Did Jesus remove all the sin from the world?

[pandaflower]

if a man chooses to believe a lie
rather than the truth , whose fault is that . it would be the fault of such a one .
The sheep , whose love would be of the truth , of the LORD , follow the bidding of the SPIRIT
which guides them into all TRUTH .
And when sheep see those in any dissumalation , in sin and error
Correction time .
Let love be WITHOUT dissumlation .
And yet the version of todays love i see in most churches
has caused GREAT DISSUMLATION from the TRUTH .
PUAL corrected dissumlation . As he did with peter and all others if he seen error .
Many today seem to love this love that dissumulates FROM the one true gospel
FROM the one true JESUS the CHRIST .
And it has led them into only greater and greater darkness .
LOVE , if it be of GOD , would have REJOICED IN THE TRUTH , not in a lie , not in inquity , IN TRUTH .
And every lovely word of the LORD , IS TRUTH . AS HE IS TRUTH and in HIM IS no darkness
The LOVE OF GOD shed upon the heart of the sheep
is not like the love of the world . But do beware
for the love of the world can come cloaked as though tis love
and with good works , But it will come to shut out the TRUTH of the GOSPEL
and make the road to GOD very broad , sin accepting , unbeleif accepting . The devil is a liar
and he can twist any word , any scrip and will always present
twisted truths to implant a lie and NOT THE TRUTH . FOR THERE IS NO TRUTH IN HIIM .

The truth is, Jesus was not born as a regular mortal man with a corresponding sin nature.

Our Savior cannot be a sinner and then save us.Because the question then is,who saved him first? So that he could save us next.

I've read postings at other forums over time. I like to focused on the theology boards and Bible study posts.
I cannot recall anyone who insisted the Bible teaches what @Hiddenthings defends here.


Everything they've said is contrary to everything related to our divine Lord and Savior.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It seems so.

Calvinism being the go-to word so to imply someone charged as a Calvinist is therefore not Christian.
It's a shame.
Though it does have a silver lining. Those accusers are showing they don't read their Bible as closely as they should.

I see them as arguing "ISMS" and not the word

 

[Eternally Grateful]

I wonder if you are able... to read... the simple Bible Scripture below, especially that part in red:

this just tells me there is probably nothin go value below. But I will read it only

Acts 17:29-30
29 Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.

30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
KJV


Rom 5:13-14
13 (For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of Him That was to come.
KJV

and this is against me how?

I think your drawing at straws

this does not answer my question. Does God need proof we have saving faith..

can you answer the question?

 

[Davy]

Once again, you dance away from the point at hand, to deflect into more personal nonsense.

Not much of a conversation, so I'm bowing out.

Much love!

I'm not the one dancing... around the subject. The subject is... the falling away (Greek apostasia) ideas that Apostle Paul taught, which you apparently REJECT. Apostle Paul wasn't alone in teaching about falling away, Lord Jesus did too.

Luke 8:13
13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
KJV

That is about the BELIEVER on Jesus Christ who later 'falls away' from Christ because they won't endure temptation. And the biggest temptation for this present world is just around the corner, when the prophesied false-Messiah shows up first in Jerusalem, and proclaims himself as GOD, and all that is called GOD, or that is worshiped (2 Thessalonians 2).


Rev 2:26
26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth My works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
KJV

Does that say, he that keepeth My works of ONLY having BELIEVED ON ME AND HAVING BEEN BAPTIZED that He will give power over the nations?

No! It's those who remain in the WALK with Jesus Christ by keeping His commandments and walking by The Spirit that are the keeping of His works to the end. And per 1 John 1 that includes repentance to Christ of our future sins.


Heb 10:26-31
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

As long as we are in the flesh, our flesh body will be under the "law of sin" (Rom.7). That means we are still going to slip up and have future sin, period. For that reason, Apostle John in 1 John 1 showed that we still need to repent to Christ of our future sins, asking forgiveness.

Are those on man's OSAS doctrine repenting of future sins? NO! They are lied to and told they have no need, because they claim Jesus forgave ALL their sins already, including any future sins. But that's not what Paul showed either in Romans 3:25:

Rom.3:25
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

How strange it is too, that no one cares to comment on what Paul said above about ONLY our "sins that are past" is what is forgiven when we first believe on Jesus Christ. That's enough Biblical proof alone to show man's OSAS doctrine is false, and proves what Apostle John taught in 1 John 1 as Truth.

