Ultimately, it's not a matter of who is right and who is wrong... (?)

[PS95]

Believe means more than that single word--Matt 7:21-23--these believe.; The laodecians( ones called christian) who are lukewarm in Revelation believe, but Jesus will vomit them out it says in revelation.
So believing means more than that single word--Obeying is a major part of those who believe.

Why must you always insinuate that I think we should disobey God? There is no reason for that. Where have I ever said that?
Belief in Jesus is OUR FIRST act of obedience to God the Father. The rest follows when one sincerely believes, and is born a new- the spirit of Christ/spirit of God/Holy Spirit helps us to obey and teaches us. It is not a set of man's rules- but is to love one another.

Ones will be resurrected because they are acquitted of sin at death. Gods 100% judgement against sin=the wages sin pays is death. Paid in full at death. But then there is the matter of taking a direct stand against Jehovah and his will.

Do you continue in that lie on purpose? Nowhere does the bible teach that. Romans 6:7 is 1/7 of one sentence.. it is about our lives now. Our old nature was CRUCIFIED and DIED. ONLY those who are born again in Christ have sins acquitted because we DIED to the flesh and live in the spirit--- That is what Paul is saying. It's absurd to twist that into what you are teachings. Be careful!!!!
Romans 6:5-7 is one sentence---
5For if we have been united with Him like this in His death, we will certainly also be united with Him in His resurrection. 6We know that our old self was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be rendered powerless, that we should no longer be slaves to sin. 7For anyone who has died has been freed from sin.

keep reading.. Ro 6:8-11
8Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with Him. 9For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, He cannot die again; death no longer has dominion over Him. 10The death He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life He lives, He lives to God. 11So you too must count yourselves dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

No one is that dense to think that is speaking about our physical death. You must want to continue to teach a lie.
There is nothing left to say. We have been through this countless times. You just refuse to believe anyone but your goons- even if that means denying the very scriptures..

In order for a mortal to know for sure if another is saved, he would have to be able to read the true heart=he cannot--2) he would have to have seen ones name written in Gods book of life=He has not seen one.-3) He would have to know who will endure until their end= he has no clue. Thus does not know who is saved only by theory.

Have you seen the book of life with your goon leaders names in it? NO. Then why do you believe every lie they tell?

Example Joel Osteen stands on tv says-say 3 lines of prayer with me and you are saved--he doesn't know 1/ 10th of those people and which sins they practice or what partaking's off the table of demons they do, but the blind believe people like that.. He is making millions of $$$ doing it.
All telling others-you are saved= blind guides.

Osteen is a false teacher. There are MANY. --Never look to man for your answers. Read the scriptures and Pray.

 

[Keiw]

Why must you always insinuate that I think we should disobey God? There is no reason for that. Where have I ever said that?
Belief in Jesus is OUR FIRST act of obedience to God the Father. The rest follows when one sincerely believes, and is born a new- the spirit of Christ/spirit of God/Holy Spirit helps us to obey and teaches us. It is not a set of man's rules- but is to love one another.

Do you continue in that lie on purpose? Nowhere does the bible teach that. Romans 6:7 is 1/7 of one sentence.. it is about our lives now. Our old nature was CRUCIFIED and DIED. ONLY those who are born again in Christ have sins acquitted because we DIED to the flesh and live in the spirit--- That is what Paul is saying. It's absurd to twist that into what you are teachings. Be careful!!!!
Romans 6:5-7 is one sentence---
5For if we have been united with Him like this in His death, we will certainly also be united with Him in His resurrection. 6We know that our old self was crucified with Him so that the body of sin might be rendered powerless, that we should no longer be slaves to sin. 7For anyone who has died has been freed from sin.

keep reading.. Ro 6:8-11
8Now if we died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with Him. 9For we know that since Christ was raised from the dead, He cannot die again; death no longer has dominion over Him. 10The death He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life He lives, He lives to God. 11So you too must count yourselves dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus.

No one is that dense to think that is speaking about our physical death. You must want to continue to teach a lie.
There is nothing left to say. We have been through this countless times. You just refuse to believe anyone but your goons- even if that means denying the very scriptures..




Have you seen the book of life with your goon leaders names in it? NO. Then why do you believe every lie they tell?


Osteen is a false teacher. There are MANY. --Never look to man for your answers. Read the scriptures and Pray.

You call me a liar--Then prove Gods judgement for one who sins isn't death.=The wages sin pays is death.
It is 100% reality=Jesus leads the JW religion. My teachers are these=Matt 24:45--Thus when you call them liars are calling Jesus a liar as well= Whatever you do to the least of these my brothers, you do to me.

