Is believing/faith a work ?

[amigo de christo]

Hebrews 11:8,
-by faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.
The faith that saves is the faith that obeys.

Dont ye know that to whom ye obey HIS SERVANTS YE ARE . I Got news , james didnt write that , PAUL DID .
Paul also wrote , he who provides not , A DOING ACTION JESUS TAUGHT TO DO , specially for those of his own household
HE has DENIED , DENIED what , THE FAITH and is worse than an infidel . Too many folks
teach that pual and james were at odds with another , or that one wrote to the jews the other to the gentiles .
THE TRUTH IS they BOTH WROTE TO THE CHURCH . I am telling us all that too many are following a jesus
that led them down the broad road . FOLLOW JESUS and by that i mean the BIBLICAL ONE .
Now hands up , titus , ITS LORD PRAISING TIME .

 

[amigo de christo]

Hebrews 11:8,
-by faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.
The faith that saves is the faith that obeys.

paul wrote that as well . exactly .

 

[amigo de christo]

Hebrews 11:8,
-by faith Abraham obeyed when he was called to go out to the place which he would receive as an inheritance. And he went out, not knowing where he was going.
The faith that saves is the faith that obeys.

By FAITH he did what . OBEYED . Just as love cannot be seperated from obediance nor can faith .
HE WHO LOVES ME OBEYS ME . exactly .

 

[bbyrd009]

Because Abraham believed(faith) God...
Genesis 15:6,
-and he believed in the Lord, and God accounted it to him for righteousness.

well now i am finding aman there, dunno what i was looking at before hmm

 

[brightfame52]

Because Abraham believed(faith) God...
Genesis 15:6,
-and he believed in the Lord, and God accounted it to him for righteousness.

This scripture tells us that Abraham believed in Jesus Christ to be his righteousness. His God given Faith believed in Jesus Christ who was to come, and even be of his seed, and establish a righteousness for His people. God had before preached the Gospel of Christ to Abraham Gal 3:8

6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness.

7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed.

So thats what was counted to him as righteousness, not his believing, but the object of what he believed, Christ his righteousness, he heard about in the Gospel preached to him.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

still conflating faith and belief, ernest? hmm
ok then
(5 diff kinds of “belief,” what)

The words 'faith' and 'believe' come from the same Greek root word pisteuo where faith is a noun and believe is a verb.

The problem I see with the faith onlyist is they are trying to conflate obedience to God's will as if obedience is a work of merit.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Works !

Yes, obedience to God's will saves whereas works of merit and the flawless works required by the OT law do not. All works are not alike as seen in Rom 10:3 where one work (going about to establish their OWN righteousness) that does not save rather than obeying GOD'S righteousness that does save.

 

[brightfame52]

Yes, obedience to God's will saves whereas works of merit and the flawless works required by the OT law do not. All works are not alike as seen in Rom 10:3 where one work (going about to establish their OWN righteousness) that does not save rather than obeying GOD'S righteousness that does save.

Works !

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

Works !

Do you understand that all works spoken about in the Bible are not alike, not all the same? Works of God, works of Satan, good works, evil works, works of righteousness, works of unrighteousness, works of the OT law, works of merit, works in obeying God's will are not all alike, not all the same? Do you understand that there is not a single verse that eliminates all works of all kinds from becoming saved? Do you understand that obedience to God's will is not a work of merit? Unless a person understands these facts they will never have an accurate understanding of NT salvation.

 

[Titus]

Do you understand that all works spoken about in the Bible are not alike, not all the same? Works of God, works of Satan, good works, evil works, works of righteousness, works of unrighteousness, works of the OT law, works of merit, works in obeying God's will are not all alike, not all the same? Do you understand that there is not a single verse that eliminates all works of all kinds from becoming saved? Do you understand that obedience to God's will is not a work of merit? Unless a person understands these facts they will never have an accurate understanding of NT salvation.

Right, if every kind of work before salvation are meritorious in nature. Then to be consistent with that belief all works of every kind after salvation would be meritorious. Because of the lack of not differentiating works into there proper categories. Therefore no one could do a work after salvation(all works are merit) otherwise they would be earning eternal life. Excellent work Ernest T Bass.

 

[brightfame52]

Do you understand that all works spoken about in the Bible are not alike, not all the same? Works of God, works of Satan, good works, evil works, works of righteousness, works of unrighteousness, works of the OT law, works of merit, works in obeying God's will are not all alike, not all the same? Do you understand that there is not a single verse that eliminates all works of all kinds from becoming saved? Do you understand that obedience to God's will is not a work of merit? Unless a person understands these facts they will never have an accurate understanding of NT salvation.

All works are the same, conditions performed by man that makes a difference. BTW you may say what you do like believing isn't considered meritorious, but it is, because you are saying it made the difference in one being saved and lost. Its also boasting and pride.

