‘I SAID, YOU ARE GODS’?

[L.A.M.B.]

@WalkInLight
I understand keyboard language can at its best be difficult to understand as far as expression, tone, inflictions ect. as opposed to face to face communications .
But accepting of heresies whether by opinion or error of indoctrination IMO is harmful to the body of Christ

Galatians 5 KJV

5 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

7 Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth?

8 This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you.

9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.

 

[Karl Peters]

In full agreement here-our freedom of speech is being monitored and Jesus and God is ALL love and nothing else.
Stay grounded and rooted in Christ Jesus brother-many, many are lukewarm, having an outward appearance of godliness-and that's all.
Lawlessness is rife the world over and the "Bible thumpers" are an impediment/impeachment/obstacle to the sexual mores of most.
God bless.
J.

Yes, Jesus is love but what does that really mean to us??

It means He reproves us - and we don't like that, do we???

Rev 3:19 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.'

And because He loves us He disciplines us!! And we really don't like that!! Anyone reproving us and suggesting discipline - they are not loving us, right??

Then He asks us to be zealous for Him and repent of our ways to doing things - all because He loves us!!

Well, are we zealous for Him or for leaning on our own understanding?????

If indeed we want His reproof, and can see there would be value in having God HImself prove us, the that would mean we would want His discipline, meaning that we would want to be His disciple of His. And that would mean we are actually getting zealous for Him and that we are in fact actually repenting of our ways!! And it would also mean that we want to hear from Him, so we would actually seek His voice with the little bit of faith that says God is there and might talk to us!!

Rev 3:20 ‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.

Yet, we don't want to hear from Him, because we don't want the reproof, and we are not interested in actually being discipled by Him,and are absolutely unwilling to be actually zealous for Him, so are not going to repent of our ways!! Still, we might want to give the outward appearance of godliness - so we study the Bible and what other seemingly wise men have said about it, so we can present ourselves as experts about God and have never actually heard from Him, and have never actually heard from Him. We have in fact closed our ears to Him!! And we tell ourselves He doesn't know all this, but He knows!!

He knows how men are. How they want to lean on their own understanding! And how they deny Him, and how He is always around to talk to them! He knows how He wishes that they would just repent of leaning on their own understanding and talk to Him. He knows all that because He loves them!! They just will not believe in Him, and are just giving "an outward appearance of godliness-and that's all!"

So being cleaver in His love for them He even puts His words even in their own mouth and proclaims that as you judge so shall you be judged!

The men who know the Lord tells others to get to know Him, because they truly know Him and He is worth knowing!! And so the men who hear Him, tell other men to seek to hear Him, because they truly hear from Him and understand that He is worth hearing from!! And if a man, being just a man, hears from God they understand that if and since God talks to them He will surely talk to anyone else!! They understand that if other men just want to know the loving God they will want the reproof, the discipline, will repent, and will be zealous for God. So, they will seek the Lord and His voice and they will find Him. After all, that worked for them, and they are just another man walking around in the flesh!

John knew the Lord. He heard Him and walked with Him. He could give a person this revelation - and the information above is still a revelation to many who pretend!

In fact all those authors of the Bible knew the above revelation, that He was always the Great I Am and always wanted people to repent of their ways and seek His voice!!

Of course we went over that seeking and actually hearing His voice using: verse after verse, after verse, after verse, after verse, after verse!!

And we can add more verses, because this pretending to know the Lord is all over the Bible!!

Is 30:1“Woe to the rebellious children,” declares the LORD,
“Who execute a plan, but not Mine,
And make an alliance, but not of My Spirit,
In order to add sin to sin;

That is what they have to "execute a plan, but not His" if they refuse to listen to Him!

But if they have refused to seek Him and listen to Him, it is not going to help writing to them, is it? The writing will only serve as a testimony that they were told to seek Him and His voice, so if it comes up in the future, like perhaps on the day of judgement, a record can be shown to them, how they were told to seek Him. So what is the purpose of the writings in the Bible to them who will not listen? And what is the purpose for even me writing to them, if they refuse to seeking Him and His voice. They only serve as a witness against them!

Is 30:8 Now go, write it on a tablet before them
And inscribe it on a scroll,
That it may serve in the time to come
As a witness forever.

Is 30:9
For this is a rebellious people, false sons,
Sons who refuse to listen
To the instruction of the LORD;

Is 30:10
Who say to the seers, “You must not see visions”;
And to the prophets, “You must not prophesy to us what is right,
Speak to us pleasant words,
Prophesy illusions.

Is 30:11 “Get out of the way, turn aside from the path,
Let us hear no more about the Holy One of Israel.”

Yeah - people say in their hearts that if the words to them are not pleasant words they are not loving.
Ok - you can shut off from hearing about the Holy One of Israel!! So many many do just that!! Yet to what end does that lead?

 

[WalkInLight]

@WalkInLight
I understand keyboard language can at its best be difficult to understand as far as expression, tone, inflictions ect. as opposed to face to face communications .
But accepting of heresies whether by opinion or error of indoctrination IMO is harmful to the body of Christ

Galatians 5 KJV

5 Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

2 Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.

4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

5 For we through the Spirit wait for the hope of righteousness by faith.

6 For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision; but faith which worketh by love.

7 Ye did run well; who did hinder you that ye should not obey the truth?

8 This persuasion cometh not of him that calleth you.

9 A little leaven leaveneth the whole lump.

I agree with a little leaven leavens the whole lump.
A forum is literally an exchange of positions without the accompanying context and other background.