 

[St. SteVen]

It is 100% reality=Jesus leads the JW religion.

Say what?

[

 

[PS95]

You call me a liar--Then prove Gods judgement for one who sins isn't death.=The wages sin pays is death.
It is 100% reality=Jesus leads the JW religion. My teachers are these=Matt 24:45--Thus when you call them liars are calling Jesus a liar as well= Whatever you do to the least of these my brothers, you do to me.

I didn't call you a liar. I said you are continuing in that lie- (it was taught to you and is a lie) That's why I have compassion on you. If it was your lie I would not! Why you continue in believing it is my question- you have been shown numerous times that it is incorrect.
Romans 6 is not speaking about physical death!! You know that in side somewhere. All I ask of you is simple. READ YOUR BIBLE. Put down the wt books and mags. ALONE. just READ GOD's WORD AND PRAY FOR UNDERSTANDING.
how is that wrong?
because man told you not to? WHY would they do that KEIW? WHAT DO THEY HIDE? They are not fds. That's been proven a zillion times over,

 

[Keiw]

Say what?

[

All who knows what Jesus teaches knows its fact. Few know what he teaches.

 

[Keiw]

I didn't call you a liar. I said you are continuing in that lie- (it was taught to you and is a lie) That's why I have compassion on you. If it was your lie I would not! Why you continue in believing it is my question- you have been shown numerous times that it is incorrect.
Romans 6 is not speaking about physical death!! You know that in side somewhere. All I ask of you is simple. READ YOUR BIBLE. Put down the wt books and mags. ALONE. just READ GOD's WORD AND PRAY FOR UNDERSTANDING.
how is that wrong?
because man told you not to? WHY would they do that KEIW? WHAT DO THEY HIDE? They are not fds. That's been proven a zillion times over,

Its not a lie--The bible teaches 100% = the wages sin pays is death= Gods judgement against sin.
Not one on Earth can understand the deep things in Gods bible without being taught by these=Matt 24:45. Its why the trinity based religionsssssssssssssssssssssssssss are a house dived they will not stand.=a mass of confusion.

 

[PS95]

Small g in 20 translations by unbias Greek scholars as well.

lol That's not true.

 

[PS95]

Its not a lie--The bible teaches 100% = the wages sin pays is death= Gods judgement against sin.
Not one on Earth can understand the deep things in Gods bible without being taught by these=Matt 24:45. Its why the trinity based religionsssssssssssssssssssssssssss are a house dived they will not stand.=a mass of confusion.

Yes, It is a lie. You will not be resurrected SINLESS just because you died. Utter nonsense.
It is getting what you've earned- your pay- your wages. That is ALL that it means. You get what you deserve. The wages of sin is death. BTW not that it matters much but as usual( YOUR JW bible adds words that are NOT in the Greek!) Check your interlinear. There is no "pays" there.
OR choose LIFE--
and the rest of the sentence is... BUT the gift of God is eternal life in Jesus Christ our Lord.
It's a gift that you do NOT deserve.
JWs have forgotten JESUS. You need to accept His forgiveness for your sins. ONLY He can atone for your sins. Your dead body isn't spotless & blameless or sinless. Only Jesus IS righteousness not your corpse! Why can't JWs believe Jesus is our SAVIOR who paid for your sins? Rock of offense that you keep stumbling over and keep kicking down. It's so messed up. If you don't accept HIS gift He won't force you. You can choose death instead of life. That's the point.
Keiw, since you are so sure- aside from the 1/7 of one sentence that you have twisted in to a MAJOR false doctrine. since it's such a big deal to JWs that physical death makes people sinless--- show me where "else" the bible teaches this? Rhetorical Q because it's nowhere to be found.
If you just understood the forgiveness of sins = our sins are paid for BY JESUS SHED BLOOD.--
I cant make you believe in Jesus. I can only share the truth of the scriptures with you.

Deep things of God? Your fake fds doesn't know Jesus enough to teach you the BASICS of Jesus death-- so they sure don't know His Father.
They did a real number on your head. It's time now to believe the scriptures and not man.
There are plenty of people who don't accept the trinity but who understand why Jesus gave His life. That's no excuse so save it. Your fds is wrong on way tooooo much.
You must be born again, Keiw. then, things will make more sense to you.
Please go here- I invited you..

Is BEING BORN AGAIN AN EARTHY THING ?

This post is for all JWS here @Keiw @TheHC @ElieG12 @Aunty Jane **Aunty Jane said--The fact that you believe that being “born again” is something that takes place “on earth”, tells me that you have no idea what it is, or what it means. It isn’t some mystical personal experience…it is a...

www.christianityboard.com

 

[PS95]

Believe means more than that single word--Matt 7:21-23--these believe.; The laodecians( ones called christian) who are lukewarm in Revelation believe, but Jesus will vomit them out it says in revelation.
So believing means more than that single word--Obeying is a major part of those who believe.

