Is it possible to lose salvation?

[GodsGrace]

it was to avoid confusion and to keep things clear.

Paul’s writings on works often appear contradictory. In some places, he says we are justified by faith apart from works. For example, “Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law” (Romans 3:28) and “For by grace you have been saved through faith… not of works, lest anyone should boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9). These verses seem to dismiss works as unnecessary for salvation.

Yet in other passages, Paul affirms that deeds matter. He writes: “[God] will render to each one according to his deeds: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality” (Romans 2:6–7).

Paul is saying that we are not saved by deeds of THE LAW. And in this he's correct.
He doesn't mean GOOD DEEDS. Good deeds are absolutely required of the saved.

Plus, Paul has been researched a lot lately due to the incorrect ideas some have of his teachings.
Some make Jesus and Paul disagree...when in reality they agreed. (of course).

Paul taught good works.
Jesus taught good works.

No conflict.

 

[Behold]

The reason I am asking you is because you deny what Paul wrote by insisting a believers sins don't get in the way of entering the Kingdom of God.

A believer's sins are on Jesus, who bore them, and died for them ALL.
The believer does not have them anymore.......as that is why Jesus died on The Cross.
If you own a bible then read Romans 4:8 or 2 Corin 5:19 or John 3:17., and find out that God does not charge sin to a Christian
= Never Again, because God has already judged Jesus for their SIN, 2000 yrs ago.
So, NOW FORGIVEN........the CHRISTian, is born again, into the Kingdom of God.
THis is why the NT says the CHRISTian is "IN CHRIST, and "ONE WTIH GOD"., and "seated in Heavenly Places".

 

[ProDeo]

it was to avoid confusion and to keep things clear.

Paul’s writings on works often appear contradictory. In some places, he says we are justified by faith apart from works. For example, “Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law” (Romans 3:28) and “For by grace you have been saved through faith… not of works, lest anyone should boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9). These verses seem to dismiss works as unnecessary for salvation.

Keep in mind that in Paul days people were raised with the Mosaic Law, 613 commandments (works) to obey, mission impossible. Then Jesus fulfilled and abolished the Law (Efeze 2:15, Gal 3:13,25) and was hard, very hard to understand, a complete change of mind, way of living. The echo of of the Mosaic Law was still loud but growing old and ready to vanish away.

Hebr 8:13 In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Notable even Peter needed to be told by the Lord Himself :

Acts 10:13 And there came a voice to him: “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.”
Acts 10:15 And the voice came to him again a second time, “What God has made clean, do not call common.”

The new covenant is in Christ, not in the old Mosaic covenant.

Makes Rom 3:28 and Efeze 2:8:10) more understandable.

Yet in other passages, Paul affirms that deeds matter. He writes: “[God] will render to each one according to his deeds: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality” (Romans 2:6–7).

Yep, and xx other passages.

 

[Ronald Nolette]

So by your accounting then once i am saved i can do whatever i like because i will never perish. Excellent. Please spare us the you were never saved nonsense. If faith is sufficient and I cannot lose my salvation then i can do whatever i like after i have faith.

No, that is your carnal mind saying that as an excuse to believe a lie!

I say what Paul says in Romans 5 and 6:

20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6

King James Version

​

6 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

salvation is not a license to sin. We become new creatures and have a new mind and are now learning to think like Jesus.

sny who say-"now that I am saved I can sin as much as I want" have no clue what salvation entails.

 

[PS95]

A believer's sins are on Jesus, who bore them, and died for them ALL.
The believer does not have them anymore.......as that is why Jesus died on The Cross.
If you own a bible then read Romans 4:8 or 2 Corin 5:19 or John 3:17., and find out that God does not charge sin to a Christian
= Never Again, because God has already judged Jesus for their SIN, 2000 yrs ago.
So, NOW FORGIVEN........the CHRISTian, is born again, into the Kingdom of God.
THis is why the NT says the CHRISTian is "IN CHRIST, and "ONE WTIH GOD"., and "seated in Heavenly Places".

