Re Spirit baptism

[David in NJ]

Great post, thanks.
I noticed something in the wording of this verse.
It says, "... all of us who were baptized...", which would indicate baptized believers as a subset of all believers.
It doesn't say "... all of us were baptized...", it says, "... all of us who were baptized..." Interesting.

@Godslittleservant

BINGO

 

[David in NJ]

I have tried to study the subject of baptism with you but you do not show me where my scripture I point toward have any bearing in our study. You do not show me why they do not align and confirm the other as I have tried to show using Gods word.

You say with out proof with scripture that Water baptism in the name of Jesus Christ does not have any salvation principle at all it is just an empty ritual that just symbolizes the inward to the outward .

I tried to show using Gods word that you missed the point that God was trying to teach you on that but instead it was where he chose to do the cleansing work of transforming you from dead in sin to alive in Christ and you had not showed me with scripture where that was not the case

I have asked you to read the 6TH chapter of Romans where Paul clearly teaches that The baptism in Christ name is where one is changed by the work of God from dead in sin to alive in Christ. You have not dealt with that.

You keep telling me that baptism does not save you but God tells me it does I was just trying to study this with you but apparently you are not open for study.

OK
i SEE where you are stuck
You are on the same plane as the Israelites when they were bitten by snakes and God told Moses to make a brazen serpent on a pole.
Anyone who looked at the brazen serpent was healed.

BUT THEN

But then the Israelites began worshipping the brazen serpent and so it had to be destroyed.

2 Kings 18:4
He removed the high places, and broke the images, and cut down the groves, and broke in pieces the brazen serpent that Moses had made: for to those days the children of Israel did burn incense to it: and he called it Nehushtan.

@Godslittleservant believes water is thicker then blood = water baptism saves us

 

[Godslittleservant]

No worries.
Let's be respectful of each others views going forward. Thanks.

I honestly am trying to be respectful but you do not show me why God did not mean what he said about baptism with scriptural backing I did try to show you all the scriptures God has given to prove he meant what he said. If you follow the study it shows beyond doubt. Sorry I seem to stand alone but you are missing out on the beautiful things water baptism does .

 

[Godslittleservant]

St. SteVen said:

If you break it down, I'm not sure that Acts 2:38 even makes sense.
1) Repent
Is this done in a moment of time and is then finished? Nope.
2) Be baptized
How exactly? Water baptism, or the Baptism with the Holy Spirit?
3) In the name of Jesus Christ
A task for the baptism facilitator, I suppose?
(and none of this Trinity stuff that Jesus commanded!)
4) For the remission of your sin
I thought Christ took care of that on the cross,
Why is my act paying for my own sin? I don't get it.
5) And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit
How did I repent without the help of the Holy Spirit?
I don't get it until now?

No, you are welcome here.
I wanted to demonstrate how easy it is to mindlessly take something familiar and not question it.
When you break it down, sometimes these things fall apart.

And in this case some serious questions arise. The Bible has contradictions we need to steer around.
Like Jesus' commandment to baptize in the names of the Trinity, which we see nowhere in the rest of the New Testament.
What's up with that?

And how do we react? With workaround apologetics. Thus denying obvious contradictions.

I already answered how Acts 2:38 makes sense with scripture even shown the scriptures that back it but you refuse to look deeply at them because they do not make sense to you I can not help with out the scriptures so we can look away or study the scriptures together.

 

[Godslittleservant]

Was it a NEED to be baptized, or a desire?
He wasn't joining their church, as he was heading back to Ethiopia.
Seems he wanted to solidify a decision to follow Jesus.

We seem to be lining up on either side of whether baptism is needed for salvation.

@Jim C

This shows where your view of water baptism is flawed, the scriptures can answer this if you seek can I help you find the answers in scripture or have you already got your mind made up

 

[Godslittleservant]

We are baptised into Christ, through the Holy Spirit, which is the spiritual birth....the rebirth/ regenerated...brought Alive in Christ, by the Holy Spirit, he births our spirit into his..it’s his supernatural power that births us, you do know his word is Alive and Active?...which means what to you?​

Hebrews 4:12​

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New International Version​

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12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

John 3:8​

“The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.”

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Romans 6​

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New International Version​

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​

Dead to Sin, Alive in Christ​

6 What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2 By no means! We are those who have died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? 3 Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.
5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly also be united with him in a resurrection like his.6 For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin— 7 because anyone who has died has been set free from sin.
8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. 10 The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God.
11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. 13 Do not offer any part of yourself to sin as an instrument of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer every part of yourself to him as an instrument of righteousness. 14 For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.

We are baptised into Christ, through the Holy Spirit, which is the spiritual birth....the rebirth/ regenerated...brought Alive in Christ, by the Holy Spirit, he births our spirit into his..it’s his supernatural power that births us, you do know his word is Alive and Active?...which means what to you?​

Hebrews 4:12​

​

New International Version​

​

​

12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.

