Salvation : Is Finished.

[brightfame52]

Your Hyper Calvinism is a Satanic lie and Calvinists are the deceived liars, who teach it.

Christians lead people to Christ.
Calvinists, lead people to Calvin.

Jesus died for the sin of the world.
"All who call on the name of Jesus shall be saved".

God forgives sinners He Christ died for, for Christs Sake, because He did the work of satisfying Justice, its His Reward to Christ to forgive all sinners Christ died for. Again Eph 4:32

And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

 

[Behold]

God forgives sinners He Christ died for,

Christ died for the sin of the world.
So, as everyone is a sinner, = John 3:16 states this as "the world" that Christ died for..........us all.

":""Jesus came into the WORLD... to save sinners'.""""........not just the elect.

 

[brightfame52]

@Taken

People were Not “created” perfect, but are Offered the Opportunity to become made “perfected.”

Sorry not correct, nothing in scripture about an opportunity to become made perfect, instead, Christs Offering of Himself for the sins of the elect, that offering made them perfected forever Heb 10:14-17

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.

15 Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,

16 This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

Gods not going to ever remember their sins and iniquities because of Christs offering for them, !

 

[GodsGrace]

God is Faithful to His Own Word.
God Keeps man that IS Faithful to Him.
God Destroys and forgets man that Rejects Him.

No §Taken.
You have just created a conflict in scripture.

I'll post it again: God DOES NOT forget if a man rejects Him.

2 Timothy 2:11-13
11It is a trustworthy statement:
For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;

12If we endure, we will also reign with Him;
If we deny Him, He also will deny us;

13If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself.


Now read it carefully and then reply and explain why you are NOT creating a conflict in just these 3 verses.....

Verse 12 states that IF WE DENY HIM, HE WILL DENY US.

Verse 13 states that IF WE ARE FAITHLESS, HE REMAINS FAITHFUL.


If we deny God we are being faithless.

So if we are faithless, does God still keep us saved....as (in your version) verse 13 seems to you to state...
or
if we are faithless does God deny us?

Can't be both Taken.
Read it well

YOU are causing a conflict in scripture IF your understanding is correct...
which, of course it cannot be or we could throw out the NT.

Think this over carefully and then come back and try to explain, again, how verses 12 and 13 do not conflict.

 

[GodsGrace]

If you trusted in Christ you would not be trying to prove that you keep yourself saved.
You would trust Him to keep you saved.
You do not.

Sorry Behold...
The tactic you just used of taking a comment OUT OF CONTEXT is most unbecoming to an honest person.


I stated WHY I trust in Jesus more than YOU do.
Because I TRUST WHAT HE TAUGHT and you DO NOT.

I went on to post the following.
PLEASE REPLY TO THE FOLLOWING WITH SCRIPTURE
instead of making remarks that mean nothing.

We're discussing John 15:1-6
We're discussing what JESUS TAUGHT



°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°°
I trust what HE taught:

Here is what Jesus taught:
That a person could STOP abiding in Him:

John 15:5-6
5 “I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing.
6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned.



IF you REMAIN in Me.

IF

What does IF mean?

Let's stick to these verses instead of jumping all over and posting paragraphs full of YOUR opinions.


When Jesus says IF YOU REMAIN IN ME.....
He is setting a CONDITION.

We could either remain in Him
or NOT.

IF you DO NOT REMAIN in Me....


Really simple.

Let's hear your rendering of JESUS' words.

Jesus was very clear in what HE taught.
He wanted to be sure that all His disciples understood Him.

 

[brightfame52]

Christ died for the sin of the world.
So, as everyone is a sinner, = John 3:16 states this as "the world" that Christ died for..........us all.

":""Jesus came into the WORLD... to save sinners'.""""........not just the elect.

He died for the world of sinners that God has forgiven for His Name's sake, if your sins aren't forgiven, He didnt die for you

Remember Eph 4:32

Eph 4:32

And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you.

And this is written to Gods elect, chosen in Christ b4 the foundation Eph 1:4

 

[Taken]

No §Taken.
You have just created a conflict in scripture.

I'll post it again: God DOES NOT forget if a man rejects Him.

2 Timothy 2:11-13
11It is a trustworthy statement:
For if we died with Him, we will also live with Him;

12If we endure, we will also reign with Him;
If we deny Him, He also will deny us;

13If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot deny Himself.


Now read it carefully and then reply and explain why you are NOT creating a conflict in just these 3 verses.....

Verse 12 states that IF WE DENY HIM, HE WILL DENY US.

Verse 13 states that IF WE ARE FAITHLESS, HE REMAINS FAITHFUL.


If we deny God we are being faithless.

So if we are faithless, does God still keep us saved....as (in your version) verse 13 seems to you to state...
or
if we are faithless does God deny us?