Behold, why do you say God will not charge sin to a Christian? I have shown you these passages BY PAUL many times now and all you do is ignore them. Once again, WHY does Paul say that a believer who practices these sins will NOT enter the Kingdom of God??? Paul's words fly in the face of your false Paul only theology. Please stop teaching false things.
It's a simple and fair question. Why wont you answer it? Does it involve that word you hate.." REPENTANCE"??? It is not a bad word. Paul did teach it! Repentance isn't a work to earn salvation- it is obedience which is required of us after initial justification.
If we love the Lord we will obey HIM! We are under TWO commands- Love God Love Neighbor. Are we to be HOLY? Do you understand we are being sanctified- being born anew- being made holy--? God is working IN US- thy the Spirit we DIED to SINS!- WE CAN'T LIVE IN SINS ANYMORE.
This is for your own good and for those who teach like you do- to see the error and correct yourselves. Paul said, You are rejecting GOD who gives us the Holt Spirit. Wake up- I beg you. This matters. You are teaching people no repentance is ever needed and that is a LIE.


For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus. 3For this is the will of God, your sanctification; that is, that you abstain from sexual immorality; 4that each of you know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, 5not in lustful passion, like the Gentiles who do not know God; 6and that no man transgress and defraud his brother in the matter because the Lord is the avenger in all these things, just as we also told you before and solemnly warned you. 7For God has not called us for the purpose of impurity, but in sanctification. 8So, he who rejects this is not rejecting man but the God who gives His Holy Spirit to you.
1 Thes 4:2-8

Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who submit to or perform homosexual acts, / nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. --1 Cor 6

The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; / idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, / and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. --Galatians 5:19-21

But among you, as is proper among the saints, there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed. / Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk, or crude joking, which are out of character, but rather thanksgiving. / For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure, or greedy person (that is, an idolater) has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Eph 5:3-5

For it is God’s will that you should be holy: You must abstain from sexual immorality; / each of you must know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, / not in lustful passion like the Gentiles who do not know God; 1 Thes 4:3-5

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its desires. / Do not present the parts of your body to sin as instruments of wickedness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life; and present the parts of your body to Him as instruments of righteousness. Ro 6:12-13

For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. Ro 8:13

Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. --Colossians 3:5

Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? Ro 6:16


Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy. / Instead, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the desires of the flesh. Ro 13

Flee from youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, together with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart. 2 Tim 2:22

Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Ro 6:6

Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. Ro 6:13

 

[Behold]

Behold, why do you say God will not charge sin to a Christian?

Because its true.
God does not charge sin to a Christian, because God has already charged it to Jesus on The Cross, on their behalf.

Here, Let Paul show you......

See #1 and #2

1.)

Holman Christian Standard Bible How joyful is the man the Lord will never charge with sin! New International Version Blessed is the one whose sin the Lord will never count against them.” English Standard Version blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.” Berean Standard Bible Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him.” Berean Literal Bible blessed is the man against whom the Lord will never reckon sin." King James Bible Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. New King James Version Blessed is the man to whom the LORD shall not impute sin.” New American Standard Bible “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1995 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1977 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Legacy Standard Bible BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Amplified Bible “BLESSED and HAPPY and FAVORED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT nor CHARGE AGAINST HIM.” Christian Standard Bible Blessed is the person the Lord will never charge with sin. American Standard Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. English Revised Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. GOD'S WORD® Translation Blessed is the person whom the Lord no longer considers sinful."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2.)

NIV : that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

New Living Translation
For God was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself, no longer counting people’s sins against them. And he gave us this wonderful message of reconciliation.

English Standard Version
that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.

Berean Standard Bible
that God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ, not counting men’s trespasses against them. And He has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

Berean Literal Bible
how that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not reckoning their trespasses to them, and having put into us the word of reconciliation.

King James Bible
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

New King James Version
that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

New American Standard Bible
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their wrongdoings against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

NASB 1995
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

NASB 1977
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

Legacy Standard Bible
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their transgressions against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

Amplified Bible
that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting people’s sins against them [but canceling them]. And He has committed to us the message of reconciliation [that is, restoration to favor with God].

 

[PS95]

No, that is your carnal mind saying that as an excuse to believe a lie!

I say what Paul says in Romans 5 and 6:

20 Moreover the law entered, that the offence might abound. But where sin abounded, grace did much more abound:

21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.