John 3:8​

“The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.”

​

Romans 6​

​

New International Version​

​

​

Dead to Sin, Alive in Christ​

6 What shall we say, then? Shall we go on sinning so that grace may increase? 2 By no means! We are those who have died to sin; how can we live in it any longer? 3 Or don’t you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4 We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.
5 For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we will certainly also be united with him in a resurrection like his.6 For we know that our old self was crucified with him so that the body ruled by sin might be done away with,[a] that we should no longer be slaves to sin— 7 because anyone who has died has been set free from sin.
8 Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him. 9 For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, he cannot die again; death no longer has mastery over him. 10 The death he died, he died to sin once for all; but the life he lives, he lives to God.
11 In the same way, count yourselves dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. 12 Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its evil desires. 13 Do not offer any part of yourself to sin as an instrument of wickedness, but rather offer yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life; and offer every part of yourself to him as an instrument of righteousness. 14 For sin shall no longer be your master, because you are not under the law, but under grace.

Prove to me that this is not talking about water baptism . From acts 2 most all reference is talking about the baptism of Acts 2:38 it is the baptism that Romans 6 is in reference to,. It is the one that God does his work in. it is the one that All the Apostles preach. No where in scripture can you find the dry baptism you are to place on Romans 6 it you think that the baptism of Romans 6 is not talking about that of Acts 2:38 then you are miss reading scripture.

The baptism of Romans 6 is the same as Acts 2:38 and only one that the Apostles commanded . There is only one gospel that God sent forth through the Apostles with the Spirit giving them the words to speak they did not speak for themselves but spoke the words the spirit gave from God.

 

[Ritajanice]

Prove to me that this is not talking about water baptism . From acts 2 most all reference is talking about the baptism of Acts 2:38 it is the baptism that Romans 6 is in reference to,. It is the one that God does his work in. it is the one that All the Apostles preach. No where in scripture can you find the dry baptism you are to place on Romans 6 it you think that the baptism of Romans 6 is not talking about that of Acts 2:38 then you are miss reading scripture.

The baptism of Romans 6 is the same as Acts 2:38 and only one that the Apostles commanded . There is only one gospel that God sent forth through the Apostles with the Spirit giving them the words to speak they did not speak for themselves but spoke the words the spirit gave from God.

Prove to me that it is?.....

I have given you scripture, which you have dismissed...why aren’t you answering my questions, I’ve answered yours?
A Born Again in not birthed in water, they are birthed in the Spirit?

Which means what exactly?

Flesh gives birth to flesh, means;g?

Spirit gives birth to spirit, meaning?

 

[Godslittleservant]

@Godslittleservant
We seem to be lining up on either side of whether baptism is needed for salvation.

Some of us have shown that baptism is NOT needed for salvation.
(though important for other reasons)
You seem to be of the opposite opinion.

Do you have more than Acts 2:38 to make your case?
Present your position.

But don't assume that your collection of scriptures is better than anyone else's.
I have a pet peeve about those who play the "God card" to win the argument.

I have given you many more scriptures where the bible proves Acts 2:38 to be the baptism where in we are born again.
In acts 2;38 it says that sins are remitted and the spirit is given (the new birth)
Romans chapter six Paul explains that yea in the baptism of Acts 2:38 is where God does his transforming work of changing us from dead to sin to alive in Christ (the new birth) same as Peter preach water baptism in Christ name is what all the Apostles taught that we must do no where do I see them teaching a dry baptism.
Acts 10:47-48 shows beyond the doubt that the baptism in the name of Jesus Christ is Acts 2:38 is indeed a water baptism.
Acts 19:1-5 shows that the baptism of acts 2 the one in the name of Christ is definitely where the indwelling spirit is given it also show it is not the baptism in the holy ghost as some may think because what some are calling the baptism in the holy came after the baptism in Christ name and was not a dry baptism as some say but was transferred BY THE LAYING ON OF HANDS

See we don't have to be confused the word of God answers all question if we allow it and not be hung up in our own heads.

 

[Ritajanice]

I have given you many more scriptures where the bible proves Acts 2:38 to be the baptism where in we are born again.
In acts 2;38 it says that sins are remitted and the spirit is given (the new birth)
Romans chapter six Paul explains that yea in the baptism of Acts 2:38 is where God does his transforming work of changing us from dead to sin to alive in Christ (the new birth) same as Peter preach water baptism in Christ name is what all the Apostles taught that we must do no where do I see them teaching a dry baptism.
Acts 10:47-48 shows beyond the doubt that the baptism in the name of Jesus Christ is Acts 2:38 is indeed a water baptism.
Acts 19:1-5 shows that the baptism of acts 2 the one in the name of Christ is definitely where the indwelling spirit is given it also show it is not the baptism in the holy ghost as some may think because what some are calling the baptism in the holy came after the baptism in Christ name and was not a dry baptism as some say but was transferred BY THE LAYING ON OF HANDS

See we don't have to be confused the word of God answers all question if we allow it and not be hung up in our own heads.