Can't be both Taken.
Read it well

YOU are causing a conflict in scripture IF your understanding is correct...
which, of course it cannot be or we could throw out the NT.

Think this over carefully and then come back and try to explain, again, how verses 12 and 13 do not conflict.

All Scripture IS TRUE.

All Scripture DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL MEN!

Scripture IS NOT in Conflict.

It is MEN who conflict among themselves, regarding their Beliefs.

And many men conflict “within themselves”…
Their minds thoughts and their spirits thoughts in disagreement.
Scripture calls it Poor…and Has A Lord who offers a Cure.
Humans call it a mental disorder….and Has drugs offered for a Soothing.

 

[Behold]

Sorry Behold...
The tactic you just used of taking a comment OUT OF CONTEXT is most unbecoming to an honest person.

I dont take verses out of context.

Now let me show you who is not telling the truth.
The deceiver is the one who accused me of doing that, and didnt post any quote.
This is you @GodsGrace

I stated WHY I trust in Jesus more than YOU do.
Because I TRUST WHAT HE TAUGHT and you DO NOT.

You come to forums and deny that Jesus's Salvation is completed, by telling members that you have to do it for yourself, to stay saved.
That is your "faith".
Its in yourself.
"self righteousness"

We're discussing John 15:1-6

WE abide in Jesus by being born again into Jesus.
You cant get into Jesus by your works or by your behavior.

Christ is also teaching that the reason you bear fruit is because you are IN The Vine........which means "in Christ"......and again that is not something that you do for yourself, so you can't maintain that for yourself.

So, if a person is not IN The Vine, they are not born again, and they have no part in The Vine and they will go to Hell.

IF you DO NOT REMAIN in Me....

You "remain in Christ" by being born again "in Christ"....as there is no other way to get into Him.
Works and self effort have no part in being "IN Christ"., as only a spirituial birth can put you there and keep you there.

So, if you do not "remain in Christ" its because you were never in there to begin with.......never born again.
Just water baptized and religious, or something similar..
"religiious but lost".
You were only a "seed that fell among" and for a little while"........so that seed has no ROOT....it didnt last...it didnt grow or produce fruit ...because its not actually "IN Christ"... Its not in the VINE. Its just an unsaved dead branch.......a religious person, not born again.

 

[GodsGrace]

I dont take verses out of context.

Now let me show you who is not telling the truth.
The deceiver is the one who accused me of doing that, and didnt post any quote.
This is you @GodsGrace



You come to forums and deny that Jesus's Salvation is completed, by telling members that you have to do it for yourself, to stay saved.
That is your "faith".
Its in yourself.
"self righteousness"



WE abide in Jesus by being born again into Jesus.
You cant get into Jesus by your works or by your behavior.

Christ is also teaching that the reason you bear fruit is because you are IN The Vine........which means "in Christ"......and again that is not something that you do for yourself, so you can't maintain that for yourself.

So, if a person is not IN The Vine, they are not born again, and they have no part in The Vine and they will go to Hell.



You "remain in Christ" by being born again "in Christ"....as there is no other way to get into Him.
Works and self effort have no part in being "IN Christ"., as only a spirituial birth can put you there and keep you there.

So, if you do not "remain in Christ" its because you were never in there to begin with.......never born again.
Just water baptized and religious, or something similar..
"religiious but lost".
You were only a "seed that fell among" and for a little while"........so that seed has no ROOT....it didnt last...it didnt grow or produce fruit ...because its not actually "IN Christ"... Its not in the VINE. Its just an unsaved dead branch.......a religious person, not born again.

Please show me where it states that we were NEVER REALLY BORN AGAIN in

John 15:2
2“Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit, He takes away;

Step by Step:

What does it mean to be IN ME [Jesus]?

I believe that in Christian theology IF we are IN JESUS it means we are saved.

So...those IN JESUS that do not bear fruit will be taken away.

Where do you disagree?

 

[GodsGrace]

All Scripture IS TRUE.

All Scripture DOES NOT APPLY TO ALL MEN!

Scripture IS NOT in Conflict.

It is MEN who conflict among themselves, regarding their Beliefs.

And many men conflict “within themselves”…
Their minds thoughts and their spirits thoughts in disagreement.
Scripture calls it Poor…and Has A Lord who offers a Cure.
Humans call it a mental disorder….and Has drugs offered for a Soothing.

Well Taken....
Your words mean nothing.

You're going to have to prove that 2 Timothy 2:11-13 is NOT causing a conflict in the way that YOU understand it.

BECAUSE
In the way that YOU understand it...
YOU are creating a very big conflict within the New Testament.

Or you could retract what you incorrectly stated earlier which is NOT CORRECT
and which causes a CONFLICT in the NT.

And I'm still waiting on your reply to post no. 2218

 

[GodsGrace]

@Behold

Still waiting for a reply to my post no. 109

Thanks.