Romans 6​

​

King James Version​

​

​

6 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound?
2 God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:
6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
7 For he that is dead is freed from sin.
8 Now if we be dead with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with him:
9 Knowing that Christ being raised from the dead dieth no more; death hath no more dominion over him.
10 For in that he died, he died unto sin once: but in that he liveth, he liveth unto God.
11 Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord.

salvation is not a license to sin. We become new creatures and have a new mind and are now learning to think like Jesus.

sny who say-"now that I am saved I can sin as much as I want" have no clue what salvation entails.

Ron- I agree with you. I wish someone would get through to Behold. I have been trying for days. Behold teaches that a believers sins do not need repentance because they are all already forgiven- he/she teaches behavior after salvation plays no role in a person's salvation. That is not what Paul ever taught. Paul taught that BELIEVERS WHO PRACTICE sins will NOT enter God's Kingdom.
We are to obey the Spirit and put the deeds of the flesh to death- we are being born anew- being sanctified. We can not ignore this crucial lifelong process. Our sins are not just ignored. We are to repent of our sins and put them to death by the Spirit God has given us. Like you said, we are becoming more like Jesus. This is sanctification.- process.
I give you these to consider. -- please take your time reading them.

For you know what commandments we gave you by the authority of the Lord Jesus. 3For this is the will of God, your sanctification; that is, that you abstain from sexual immorality; 4that each of you know how to possess his own vessel in sanctification and honor, 5not in lustful passion, like the Gentiles who do not know God; 6and that no man transgress and defraud his brother in the matter because the Lord is the avenger in all these things, just as we also told you before and solemnly warned you. 7For God has not called us for the purpose of impurity, but in sanctification. 8So, he who rejects this is not rejecting man but the God who gives His Holy Spirit to you.
1 Thes 4:2-8

Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who submit to or perform homosexual acts, / nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. --1 Cor 6

The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity, and debauchery; / idolatry and sorcery; hatred, discord, jealousy, and rage; rivalries, divisions, factions, / and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. --Galatians 5:19-21

But among you, as is proper among the saints, there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed. / Nor should there be obscenity, foolish talk, or crude joking, which are out of character, but rather thanksgiving. / For of this you can be sure: No immoral, impure, or greedy person (that is, an idolater) has any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. Eph 5:3-5

For it is God’s will that you should be holy: You must abstain from sexual immorality; / each of you must know how to control his own body in holiness and honor, / not in lustful passion like the Gentiles who do not know God; 1 Thes 4:3-5

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body so that you obey its desires. / Do not present the parts of your body to sin as instruments of wickedness, but present yourselves to God as those who have been brought from death to life; and present the parts of your body to Him as instruments of righteousness. Ro 6:12-13

For if you live according to the flesh, you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. Ro 8:13

Therefore put to death your members which are on the earth: fornication, uncleanness, passion, evil desire, and covetousness, which is idolatry. --Colossians 3:5

Do you not know that if you present yourselves to anyone as obedient slaves, you are slaves of the one whom you obey, either of sin, which leads to death, or of obedience, which leads to righteousness? Ro 6:16


Let us behave decently, as in the daytime, not in carousing and drunkenness, not in sexual immorality and debauchery, not in dissension and jealousy. / Instead, clothe yourselves with the Lord Jesus Christ, and make no provision for the desires of the flesh. Ro 13

Flee from youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, together with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart. 2 Tim 2:22

Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
Ro 6:6

Neither yield ye your members as instruments of unrighteousness unto sin: but yield yourselves unto God, as those that are alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness unto God. Ro 6:13

 

[Behold]

Ron- I agree with you. I wish someone would get through to Behold. I have been trying for days. Behold teaches that a believers sins do not need repentance because they are all already forgiven

You dont know that....

"""God hath made Jesus to be sin for us".......as "the ONE TIME ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin".

You dont know that "where there is no LAW, there is no SIN, (Transgression)"", and the born again are "not under the LAW, but under Grace"".

You have not read Paul's teaching that says that God does not charge SIN.....to the born again.

Ive shown you the verses....., in the previous post., and not for the first time.

Romans 4:8
2 Corin 5:19

1.)