Where in the Bible does it say we are Born Again in water?

Online commentary...

It seems that anywhere baptism is mentioned in the New Testament, confusion follows. It must be clear that baptism is no more required for becoming saved than putting on a jersey is required to officially join a sports team. We are saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8–9), just as a professional football player is made a teammate by signing a contract. Baptism, like the uniform, is an outward, public sign, not a requirement in and of itself.

 

[Godslittleservant]

what does spirit baptism have to do with water baptism?

Romans 6 answers this question the baptism Jesus was to baptize with is spiritual be God is at work transforming us from dead to sin to alive in Christ. I can not seem to get you to see that the baptism in Christ name is the one Paul is explaining in Romans six
Peter said that the baptism in Christ name remits sin and gives the indwelling spirit Paul tells you just how that happens to all that were baptized in Christ name Acts 2 and Romans 6 is the same baptism

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Romans 6 answers this question the baptism Jesus was to baptize with is spiritual be God is at work transforming us from dead to sin to alive in Christ. I can not seem to get you to see that the baptism in Christ name is the one Paul is explaining in Romans six
Peter said that the baptism in Christ name remits sin and gives the indwelling spirit Paul tells you just how that happens to all that were baptized in Christ name Acts 2 and Romans 6 is the same baptism

What is there to see

I was BAPTIZED (An action word which means to be placed into, or immersed) CHRIST.

there is no water involved.

I hope to get you to see that people have taken a greek verb and twisted its meaning into some religious meaning that was not tyhe intent of the word used..

Baptize is not the definition of the greek word baptizo, it is a transliteration of the word.

which means we have to go to the definition of the greek word to find its true meaning.

 

[Godslittleservant]

Romans 6 is not water baptism.

It is the act of God baptizing us into Christ.

it is spirit baptism, as promised by John the baptist.

Water baptism does nto save you. Peter did not tell people in acts to to get baptized to receive remission of sin. He said get baptized on the account you have already received remission of sin.. Because they repented. and received the spirit.

Again, if you study deeper (the greek) you will see it does nto say what many think it says by the English translation.

I have shown by scripture that this is an incorrect view. Let me be brief here with scripture Acts 2 is the baptism in Christ name that we are commanded to submit to it is the same one that Paul explains in Romans 6 as to how God spiritually transform us from dead to alive in Christ as Peter said in Acts 2 It is the same and only baptism that the Apostles preach from Acts two forward it is in water per Acts 10:47,48
And it is the one that gives the deposit of the indwelling spirit as Paul said in Acts 19:1-5 it is not the dry baptism of the holy ghost as some say because Paul made that clear in Acts 19 he baptized the Ephesians in the baptism in Christ name to give them the indwelling spirit just as all others from Acts 2 then he laid hands on them to give them the power gifts to grow the church

The difference in the teaching some that the baptism of the holy ghost is a dry baptism where the holy ghost come on them with power but no where in scripture do we see that happen except in Acts 2 and Acts 10 and in both cases that was not to give the indwelling but to give signs from God that it was Gods will For the Apostles in Acts to prove that what they taught was indeed from God and to Cornelius house to show the accompanying Jews that God was indeed opening the door to the Gentiles.

The baptism in the name of Christ is the baptism that God works his grace of transforming men from dead to sin to alive in Christ and is the only one commanded to me as in Acts 2 Acts 10 Acts 19 Romans 6 and other if need to be shown

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I have shown by scripture that this is an incorrect view.

No you have not, You have shown me your opinion

Let me be brief here with scripture Acts 2 is the baptism in Christ name that we are commanded to submit to it is the same one that Paul explains in

Acts 2 does not say what you think it says, this has been explained to you

Romans 6 as to how God spiritually transform us from dead to alive in Christ as Peter said in Acts 2

Yes,

and it is done by the baptism of the spirit upon the time the person repents and recieved the spirit..

they get water baptized AFTER they do this

It is the same and only baptism that the Apostles preach from Acts two forward it is in water per Acts 10:47,48
And it is the one that gives the deposit of the indwelling spirit as Paul said in Acts 19:1-5 it is not the dry baptism of the holy ghost as some say because Paul made that clear in Acts 19 he baptized the Ephesians in the baptism in Christ name to give them the indwelling spirit just as all others from Acts 2 then he laid hands on them to give them the power gifts to grow the church

The difference in the teaching some that the baptism of the holy ghost is a dry baptism where the holy ghost come on them with power but no where in scripture do we see that happen except in Acts 2 and Acts 10 and in both cases that was not to give the indwelling but to give signs from God that it was Gods will For the Apostles in Acts to prove that what they taught was indeed from God and to Cornelius house to show the accompanying Jews that God was indeed opening the door to the Gentiles.