Within this context, there are people here who in real life one would never meet.
A lot of the latter rain theology I only saw in detail through forums and videos of sermons.
The great thing is they have to expand their answer to biblical challenges and often a lot of things one believes could not possibly mean the same thing to these folk. Three examples of this are

1. Sermon on the mount is only for Jews and it is legalism to believe its for christians,
2. Elijah sinned because he ran away for Jezebel in fear.
3. Repentance is just changing an opinion without any necessary change of behaviour.

A whole group could not believe anyone held this position, so the group spelt it out in detail.
They had reinterpreted major theological words to mean for them something different than traditional theology.
They have the same chorus and worship, but the teaching is quite different.

Because of this education I understood why the NAR is heretical, and how their foundation is a different gospel.
Some fellowships who have been taken over by NAR groups, have found bible believing Christians are expelled as evil opponents.
What has been surprising is the anger and hatred a lot of these folk feel towards repenting faithful believers.

When you see such folk come into churches you know their intention, and the effect they will have.
On balance a lot of believers do not know the theology and its failure, so its fine to see the best and bless where possible.
God bless you

 

[WalkInLight]

Yes, Jesus is love but what does that really mean to us??

It means He reproves us - and we don't like that, do we???

Rev 3:19 ‘Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent.'

And because He loves us He disciplines us!! And we really don't like that!! Anyone reproving us and suggesting discipline - they are not loving us, right??

Then He asks us to be zealous for Him and repent of our ways to doing things - all because He loves us!!

Well, are we zealous for Him or for leaning on our own understanding?????

If indeed we want His reproof, and can see there would be value in having God HImself prove us, the that would mean we would want His discipline, meaning that we would want to be His disciple of His. And that would mean we are actually getting zealous for Him and that we are in fact actually repenting of our ways!! And it would also mean that we want to hear from Him, so we would actually seek His voice with the little bit of faith that says God is there and might talk to us!!

Rev 3:20 ‘Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me.

Yet, we don't want to hear from Him, because we don't want the reproof, and we are not interested in actually being discipled by Him,and are absolutely unwilling to be actually zealous for Him, so are not going to repent of our ways!! Still, we might want to give the outward appearance of godliness - so we study the Bible and what other seemingly wise men have said about it, so we can present ourselves as experts about God and have never actually heard from Him, and have never actually heard from Him. We have in fact closed our ears to Him!! And we tell ourselves He doesn't know all this, but He knows!!

He knows how men are. How they want to lean on their own understanding! And how they deny Him, and how He is always around to talk to them! He knows how He wishes that they would just repent of leaning on their own understanding and talk to Him. He knows all that because He loves them!! They just will not believe in Him, and are just giving "an outward appearance of godliness-and that's all!"

So being cleaver in His love for them He even puts His words even in their own mouth and proclaims that as you judge so shall you be judged!

The men who know the Lord tells others to get to know Him, because they truly know Him and He is worth knowing!! And so the men who hear Him, tell other men to seek to hear Him, because they truly hear from Him and understand that He is worth hearing from!! And if a man, being just a man, hears from God they understand that if and since God talks to them He will surely talk to anyone else!! They understand that if other men just want to know the loving God they will want the reproof, the discipline, will repent, and will be zealous for God. So, they will seek the Lord and His voice and they will find Him. After all, that worked for them, and they are just another man walking around in the flesh!

John knew the Lord. He heard Him and walked with Him. He could give a person this revelation - and the information above is still a revelation to many who pretend!

In fact all those authors of the Bible knew the above revelation, that He was always the Great I Am and always wanted people to repent of their ways and seek His voice!!

Of course we went over that seeking and actually hearing His voice using: verse after verse, after verse, after verse, after verse, after verse!!

And we can add more verses, because this pretending to know the Lord is all over the Bible!!

Is 30:1“Woe to the rebellious children,” declares the LORD,
“Who execute a plan, but not Mine,
And make an alliance, but not of My Spirit,
In order to add sin to sin;

That is what they have to "execute a plan, but not His" if they refuse to listen to Him!

But if they have refused to seek Him and listen to Him, it is not going to help writing to them, is it? The writing will only serve as a testimony that they were told to seek Him and His voice, so if it comes up in the future, like perhaps on the day of judgement, a record can be shown to them, how they were told to seek Him. So what is the purpose of the writings in the Bible to them who will not listen? And what is the purpose for even me writing to them, if they refuse to seeking Him and His voice. They only serve as a witness against them!

Is 30:8 Now go, write it on a tablet before them
And inscribe it on a scroll,
That it may serve in the time to come
As a witness forever.

Is 30:9
For this is a rebellious people, false sons,
Sons who refuse to listen
To the instruction of the LORD;

Is 30:10
Who say to the seers, “You must not see visions”;
And to the prophets, “You must not prophesy to us what is right,
Speak to us pleasant words,
Prophesy illusions.

Is 30:11 “Get out of the way, turn aside from the path,
Let us hear no more about the Holy One of Israel.”

Yeah - people say in their hearts that if the words to them are not pleasant words they are not loving.
Ok - you can shut off from hearing about the Holy One of Israel!! So many many do just that!! Yet to what end does that lead?

Sadly so much of the church is listening to prophets proclaiming Trump as Gods messenger.
So God has chosen a liar, sexual abuser, a man who calls friends enemies as soon as they upset him is the example we should all
follow and it matters the fate of the USA.

It is no coincidence that the prophets have come alive to this message when they are the ones who reject a righteous walk and love transforming the heart. They are digging a grave for themselves and their groups, and when judgement falls they will regret it all.

Funnily many of their preachers claim God will judge you for speaking about their sin and failure.

