The good man

[Matthias]

“The good man out of the good treasure of his heart brings forth what is good; and the evil man out of the evil treasure brings forth what is evil; for his mouth speaks from that which fills his heart.”

(Luke 6:45, NASB)

 

[Matthias]

The good man stands as a witness.

 

[JustMe]

The good man can discern and witness the good and evil actions and words of others, and the evil person cannot. The latter does not feel or sense remorse or guilt over their evil actions or those of others, to witness any truth or of evil activity; as this is generally considered 'normal' in life for them. The good man on the other hand will act upon his own evil actions, whenever he/she becomes caught up in evil, and accused of the same, from the heart at least, and also by another person.

Late addition....what comes from the heart is soon revealed in our actions and words...inevitable

 

[JustMe]

@Debp and @Sister-n-Christ I've been listening/reading the words of this heated discussion on that thread by NetChaplain - "Once for all." “Once For All”

This thread here of Matthias, ties right into it...I would even consider the verse he posed be brought into this subject.

My recommendation that might simmer things down a bit, is to first, separate the OSAS and the OSNAS talk. And do not speak of the Law at this point as well. It will get a few hot heads really rattled. I have seen it many times before. Then the opportunity is lost...

Address just the OP. The subject is about the one-time forgiveness of Christ derived from his Father for those who are reborn in Christ. And if subsequent sin after this conversion needs to be just acknowledged and truly confessed, or do we digress and ask full forgiveness for it and all our sins over again in deep emotion, as when we first came to Christ and asked forgiveness for all sin committed at that time. God already said he forgave us of our sins, as a one time announcement. We must sincerely believe this in our hearts, without any wavering, in true and strong faith

The last part I recommend is to completely and clearly for everyone, define willful/not-willful sinning, intentional or unintentional sinning. Even the NetChaplain and a few others have not done justice to this critical area for a genuine believer's inquiry yet.

You know borrowing from Mattias' verse of Luke 6:45. those that commit truly evil deeds as sin is, in the eyes of the Father, they cannot discern with clear conscious what is right from wrong. These people are the unconverted ones who sin, and practice sinning as a lifestyle. This is willful and intentional sinning. I believe scripture speaks to this form of the sin definition for the unconverted.

If these definitions do not get the time and space on a good-sized piece of paper, I'm afraid more darts will be thrown. And then when the dust finally settles, with this episode be called intentional/willful sinning by both parties or not... then do we ask full forgiveness of our actions as Christ already gave those, he knows well today?

Just saying...

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

Here's the thing about the few hot heads in that thread.

No actual born again Christian denies they are eternally Saved by Christ. Eternal Salvation. That's the "slogan" that Jesus taught for three years. That's the truth that has been taught for over 2000.

Opponents of eternal salvation teach us that they don't know that. The love of self gives them the false impression God requires their assistance ,work,for him to keep his word.

And the law? Those that think God's moral precepts no longer attach to us are not only wrong but are dangerously immoral.
Jesus reiterated the 10 commandments. And he never once said they expire.

They're written on our hearts. In other words,those are what make us decent moral examples as irrevocably eternally secure in God's grace gift of Salvation.

Rather than suggest what Christians here shouldn't say in that other thread maybe ask yourself,yourselves, why would any indwelt Born Again Christian repeatedly deny Jesus' teaching and instead insist, they can be lost again if they don't work hard to keep it?

Answer? We never would do that.

Remember,the hungry Lion still roams this Earth.

 

[JustMe]

Here's the thing about the few hot heads in that thread.

No actual born again Christian denies they are eternally Saved by Christ. Eternal Salvation. That's the "slogan" that Jesus taught for three years. That's the truth that has been taught for over 2000.

Opponents of eternal salvation teach us that they don't know that. The love of self gives them the false impression God requires their assistance ,work,for him to keep his word.

And the law? Those that think God's moral precepts no longer attach to us are not only wrong but are dangerously immoral.
Jesus reiterated the 10 commandments. And he never once said they expire.

They're written on our hearts. In other words,those are what make us decent moral examples as irrevocably eternally secure in God's grace gift of Salvation.

Rather than suggest what Christians here shouldn't say in that other thread maybe ask yourself,yourselves, why would any indwelt Born Again Christian repeatedly deny Jesus' teaching and instead insist, they can be lost again if they don't work hard to keep it?

Answer? We never would do that.

Remember,the hungry Lion still roams this Earth.

I can tell your emphasis is on eternal salvation and those that apparently indicate to you, in their posts they are not genuinely reborn in Christ. And actually I have often wondered myself, over the years that similar that last question of yours. You are not the only one sister.

Here though, I was just trying to diffuse and define forgiveness for intentional or unintentional sin, at conversion, and later on as a reborn person of God, in spirit.

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

I can tell your emphasis is on eternal salvation and those that apparently indicate to you, in their posts they are not genuinely reborn in Christ. And actually I have often wondered myself, over the years that similar that last question of yours. You are not the only one sister.

Here though, I was just trying to diffuse and define forgiveness for intentional or unintentional sin, at conversion, and later on as a reborn person of God, in spirit.

I appreciate your post. I hope I communicated that in my initial post.

My concern is for a pattern that appears here and in other active Communities of Christ.

That is a dedicated faction who will pose as one of us but are not of us.

If you journey to other active sites you'll see it .

They insist Jesus didn't mean what he taught. And Paul was mistaken.

