ZECHARIAH 14 IS FOR CHRIST'S CHURCH
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Brethren in Christ:
That just goes to show you that if you cover God's written Word AS WRITTEN, full strength, Satan's little children will show up trying to counter it. That's why they will keep 'pounding' their question at you trying to get you to somehow slip up with what you say, and at the same time they throw little slurs at you as IN-ROADS to lead to other senseless and stupid arguments, all to get you OFF the main TOPIC.
That just goes to show you that if you cover God's written Word AS WRITTEN, full strength, Satan's little children will show up trying to counter it. That's why they will keep 'pounding' their question at you trying to get you to somehow slip up with what you say, and at the same time they throw little slurs at you as IN-ROADS to lead to other senseless and stupid arguments, all to get you OFF the main TOPIC.
THEREFORE... BACK TO THE THREAD TOPIC...
Here is something every serious Bible student should know about how God teaches in His written Word:
1. God will TEST you, to see if you are paying attention in His Word, or not.
The Zechariah 14 Chapter is in The Old Testament, not The New Testament. That right there is enough for some Christian denominations to just pass Zechariah 14 off as already having been fulfilled, especially those on man's Preterist doctrines.
Also, because the Zechariah 14:21 verse mentions the idea of sacrifices, that too causes some Christian denominations to pass the Chapter off as past history, when it is not past history. But how do we as Christians explain that idea of sacrifices mentioned there? Wait and I'll show how in a minute.
Yet the much bigger... question is, why did God put that Zechariah 14 Chapter about Christ's still future 2nd coming back there in the Old Testament? That Zechariah 14:1-5 section alone picks up where Apostle Paul left off in 1 Thessalonians 4:17. And there's a major detail about Christ's future reign after His future coming over the nations in Zechariah 14:16-19, and even how the spirit of rebellion will still exist for those nations in that time with Christ's Presence directly here on earth, in Person.
Lot of my Christian brethren don't even know that Zechariah 14 Chapter exists! Their Church isn't teaching them about it. And there is an anti-Zechariah 14 smear campaign today that is against teaching it is about Christ's future 2nd coming, which Christ's future return and gathering of His Church and future reign on earth is the very subject it is covering!
Why did our Heavenly Father do this, place a Scripture like Zechariah 14 that is so important to Christian prophecy that it is not placed in The New Testament Books instead, especially with all the detail that's in it? Zechariah 14 does point to certain New Testament passages, but other details it contains are not in The New Testament.
2. Likewise with the Ezekiel 40 through 48 Chapters, those are all FUTURE for AFTER Christ's future 2nd coming.
There is even a great detail about God's future LITERAL River of the Waters of Life shown in Ezekiel 47 with the many Trees of Life on either side of that River, AND... even where on EARTH it will be located! Why is all that NOT detailed in The New Testament Books? Those denominations that only stay in The New Testament Books don't know about all that, and that's why they dream up all sorts of myths outside The Bible of where God's future Kingdom is going to be, their wrongly thinking there will be no more earth, i.e, like we are going to live up in the clouds!
Ezekiel 44 does a similar thing like the Zechariah 14:21 verse does with mentioning the idea of sacrifices. That is why some simply deny those Ezekiel Chapters, their trying to treat it as past history.
How would the Patriarchs and prophets of those days when Zechariah and Ezekiel was written react if those idea of sacrifices were meant in the spiritual sense only, and mentioned because Christ will have come to die on the cross and thus fulfilling the need for all future sacrifice? What if they had been given that bit of Good News about Christ fulfilling the need for animal sacrifices to write down in those Old Testament prophecies while under the old covenant? It would have ruined a lot involving God's Timeline, wouldn't it? Yeah, it would have. But now... since Christ Jesus has come, and became the Perfect Sacrifice for one and all time, we know when a Bible prophecy is still future, but mentions old covenant sacrifices, we know today that has... to be meant about our sacrifice of love to The Father and His Son Jesus Christ, and no more about literal animal sacrifice.
However, the Orthodox unbelieving Jews still believe they are under the old covenant, and that they still need a stone temple with animal sacrifices. Thus they will build their 3rd temple in Jerusalem eventually at the end of this world.
Point still is though, why did God place that idea of sacrifices there in Zech.14 and Ezek.44 when the events being described there are for AFTER... Christ's future return? It's to check YOU out, to see if you are paying attention in His Word!
3. The Ezekiel 13 Chapter is another example, which God shows His anger at those preachers who claim... to speak for Him, but God says they do not.