Holman Christian Standard Bible How joyful is the man the Lord will never charge with sin! New International Version Blessed is the one whose sin the Lord will never count against them.” English Standard Version blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.” Berean Standard Bible Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him.” Berean Literal Bible blessed is the man against whom the Lord will never reckon sin." King James Bible Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. New King James Version Blessed is the man to whom the LORD shall not impute sin.” New American Standard Bible “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1995 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1977 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Legacy Standard Bible BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Amplified Bible “BLESSED and HAPPY and FAVORED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT nor CHARGE AGAINST HIM.” Christian Standard Bible Blessed is the person the Lord will never charge with sin. American Standard Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. English Revised Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. GOD'S WORD® Translation Blessed is the person whom the Lord no longer considers sinful."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2.)

NIV : that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

New Living Translation
For God was in Christ, reconciling the world to himself, no longer counting people’s sins against them. And he gave us this wonderful message of reconciliation.

English Standard Version
that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.

Berean Standard Bible
that God was reconciling the world to Himself in Christ, not counting men’s trespasses against them. And He has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

Berean Literal Bible
how that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not reckoning their trespasses to them, and having put into us the word of reconciliation.

King James Bible
To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

New King James Version
that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not imputing their trespasses to them, and has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

New American Standard Bible
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their wrongdoings against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

NASB 1995
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

NASB 1977
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

Legacy Standard Bible
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their transgressions against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation.

Amplified Bible
that is, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting people’s sins against them [but canceling them]. And He has committed to us the message of reconciliation [that is, restoration to favor with God].

 

[PS95]

Because its true.
God does not charge sin to a Christian, because God has already charged it to Jesus on The Cross, on their behalf.

Here, Let Paul show you......

See #1 and #2

1.)

New American Standard Bible “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.”

I agree! BUT What does this have to do with anything? Does that say that sinning after salvation is all just forgiven- no need to repent? NO!

2.)
New American Standard Bible
namely, that God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself, not counting their wrongdoings against them, and He has committed to us the word of reconciliation

Yes, God reconciled us to Himself and forgave our sins- BUT WE ARE NOT TO CONTINUE IN SINS! I have no idea why you can't understand that.

We are to repent of sins or we will not enter the Kingdom. <--THAT is what Paul Taught. I have posted the passages enough times- If you want to deny all of Paul's counsel that is on you. You have seen what it says. You sure can't claim ignorance anymore. Be careful.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Paul is saying that we are not saved by deeds of THE LAW. And in this he's correct.
He doesn't mean GOOD DEEDS. Good deeds are absolutely required of the saved.

Plus, Paul has been researched a lot lately due to the incorrect ideas some have of his teachings.
Some make Jesus and Paul disagree...when in reality they agreed. (of course).

Paul taught good works.
Jesus taught good works.

No conflict.

agreed nonetheless the trouble it causes is immense many are lost by twisting paul's words that are hard to understand and have confused so many. it is why I have decided not to quote Paul anymore, the fact is and remains that the synoptic gospels reveal all Christ said and did and how to enter into life. I see Paul now as superfluous and no longer necessary to preach the good news of the Kingdom of heaven and repentance.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Keep in mind that in Paul days people were raised with the Mosaic Law, 613 commandments (works) to obey, mission impossible. Then Jesus fulfilled and abolished the Law (Efeze 2:15, Gal 3:13,25) and was hard, very hard to understand, a complete change of mind, way of living. The echo of of the Mosaic Law was still loud but growing old and ready to vanish away.

Hebr 8:13 In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

Notable even Peter needed to be told by the Lord Himself :

Acts 10:13 And there came a voice to him: “Rise, Peter; kill and eat.”
Acts 10:15 And the voice came to him again a second time, “What God has made clean, do not call common.”

The new covenant is in Christ, not in the old Mosaic covenant.

Makes Rom 3:28 and Efeze 2:8:10) more understandable.



Yep, and xx other passages.

what do you mean by Jesus abolished the law? what about the ten commandments Jesus was teaching?

 

[GodsGrace]

You dont know that....

"""God hath made Jesus to be sin for us".......as "the ONE TIME ETERNAL Sacrifice for sin".

You dont know that "where there is no LAW, there is no SIN, (Transgression)"", and the born again are "not under the LAW, but under Grace"".

You have not read Paul's teaching that says that God does not charge SIN.....to the born again.

