them all; And charged them that they should not make him known: That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Behold my servant, whom I have chosen; my beloved, in whom my soul is well pleased: I will put my spirit upon him, and he shall shew judgment to the Gentiles. He shall not strive, nor cry; neither shall any man hear his voice in the streets. A bruised reed shall he not break, and smoking flax shall he not quench, till he send forth judgment unto victory. And in his name shall the Gentiles trust. Then was brought unto him one possessed with a devil, blind, and dumb: and he healed him, insomuch that the blind and dumb both spake and saw.”

Christ’s rejection by his own house (Israel) saw Him turn to the Gentiles and the formerly outcast. He was now going to invade the devil’s house and acquire a spoil. Immediately after the Jews turned on Him in this story He delivers one of Satan’s household – a demon possessed man – thus illustrating that there was a darkened people out there that would come to faith in Christ. He used this man who belonged to the devil’s own house (kingdom) to impress the direction of the Gospel from hereon. Now, my main point is this: this reading expressly declares “in his name shall the Gentiles trust.” Using the Premil argument: all the Gentiles must trust, or this cannot apply today. What I am saying is, if you were to apply this argument namely that the fact that the vast bulk of Gentiles still remain deceived is evidence why we can’t be in the millennium now then we must (if we are consistent) apply the same rule to this statement to show that it can’t be relevant to today. It cannot relate to the here-and-now because the majority of Gentiles still don’t trust God. Of course, that would be preposterous. Such a statement is a general reference to the removal of the veil deceiving the Gentiles as a whole after the cross.

Paul draws several of the Old Testament prophecies, relating to the removing of this global deception upon the ethnos, together in Romans 15:8-12 and shows how this began with the life, death and resurrection of Christ and the subsequent evangelism of the early Church. He declares, “Now I say that Jesus Christ was a minister of the circumcision for the truth of God, to confirm the promises made unto the fathers: And that the ethnos Gentiles might glorify God for his mercy; as it is written (in 1 Samuel 22:50), For this cause I will confess to thee among the ethnos Gentiles, and sing unto thy name. And again he saith (in Psalm 18:49), Rejoice, ye ethnos Gentiles, with his people. And again (in Deuteronomy 32:43), Praise the Lord, all ye ethnos Gentiles; and laud him, all ye people. And again (in Isaiah 11:10), Esaias saith, There shall be a root of Jesse, and he that shall rise to reign over the ethnos Gentiles; in him shall the ethnos Gentiles trust.”

The Old Testament writers predicted that there was a time coming when the Gentiles would accept Christ, glorify His name and trust Him. Now, here is an important question: do all the Gentiles fully and wholly surrender to Jesus? Using the Premil argument on Revelation 20:2 they must. After all, this reading makes a blanket statement they would believe, without qualification. Indeed, did that mean that the majority of Gentiles would do so? Of course not. Did that mean that the majority of Gentile nations would turn to God? Of course not. Did that mean that the majority of Gentiles would turn from heathenism? Of course not. This was talking about the general enlightenment of the Gentiles.

 

[Truther]

I use the KJV also. But the word "rule" means "shepherd." Christ will shepherd over the nations at the end. He will shepherd over the sheep and goats and will separate them. That is what the word rendered reign/rule in the KJV actually means in the original Greek. There is nowhere in Scripture that says that He will rule over them with the rod of iron for 1000 years. That is a Premil invention.

The word poimaino shows us that Christ is going to divide at the end between the sheep and the goats like a shepherd. You avoid the key destructive detail contained in the Greek and Hebrew words that show the destruction of the nations. For example: The original Greek in Revelation 19:15 states “he should (patasso ho ethnos kai autous poimaino autous) smite the nations, and shepherd them with a rod of iron.”

The coming of Christ is not to high-five sin and mollycoddle sinners. It is to judge sinners and banish sin from the earth forever. Premil ushers countless mortal rebels unto the new earth, but Scripture shows they are all totally destroyed. The new earth is incorrupt! Only the incorrupt can possess it. Your argument conflicts with clear and repeated Scripture.

Here we see the Savior revealed who was brought forth to shepherd. Interesting, the man-child was caught up to His throne from where He now currently sovereignly shepherds the nations.

No, rule means rule.

Don't rething the KJV.

It was there 400 years before you were born.

Fake religions redefine words daily to make their proposals.

 

[WPM]

Modernists redefine(correct) the KJV and retranslate new bibles with phony redefinitions.

The KJV is not perfect. It is only a translation. The Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek.

 

[Truther]

No, rule means rule.

Don't rething the KJV.

It was there 400 years before you were born.

Fake religions redefine words daily to make their proposals.

You have no original Greek, nor are your modern translators qualified to translate anymore.

 

[David Boyer]

Modernists redefine(correct) the KJV and retranslate new bibles with phony redefinitions.

Greek... not English.
So where do you get the Greek from?

 

[Truther]

The KJV is not perfect. It is only a translation. The Bible was written in Hebrew and Greek.

The originals don't exist, nor do qualified translators today.

They are all hand me down modernists from seminary.

 

[WPM]

No, rule means rule.

Don't rething the KJV.

It was there 400 years before you were born.

Fake religions redefine words daily to make their proposals.

I hate to burst yoiur bubble. But the reigning over the nations with a rod of iron described in Revelation 2, 12 and 19 is a shepherding over the nations at the end. This is not reigning for a 1,000 years as Premils intimate. In fact, one thousand years are not mentioned in the reading. The only thing awaiting the wicked after Christ’s coming is judgment then eternal punishment.