In Ezekiel 13:4-5, God is giving a small CLUE of what timeline He is pointing to. He mentions the "house of Israel" and the "day of the Lord". By this time in Ezekiel's life, God had already split old Israel into 2 separate kingdoms, and had already scattered the northern ten tribe "house of Israel" captive to Assyria and lands of the Medes. His prophet Ezekiel was given at some point to go north during his Babylon captivity, and speak to the ten tribes that were captives. To cut this history short, those ten tribes later would be scattered and migrate to Asia Minor and Europe and become the western Christian nations. So God here in Ezekiel 13 is not speaking to the Jews of the "house of Judah", He is speaking to CHRIST'S CHURCH, and those pastors over it.
The doctrine God is angry against especially outlined in this Ezekiel 13 Chapter is..., believe it or not, the false Pre-trib Rapture theory...
Ezek 13:19-23
19 And will ye pollute Me among My people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to My people that hear your lies?
20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver My people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:
23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver My people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
KJV
Ever heard the old Gospel tune, "I'll fly away"? It's about the false Pre-tribulational Rapture theory. That is exactly what the false Pre-trib Rapture preachers do, they HUNT SOULS TO MAKE THEM FLY! Per what Lord Jesus and His Apostles taught, the Church will go through the "great tribulation" and only be gathered by Christ AFTER the tribulation. Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 taught that time of Christ's future coming and gathering of the saints is timed when the future resurrection happens, which Jesus showed will occur on the LAST DAY of this present world.
What is that above warning from our Heavenly Father against the pre-trib rapture theory doing in The Old Testament Book of Ezekiel though? Is God testing us to see if we will study ALL... His Word, and pay attention in it while... we study ALL of it?? Yeah, hopefully you got that idea by now, and there are still other examples of this going even in the other direction in God's timeline, back to the time of Lucifer's original rebellion.
Keep plowing then.
Here is something every serious Bible student should know about how God teaches in His written Word:
1. God will TEST you, to see if you are paying attention in His Word, or not.
The Zechariah 14 Chapter is in The Old Testament, not The New Testament. That right there is enough for some Christian denominations to just pass Zechariah 14 off as already having been fulfilled, especially those on man's Preterist doctrines.
Also, because the Zechariah 14:21 verse mentions the idea of sacrifices, that too causes some Christian denominations to pass the Chapter off as past history, when it is not past history. But how do we as Christians explain that idea of sacrifices mentioned there? Wait and I'll show how in a minute.
Yet the much bigger... question is, why did God put that Zechariah 14 Chapter about Christ's still future 2nd coming back there in the Old Testament? That Zechariah 14:1-5 section alone picks up where Apostle Paul left off in 1 Thessalonians 4:17. And there's a major detail about Christ's future reign after His future coming over the nations in Zechariah 14:16-19, and even how the spirit of rebellion will still exist for those nations in that time with Christ's Presence directly here on earth, in Person.
Lot of my Christian brethren don't even know that Zechariah 14 Chapter exists! Their Church isn't teaching them about it. And there is an anti-Zechariah 14 smear campaign today that is against teaching it is about Christ's future 2nd coming, which Christ's future return and gathering of His Church and future reign on earth is the very subject it is covering!
Why did our Heavenly Father do this, place a Scripture like Zechariah 14 that is so important to Christian prophecy that it is not placed in The New Testament Books instead, especially with all the detail that's in it? Zechariah 14 does point to certain New Testament passages, but other details it contains are not in The New Testament.
2. Likewise with the Ezekiel 40 through 48 Chapters, those are all FUTURE for AFTER Christ's future 2nd coming.
There is even a great detail about God's future LITERAL River of the Waters of Life shown in Ezekiel 47 with the many Trees of Life on either side of that River, AND... even where on EARTH it will be located! Why is all that NOT detailed in The New Testament Books? Those denominations that only stay in The New Testament Books don't know about all that, and that's why they dream up all sorts of myths outside The Bible of where God's future Kingdom is going to be, their wrongly thinking there will be no more earth, i.e, like we are going to live up in the clouds!
Ezekiel 44 does a similar thing like the Zechariah 14:21 verse does with mentioning the idea of sacrifices. That is why some simply deny those Ezekiel Chapters, their trying to treat it as past history.