Paul continues his rebuke of those who trample upon The New Covenant in Christ's Blood shed upon the cross by their continuing in sin, not watching for future sin, which is what the OSAS doctrine promotes, while Christ Jesus instead commanded us to REPENT of future sins (Luke 11 prayer Jesus taught us to say asks forgiveness of future sin).

The result for those who are not examining theirselves for future sin, and not repenting of it, is per the following...

Heb.10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith He was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know Him That hath said, "Vengeance belongeth unto Me, I will recompense, saith the Lord." And again, "The Lord shall judge His people."
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
KJV

 

[MatthewG]

Did you guys know that Jesus, was Israel?

 

[MatthewG]

I'm not the one dancing... around the subject. The subject is... the falling away (Greek apostasia) ideas that Apostle Paul taught, which you apparently REJECT. Apostle Paul wasn't alone in teaching about falling away, Lord Jesus did too.

Luke 8:13
13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
KJV

That is about the BELIEVER on Jesus Christ who later 'falls away' from Christ because they won't endure temptation. And the biggest temptation for this present world is just around the corner, when the prophesied false-Messiah shows up first in Jerusalem, and proclaims himself as GOD, and all that is called GOD, or that is worshiped (2 Thessalonians 2).


Rev 2:26
26 And he that overcometh, and keepeth My works unto the end, to him will I give power over the nations:
KJV

Does that say, he that keepeth My works of ONLY having BELIEVED ON ME AND HAVING BEEN BAPTIZED that He will give power over the nations?

No! It's those who remain in the WALK with Jesus Christ by keeping His commandments and walking by The Spirit that are the keeping of His works to the end. And per 1 John 1 that includes repentance to Christ of our future sins.


Heb 10:26-31
26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

As long as we are in the flesh, our flesh body will be under the "law of sin" (Rom.7). That means we are still going to slip up and have future sin, period. For that reason, Apostle John in 1 John 1 showed that we still need to repent to Christ of our future sins, asking forgiveness.

Are those on man's OSAS doctrine repenting of future sins? NO! They are lied to and told they have no need, because they claim Jesus forgave ALL their sins already, including any future sins. But that's not what Paul showed either in Romans 3:25:

Rom.3:25
25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;
KJV

How strange it is too, that no one cares to comment on what Paul said above about ONLY our "sins that are past" is what is forgiven when we first believe on Jesus Christ. That's enough Biblical proof alone to show man's OSAS doctrine is false, and proves what Apostle John taught in 1 John 1 as Truth.

Paul continues his rebuke of those who trample upon The New Covenant in Christ's Blood shed upon the cross by their continuing in sin, not watching for future sin, which is what the OSAS doctrine promotes, while Christ Jesus instead commanded us to REPENT of future sins (Luke 11 prayer Jesus taught us to say asks forgiveness of future sin).

The result for those who are not examining theirselves for future sin, and not repenting of it, is per the following...

Heb.10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith He was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
30 For we know Him That hath said, "Vengeance belongeth unto Me, I will recompense, saith the Lord." And again, "The Lord shall judge His people."
31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
KJV

Revelation, Hebrews, Romans, and Luke, where not written directly to you.


People miss much when they assign books to themselves.

 

[marks]

A commonwealth is a grouping of nations. And the commonwealth of Israel that is being referred to is "the Israel of God", ie, believing Israel, not "Israel after the flesh." So we believing Gentiles of other nations have joined the commonwealth of the Israel of God. We Gentiles are unnatural branches which have been grafted into it, as it were.

πολιτεία
politeia
pol-ee-ti'-ah
From G4177 (“polity”); citizenship; concretely a community: - commonwealth, freedom.
Total KJV occurrences: 2

The second place is:

Acts 22:28 KJV
And the chief captain answered, With a great sum obtained I this freedom. And Paul said, But I was free born.

I don't see this as "a grouping of nations".