They do this when they deny what Jesus died for.
They insist Salvation isn't eternal. They insist we have to live afraid of losing our Salvation if we don't work to keep it, and obey in strict lockstep rules they imagine exist beyond the laws of God they claim are done away.

Sure,there are actual Christians who may not understand. There are those who are in a bad church.

And then there are those who pose. And enter communities intending to assail God's truth and the teachings of Jesus and in a manner that doesn't get them banned, call Jesus a fraud. And Eternal Irrevocable Salvation a myth. And a lie.

And if we correct false teachings published here so to accomplish that end an actual Christian may be labeled by them as a demon.

Their point,the spirit that compels, is to bring Chaos to those living the peace of Christ. And,if the record holds,cause so much upset that the site itself closes.

Until then, they play Christians against one another while pretending to be one.

As God warned,even Satan can pose as an angel of light and quote scripture. He still lives. Roaming like a lion. And he has disciples too.
Great metaphor. Lions travel in prides.

Jesus said Salvation is eternal and an irrevocable gift of God. Not of ourselves so that we cannot boast we can save ourselves. That's fact.

If you ever encounter someone who says that's not true, and they can prove it. Pay attention.

And be sure,the pride is always a population of more than one.

 

[JustMe]

I appreciate your post. I hope I communicated that in my initial post.

My concern is for a pattern that appears here and in other active Communities of Christ.

That is a dedicated faction who will pose as one of us but are not of us.

If you journey to other active sites you'll see it .

They insist Jesus didn't mean what he taught. And Paul was mistaken.

They do this when they deny what Jesus died for.
They insist Salvation isn't eternal. They insist we have to live afraid of losing our Salvation if we don't work to keep it, and obey in strict lockstep rules they imagine exist beyond the laws of God they claim are done away.

Sure,there are actual Christians who may not understand. There are those who are in a bad church.

And then there are those who pose. And enter communities intending to assail God's truth and the teachings of Jesus and in a manner that doesn't get them banned, call Jesus a fraud. And Eternal Irrevocable Salvation a myth. And a lie.

And if we correct false teachings published here so to accomplish that end an actual Christian may be labeled by them as a demon.

Their point,the spirit that compels, is to bring Chaos to those living the peace of Christ. And,if the record holds,cause so much upset that the site itself closes.

Until then, they play Christians against one another while pretending to be one.

As God warned,even Satan can lose as an angel of light and quote scripture. He still lives. Roaming like a lion. And he has disciples too.
Great metaphor. Lions travel in prides.

Jesus said Salvation is eternal and an irrevocable gift of God. Not of ourselves so that we cannot boast we can save ourselves. That's fact.

If you ever encounter someone who says that's not true, and they can prove it. Pay attention.

And be sure,the pride is always a population of more than one.

There is much truth in what you have said sis. And for reason s you give and there's much more, this is why some chat forum sites have banned this topic of discussion altogether. I don't want it to happen here.

If you are truly saved with strong faith, and love for the Father and Son over the years that never really wanes, through the 'hard' and 'easy' times, then it's for eternity. No one can ever take this gift of true salvation away from your soul sis. You are Christ's and you hear him.

 

[Debp]

I appreciate your post. I hope I communicated that in my initial post.

My concern is for a pattern that appears here and in other active Communities of Christ.

That is a dedicated faction who will pose as one of us but are not of us.

If you journey to other active sites you'll see it .

They insist Jesus didn't mean what he taught. And Paul was mistaken.

They do this when they deny what Jesus died for.
They insist Salvation isn't eternal. They insist we have to live afraid of losing our Salvation if we don't work to keep it, and obey in strict lockstep rules they imagine exist beyond the laws of God they claim are done away.

Sure,there are actual Christians who may not understand. There are those who are in a bad church.

And then there are those who pose. And enter communities intending to assail God's truth and the teachings of Jesus and in a manner that doesn't get them banned, call Jesus a fraud. And Eternal Irrevocable Salvation a myth. And a lie.

And if we correct false teachings published here so to accomplish that end an actual Christian may be labeled by them as a demon.

Their point,the spirit that compels, is to bring Chaos to those living the peace of Christ. And,if the record holds,cause so much upset that the site itself closes.

Until then, they play Christians against one another while pretending to be one.

As God warned,even Satan can lose as an angel of light and quote scripture. He still lives. Roaming like a lion. And he has disciples too.
Great metaphor. Lions travel in prides.

Jesus said Salvation is eternal and an irrevocable gift of God. Not of ourselves so that we cannot boast we can save ourselves. That's fact.

If you ever encounter someone who says that's not true, and they can prove it. Pay attention.

And be sure,the pride is always a population of more than one.

I never knew about the "lose your salvation" crowd until I came to Christian forums many years ago.

I think it's pitiful and sad that some seem to want to chip away at the faith of others.

 

[Rockerduck]

If you have seen the posts that use scripture wrong. I've purposely only used scripture to show error, only to barbed back. Scripture cannot contradict scripture. All scripture is by inspiration of God, and God cannot contradict His own Word. Therein lies the problem. Many don't see that and lack the Holy Spirit to see it.

 

[Sister-n-Christ]

I never knew about the "lose your salvation" crowd until I came to Christian forums many years ago.

I think it's pitiful and sad that some seem to want to chip away at the faith of others.

It is sad. Which makes the effort suspect in the first place.
How could a Christian who actually lives the peace Christ invites us with insist that's on us? We can choose that for ourselves. And as such lose it by choice.

It makes no sense in itself. And it has no Biblical support. Twisting scripture isn't support.