No one has said that obedience is not required. Matt 7 is speaking about FALSE PROPHETS. Read it!
The first step of obedience is BELIEVING GOD. If you have not done that how can you obey anything else? You don't believe that Jesus' death pays for your personal sins. That is unbelief.

Ones will be resurrected because they are acquitted of sin at death. Gods 100% judgement against sin=the wages sin pays is death. Paid in full at death.

No Kiew. Your physical death does not make you sinless.
Jesus paid for your sins. You don't believe Him. That is the real problem.

 

[Keiw]

lol That's not true.

Those translations were rejected by the trinity religions.
1822--Abner kneeland( non JW, or trinitarian) Compared Greek to English side by side in his NT translation to prove to the world a god is correct.

 

[Keiw]

Yes, It is a lie. You will not be resurrected SINLESS just because you died. Utter nonsense.
It is getting what you've earned- your pay- your wages. That is ALL that it means. You get what you deserve. The wages of sin is death. BTW not that it matters much but as usual( YOUR JW bible adds words that are NOT in the Greek!) Check your interlinear. There is no "pays" there.
OR choose LIFE--
and the rest of the sentence is... BUT the gift of God is eternal life in Jesus Christ our Lord.
It's a gift that you do NOT deserve.
JWs have forgotten JESUS. You need to accept His forgiveness for your sins. ONLY He can atone for your sins. Your dead body isn't spotless & blameless or sinless. Only Jesus IS righteousness not your corpse! Why can't JWs believe Jesus is our SAVIOR who paid for your sins? Rock of offense that you keep stumbling over and keep kicking down. It's so messed up. If you don't accept HIS gift He won't force you. You can choose death instead of life. That's the point.
Keiw, since you are so sure- aside from the 1/7 of one sentence that you have twisted in to a MAJOR false doctrine. since it's such a big deal to JWs that physical death makes people sinless--- show me where "else" the bible teaches this? Rhetorical Q because it's nowhere to be found.
If you just understood the forgiveness of sins = our sins are paid for BY JESUS SHED BLOOD.--
I cant make you believe in Jesus. I can only share the truth of the scriptures with you.

Deep things of God? Your fake fds doesn't know Jesus enough to teach you the BASICS of Jesus death-- so they sure don't know His Father.
They did a real number on your head. It's time now to believe the scriptures and not man.
There are plenty of people who don't accept the trinity but who understand why Jesus gave His life. That's no excuse so save it. Your fds is wrong on way tooooo much.
You must be born again, Keiw. then, things will make more sense to you.
Please go here- I invited you..

Is BEING BORN AGAIN AN EARTHY THING ?

This post is for all JWS here @Keiw @TheHC @ElieG12 @Aunty Jane **Aunty Jane said--The fact that you believe that being “born again” is something that takes place “on earth”, tells me that you have no idea what it is, or what it means. It isn’t some mystical personal experience…it is a...

www.christianityboard.com

you can't prove your words. But 100% proof in Gods written word= every translation on Earth--The wages sin pays is death)= wages paid in full at death.

 

[Keiw]

No one has said that obedience is not required. Matt 7 is speaking about FALSE PROPHETS. Read it!
The first step of obedience is BELIEVING GOD. If you have not done that how can you obey anything else? You don't believe that Jesus' death pays for your personal sins. That is unbelief.

No Kiew. Your physical death does not make you sinless.
Jesus paid for your sins. You don't believe Him. That is the real problem.

None would have to die and pay their own wages of sin if Jesus covers them as you think. Nor would they have to repent and turn around to get their sins blotted out( Acts 3:19) if Jesus covered those sins over. There is a whole bible sir.

 

[PS95]

Those translations were rejected by the trinity religions.
1822--Abner kneeland( non JW, or trinitarian) Compared Greek to English side by side in his NT translation to prove to the world a god is correct.

You said there are 20 translations that say, The Word was a god. Time to list them.

DO you understand that if John had put the definitive article in 1c he would have been saying the Son was the Father?
Clearly, John didn't want to say that. 1b he just showed us that the Son was with His Father.
So to now say- the Word was the God would have been wrong and very confusing!
The way it is worded without the article is CORRECT.
There were no capital letters in Greek. All were capital. and there is no "a" nor should anyone insert it. a god did not lay the foundations of heaven and earth. BUT The Word of God did. At least if you believe what the Father said about His Son you know that.