Meanwhile,

Philippians 3:20 LITV
For our citizenship is in Heaven, from where we also wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ,

This "citizenship" is from:

ίτευμα
politeuma
pol-it'-yoo-mah
From G4176; a community, that is, (abstractly) citizenship (figuratively): - conversation.
Total KJV occurrences: 1

We are not "spiritual Jews". We are grafted into Abraham. We are not the "spiritual children" of Jacob, we are the spiritual children of Abraham.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

We do not believe this

IF... you believe in man's false Once Saved, Always Doctrine, which teaches all... those who believe on Christ were pre-ordained to Salvation, then that makes you a Calvinist, because that is a Fate-Salvation theory, and that was one of Calvin's ideas. Thus ignorance of that is no excuse.

I believe in free will.

If you believe man's OSAS doctrine, then you DO NOT believe in free will.
If you believe all believers were pre-ordained already to Salvation, not depending on their free will choice, then that is Calvinism.

If you want to keep showing how much YOU lack listening skills. continue to nonsense by trying to declare I am Calvinist.

otherwise. listen to what I say and interpret me. otherwise. You just show you are hard hearted

Your ignorance of Calvinism is no excuse. And makes one wonder just what 'other' false doctrines from men you've been learning in the churches you've attended.

And it is so... EASY... to recognize your deceptions, because they dwell 'outside' of God's written Word.

 

[Davy]

again, You have completely made yourself look bad

NOTHING you said here goes again anything I believe. or proves your point.

If your going to continue to read me with a calvinist lens. you will continue to misrepresent me and continue to prove you have not heard A word I said.

All my responses to you have been based on what YOU have already said in your support of man's Once Saved, Always Saved ideas.

What you have revealed about yourself is that you really don't know a whole lot of what you are saying, Biblically that is, but you are only regurgitating what you have heard at the pulpit with men's doctrines outside The Bible. And if you were truly interested in what God's Word says 'as written', you would have RESPONDED TO THOSE SCRIPTURES I HAVE GIVEN, instead running your mouth full of hot air and going nowhere.

 

[KUWN]

Hmmm what is your basis for this?

Amen...it's only true for whosoever believes on Him. We cant' take that one verse and isolate it from the whole counsel of God as set out in other scriptures.

I believe marks expressed that verse as being a "statement of intent", if I'm understanding him correctly. It has been accomplished for the whole world but only applies to those who believe/receive Christ. It's like everyone has been freed to walk out of debtor's prison so to speak, the door has been unlocked and opened for all, but not everyone will take the opportunity to walk through that door into the freedom that has been bought for them.

The unbelievers have been bought also. Does your theology allow for this?

 

[Muna]

Did you guys know that Jesus, was Israel?

How would you reckon it, for example, here are a few

For example

Mat 2:14 When he arose, he took the young child and his mother by night, and departed INTO Egypt:

Then here, it speaks of Israel as a child, and calling his son OUT of Egypt

Hosea 11:1 When Israel was a child, then I loved him, and called my son OUT OF Egypt.

Then appearing to Joseph IN Egypt to call him OUT OF but INTO the land of Israel

Mat 2:19 But when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeareth in a dream to Joseph IN Egypt, Saying, Arise, and take the young child and his mother, and go INTO the land of Israel: for they are dead which sought the young child's life.

It speaks of those things that were determined to be done beforehand

Acts 4:26 The kings of the earth stood up, and the rulers were gathered together against the Lord, and against his Christ. For of a truth against thy holy child Jesus, whom thou hast anointed, both Herod, and Pontius Pilate, with the Gentiles, and the people of Israel, were gathered together, For to do whatsoever thy hand and thy counsel determined before to be done.

There is Israel was a child, there are the people of Israel, and the land of Israel

 

[KUWN]

Revelation (but see 1.4), Hebrews (10.25), Romans (1.7), and Luke (this is an Old Testament book) where not written directly to you.

 

[pandaflower]

I see them as arguing "ISMS" and not the word.

That would seem to fit.
I think if someone sees Jesus as a sin nature man first,they're unable to see any truth after that grave error.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

IF... you believe in man's false Once Saved, Always Doctrine, which teaches all... those who believe on Christ were pre-ordained to Salvation, then that makes you a Calvinist, because that is a Fate-Salvation theory, and that was one of Calvin's ideas. Thus ignorance of that is no excuse.

Again

we do not believe this

we believe that the moment we freely of our own chosing chose to repent based on all the work God has done to draw us to himself. and in faith recieve his free gift of life. That we will never perish, and we will live forever.