 

[nedsk]

It doesnt matter what something sounds like to you friend. Whats the promise Jer 32:40

40 And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from them, to do them good; but I will put my fear in their hearts, that they shall not depart from me.

So you are a prisoner. You dont lose your free will

 

[nedsk]

We receive eternal life as our Salvaiton.
Its "The Gift of eternal life"........you dont earn it, you receive it, as Salvation.
The sinner who gives God their faith in Christ, receives Etneral life.
This is why Jesus told you.....that if you believe in Him......He will give you "eternal life, and you shall never go to Hell (perish)".

You receive it and you stomp on it like you do every time you post here

 

[nedsk]

Exactly what I wondered About “You”, with your comment, regarding God…





Disagree.

People were Not “created” perfect, but are Offered the Opportunity to become made “perfected.”



Uh huh.



You severely lack “Understanding”…
A mans FREEWILL is his personal option to MAKE a “Choice he Chooses Without Force”.

You can choose, whom to believe, like, what work to do, where to live, whom to wed, what to eat…. And tomorrow Change all of your choices…So? Who cares?
You want to change where you live, change jobs, leave your spouse, abandon your family, children…you will have the positive or negative consequences to enjoy or regret.

When it comes to the Lord God…Calling ON Him…Talking TO Him, is a Spiritual Experience…Because the Lord God IS a Spirit…your conversation WITH Him, is by, from, of “YOUR spirit”…to Him.

The Lord God IS “Truth”.
Any human “calling TO the Lord God”…HAS an expectation, that individual ALSO, “ONLY” speaks Their Truth.
And not to forget…The Lord God…IS: All Knowing.

What you suggest, is a man can Call on the Lord God… Confess, Declare his TRUE spirits Belief….
And Later “exercise his FREEWILL TO: Change his MIND, and reject Belief.

A mans “spirit” IS NOT “his MIND”, which is:
* Naturally Against God…
* Routinely Changes thoughts and beliefs.
* Not the Means to call on the Lord God.

So, IF you conclude you can …with your Minds Thoughts, call on the Lord God, confess your Belief, Receive His Gift of Salvation, later exercise your FREEWILL to Change your Mind, and then what?
…Throw back your Gift of Salvation?
…Keep your Gift of Salvation?
…Complain, claiming God Revoked your Gift of Salvation?

All a load of Nonsense…

God Who IS Spirit, IS Truth, IS Life…
Has Offered “His WAY” for mankind to Freely Choose to Become (by the power of God) MADE (once and Forever) “Perfected”.

God IS NOT a Fool, nor IS He fooled, by the wishy, washy, ever changing mans MIND.

God Knows, IF a mans Confession IS True …
God Knows, A mans struggles, with governing powers greater than the man, with cunning evil powers greater than the man, with famous peoples influences greater than the man…
AND…OFFERS a man…WHO spiritually, Heartfully, truly Believes…God Himself Will Send “His own Spirit to Dwell with-IN that Person… TO KEEP all, negative, evil, wicked, powerful, influencing …Powers From Drawing “THAT” man…AWAY From God.

If THAT “Condition” IS NOT Favorable … TO YOU… fearing you can not change your Mind About God…

No worries… God already Knows your “apprehension”…and Will Not Give His “Gift of Salvation”… to men…who “later will change “their MIND”.

Remember…the Way is Not to confess with the Mind…there is no Offering of Salvation for a “Mindful Confession of Belief”…

Adam and Eve were created perfect and walked away. Its not about whether or not salvation is available it always is but whether or not youre worthy of it is another matter entirely. Your presumptuous attitude is unseemly

 

[Behold]

You receive it and you stomp on it like you do every time you post here

Read carefully...
-
The only "church" is the body of Christ.......The Christians.

Now, all This stuff..

Catholic.
Baptist
Methodist
AOG
Church of Christ
Ect...

See all those?

Those are "denominations"........that contain Christians.

1.) Now the word "Catholic" means "universal"......but this is a lie regarding the MaryCult as they do not exactly accept those other denominations as being "the one true Church"..
And certainly, you would not try to LIE about that..????? ..as you know that the MaryCult falsely proclaimes itself as the ONLY= "ONE TRUE Church".. wich means that all others, like those in my list are ...not "TRUE", According to false MaryCult teaching.


2.) Water baptism does not make anyone a Christian......if it did then all those Jews that John the Baptist baptized for "remission of sin", would be Christian.
= They weren't.

Notice : Mark 16... says to "make Disciples."""
It does not say to make ""Christians""., as there is no GOSPEL in Mark 16.....as the "repent and be water baptized".. is not The Gospel.
Listen , I can dunk an unbeliever 345 times, and i can say....>>"In Jesus, name"... or "Father, Son, Holy Spirit" and they come out of the water 345 times.. And after i said that,. this sinner....water baptized 345 times....,is stil not born again., is not forgiven, is not a Christian, and is still going to Hell. (wet).