The baptism in the name of Christ is the baptism that God works his grace of transforming men from dead to sin to alive in Christ and is the only one commanded to me as in Acts 2 Acts 10 Acts 19 Romans 6 and other if need to be shown

Then we are saved by works, and not by Grace.

Sorry my friend.. Trying to replace the act of God with the act of men in laymens terms is blasphemy.

 

[Godslittleservant]

Where in the Bible does it say we are Born Again in water?

Online commentary...

It seems that anywhere baptism is mentioned in the New Testament, confusion follows. It must be clear that baptism is no more required for becoming saved than putting on a jersey is required to officially join a sports team. We are saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8–9), just as a professional football player is made a teammate by signing a contract. Baptism, like the uniform, is an outward, public sign, not a requirement in and of itself.

PLEASE ready with an open heart for study all the posting I have given as proof that there is more to this subject than what you have come to believe to many scriptures to deny what the baptism in Christ name
Yes we are saved by believing in the grace of Gods plan to use baptism in Christ name to redeem us.

 

[Godslittleservant]

No you have not, You have shown me your opinion

Acts 2 does not say what you think it says, this has been explained to you

Yes,

and it is done by the baptism of the spirit upon the time the person repents and recieved the spirit..

they get water baptized AFTER they do this

Then we are saved by works, and not by Grace.

Sorry my friend.. Trying to replace the act of God with the act of men in laymens terms is blasphemy.

No quite frankly you have shown your opinion with no scripture to support, you want me to rake your word over the biblical scriptures that prove you wrong

And if you would allow the scripture to show baptism in Christ name is not a work of man but what God is doing for you. There is no way man can do the work that is being done in the baptism in Christ name only God can bring about the new birth as Paul explains in Romans 6 Please stop takeing the glory from God and placing it on man.

 

[David in NJ]

Romans 6 answers this question the baptism Jesus was to baptize with is spiritual be God is at work transforming us from dead to sin to alive in Christ. I can not seem to get you to see that the baptism in Christ name is the one Paul is explaining in Romans six
Peter said that the baptism in Christ name remits sin and gives the indwelling spirit Paul tells you just how that happens to all that were baptized in Christ name Acts 2 and Romans 6 is the same baptism

If we use your athlete/team analogy, what the jersey is put on(athlete) comes First!

Therefore, as the scripture says: "we are saved by faith thru the hearing of the Word" AFTER that, the water baptism occurs.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

PLEASE ready with an open heart for study all the posting I have given as proof that there is more to this subject than what you have come to believe to many scriptures to deny what the baptism in Christ name
Yes we are saved by believing in the grace of Gods plan to use baptism in Christ name to redeem us.

Read john 3

tell me where jesus said we have to be baptized to be born again

 

[Eternally Grateful]

No quite frankly you have shown your opinion with no scripture to support, you want me to rake your word over the biblical scriptures that prove you wrong

And if you would allow the scripture to show baptism in Christ name is not a work of man but what God is doing for you. There is no way man can do the work that is being done in the baptism in Christ name only God can bring about the new birth as Paul explains in Romans 6 Please stop takeing the glory from God and placing it on man.

My friend, Baptism in water is just as much a work as being circumcised in the OT was.. they both represent cleaning.

We are cleaned by God not by man.

Again, in john 3, where jesus said we are born again and given eternal life. show me the word baptism..

in fact do the same in John 4 (living water) john 5 (Believe) and John 6 (come to, recieve, believe eat and drink) or how about John 1 (but as many as have recieved him)

 

[Ritajanice]

PLEASE ready with an open heart for study all the posting I have given as proof that there is more to this subject than what you have come to believe to many scriptures to deny what the baptism in Christ name
Yes we are saved by believing in the grace of Gods plan to use baptism in Christ name to redeem us.

As I thought, you never answered my questions, because you haven’t a clue what I’m talking about.

Which makes a lot of sense to me.

If one hasn’t been birthed in the Spirit, then of course they wouldn’t know these things..

 

[Ritajanice]

My friend, Baptism in water is just as much a work as being circumcised in the OT was.. they both represent cleaning.

We are cleaned by God not by man.

Again, in john 3, where jesus said we are born again and given eternal life. show me the word baptism..

in fact do the same in John 4 (living water) john 5 (Believe) and John 6 (come to, recieve, believe eat and drink) or how about John 1 (but as many as have recieved him)

Isn’t Born of water, the flesh birth..?