And this has grown because you can get money and a ministry from predicting rubbish and dressing it up as from the Lord.
The prophets of baal did this and it did not end well for them. I have heard decades of predictions of revivals and works of God, while the opposite has taken place and churches are closing and fellowships disappearing because believing God will heal you and the person dies, says God does not care and the promise of healing is a lie. Who benefits from this?

God bless you

 

[CadyandZoe]

Jn 10:31 - 38 The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?” The Jews answered Him, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” Jesus answered them, “Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I SAID, YOU ARE GODS’? “If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’? “If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”

There is a certain subject that the Jews had trouble with when Jesus the Christ was on earth in the flesh!! They had trouble with Him being One with the Father!!

So I guess it would not be surprising that there are those today who have trouble with the idea of the Oneness of God!! Some want to argue about how the Lord our God is One Lord - and that the Holy Spirit says Jesus Christ is Lord!

Mark 12:29 Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD;

Deut 6:4 “Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!

1 Cor 12:3 Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus is accursed”; and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

Of course who don't know Jesus Christ is our Lord and is also God, are going to have a problem with Jesus Christ being the Lord our God, no matter how often this is discussed in the Scriptures! Still, this Oneness is discussed over and over and over again in the Bible, despite what they think! Indeed, if you read the Bible you will note that this Oneness is what saves us, because we are saved because we come into a oneness with God ourselves!!

Jn 17: 19 - 22 “For their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth. “I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; hat they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. “The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one;

Jesus prayed that we would be one with Him even as He is one with His Father. Of course we are not perfect like Him!! He is the perfect image of the invisible God, and is one with His Father, so He is God - even if the religious Jews back then didn't like Him being God!!!

And note that when He prays He gets what He asks for! The true believer, whether anyone cares to believe it or not, becomes one with Jesus Christ, because He sends His Holy Spirit to indwell us. Of course that doesn't mean we are the perfect image of the invisible God!! We still too often lean on our understanding instead of doing and saying only what the Lord our God tells us. But still we have the Holy Spirit of God (meaning God) inside us. What did we think it meant when we read about being Born Again. When Born Again, we are born of the Holy Spirit, meaning it is not just us in us, but God also is in us. We are a new creature in Christ, because we have His spirit in us, to listen to if we decide to listen. So we hear the sound of the wind (the Holy Spirit) who indwells us!!

That is why it was written "he called them gods, to whom the word of God came"

We get salvation when His Holy Spirit comes into us! And the Holy Spirit brings us the words that the Lord our God Jesus Christ has to speak to us personally - which is why "to whom the word of God came"!!

Now I certainly don't feel like any god, even with a small "g"!! Never-the Less, I do hear from my Lord vis His Holy Spirit speaking His words to my spirit. And also, by following His instructions, there have been times in my life when I have seen miracles!! Hundreds of them, actually! I can't do them, but i can do what He asks of me, and He has asked me at times to pray for other people, and then I saw miracles happen! Honestly, it seems that the Holy Spirit who indwells me provides the power of God to do the miracles that I see happen. Indeed, often I feel something like power flowing through me when I have laid hands on a person and prayed like I was told to pray.

Honestly, it is all kind of weird!! What I like is the relationship with my Lord Jesus Christ. I like talking to Him, and hearing what He says. The miracles are just kind of a side thing that occasionally happens when I am doing what He askes me to do from in me. The Word of God I preach (Jesus Christ talking to me) is found near me, even in my heart... and sometimes I find The Word of God in my mouth. So maybe I could be considered a god, like it is written. But I don't think about it much. I just like to think about hearing from my friend Jesus Christ! He is the Lord my God and is One with His Father, whether others like it or not!!!

That is why it was written "he called them gods, to whom the word of God came"

I disagree with your interpretation of this passage. Perhaps you didn't know that in the ancient world, the terms "god" and "son of God" were often used in reference to human kings. This was no less true of David's sons.

2Samuel 7:13-16

He shall build a house for my name, and I will establish the throne of his kingdom forever. I will be his father, and he shall be my son. If he commits iniquity, I will chasten him with the rod of men, and with the stripes of the children of men: But my mercy shall not depart away from him, as I took it from Saul, whom I put away before thee. And thine house and thy kingdom shall be established forever before thee: thy throne shall be established forever.​

After that point, the kings and princes of Israel were called "gods" and "sons of god."

The gospel of John records an argument between Jesus and the scribes and Pharisees. The subject of the debate was their understanding that the Messiah was going to be an angel or a theophany. Jesus' claim to be the Messiah, being a man and not a theophany, upset them greatly. In his defense, Jesus takes them back to Psalm 82 to remind them that God referred to the kings of Israel as "gods" even while they were men. Jesus argues, if God didn't have a problem calling men "gods" then why do you have a problem if I, a man, claim to be the Messiah?

 

[Johann]

I'm not chasing any more threads here-but more than willing to share Scriptures with the few I am close with.
Shalom
J.

Signing off.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

I'm not chasing any more threads here-but more than willing to share Scriptures with the few I am close with.
Shalom
J.

Signing off.

I feel exactly what you are saying.
Blessings of encouragement to you, brother.
Romans 15:13 - Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

 

[amigo de christo]

I'm not chasing any more threads here-but more than willing to share Scriptures with the few I am close with.
Shalom
J.

Signing off.

Yep . unload all those wonderful scrips my friend . ITS A JOY TO SEE EVERY ONE OF THEM .
Let the LORD be praised .

 

[amigo de christo]

I'm not chasing any more threads here-but more than willing to share Scriptures with the few I am close with.
Shalom
J.

Signing off.

Its one forty eight where you are my friend . IF you should still be awake , LET THE GLORIOUS LORD BE PRAISED MY FRIEND .
The LORD is with the lambs . HE IS OUR HOPE and our salvation

 

[amigo de christo]

I feel exactly what you are saying.
Blessings of encouragement to you, brother.
Romans 15:13 - Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

The lambs can encourage one another my dear sister . Yep . March on in the LORD and let the GLORIOUS LORD be praised .