If your supposedly obedience to Gods will is what got you saved/righteous, and if you had not did it, you would be lost, then thats meritorious works salvation.

See God only accepts the obedience of one to His will that saved many, or made them righteous, and thats Jesus Christ. Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

His obedience was to Gods will Heb 10:9-10

9 then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. 10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

See His Obedience was meritorious in saving Gods people.

 

[brightfame52]

If we condition Salvation/Justification based on our faith or believing, as some say of God in eternal election and foreknowledge, that God did see beforehand who would believe on Him, and Justified them based upon that, then that means God Justified us based upon some foreseen grace or goodness in us, which totally does away with being Justified freely by His Grace Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Thats what makes faith/believing a meritorious work! 26

 

[Titus]

If your supposedly obedience to Gods will is what got you saved/righteous, and if you had not did it, you would be lost, then thats meritorious works salvation

Which unbelievers will be saved?
If you don't believe will you be saved?

John 8:24,
-if  you do not believe that I am He you will die in your sins.

 

[brightfame52]

Which unbelievers will be saved?
If you don't believe will you be saved?

John 8:24,
-if  you do not believe that I am He you will die in your sins.

Your question doesnt make sense to me. Any unbeliever Christ died for shall be saved.

 

[Titus]

Your question doesnt make sense to me. Any unbeliever Christ died for shall be saved.

Well I'm impressed with your honesty.

 

[Titus]

John 8:24,
-Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.

 

[brightfame52]

John 8:24,
-Therefore I said to you that you will die in your sins; for if you do not believe that I am He, you will die in your sins.

If a person doesent believe in Christ and dies in their sins, that means He never died for their sins.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

All works are the same, conditions performed by man that makes a difference. BTW you may say what you do like believing isn't considered meritorious, but it is, because you are saying it made the difference in one being saved and lost. Its also boasting and pride.

If your supposedly obedience to Gods will is what got you saved/righteous, and if you had not did it, you would be lost, then thats meritorious works salvation.

See God only accepts the obedience of one to His will that saved many, or made them righteous, and thats Jesus Christ. Rom 5:19

19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many be made righteous.

His obedience was to Gods will Heb 10:9-10

9 then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second. 10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

See His Obedience was meritorious in saving Gods people.

Incredible statement to claim "all works are the same" when it is evident they are not the same.....

God's works the same as Satan's works?
righteous works the same as unrighteous works?
Good works the same as evil works?
Works of merit the same as obedience?

Romans 5:19 "For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the one shall the many be made righteous."

The verse does not teach many are made righteous UNconditionally independent of anything man does simply because Christ died. Christ died for every man (Heb 2:9) but every man will not be UNconditionally saved.
Men are made righteous by CONDITIONALLY doing righteousness......those who work righteousness are accepted with God, (Acts 10:35). 1 Jn 3:10 those who continue to not do righteousness continue to not be of God. Paul speaks of serving "obedience unto righteousness" (Romans 6:16).

Hence men are CONDITIONALLY made sinners when they chhose to sin by transgressing God's laws and are CONDITIONALLY made righteous by choosing to obey God's NT gospel.

 

[Ernest T. Bass]

If we condition Salvation/Justification based on our faith or believing, as some say of God in eternal election and foreknowledge, that God did see beforehand who would believe on Him, and Justified them based upon that, then that means God Justified us based upon some foreseen grace or goodness in us, which totally does away with being Justified freely by His Grace Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Thats what makes faith/believing a meritorious work! 26

if believing is a meritorious work, then;

Rom 10:10 believeth unto righteousness must mean righteousness is earned/merited
John 3:16 whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life must mean eternal life is earned/merited
mark 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved must mean salvation is earned/merited

 

[brightfame52]

Incredible statement to claim "all works are the same" when it is evident they are not the same.....

God's works the same as Satan's works?
righteous works the same as unrighteous works?
Good works the same as evil works?
Works of merit the same as obedience?

Romans 5:19 "For as through the one man's disobedience the many were made sinners, even so through the obedience of the one shall the many be made righteous."

The verse does not teach many are made righteous UNconditionally independent of anything man does simply because Christ died. Christ died for every man (Heb 2:9) but every man will not be UNconditionally saved.
Men are made righteous by CONDITIONALLY doing righteousness......those who work righteousness are accepted with God, (Acts 10:35). 1 Jn 3:10 those who continue to not do righteousness continue to not be of God. Paul speaks of serving "obedience unto righteousness" (Romans 6:16).

Hence men are CONDITIONALLY made sinners when they chhose to sin by transgressing God's laws and are CONDITIONALLY made righteous by choosing to obey God's NT gospel.

If you condition salvation on something you do, its works.