Ive shown you the verses....., in the previous post., and not for the first time.

Romans 4:8
2 Corin 5:19

1.)

Holman Christian Standard Bible How joyful is the man the Lord will never charge with sin! New International Version Blessed is the one whose sin the Lord will never count against them.” English Standard Version blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.” Berean Standard Bible Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will never count against him.” Berean Literal Bible blessed is the man against whom the Lord will never reckon sin." King James Bible Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin. New King James Version Blessed is the man to whom the LORD shall not impute sin.” New American Standard Bible “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1995 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” NASB 1977 “BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Legacy Standard Bible BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT.” Amplified Bible “BLESSED and HAPPY and FAVORED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT nor CHARGE AGAINST HIM.” Christian Standard Bible Blessed is the person the Lord will never charge with sin. American Standard Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. English Revised Version Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not reckon sin. GOD'S WORD® Translation Blessed is the person whom the Lord no longer considers sinful."

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

2.)

NIV : that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation.

Same in any version.


Romans 4:5-15
6 just as David also speaks of the blessing on the man to whom God credits righteousness apart from works:
7 "BLESSED ARE THOSE WHOSE LAWLESS DEEDS HAVE BEEN FORGIVEN, AND WHOSE SINS HAVE BEEN COVERED.
8 "BLESSED IS THE MAN WHOSE SIN THE LORD WILL NOT TAKE INTO ACCOUNT."
9 Is this blessing then on the circumcised, or on the uncircumcised also? For we say, "FAITH WAS CREDITED TO ABRAHAM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS."
10 How then was it credited? While he was circumcised, or uncircumcised? Not while circumcised, but while uncircumcised;
11 and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be the father of all who believe without being circumcised, that righteousness might be credited to them,
12 and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but who also follow in the steps of the faith of our father Abraham which he had while uncircumcised.
13 For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants that he would be heir of the world was not through the Law, but through the righteousness of faith.
14 For if those who are of the Law are heirs, faith is made void and the promise is nullified;
15 for the Law brings about wrath, but where there is no law, there also is no violation.



This will fall on deaf ears,,,,
but try to read what the above is about.

It's about THE LAW...
It's about how THE LAW will no save anyone...as we can see Abraham was considered righteous by God
BEFORE he was circumcised....
BEFORE THE LAW.

God also promised to include the Gentiles..thus fulfilling His promise to Abraham.

It states that we must FOLLOW IN THE STEPS OF THE FAITH of our father Abraham.....
Abraham was made justified by faith....
but was made sanctified by his obedience to God.
James: Abraham was justified by both faith and works.


God will not hold any sin against any person that is BELIEVING in Jesus and being a DISCIPLE of Jesus.

If a person is believing in Jesus, he will also be obeying Him.

When he sins he asks for forgiveness and there is NO GUILT IMPUTED to him...
IOW,,,,once the person asks forgiveness for the sin,,,God will not hold that sin against him.

He will be able to go before God blameless....
just as PAUL, your favorite theologian, said here:


Romans 4:20-24
20 yet, with respect to the promise of God, he did not waver in unbelief but grew strong in faith, giving glory to God,
21 and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform.
22 Therefore IT WAS ALSO CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS.
23 Now not for his sake only was it written that it was credited to him,
24 but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, as those who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead,


Abraham GREW STRONG in faith...
this is not done by disobeying God.
Abraham obeyed God even to be willing to sacrifice his own son.

And for our sake also, it will be credited (righteousness) to those who BELIEVE.

Please find out what BELIEVE means.


Also...

Colossians 1:21-23
21And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds,
22yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach—
23if indeed you continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast,


We will be presented before God blameless and beyond reproach

IF
we continue in the faith firmly established and steadfast.

Also, verses 7 and 8 are important,
but I'll stop here.

 

[Behold]

Yes, God reconciled us to Himself and forgave our sins- BUT WE ARE NOT TO CONTINUE IN SINS!

Ive never stated that we are to continue in sin.

What Paul teaches, is that "our old man of sin" is "crucified with Christ" and we are born again as a "new Creation" in Christ.
This is our Born Again Spirit........not your body or your mind.