 

[Karl Peters]

The lambs can encourage one another my dear sister . Yep . March on in the LORD and let the GLORIOUS LORD be praised .

What do we encourage others to do? It is seek the Lord and listen to Him - Today, correct?

And if we want the Lord Jesus Christ to come in - it doesn't require He comes a 'Marching', it only requires that we deside to just listen to Him, because He is always just standing there talking to us so all we have to do is desire to hear from Him!!!

Yet it does sound good to say "encourage others" and "March on in Lord." - neither of which actually encourage others to actually listen to Him!

Heb 3:7 - 14
Therefore, just as the Holy Spirit says,
“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,
DO NOT HARDEN YOUR HEARTS AS WHEN THEY PROVOKED ME,
AS IN THE DAY OF TRIAL IN THE WILDERNESS,
WHERE YOUR FATHERS TRIED Me BY TESTING Me,
AND SAW MY WORKS FOR FORTY YEARS.
“THEREFORE I WAS ANGRY WITH THIS GENERATION,
AND SAID, ‘THEY ALWAYS GO ASTRAY IN THEIR HEART,
AND THEY DID NOT KNOW MY WAYS’;
AS I SWORE IN MY WRATH,
‘THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.’”
Take care, brethren, that there not be in any one of you an evil, unbelieving heart that falls away from the living God.
But encourage one another day after day, as long as it is still called “Today,” so that none of you will be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin.
For we have become partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our assurance firm until the end,

As can read in the Scriptures, we need to HEAR HIS VOICE, and we provoke Him when we don't. And when that happens, we should know that He has sworn in His wrath, ‘THEY SHALL NOT ENTER MY REST.’”

Therefore, we encourage one another day after day, as long as it still called "Today" - and that mean we encourage them to seek Him and listen to Him!!

Yet not all will accept Him!! Many reject the idea of seeking His voice and listening to Him. They can read the Scriptures and still do that. They can sound very religious, but still not actually seek His voice. But if they do that they will not actually be trying to encourage other to seek Him, but rather they encourage each other to follow them and other men, and present themselves to be the righteous One.

That doesn't mean that one day He won't come marching with His army and bring a day of judgement - when what He swore comes to pass. If you don't know Him, you really don't want that day. Yet if you know Him and hear Him tell you "...., I love you", and "...., I will always call you my friend", and "get over it ...., you will always be with me", and sooo much more like "...., pray for that person and I will heal them", and you watch it happen, then what are you going to say to people?

I can tell you what you will say once you truly get to know Him!! You will say, "People, seek Him and listen to Him"!!!

He is worth knowing, but many will not enter His rest when He comes marching in with His army to clean it all up!!

 

[Johann]

I feel exactly what you are saying.
Blessings of encouragement to you, brother.
Romans 15:13 - Now the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, that ye may abound in hope, through the power of the Holy Ghost.

Thank you and shalom to you and family
Rom_15:4 For whatever was written before was written for our instruction, so that through patience and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.

Rom_15:5 Now may the God of patience and encouragement grant you to be like-minded with one another in the manner of Messiah Yeshua,

2Co_1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Yeshua the Messiah, the Father of compassion and God of all encouragement.

2Co_1:4 He encourages us in every trouble, so that we may be able to encourage those who are in any trouble, through the very encouragement with which we ourselves are encouraged by God.

Yours in Christ
Johann

 

[Johann]

“TODAY IF YOU HEAR HIS VOICE,

... hear his voice." Connect with Heb_3:13, "exhort one another," etc.; Heb_3:14 being a parenthesis. 'It rests with yourselves that the 95th Psalm be not a mere invitation, but also an actual enjoyment.'


For the rabbis hearing is through reading out loud the holy books. Recitation of the Shema brings out the importance of hearing, for the passages used (Deu_6:4ff; Deu_11:13 ff.; Num_15:37 ff.) show that we know God by studying and keeping his law.

akoe. This common word has the active meaning 1. "sense of hearing" and the passive one 2. "report" In the NT it can mean "preaching" with a stress on the hearing (cf. 1Th_2:13; Rom_10:16 ff.; Heb_4:2). In Gal_3:2 the point is not "believing hearing" but "preaching of faith," i.e., with faith as the content and goal. In the pagan world akoai was also used 3. for the ears put on sanctuary walls to symbolize hearing deity.

While, &c. Literally In (Greek. en) its being said. i.e. the exhortation of Heb_3:13 is to them. Compare verses: Heb_3:7, Heb_3:8.

While I appreciate your stress on "hearing" the voice of God in an audible voice-for me it is through the illumination of the Scriptures dia the Holy Spirit.

J.

 

[Karl Peters]

Thank you and shalom to you and family
Rom_15:4 For whatever was written before was written for our instruction, so that through patience and the encouragement of the Scriptures we might have hope.

Rom_15:5 Now may the God of patience and encouragement grant you to be like-minded with one another in the manner of Messiah Yeshua,

2Co_1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Yeshua the Messiah, the Father of compassion and God of all encouragement.

2Co_1:4 He encourages us in every trouble, so that we may be able to encourage those who are in any trouble, through the very encouragement with which we ourselves are encouraged by God.

Yours in Christ
Johann

When should you talk to the Lord and listen to Him?

Paul explained that he took all thoughts captive to Jesus Christ, so yeah we need encouragement to talk to Him and listen in all things!!!

That is what we are talking about with "everyday called "Today"!