How would the Patriarchs and prophets of those days when Zechariah and Ezekiel was written react if those idea of sacrifices were meant in the spiritual sense only, and mentioned because Christ will have come to die on the cross and thus fulfilling the need for all future sacrifice? What if they had been given that bit of Good News about Christ fulfilling the need for animal sacrifices to write down in those Old Testament prophecies while under the old covenant? It would have ruined a lot involving God's Timeline, wouldn't it? Yeah, it would have. But now... since Christ Jesus has come, and became the Perfect Sacrifice for one and all time, we know when a Bible prophecy is still future, but mentions old covenant sacrifices, we know today that has... to be meant about our sacrifice of love to The Father and His Son Jesus Christ, and no more about literal animal sacrifice.
However, the Orthodox unbelieving Jews still believe they are under the old covenant, and that they still need a stone temple with animal sacrifices. Thus they will build their 3rd temple in Jerusalem eventually at the end of this world.
Point still is though, why did God place that idea of sacrifices there in Zech.14 and Ezek.44 when the events being described there are for AFTER... Christ's future return? It's to check YOU out, to see if you are paying attention in His Word!
3. The Ezekiel 13 Chapter is another example, which God shows His anger at those preachers who claim... to speak for Him, but God says they do not.
In Ezekiel 13:4-5, God is giving a small CLUE of what timeline He is pointing to. He mentions the "house of Israel" and the "day of the Lord". By this time in Ezekiel's life, God had already split old Israel into 2 separate kingdoms, and had already scattered the northern ten tribe "house of Israel" captive to Assyria and lands of the Medes. His prophet Ezekiel was given at some point to go north during his Babylon captivity, and speak to the ten tribes that were captives. To cut this history short, those ten tribes later would be scattered and migrate to Asia Minor and Europe and become the western Christian nations. So God here in Ezekiel 13 is not speaking to the Jews of the "house of Judah", He is speaking to CHRIST'S CHURCH, and those pastors over it.
The doctrine God is angry against especially outlined in this Ezekiel 13 Chapter is..., believe it or not, the false Pre-trib Rapture theory...
Ezek 13:19-23
19 And will ye pollute Me among My people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to My people that hear your lies?
20 Wherefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your pillows, wherewith ye there hunt the souls to make them fly, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that ye hunt to make them fly.
21 Your kerchiefs also will I tear, and deliver My people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
22 Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:
23 Therefore ye shall see no more vanity, nor divine divinations: for I will deliver My people out of your hand: and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
KJV
Ever heard the old Gospel tune, "I'll fly away"? It's about the false Pre-tribulational Rapture theory. That is exactly what the false Pre-trib Rapture preachers do, they HUNT SOULS TO MAKE THEM FLY! Per what Lord Jesus and His Apostles taught, the Church will go through the "great tribulation" and only be gathered by Christ AFTER the tribulation. Apostle Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17 taught that time of Christ's future coming and gathering of the saints is timed when the future resurrection happens, which Jesus showed will occur on the LAST DAY of this present world.
What is that above warning from our Heavenly Father against the pre-trib rapture theory doing in The Old Testament Book of Ezekiel though? Is God testing us to see if we will study ALL... His Word, and pay attention in it while... we study ALL of it?? Yeah, hopefully you got that idea by now, and there are still other examples of this going even in the other direction in God's timeline, back to the time of Lucifer's original rebellion.
Keep plowing then.
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I was on this thread with you (as Verily) asking questions of Amillenialsts because I did not know the differnce between the doctrines of Premill and Amill, I had admitted I was out of the loop and I asked questions there without being referred to as Satan's children
Apostle Paul's Change To The Spirit Body
Do you understand the coming type body of the world to come when Lord Jesus returns? Do you understand that you will no longer have a flesh type body in that world to come? It will be a body type like the angels in heaven, just as Jesus said in Matthew 22:30. It will be a body type like Lord...
www.christianityboard.com
If anyone behaves as Satan its you, at least the Amillenalists can be far more approachable then you.
You are not doing the Lord any favors with how you respond to honest questions concerning the verses you chose to post (and that, to someone who has fully acknowledged I do not have a dog in the race) since I ask both sides questions on this (desiring to know their stance).
Good thing there are other Premillenalists to ask on this board (if I have further question) because you have made yourself useless in that regard, even the Amillenalist (for example Spiritual Israelite) was far easier to approach and far more God glorifying in his response than you can only hope to be.
I was on this thread with you (as Verily) asking questions of Amillenialsts because I did not know the differnce between the doctrines of Premill and Amill, I had admitted I was out of the loop and I asked questions there without being referred to as Satan's children
Apostle Paul's Change To The Spirit Body
Do you understand the coming type body of the world to come when Lord Jesus returns? Do you understand that you will no longer have a flesh type body in that world to come? It will be a body type like the angels in heaven, just as Jesus said in Matthew 22:30. It will be a body type like Lord...