That has nothign to do with calvinism.

so please stop

If you believe man's OSAS doctrine, then you DO NOT believe in free will.

lol. Thats a good one. Sadly false. but good..

If you believe all believers were pre-ordained already to Salvation, not depending on their free will choice, then that is Calvinism.

I do not believe this.. so again, please stop

Your ignorance of Calvinism is no excuse. And makes one wonder just what 'other' false doctrines from men you've been learning in the churches you've attended.

Dude, I know calvinistic teaching quite well.. I am against it. I reject all 5 points. and would fight side by side with you if we were talking to a true calvinist.

again, Stop with the nonsense Or i will put you on ignore for your lack of humility

And it is so... EASY... to recognize your deceptions, because they dwell 'outside' of God's written Word.

yadda yadda yadda.

from soneon who thinks they can work to merit salvation.

Look in the mirror before you attack someone else. especially since you keep proving every time you talk. you have no idea what the person even believes.

 

[Muna]

Revelation, Hebrews, Romans, and Luke, where not written directly to you.


People miss much when they assign books to themselves.

This one is to the angel of the church os Laodiceans here

Rev 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

And this one to the Colossians church was to also be read in the church of the Laodiceans

Col 4:16 And when this epistle is read among you, cause that it be read also in the church of the Laodiceans; and that ye likewise read the epistle from Laodicea.

And the Colossian church were also told to read the epistle from Laoicea

Where that letter is seems to be a mystery but at least we have Paul teling them to read the letters between the churches in Asia

Edit:typo

 

[Eternally Grateful]

All my responses to you have been based on what YOU have already said in your support of man's Once Saved, Always Saved ideas.

actua;lly I have not said much to support it. I have spent to much time trying to correct you on your false accusations of what I believe

What you have revealed about yourself is that you really don't know a whole lot of what you are saying, Biblically that is, but you are only regurgitating what you have heard at the pulpit with men's doctrines outside The Bible. And if you were truly interested in what God's Word says 'as written', you would have RESPONDED TO THOSE SCRIPTURES I HAVE GIVEN, instead running your mouth full of hot air and going nowhere.

lol what is it with you people that you think you are so smart you know everything?



Ok dude, here we go.

show me works in these passages. if you want to talk about eternal security and us having to work to be saved. show me works in these gospel messages from Jesus and Paul

John 1: 11: 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12. But AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED HIM, to THEM he gave the right to become children, even TO THEM WHO BELIEVE 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (no works)

John 3, FOR God so loved the world he gave his only son that WHOEVER BELIEVES (trusts) in him will NEVER PERISH, and LIVE FOREVER (eternal life) for the son was not sent to judge, but that the world might be saved, he who BELIEVES is NOT CONDEMNED, he who does not believe is condemned already (no works)

John 4: 13 Jesus answered and said to her, “Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, 14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will NEVER THIRST. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into EVERLASTING LIFE” (no works)

John 5: 24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he whoever HEARS MY WORD and BELIEVES IN HIM WHO SENT ME who sent Me HAS ETERNAL LIFE and SHALL NOT COME INTO JUDGMENT but HAS PASSED FROM DEATH TO LIFE (No works)

John 6: 35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. HE WHO COMES TO ME shall NEVER HUNGER and he who BELIEVES IN ME shall NEVER THIRST (NO WORKS)

John 6: 37: and THE ONE WHO COMES TO ME I WILL BY NO MEANS CAST OUT 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, thatof all He has given Me I SHAL LOSE NOTHING, but SHOULD RAISE IT UP ON THE LAST DAY. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that EVERYONE WHO SEES AND BELIEVES IN HIM MAY HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE AND I WILL (NOT MIGHT) RAISE HIM ON THE LAST DAY (NO WORKS)

John 6: 47 Most assuredly, I say to you, HE WHO BELIEVES IN ME HAS EVERLASTING LIFE. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and are dead. 50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that THAT ONE MAY EAT OF IT AND NOT DIE 51 am the living bread which came down from heaven. IF ANYONE EATS THIS BREAD HE WILL LIVE FOREVER (NO WORKS)

John 6: 63 It is the SPIRIT WHO GIVES LIFE ; the flesh profits nothing. THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK to you ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE (SIGNIFYING THE BREAD FROM HEAVEN, THE FLESH AND BOOD ARE THE WORDS JESUS SPOKE. NOT THE PHYSICAL FOOD OR WORKS,)