Really know Him means you really know that He is always with you!! That results in you talking to Him a number of times each day, and also the realization that you are not still listening to Him like you should!! So like it is written - don't think you have achieved yet!

Indeed, I confess that I only hear Him about a dozen different times a day! That is no where near as often as I should hear that small voice of His. Of course, that is just some average and that is also grouping the times I hear Him. If I go for a 20 minute walk talking back and forth with Him is one time in a day that I was hearing from Him, even though it was for 20 minutes. During that one time we will talk about a number of things! He usually gives me a teaching, and perhaps we talk about my sons soccer team, and perhaps something that is bothers me like maybe the sales of my business. So what about someone that say they hear Him - reading their Bible is their hearing Him.

It is obvious that they are sooooooooooooo far off from understanding what it means that He is the Great I AM, that it is just sad! I don't take the Bible with me on a walk with Him!! Of course another time I talk to Him is in the morning when I sat down in my favorite chair which has a Bible next to it, and I pray the Lord's prayer with a number of other things - then I listen to the Lord then to find out what He says to me then. Sometime then He tells me to open the Bible to a particular location. Then I read the Bible there and He then points out things to me and talks to me about the verses!

This thread started after on a day after He took me to a verse, then talked to me about how He calls us "gods". Then He took me to another verse and spent a bit of time talking to me about how they are connected and what they mean. And then He asked me to start a thread on what He was telling me. (See the OP)

Then I run into a whole lot of people who don't seek Him and His voice, and it is obvious by what they write!! Yeah, there is the person who wrote that they thought the reading the Scriptures was there hearing Him - which of course is wrong. He talks to you most of the time when you don't even have the Scriptures next to you. That is obvious to me and to everyone who wrote the Scriptures. And I found a couple of people whose first thought is to doubt that anyone claiming to hear a voice is hearing from the devil. Yeah, it is good to test the spirits, but also practicing hearing from Him helps you discern between good and evil, and their instant doubting shows they don't practice using their spiritual senses! They are fearing the devil instead of seeking Him. And what they don't understand is how often I actually use the test in the Bible. Using the tests only take a brief moment which I can and usually do in a very quick moment, like at the beginning of the 20 minute walk. It takes less than 10 seconds of the twenty minutes.

They don't even understand that if you regularly talk to the Lord and quickly test the spirits, the evil spirit come to know that and almost never speak to you in a small voice. It is just to dangerous to them. You can bind them up and have the Kingdom of God take them into the abyss. That doesn't mean they won't try to mess with you, because they too have instructions from their bosses to mess with you. But they talk really quite, like a brief unction, and even then not when you are talking to the Lord. That is what it is written that if you keep the Lord close and resist them they flee. But who here understands that?

When I come here and post, it is like I am talking only to people who don't really have a clue about what a life with the Great I Am is like!! If is a life, even step by step, walking and talking with Him!! It is much more like Isaiah wrote:

Is 30: 21 Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.

Knowing and hearing Him is more like:

Deut 3:33 “Indeed, He loves the people; All Your holy ones are in Your hand,
And they followed in Your steps; Everyone receives of Your words.

He will quite literally sometime guide your actual step with His words spoken to you personally!!

I can tell someone, but the unbeliever can't accept this! So I just tell them to seek Him and His voice, knowing that if they do that He will start talking to them, and over time seeking Him and actually spending time with Him they will come to understand this. But they won't even start a walk with Him, but instead they pretend, and it becomes obvious to someone who really knows Him!! But I spent the first 40 years of my life without hearing from Him. So take is not a judgement, it is an opportunity to try and actually get them to seek Him and listen with their spiritual ears.

Seek and you will find! Ask and it will be opened to you! Are you ready to start hearing a voice behind you whenever you turn to the left or to the right? Are you ready for a personal relationship with the Most High God, and be counted as a child of His? Are you then ready to be a god, having the spirit of God almighty in you? Note - that is not what leads you into pride, because He is going to reprove you often, as He teaches you. Pride is when you don't think He is smarter than you, and that comes from not listening to Him and instead leaning on your own understanding.

 

[Johann]

This thread started after on a day after He took me to a verse, then talked to me about how He calls us "gods". Then He took me to another verse and spent a bit of time talking to me about how they are connected and what they mean. And then He asked me to start a thread on what He was telling me. (See the OP)

So-you don't do a thing without the Lord telling you, in an audible voice what is your next move?

 

[Lizbeth]

Jn 10:31 - 38 The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him. Jesus answered them, “I showed you many good works from the Father; for which of them are you stoning Me?” The Jews answered Him, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.” Jesus answered them, “Has it not been written in your Law, ‘I SAID, YOU ARE GODS’? “If he called them gods, to whom the word of God came (and the Scripture cannot be broken), do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, ‘You are blaspheming,’ because I said, ‘I am the Son of God’? “If I do not do the works of My Father, do not believe Me; but if I do them, though you do not believe Me, believe the works, so that you may know and understand that the Father is in Me, and I in the Father.”

There is a certain subject that the Jews had trouble with when Jesus the Christ was on earth in the flesh!! They had trouble with Him being One with the Father!!

So I guess it would not be surprising that there are those today who have trouble with the idea of the Oneness of God!! Some want to argue about how the Lord our God is One Lord - and that the Holy Spirit says Jesus Christ is Lord!

Mark 12:29 Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD;

Deut 6:4 “Hear, O Israel! The LORD is our God, the LORD is one!

1 Cor 12:3 Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God says, “Jesus is accursed”; and no one can say, “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.