NOT ONE THING came into existence without HIM.
Yet JWS disagree........... what is there to say?

 

[PS95]

None would have to die and pay their own wages of sin if Jesus covers them as you think. Nor would they have to repent and turn around to get their sins blotted out( Acts 3:19) if Jesus covered those sins over. There is a whole bible sir.

Why is that? lol Don't you know that there is a natural body and a spiritual body? 1 Cor 15:44

Think about it. If believers stopped dying physically on earth because they came to Christ- Would you want to live in a world where natural body mortals are living with spiritual body immortals. How awful would that be to live in this current world forever!!! No thanks. Watching loved ones sick and dying forever..? There are so many awful things about it I don't even want to think about it.
Yes, there is a WHOLE bible and I wish you would read it. Put down the magazines that cherry pick verses- read it all in context in prayer with out your watchtowers!! Idolizing these men is the same exact thing as listening to the pope. READ your bible. Did you ever notice that you give me the same 12 or so verses over and over and over?

 

[PS95]

you can't prove your words. But 100% proof in Gods written word= every translation on Earth--The wages sin pays is death)= wages paid in full at death.

I am not arguing with the bible. You are. How many times do I have to tell you that I agree the wages is death? It does not say ( the wages sin "pays" is death) but leave it to the jw bible to add words. Check the Greek. No that it changes much but it was inserted to help along their theology.. whatever nothing new. It does not say that you become washed and sinless by physical death!

When you get a job.. you go to work you do your job and expect your wages. Once you are done- you get paid your wages. Why? Because you deserve them. That's what you are paid by the employer. Here the employer is God and when you sin you earn your wages- He pays you what you have earned. The 2nd death.
Now if you BELIEVE Jesus and accept forgiveness of your sins you are washed clean in the blood of Christ- you be born anew with a new spirit in you and you will learn how to die to sin- by the spirit. We can not do this alone. We need God's spirit in us.

 

[Keiw]

You said there are 20 translations that say, The Word was a god. Time to list them.

DO you understand that if John had put the definitive article in 1c he would have been saying the Son was the Father?
Clearly, John didn't want to say that. 1b he just showed us that the Son was with His Father.
So to now say- the Word was the God would have been wrong and very confusing!
The way it is worded without the article is CORRECT.
There were no capital letters in Greek. All were capital. and there is no "a" nor should anyone insert it. a god did not lay the foundations of heaven and earth. BUT The Word of God did. At least if you believe what the Father said about His Son you know that.

NOT ONE THING came into existence without HIM.
Yet JWS disagree........... what is there to say?

i don't need to list them, you can look them up. The fact is 2 beings at John 1:1--The Word=1 was with God=1= The word cannot be God and be with God. a god is 100% correct.

 

[Keiw]

Why is that? lol Don't you know that there is a natural body and a spiritual body? 1 Cor 15:44

Think about it. If believers stopped dying physically on earth because they came to Christ- Would you want to live in a world where natural body mortals are living with spiritual body immortals. How awful would that be to live in this current world forever!!! No thanks. Watching loved ones sick and dying forever..? There are so many awful things about it I don't even want to think about it.
Yes, there is a WHOLE bible and I wish you would read it. Put down the magazines that cherry pick verses- read it all in context in prayer with out your watchtowers!! Idolizing these men is the same exact thing as listening to the pope. READ your bible. Did you ever notice that you give me the same 12 or so verses over and over and over?

The resurrection occurs here at Rev 20-not before for the majority. They wait in the grave.

 

[PS95]

i don't need to list them, you can look them up. The fact is 2 beings at John 1:1--The Word=1 was with God=1= The word cannot be God and be with God. a god is 100% correct.

I can't look up what doesn't exist.
JWs can't accept what John wrote so you have to change it so it makes sense to your human brain.
Have a look at apostolic church father's writings sometime. they spoke Koine Greek. You dont.
Not one had your false translation. It is made very obvious BY CONTEXT of their writings.

 

[PS95]

The resurrection occurs here at Rev 20-not before for the majority. They wait in the grave.

What does timing have to do with your question? You asked why we need to die physically. I told you why. You think that because our sins have been forgiven that our bodies should not die. So you want a world where immortals are living with mortals together in this sinful world. Ridiculous. Our bodies will be risen immortal and those who are still alive will be changed.

 

[Keiw]

I can't look up what doesn't exist.
JWs can't accept what John wrote so you have to change it so it makes sense to your human brain.
Have a look at apostolic church father's writings sometime. they spoke Koine Greek. You dont.
Not one had your false translation. It is made very obvious BY CONTEXT of their writings.

This is how difficult it is--in ones google search write--Bibles in history with a god at John 1:1