If anyone behaves as Satan its you, at least the Amillenalists can be far more approachable then you.
You are not doing the Lord any favors with how you respond to honest questions concerning the verses you chose to post (and that, to someone who has fully acknowledged I do not have a dog in the race) since I ask both sides questions on this (desiring to know their stance).
Good thing there are other Premillenalists to ask on this board (if I have further question) because you have made yourself useless in that regard, even the Amillenalist (for example Spiritual Israelite) was far easier to approach and far more God glorifying in his response than you can only hope to be.
Sounds like a KAREN to me folks, a label Truly applied to me originally, starting off with disrespect.
So brethren in Christ, Truly is doing nothing but telling LIES, and is a hypocrite. I do not respond well to MOCKING after answering one's question in a FRIENDLY MANNER, just because they do not agree with me!
And when one becomes even more BRACKISH with their VAIN ATTITUDE by my letting them know WHERE I STAND, they deserve nothing but PURE REBUKE THEREAFTER! So brethren, you do not have to allow the MOCKERS to treat you as a SECOND CLASS CITIZEN. You are are SERVANT OF JESUS CHRIST, so STAND UP and ACT LIKE A CHILD OF GOD to them!
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That made no sense, Karens hyperventillate similar to you and screech at people, they cannot be reasoned with. You have always been that way.
Earburner
Well-Known Member
You have neglected to understand that prior to Jesus' death and resurrection**, no one from Adam upto then, ever had the permanent indwelling of God's Holy Spirit.
Until that day**, the best that God the Father could do for anyone who lived "under the altar" of OC. ISRAEL, and had died in faith believing, was to keep their names written in "a book of remembrance" before Him. Malachi 3:16.
.
**Those who received "white robes" (the Holy Spirit) in Rev. 6:9-11 are the ACTUAL symbolic 144,000 saints of OC. Israel.
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That above of course is a bogus... statement, specifically that idea of "permanent indwelling of God's Holy Spirit." The Holy Spirit can LEAVE a believer that has fallen away from Christ Jesus still today, just as fast as The Holy Spirit left ole' king Saul who stopped listening to God. That above statement wrongly ASSUMES man's false Once Saved, Always Saved theory.
The 144,000 of Revelation 7 have NOT received their white robes nor their crowns yet today. No one has, including the saints that have already died in Christ. That will only happen when Jesus returns at His future 2nd coming. As of right now, today, those in Christ only have His PROMISE of receiving that, IF they remain in the walk with Him. This is why Apostle Paul in Col.2:18 said to not let anyone beguile us of our reward by the voluntary worship of angels, etc. And it's why Lord Jesus said to the Church of Philadelphia to hold fast what they had, that no man take their crown (Rev.3:11). It means their PROMISED crown when He returns.
Those represent 12,000 out of each of the tribes of Israel mentioned there (tribes of Dan and Ephraim left out), that are SEALED with God's Seal in order to make a 'stand' for Christ throughout the coming "great tribulation." The "great multitude" mentioned later represent the SEALED of the Gentiles in Christ, as they also will make that 'stand' during the coming "great tribulation."
2 Tim 4:8
8 Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love His appearing.
KJV
Earburner
Well-Known Member
So then, according to your belief system, all of the 12 tribes of OC Israel, who died in faith of the Promise that was to come, you don't believe that God did "remember" them unto "the day of their visitation", when the Promise came to them in mortal flesh?
See Malachi 3:16; Mat. 27:50-54 and Rev. 6:9-11.
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That of course is a totally irrelevant idea to what I stated. You should have realized per what I quoted Apostle Paul saying in that 2 Timothy 4:8 verse that those in Christ only receive their rewards at Jesus' future appearing, i.e., return.
Now the Old Testament saints of Faith that died prior to Christ's 1st coming, were covered by FAITH back in their day, Abraham being a prime example, as Abraham believed and it was counted to Abraham as righteousness.
Then the rebellious that had died prior to Christ's death and resurrection were covered at Jesus' resurrection when He went and preached The Gospel to the "spirits in prison" of 1 Peter 3 and 1 Peter 4. That was the Isaiah 42:7 prophecy about Christ leading the prisoners out of the darkness of the prison house, i.e., Satan's prison house. This is why 1 Peter 4 says The Gospel was preached to the dead so they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit.
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