Rom 10:9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved;

Of course who don't know Jesus Christ is our Lord and is also God, are going to have a problem with Jesus Christ being the Lord our God, no matter how often this is discussed in the Scriptures! Still, this Oneness is discussed over and over and over again in the Bible, despite what they think! Indeed, if you read the Bible you will note that this Oneness is what saves us, because we are saved because we come into a oneness with God ourselves!!

Jn 17: 19 - 22 “For their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth. “I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; hat they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. “The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one;

Jesus prayed that we would be one with Him even as He is one with His Father. Of course we are not perfect like Him!! He is the perfect image of the invisible God, and is one with His Father, so He is God - even if the religious Jews back then didn't like Him being God!!!

And note that when He prays He gets what He asks for! The true believer, whether anyone cares to believe it or not, becomes one with Jesus Christ, because He sends His Holy Spirit to indwell us. Of course that doesn't mean we are the perfect image of the invisible God!! We still too often lean on our understanding instead of doing and saying only what the Lord our God tells us. But still we have the Holy Spirit of God (meaning God) inside us. What did we think it meant when we read about being Born Again. When Born Again, we are born of the Holy Spirit, meaning it is not just us in us, but God also is in us. We are a new creature in Christ, because we have His spirit in us, to listen to if we decide to listen. So we hear the sound of the wind (the Holy Spirit) who indwells us!!

That is why it was written "he called them gods, to whom the word of God came"

We get salvation when His Holy Spirit comes into us! And the Holy Spirit brings us the words that the Lord our God Jesus Christ has to speak to us personally - which is why "to whom the word of God came"!!

Now I certainly don't feel like any god, even with a small "g"!! Never-the Less, I do hear from my Lord vis His Holy Spirit speaking His words to my spirit. And also, by following His instructions, there have been times in my life when I have seen miracles!! Hundreds of them, actually! I can't do them, but i can do what He asks of me, and He has asked me at times to pray for other people, and then I saw miracles happen! Honestly, it seems that the Holy Spirit who indwells me provides the power of God to do the miracles that I see happen. Indeed, often I feel something like power flowing through me when I have laid hands on a person and prayed like I was told to pray.

Honestly, it is all kind of weird!! What I like is the relationship with my Lord Jesus Christ. I like talking to Him, and hearing what He says. The miracles are just kind of a side thing that occasionally happens when I am doing what He askes me to do from in me. The Word of God I preach (Jesus Christ talking to me) is found near me, even in my heart... and sometimes I find The Word of God in my mouth. So maybe I could be considered a god, like it is written. But I don't think about it much. I just like to think about hearing from my friend Jesus Christ! He is the Lord my God and is One with His Father, whether others like it or not!!!

"gods" refers to heavenly divine beings. Angels are also called gods and sons of god and I believe even were erroneously worshiped at times past in history. Believers are "gods" in the sense that we are sons of God through being born of His Spirit. And Jesus said we will be like the angels, ie, become spiritual beings (gods) like they are. But it should be made clear that it doesn't mean at all that we are or will be equal to God. Even Jesus who was God in the flesh didn't consider equality with God something to be grasped, but humbled Himself and became a servant.

It is mind blowing, humbling and cause for gratitude to think that we may be exalted to such a state. Like Jesus when He was transfigured I believe, we will likewise be glorified - that was His revealing and why the apostles wrote that we beheld His glory - and it is written that all creation waits for the sons of God to be similarly revealed.

 

[Lizbeth]

When should you talk to the Lord and listen to Him?

Paul explained that he took all thoughts captive to Jesus Christ, so yeah we need encouragement to talk to Him and listen in all things!!!

That is what we are talking about with "everyday called "Today"!

Really know Him means you really know that He is always with you!! That results in you talking to Him a number of times each day, and also the realization that you are not still listening to Him like you should!! So like it is written - don't think you have achieved yet!

Indeed, I confess that I only hear Him about a dozen different times a day! That is no where near as often as I should hear that small voice of His. Of course, that is just some average and that is also grouping the times I hear Him. If I go for a 20 minute walk talking back and forth with Him is one time in a day that I was hearing from Him, even though it was for 20 minutes. During that one time we will talk about a number of things! He usually gives me a teaching, and perhaps we talk about my sons soccer team, and perhaps something that is bothers me like maybe the sales of my business. So what about someone that say they hear Him - reading their Bible is their hearing Him.

It is obvious that they are sooooooooooooo far off from understanding what it means that He is the Great I AM, that it is just sad! I don't take the Bible with me on a walk with Him!! Of course another time I talk to Him is in the morning when I sat down in my favorite chair which has a Bible next to it, and I pray the Lord's prayer with a number of other things - then I listen to the Lord then to find out what He says to me then. Sometime then He tells me to open the Bible to a particular location. Then I read the Bible there and He then points out things to me and talks to me about the verses!

This thread started after on a day after He took me to a verse, then talked to me about how He calls us "gods". Then He took me to another verse and spent a bit of time talking to me about how they are connected and what they mean. And then He asked me to start a thread on what He was telling me. (See the OP)

Then I run into a whole lot of people who don't seek Him and His voice, and it is obvious by what they write!! Yeah, there is the person who wrote that they thought the reading the Scriptures was there hearing Him - which of course is wrong. He talks to you most of the time when you don't even have the Scriptures next to you. That is obvious to me and to everyone who wrote the Scriptures. And I found a couple of people whose first thought is to doubt that anyone claiming to hear a voice is hearing from the devil. Yeah, it is good to test the spirits, but also practicing hearing from Him helps you discern between good and evil, and their instant doubting shows they don't practice using their spiritual senses! They are fearing the devil instead of seeking Him. And what they don't understand is how often I actually use the test in the Bible. Using the tests only take a brief moment which I can and usually do in a very quick moment, like at the beginning of the 20 minute walk. It takes less than 10 seconds of the twenty minutes.