Im going to go a bit deeper into what it means to be a CHRISTian......for the benefit of anyone who can follow along, and if you can't, then that is ok, because you've not been taught anything you needed to learn, once you were born again.
Just learn for now.... that you are not a sinner, you are a born again SAINT........and start to realize that God's Salvation that you received is FINISHED.
You dont complete it......you exist within it........ Reader......if you are born again and are not just water baptized and religious.

Now....Here is the reality, of becoming a "child of the Light"......having been "Translated from Darkness TO LIGH"> = BORN... AGAIN.

The Christian exists in the KOG, while still down here in a dying body.
Isnt' that AMAZING?
See, Our Born AGAIN Spirit is "in Christ", having been circumcized from our flesh... Colossians 2:11., and is become a "new Creation". "IN Christ".........as "ONE with God".. (Spiritual Union).

So, the born again, exist where there is NO LAW........as there is no LAW in the KOG.
THE LAW is down here on earth, and the born again are "not under The LAW, but under Grace".

This means that Jesus has all your sin, and you have His Righteousness, and that is your eternal life, and your SALVATiON.

 

[GodsGrace]

agreed nonetheless the trouble it causes is immense many are lost by twisting paul's words that are hard to understand and have confused so many. it is why I have decided not to quote Paul anymore, the fact is and remains that the synoptic gospels reveal all Christ said and did and how to enter into life. I see Paul now as superfluous and no longer necessary to preach the good news of the Kingdom of heaven and repentance.

I have to agree. I try to use Jesus' teachings as much as possible.
I do like to point out that there is no conflict between Jesus and Paul....
Even Peter said that Paul can be difficult to understand.
Romans is not an easy book....it was written to Jews, and we don't think like they did.

 

[Pet]

Yes, I believe that it is possible to lose salvation.

 

[GodsGrace]

Ive never stated that we are to continue in sin.

Excuse me Behold...
You have stated, just yesterday or the day before,
that we will not be judged on our behavior.
I DO hope that you've changed your mind.

Please pay attention to the statements you make.

Both Paul and Jesus disagree with this statement of yours,,,
which is heretical.

Here is what you stated in post no. 1545:


God does not save us based on our Behavior........He is saving Sinners......who were sinning all their lives.
And in that condition, God saves them.., because they put their faith in Christ which is what God requries of us so that He will give us His "Gift of Salvation"

Salvation is not based on our behavior.....its based on what Christ has finished on The Cross.. = as His Sacrifice to God on our behalf is our Salvaiton.


NOW you state that we are NOT to continue in sin?
THAT IS BEHAVIOR Behold.
Make up your mind.


You need me to post the verses again which I've posted ad nauseum?

Romans 2:6 PAUL
John 5:28-29 JESUS


Look them up.
Read what they teach.

We will be judged by our behavior.

And no strawmen...
FIRST we must be saved.

Alert: The unsaved do not need to obey God....they are already lost.

What Paul teaches, is that "our old man of sin" is "crucified with Christ" and we are born again as a "new Creation" in Christ.
This is our Born Again Spirit........not your body or your mind.

Im going to go a bit deeper into what it means to be a CHRISTian......for the benefit of anyone who can follow along, and if you can't, then that is ok, because you've not been taught anything you needed to learn, once you were born again.
Just learn for now.... that you are not a sinner, you are a born again SAINT........and start to realize that God's Salvation that you received is FINISHED.
You dont complete it......you exist within it........ Reader......if you are born again and are not just water baptized and religious.

Now....Here is the reality, of becoming a "child of the Light"......having been "Translated from Darkness TO LIGH"> = BORN... AGAIN.

The Christian exists in the KOG, while still down here in a dying body.
Isnt' that AMAZING?
See, Our Born AGAIN Spirit is "in Christ", having been circumcized from our flesh... Colossians 2:11., and is become a "new Creation". "IN Christ".........as "ONE with God".. (Spiritual Union).

So, the born again, exist where there is NO LAW........as there is no LAW in the KOG.
THE LAW is down here on earth, and the born again are "not under The LAW, but under Grace".

This means that Jesus has all your sin, and you have His Righteousness, and that is your eternal life, and your SALVATiON.