EPH 1: 13 In Him YOU ALSO TRUSTED , after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also ,HAVING BELIEVED YOU WERE SEALED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT OF PROMISE 14 who IS THE GAURANTEE OF OUR INHERITANCE until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

THE INHERITANCE HE SAID WE ALREADY HAD IN THE 1ST 12 VERSES. (AGAIN, NO WORKS)

eph 2: 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses,MADE US ALIVE together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and RAISED US UP TOGETHER , and MADE US SIT TOGETHER IN HEAVENLY PLACES 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For BY GRACE YOU HAVE BEEN SAVED (A COMPLETED ACTION) THROUGH FAITH , (AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED) and that NOT OF YOURSELVES ; it IS THE GIFT OF GOD, 9 NOT OF WORKS LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST (NO WORKS)

rom 4: 3 For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND HE ACOUNTED IT TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” 4 Now TO HIM WHO WORKS, THE WAGES ARE NOT COUNTED AS GRACE BUT DEBT (Works cancels out grace. and makes it a wage) 5 But TO HIM WHO DOES NOT WORK but BELIEVES ON HIM WHO JUSTIFIES THE UNGOLDY , his HIS FAITH IS ACCOUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS (AGAIN NO WORKS. PERIOD)

rom 4: 16 Therefore IT IF OF FAITH THAT IT MAY BE ACCORDING TO GRACE , so that THE PROMISE MAY BE SURE TO ALL THE SEED not only to those who are of the law, but also TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM , who is the father of us all (AGAIN, NO WORKS, IT IS OF GRACE THROUGH FAITH)

Rom 4: 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but ALSO FOR US, IT SHALL BE IMPUTED TO US WHO BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED UP JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD , 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was RAISED BECAUSE OF OUR JUSTIFICATION (AGAIN NO WORKS)

Rom 11: 6 And IF BY GRACE, THAN IT IS NO LONGER OF WORKS, ; otherwise GRACE IS NO LONGER GRACE.But IF IT IS OF WORKS, THEN IT IS NO LONGER OF GRACE. OTHERWISE WORK IS NO LONGER WORK (AS i HAVE SAID NUMEROUS TIME, GRACE + WORKS = WORKS.. GRACE AND WORKS CAN NOT MIX IN THE AREA OF SALVATION. ITS LIKE MIXING OIL AND WATER)

2 Tim 1: 9 who HAS SAVED US (A COMPLETED ACTION) and called us with a holy calling, NOT ACCORDING TO OUR WORKS , but ACCORDING TO HIS OWN PURPOSE AND GRACE which was GIVEN TO US in Christ Jesus BEFORE TIME BEGAN (AGAIN, NO WORKS. BUT GRACE)

Titus 3: 4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS (GOOD DEEDS) WHICH WE HAVE DONE , but ACCORDING TO HIS MERCY HE SAVED USthrough the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that HAVING BEEN JUSTIFIED BY HIS GRACE we should become HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE
(AGAIN, NO QUESTION HERE. PAUL LEAVES NO QUESTION. NO GOOD DEED CAN SAVE US,. WE ARE SAVED BY GODS MERCY, AND GIVEN THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE. WHICH IS PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN

Titus 1: 2 in HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE which GOD WHO CAN NOT LIE PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN

this is what our faith is in, the grace and mercy of God. not our deeds.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

That would seem to fit.
I think if someone sees Jesus as a sin nature man first,they're unable to see any truth after that grave error.

yes, if jesus is mere man we have no hope. his death is nullified

 

[Muna]

yes, if jesus is mere man we have no hope. his death is nullified

It does say this here

1Cr 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain;
ye are yet in your sins.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

It does say this here

1Cr 15:17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain;
ye are yet in your sins.

yes..

But Christ was not just mere man. he was not born with a sin nature, he was not in adam.

He is God come to earth.

 

[Scott Downey]

actua;lly I have not said much to support it. I have spent to much time trying to correct you on your false accusations of what I believe

lol what is it with you people that you think you are so smart you know everything?