They don't even understand that if you regularly talk to the Lord and quickly test the spirits, the evil spirit come to know that and almost never speak to you in a small voice. It is just to dangerous to them. You can bind them up and have the Kingdom of God take them into the abyss. That doesn't mean they won't try to mess with you, because they too have instructions from their bosses to mess with you. But they talk really quite, like a brief unction, and even then not when you are talking to the Lord. That is what it is written that if you keep the Lord close and resist them they flee. But who here understands that?

When I come here and post, it is like I am talking only to people who don't really have a clue about what a life with the Great I Am is like!! If is a life, even step by step, walking and talking with Him!! It is much more like Isaiah wrote:

Is 30: 21 Your ears will hear a word behind you, “This is the way, walk in it,” whenever you turn to the right or to the left.

Knowing and hearing Him is more like:

Deut 3:33 “Indeed, He loves the people; All Your holy ones are in Your hand,
And they followed in Your steps; Everyone receives of Your words.

He will quite literally sometime guide your actual step with His words spoken to you personally!!

I can tell someone, but the unbeliever can't accept this! So I just tell them to seek Him and His voice, knowing that if they do that He will start talking to them, and over time seeking Him and actually spending time with Him they will come to understand this. But they won't even start a walk with Him, but instead they pretend, and it becomes obvious to someone who really knows Him!! But I spent the first 40 years of my life without hearing from Him. So take is not a judgement, it is an opportunity to try and actually get them to seek Him and listen with their spiritual ears.

Seek and you will find! Ask and it will be opened to you! Are you ready to start hearing a voice behind you whenever you turn to the left or to the right? Are you ready for a personal relationship with the Most High God, and be counted as a child of His? Are you then ready to be a god, having the spirit of God almighty in you? Note - that is not what leads you into pride, because He is going to reprove you often, as He teaches you. Pride is when you don't think He is smarter than you, and that comes from not listening to Him and instead leaning on your own understanding.

Amen, and we can see how often the Lord spoke to Moses, for example. And notice how Moses said he wouldn't go without the Lord going before him - we might examine ourselves to see how often are we trying to serve the Lord independently of Him? The Lord will begin reproving His children when we are ready to begin to bear it without fainting. "Faint not when thou art chastised by the Lord." Jesus, the exact representation of the Father, often reproved His disciples.

I'm not sure I would always call it pretending in every case, so often it is a matter of growing and learning and being in faith. It's a battle we are in, and the devil is always trying to hinder the light any way he can.

 

[Lizbeth]

I sometimes find writings such as the above somewhat interesting, but did Jesus in the Scriptures ever sound like He spoke in such a way as is written above? Never!

When I listen to the Lord and I find that He speaks more like what we actually find written in the Scripture. He sometimes uses parables. But He will give you some explanation afterwards if you ask. He, as the Lord, also gives me instructions. The first words I heard from Him was, "Read Your Bible". And there are words of encouragement and love that He speaks to me. The most common words I hear from Him are, "Karl, I love you." I hear that and sometimes have heard those words numerous times in the same day. And another endearing word that He speaks to me is, "son"!!!

Yeah, He often calls me "son" as in "Son, I appreciate what you do for me.", or "Son, why don't you come for a walk with me." Yet none of what He tells me comes across like the writing above. But I can ask Him about writing like the above, can't I? Yeah, I can. Is it not the writings of men, and them looking to other men and not God?

It was pointed out to me that it was written above:




So the author of the post is, by his own statements, looking to 'rabbinical arguments' and ' Johannine word play',. instead of looking to the Lord as his Teacher!!! So who are we to look to: "wise men" or the Lord our God?

I tell you truly, that if a man is wise it is because He looks to God and what the Word of God, Jesus Christ, has to say to Him.

I try to do that, seek the Lord and listen to Him! Of course the Holy Spirit is not the only spirit around, but it is also written that if we seek we find. I believe in Jesus Christ because when I seek Him I find Him with that small voice of His. I find the One who tells me He loves me, and who calls me His son, and the One who teaches me!! And He does not ever sound like the above post.

Oh, I my studies with Him, He did talk to me about "elohim", many God in the plural sense. Was not "elohim" used in Genisis and before things, like men, were even created?

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God (elohiym, el-o-heem': plur of gods in the ordinary sense) created the heavens and the earth...

So before there were any men, there was God and that in plural in the ordinary sense!!! How then can it now be used to mean more that God who was in the beginning??? Is it because of this:

Jn 17: 19 - 22 “For their sakes I sanctify Myself, that they themselves also may be sanctified in truth. “I do not ask on behalf of these alone, but for those also who believe in Me through their word; hat they may all be one; even as You, Father, are in Me and I in You, that they also may be in Us, so that the world may believe that You sent Me. “The glory which You have given Me I have given to them, that they may be one, just as We are one;

Is it because He calls us sons and daughters of the Most High if we decide to listen to Him???

So we are included in the word 'elohiym, el-o-heem': - (meaning plur of gods in the ordinary sense) because we listen to Him and He decides us to includes us in the family of God!! And that is what is written in the Scriptures and explained by our Father in heaven!

Ps 82:6 I said, “You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High.

So He calls us sons of the Most High and He includes us as in the family of God, so we are gods - yet never-the-less we will die like men because we do not listen to Him like we should!! We still keep looking to other men and even our own silly wisdom instead of seek His voice and Him as our Teacher!! Yet the Word of God has saved us who believe in Him: which means we do remember to seek Him and His voice at times because we have a measure of belief in Him. Some with a greater of lesser measure of faith, but it doesn't take a large amount of faith to seek Him and listen!! Yet since faith comes from hearing, what about the man who refuses to listen?