 

[Rich R]

Jesus had a lot to say about and this taught that the path to eternal life is narrow and that few find it. In Matthew 7:13-14, He said;

"Enter by the narrow gate; for wide is the gate and broad is the way that leads to destruction, and there are many who go in by it. Because narrow is the gate and difficult is the way which leads to life, and there are few who find it."​

This shows that salvation is not guaranteed for everyone, and only those who stay faithful and follow His teachings will enter the Kingdom of Heaven.


Jesus also warned that some would hear the word and believe for a while, but eventually fall away. In the Parable of the Sower, He explained;

"But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles." (Matthew 13:20-21).​

This illustrates that some will start their walk with God but will not persevere when faced with trials or temptations.

In John 15:6, Jesus made it even clearer, saying;

"If anyone does not abide in Me, he is cast out as a branch and is withered; and they gather them and throw them into the fire, and they are burned."​

Here, Jesus compares Himself to a vine and believers as branches. A branch must remain connected to the vine to stay alive and bear fruit. If a person disconnects from Christ through disobedience or unbelief, they wither spiritually and face eternal judgment.


The original apostles also confirmed this truth. Peter warned in 2 Peter 2:20-21;

"For if, after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overcome, the latter end is worse for them than the beginning. For it would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than having known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered to them."​

This shows that a person who was once saved and returns to sin is in a worse condition than before they knew the truth.​

James also affirmed this truth when he said;

"Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back, let him know that he who turns a sinner from the error of his way will save a soul from death and cover a multitude of sins."​

(James 5:19-20).​

This verse reveals that a believer can wander away from the truth and face spiritual death unless they repent and return to God.

The Bible does provide examples of those who lost their salvation. Judas Iscariot was one of the twelve apostles chosen by Jesus, yet he betrayed the Lord for thirty pieces of silver. Jesus Himself said about Judas;

"It would have been good for that man if he had not been born." (Matthew 26:24).​

This shows that Judas was once in the faith but fell away and was lost.

Another example is Balaam, a prophet who once heard from God but later led Israel into sin for personal gain. Peter referred to him, saying,

"They have forsaken the right way and gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Beor." (2 Peter 2:15). King Saul is yet another example; he was chosen and anointed by God but later disobeyed and rebelled, and the Spirit of God departed from him (1 Samuel 16:14)​

Jesus' words make it clear that salvation is not a one-time event but requires endurance and faithfulness until the end. As He said in Matthew 24:13, "But he who endures to the end shall be saved." Therefore, those who abide in Christ, obey His commandments, and remain faithful will receive eternal life. However, those who turn away from Him and return to sin risk losing their salvation and facing eternal separation from God: "Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that keep the commandments of God, and the faith of Jesus."Rev 14:12

Blessings.

The thing I always wonder when this topic comes up is how many sins does one get before it's too late? Can anyone be sure they haven't yet, or will in the future, go over the limit?

Even Paul admitted he served the law of sin (Romans 7). I wonder if he went over the limit. I hope not. Assuming I've not gone over the limit, I'd like to hang out with him in the new earth.

 

[Toro55]

Is it possible you might break a commandment and not repent to avoid punishment such as hire a lawyer to get you off pleading false innocence happens all the time with some Christians they go to the grave pretending to be innocent of a crime they committed OJ for one. The world has made it this way.Yes you can loose your salvation knowingly.

Justice will be served now or in the next life the choice is yours.

 

[GodsGrace]

The thing I always wonder when this topic comes up is how many sins does one get before it's too late? Can anyone be sure they haven't yet, or will in the future, go over the limit?

Even Paul admitted he served the law of sin (Romans 7). I wonder if he went over the limit. I hope not. Assuming I've not gone over the limit, I'd like to hang out with him in the new earth.

What a silly remark.
Do you want to know so you could reach your limit and then come to a grinding halt?

God will not be mocked Rich R.

 

[Pet]

The thing I always wonder when this topic comes up is how many sins does one get before it's too late? Can anyone be sure they haven't yet, or will in the future, go over the limit?

Even Paul admitted he served the law of sin (Romans 7). I wonder if he went over the limit. I hope not. Assuming I've not gone over the limit, I'd like to hang out with him in the new earth.

Adam and Eve committed one sin, and died for it.
Paul was describing a person under the law in Romans 7