Ok dude, here we go.

show me works in these passages. if you want to talk about eternal security and us having to work to be saved. show me works in these gospel messages from Jesus and Paul

John 1: 11: 11 He came to His own, and His own did not receive Him. 12. But AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED HIM, to THEM he gave the right to become children, even TO THEM WHO BELIEVE 13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God. (no works)

John 3, FOR God so loved the world he gave his only son that WHOEVER BELIEVES (trusts) in him will NEVER PERISH, and LIVE FOREVER (eternal life) for the son was not sent to judge, but that the world might be saved, he who BELIEVES is NOT CONDEMNED, he who does not believe is condemned already (no works)

John 4: 13 Jesus answered and said to her, “Whoever drinks of this water will thirst again, 14 but whoever drinks of the water that I shall give him will NEVER THIRST. But the water that I shall give him will become in him a fountain of water springing up into EVERLASTING LIFE” (no works)

John 5: 24 “Most assuredly, I say to you, he whoever HEARS MY WORD and BELIEVES IN HIM WHO SENT ME who sent Me HAS ETERNAL LIFE and SHALL NOT COME INTO JUDGMENT but HAS PASSED FROM DEATH TO LIFE (No works)

John 6: 35 And Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. HE WHO COMES TO ME shall NEVER HUNGER and he who BELIEVES IN ME shall NEVER THIRST (NO WORKS)

John 6: 37: and THE ONE WHO COMES TO ME I WILL BY NO MEANS CAST OUT 38 For I have come down from heaven, not to do My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me. 39 This is the will of the Father who sent Me, thatof all He has given Me I SHAL LOSE NOTHING, but SHOULD RAISE IT UP ON THE LAST DAY. 40 And this is the will of Him who sent Me, that EVERYONE WHO SEES AND BELIEVES IN HIM MAY HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE AND I WILL (NOT MIGHT) RAISE HIM ON THE LAST DAY (NO WORKS)

John 6: 47 Most assuredly, I say to you, HE WHO BELIEVES IN ME HAS EVERLASTING LIFE. 48 I am the bread of life. 49 Your fathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and are dead. 50 This is the bread which comes down from heaven, that THAT ONE MAY EAT OF IT AND NOT DIE 51 am the living bread which came down from heaven. IF ANYONE EATS THIS BREAD HE WILL LIVE FOREVER (NO WORKS)

John 6: 63 It is the SPIRIT WHO GIVES LIFE ; the flesh profits nothing. THE WORDS THAT I SPEAK to you ARE SPIRIT AND THEY ARE LIFE (SIGNIFYING THE BREAD FROM HEAVEN, THE FLESH AND BOOD ARE THE WORDS JESUS SPOKE. NOT THE PHYSICAL FOOD OR WORKS,)

EPH 1: 13 In Him YOU ALSO TRUSTED , after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also ,HAVING BELIEVED YOU WERE SEALED WITH THE HOLY SPIRIT OF PROMISE 14 who IS THE GAURANTEE OF OUR INHERITANCE until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.

THE INHERITANCE HE SAID WE ALREADY HAD IN THE 1ST 12 VERSES. (AGAIN, NO WORKS)

eph 2: 4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses,MADE US ALIVE together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and RAISED US UP TOGETHER , and MADE US SIT TOGETHER IN HEAVENLY PLACES 7 that in the ages to come He might show the exceeding riches of His grace in His kindness toward us in Christ Jesus. 8 For BY GRACE YOU HAVE BEEN SAVED (A COMPLETED ACTION) THROUGH FAITH , (AS MANY AS HAVE RECIEVED) and that NOT OF YOURSELVES ; it IS THE GIFT OF GOD, 9 NOT OF WORKS LEST ANYONE SHOULD BOAST (NO WORKS)

rom 4: 3 For what does the Scripture say? “ABRAHAM BELIEVED GOD AND HE ACOUNTED IT TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.” 4 Now TO HIM WHO WORKS, THE WAGES ARE NOT COUNTED AS GRACE BUT DEBT (Works cancels out grace. and makes it a wage) 5 But TO HIM WHO DOES NOT WORK but BELIEVES ON HIM WHO JUSTIFIES THE UNGOLDY , his HIS FAITH IS ACCOUNTED FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS (AGAIN NO WORKS. PERIOD)

rom 4: 16 Therefore IT IF OF FAITH THAT IT MAY BE ACCORDING TO GRACE , so that THE PROMISE MAY BE SURE TO ALL THE SEED not only to those who are of the law, but also TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM , who is the father of us all (AGAIN, NO WORKS, IT IS OF GRACE THROUGH FAITH)