3.) None of the Apostles were Catholics.

Also, =Mary was not a Catholic.
Paul was not a Catholic
Peter is not a Catholic
Just read a bible, and it'll show you that there were none...

A.) Noone in the NT is a Catholic.

The MaryCult decided that Peter was a Catholic......their first Pope, after he is dead.
Had they tried that trick when He was alive, he would have "cast them out".
See, the MaryCult has this carnal fascination with giving people MaryCult TITLES after they die, that have nothing to do with the Bible.
So, all this MaryCult nonsense, started with MaryCult Church Fathers........and those were not Apostles.

 

[marks]

Here is what Jesus taught:
That a person could STOP abiding in Him:

John 15:5-6
5 “I am the vine; you are the branches. If you remain in me and I in you, you will bear much fruit; apart from me you can do nothing.
6 If you do not remain in me, you are like a branch that is thrown away and withers; such branches are picked up, thrown into the fire and burned.



IF you REMAIN in Me.

IF

What does IF mean?

You are making an assumption that is not found in this passage.

I can drive down the street pointing to each house as I pass, "I don't live there, and I don't live there, and I don't live there . . ." and I never did.

You are assuming that the one who does not abide in Christ once did. It doesn't say that. You, as many do in this passage, are reading that into it. Check it out.

Much love!

 

[Behold]

Adam and Eve were created perfect and walked away.

Adam and Eve didn't have Salvation.......as Salvation is Jesus on the Cross, saving a sinner.

There was no Cross of Christ in the Garden of Eden.

You really should try to post smarter, or at least try, before you post anything else.

 

[nedsk]

Read carefully...
-
The only "church" is the body of Christ.......The Christians.

Now, all This stuff..

Catholic.
Baptist
Methodist
AOG
Church of Christ
Ect...

See all those?

Those are "denominations"........that contain Christians.

1.) Now the word "Catholic" means "universal"......but this is a lie regarding the MaryCult as they do not exactly accept those other denominations as being "the one true Church"..
And certainly, you would not try to LIE about that..????? ..as you know that the MaryCult falsely proclaimes itself as the ONLY= "ONE TRUE Church".. wich means that all others, like those in my list are ...not "TRUE", According to false MaryCult teaching.


2.) Water baptism does not make anyone a Christian......if it did then all those Jews that John the Baptist baptized for "remission of sin", would be Christian.
= They weren't.

Notice : Mark 16... says to "make Disciples."""
It does not say to make ""Christians""., as there is no GOSPEL in Mark 16.....as the "repent and be water baptized".. is not The Gospel.
Listen , I can dunk an unbeliever 345 times, and i can say....>>"In Jesus, name"... or "Father, Son, Holy Spirit" and they come out of the water 345 times.. And after i said that,. this sinner....water baptized 345 times....,is stil not born again., is not forgiven, is not a Christian, and is still going to Hell. (wet).

3.) None of the Apostles were Catholics.

Also, =Mary was not a Catholic.
Paul was not a Catholic
Peter is not a Catholic
Just read a bible, and it'll show you that there were none...

A.) Noone in the NT is a Catholic.

The MaryCult decided that Peter was a Catholic......their first Pope, after he is dead.
Had they tried that trick when He was alive, he would have "cast them out".
See, the MaryCult has this carnal fascination with giving people MaryCult TITLES after they die, that have nothing to do with the Bible.
So, all this MaryCult nonsense, started with MaryCult Church Fathers........and those were not Apostles.

Not only incorrect but grossly incorrect. It shows just how little you actually know. Only one church can even begin claim a line back to Peter and its not the buffoonery you teach. You really should stop talking but you have a truck load of pride that wont allow you to be quiet and listen. Its not your foolishness that troubles me as much as your inability to think.

What I like though is you keep trying to "teach" even though Ive told you a thousand times I hold you in no esteem whatsoever. You dont speak for God or for scripture you speak only for yourself and thats pure nonsense.

 

[Taken]

Well Taken....
Your words mean nothing.

Noted.

You're going to have to prove that 2 Timothy 2:11-13 is NOT causing a conflict in the way that YOU understand it.

No

Because…

Your words mean nothing.

And I'm still waiting on your reply to post no. 2218

Why?
You want an answer in your words, your beliefs, your understanding…best for you to have a conversation with yourself.

 

[nedsk]

Adam and Eve didn't have Salvation.......as Salvation is Jesus on the Cross, saving a sinner.

There was no Cross of Christ in the Garden of Eden.

You really should try to post smarter, or at least try, before you post anything else.

They did need it skippy because they were perfect. Stop responding to me youre wasting my time