Do they not start leaning on their own understanding and even the understanding of other men??

We need to turn back to Him, the God through whom all things were created, and start listening to Him - right??

That is what caused Him to call us gods, and that is where the instructions and power of God come from, right? So it is that I preach the Word of God and that to mean we need to listen to the Lord our God, Jesus Christ!!

We are sometimes like the Pharisees who diligently searched the scriptures to learn "about" God, but refuse to come TO Him. He is actually alive and not just words on a page. We can have a living relationship with Him!

But I believe He may speak to different people in different ways....because we're not all gifted the same.

 

[Johann]

We are sometimes like the Pharisees who diligently searched the scriptures to learn "about" God, but refuse to come TO Him. He is actually alive and not just words on a page. We can have a living relationship with Him!

But I believe He may speak to different people in different ways....because we're not all gifted the same.

So you agree with Karl-we need to hear "a voice" in an audible manner?
This is where the rubber hits the road.
J.

 

[Lizbeth]

You are missing it-big time-

Most people want to hear God’s voice when they are facing a decision. If only God would speak to them and tell them which choice to make or which direction to embark upon. Many people will claim to have heard God’s voice, saying, “God led me to do this,” when in fact it was simply their own thoughts and desires that led them in a particular direction.

The primary way that God speaks to us today is through His revealed, written Word. When we want to hear God’s voice, the Bible is where we should look. Most of the will of God for our lives is already fully revealed in its pages, and it is simply a matter of our obedience to it. All of Scripture is the will of God, but there are a few places in Scripture that specifically use the term will of God, which may be especially interesting to a person who wants to hear God’s voice:

• 1 Thessalonians 4:3: “It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality.”

• 1 Thessalonians 5:18: “Give thanks in all circumstances; for this is God’s will for you in Christ Jesus.”

• 1 Peter 2:12–15: “Live such good lives among the pagans that, though they accuse you of doing wrong, they may see your good deeds and glorify God on the day he visits us. Submit yourselves for the Lord’s sake to every human authority: whether to the emperor, as the supreme authority, or to governors, who are sent by him to punish those who do wrong and to commend those who do right. For it is God’s will that by doing good you should silence the ignorant talk of foolish people.”

Other passages also let us hear God’s voice, even if they don’t use the phrase the will of God. But, just taking the three above passages, we know that a Christian should always give thanks in every circumstance, avoid sexual immorality, and live an exemplary life. If a Christian does not follow these clear dictates given directly by God through inspired Scripture, why should he or she expect to hear more information from God? If you want further direction from God, obey what He has already told you. A heart willing to listen and obey is the key to hearing from God.

The primary way that a Christian hears God’s voice is through reading and studying Scripture and then obeying and applying what the Scripture says. People often rely upon “the leading of the Holy Spirit,” which is spoken of in Romans 8:14. In context, the passage speaks of the Spirit’s leading us away from sinful activity and into a confidence in our relationship with God as Father. The Holy Spirit will never lead contrary to Scripture.

If a person is considering having an affair, the Spirit will only lead in one direction—toward marital fidelity. The Spirit might very well bring a verse like 1 Thessalonians 4:3 to mind for the person being tempted.

When the Spirit leads, He is not imparting “new” information as much as He is impressing on our hearts the truth God has already revealed in Scripture and applying it to our situation.

If a person says, “God told me” or “The Spirit led me to do such and such,” and the action taken is contrary to Scripture, we can be sure the person is mistaken.

We can also hear God’s voice as God speaks through other people. “Plans fail for lack of counsel, but with many advisers they succeed” (Proverbs 15:22). Good counselors or advisers can help us see a situation with new eyes.

Again, the Bible is key. Biblical preaching and biblically sound Christian material can be put in the “advisers” category. The Word of God is the control. If a bunch of counselors advise a person to do something contrary to Scripture, then they are all wrong, no matter what their credentials; however, if the advisers help an individual understand and apply Scripture, then they can be helpful. Godly advisers can often see areas that an individual is blind to. A group of advisers may discern that the person seeking to hear God’s voice concerning a particular plan is in reality seeking approval of his own personal agenda.

Another way to hear God’s voice is to pray and ask for wisdom: “If any of you lacks wisdom, you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you” (James 1:5). When a Christian is facing difficult circumstances and needs to hear from God, the Christian should ask for the wisdom that God promises to give.

This wisdom will ultimately come from God, but it may come through the word of a friend; through a sermon, article, or book; or from the inner prompting of the Holy Spirit. Once again, the written Word of God is the standard by which all thoughts, actions, ideas, and feelings must be judged.

In this day of self-proclaimed prophets and the promotion of “new revelations” from God, people often mistake the voice of God for their own thoughts or the suggestions of other people. If you are hearing God’s voice, then the message will always be in accord with Scripture. We should all take great care not to misrepresent God. Instead of saying, “God told me this,” a better approach would be to say, “I think God may be saying this—what do you think?”

J.

That many people erroneously think they are hearing from God when they are not, is not a reason to throw out the concept of hearing from God. The devil is always working overtime trying to discredit the true things of God...and even we are tested this way by God to see whether we will believe the devil's work or believe God. People are often so afraid of being deceived that they are bound by their fear and refuse to reach for more than they have and grow. And we grow as children do, sometimes making mistakes that we learn from - thankfully the Lord is not a harsh taskmaster and is ready to forgive us when we blunder, as long as we are sincerely sorry when we do. People are often so afraid of making mistakes because they don't know God very well. We can be encouraged by remembering Peter in his as yet immature zeal and then fell flat on his face when tested. Jesus forgave him.