Rom 4: 23 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, 24 but ALSO FOR US, IT SHALL BE IMPUTED TO US WHO BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED UP JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD , 25 who was delivered up because of our offenses, and was RAISED BECAUSE OF OUR JUSTIFICATION (AGAIN NO WORKS)

Rom 11: 6 And IF BY GRACE, THAN IT IS NO LONGER OF WORKS, ; otherwise GRACE IS NO LONGER GRACE.But IF IT IS OF WORKS, THEN IT IS NO LONGER OF GRACE. OTHERWISE WORK IS NO LONGER WORK (AS i HAVE SAID NUMEROUS TIME, GRACE + WORKS = WORKS.. GRACE AND WORKS CAN NOT MIX IN THE AREA OF SALVATION. ITS LIKE MIXING OIL AND WATER)

2 Tim 1: 9 who HAS SAVED US (A COMPLETED ACTION) and called us with a holy calling, NOT ACCORDING TO OUR WORKS , but ACCORDING TO HIS OWN PURPOSE AND GRACE which was GIVEN TO US in Christ Jesus BEFORE TIME BEGAN (AGAIN, NO WORKS. BUT GRACE)

Titus 3: 4 But when the kindness and the love of God our Savior toward man appeared, 5 NOT BY WORKS OF RIGHTEOUSNESS (GOOD DEEDS) WHICH WE HAVE DONE , but ACCORDING TO HIS MERCY HE SAVED USthrough the washing of regeneration and renewing of the Holy Spirit, 6 whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior, 7 that HAVING BEEN JUSTIFIED BY HIS GRACE we should become HEIRS ACCORDING TO THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE
(AGAIN, NO QUESTION HERE. PAUL LEAVES NO QUESTION. NO GOOD DEED CAN SAVE US,. WE ARE SAVED BY GODS MERCY, AND GIVEN THE HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE. WHICH IS PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN

Titus 1: 2 in HOPE OF ETERNAL LIFE which GOD WHO CAN NOT LIE PROMISED BEFORE TIME BEGAN

this is what our faith is in, the grace and mercy of God. not our deeds.

I like how the Father has given to Jesus His children from before time began, which definitely confirms we are eternally saved, having eternal consolation in Christ.

John 17
5 And now, O Father, glorify Me together [a]with Yourself, with the glory which I had with You before the world was.

Jesus Prays for His Disciples​

6 “I have [b]manifested Your name to the men whom You have given Me out of the world. They were Yours, You gave them to Me, and they have kept Your word. 7 Now they have known that all things which You have given Me are from You.

Not Ashamed of the Gospel​

8 Therefore do not be ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me His prisoner, but share with me in the sufferings for the gospel according to the power of God, 9 who has saved us and called us with a holy calling, not according to our works, but according to His own purpose and grace which was given to us in Christ Jesus before time began, 10 but has now been revealed by the appearing of our Savior Jesus Christ, who has abolished death and brought life and immortality to light through the gospel, 11 to which I was appointed a preacher, an apostle, and a teacher [c]of the Gentiles. 12 For this reason I also suffer these things; nevertheless I am not ashamed, for I know whom I have believed and am persuaded that He is able to keep what I have committed to Him until that Day.

Bible Gateway passage: 2 Timothy 1 - New King James Version

Greeting - Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus, To Timothy, a beloved son: Grace, mercy, and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord. Timothy’s Faith and Heritage - I thank God, whom I serve with a pure...

www.biblegateway.com

Yes sir, from before Time began, God has foreknown His people. And God does not cast away His people whom He foreknew

Acts 15:18
“Known to God from eternity are all His works.

Romans 8

26 Likewise the Spirit also helps in our weaknesses. For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession [g]for us with groanings which cannot be uttered. 27 Now He who searches the hearts knows what the mind of the Spirit is, because He makes intercession for the saints according to the will of God.

28 And we know that all things work together for good to those who love God, to those who are the called according to His purpose. 29 For whom He foreknew, He also predestined to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. 30 Moreover whom He predestined, these He also called; whom He called, these He also justified; and whom He justified, these He also glorified.