No one has seen God at any time, John?

[Matthias]

I have no position, and make no claims that are mine.

Everyone has a position and everyone makes claims about their position.

But you are not representing the One True God well, in fact have crossed a line where you admittedly refer to a religious sect as your authority rather than God Himself, even making false and unbiblical claims against Christ.

You’ve made it clear that you aren’t going to go back and discover the details of my position. That’s fine. However, those who do will find that I‘ve stated that my authority comes from God - the God of Jewish monotheism.

The trinitarians say that we both “make false and unbiblical claims against Christ.” Anyone who doesn’t agree with them makes “false and unbiblical claims against Christ” according to them.

I’ve already told you plainly - and you’ve said, clearly - that I don’t believe what you are saying is truth. Some would have difficulty equating that with “false and unbiblical claims about Christ” but you won’t.

Where does that get us?

Meanwhile, I have [again] explained a biblical matter to you as a plumb line between your position and claims and what is actually true--which I do by the Spirit of all truth as foretold--

I listened to you, considered it, and didn’t find it persuasive. Why, some might ask, am I not persuaded by your explanation? Jesus himself is a Jewish monotheist. When you speak against Jewish monotheism, you speak against Jesus’ theology.

... meaning we two have nothing to discuss.

I have something to discuss. If not any further with you, then with others.

Even so, all truth--not fully revealed during the times and origins you now hold to--was to come, and has come.

Jesus hasn’t changed his theology. He was, is, and always will be a Jewish monotheist.

 

[Waiting on him]

Everyone has a position and everyone makes claims about their position.



You’ve made it clear that you aren’t going to go back and discover the details of my position. That’s fine. However, those who do will find that I‘ve stated that my authority comes from God - the God of Jewish monotheism.

The trinitarians say that we both “make false and unbiblical claims against Christ.” Anyone who doesn’t agree with them makes “false and unbiblical claims against Christ” according to them.

I’ve already told you plainly - and you’ve said, clearly - that I don’t believe what you are saying is truth. Some would have difficulty equating that with “false and unbiblical claims about Christ” but you won’t.

Where does that get us?



I listened to you, considered it, and didn’t find it persuasive. Why, some might ask, am I not persuaded by your explanation? Jesus himself is a Jewish monotheist. When you speak against Jewish monotheism, you speak against Jesus’ theology.



I have something to discuss. If not any further with you, then with others.



Jesus hasn’t changed his theology. He was, is, and always will be a Jewish monotheist.

Does being a Jewish Monotheist mean that you believe Jesus had a biological father?

 

[Waiting on him]

@Matthias

I believe it’s important to review the verse before the on you’ve based your thread on.

For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
— John 1:17

To me this is John stating that the law of Moses wasn’t given from God the Father.

 

[Matthias]

Does being a Jewish Monotheist mean that you believe Jesus had a biological father?

It’s important to ask every Jewish monotheist that question individually.

Unbelieving Jewish monotheists believe that either Jospeh or someone else was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists believe that Joseph was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists, including myself, believe that Yahweh is responsible for begetting Jesus in the womb of the virgin Mary by supernatural means.

 

[Waiting on him]

It’s important to ask every Jewish monotheist that question individually.

Unbelieving Jewish monotheists believe that either Jospeh or someone else was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists believe that Joseph was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists, including myself, believe that Yahweh is responsible for begetting Jesus in the womb of the virgin Mary by supernatural means.

The scripture does say that when Joseph awoke from the second dream, he did as the Angel told him and he took Mary.

 

[Waiting on him]

It’s important to ask every Jewish monotheist that question individually.

Unbelieving Jewish monotheists believe that either Jospeh or someone else was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists believe that Joseph was responsible for begetting Jesus by natural means.

Some believing Jewish monotheists, including myself, believe that Yahweh is responsible for begetting Jesus in the womb of the virgin Mary by supernatural means.

Paul states it this way.


Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God, (Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,) Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh; And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:
— Romans 1:1-4

 

[Matthias]

The scripture does say that when Joseph awoke from the second dream, he did as the Angel told him and he took Mary.

All believing Jewish monotheists would agree that Joseph did go on to wed the already pregnant Mary rather than sending her away, as he had been thinking about doing before the dream.

 

[ScottA]

Hi Scott, can you please specifically point out and explain the "false and unbiblical claims against Christ" that he made? (I mean explain from the scripture why you say the claims were unbiblibal). Or is this really mostly about John 1:1 which you have already mentioned?

There are many passages (not just John 1:1), God with us, etc., etc.

But I don't see that as the issue with Matthias, not exactly. It's just that he misrepresents the entire "Our image" claim of God in the beginning and the "One" claims in the end--even that--"The Beginning and the End"...as if he is not even true to the "One God" position of so called monotheism.

 

[Waiting on him]

BAck on topic.

Jesus said that God is a spirit.

At Jesus resurrection he to them that spirit doesn’t have flesh and bone.

 

[ScottA]

Everyone has a position and everyone makes claims about their position.

Okay, in that context: This is mine >

I have no position, and make no claims that are mine.

 

[Waiting on him]

There are many passages (not just John 1:1), God with us, etc., etc.

But I don't see that as the issue with Matthias, not exactly. It's just that he misrepresents the entire "Our image" claim of God in the beginning and the "One" claims in the end--event that--"The Beginning and the End"...as if he is not even true to the "One God" position of so called monotheism.

My personal opinion is that Jesus was the first man born in the image of God, and I’m no speaking of his literal birth

 

[Waiting on him]

All believing Jewish monotheists would agree that Joseph did go on to wed the already pregnant Mary rather than sending her away, as he had been thinking about doing before the dream.

I believe they are all missing the fact that in Joseph’s first Vision with the Angel, Joseph misunderstood….. that’s why the second vision came.

 

[LoveYeshua]

Hmmm....... this is getting interesting.

no this is Matthias playing with your heads again and again , when will you learn. valid for anyone replying to this thread.

 

[LoveYeshua]

now come on Mathias query your favourite AI to know what I mean or what to do next.

 

[ScottA]

You’ve made it clear that you aren’t going to go back and discover the details of my position. That’s fine. However, those who do will find that I‘ve stated that my authority comes from God - the God of Jewish monotheism.

The trinitarians say that we both “make false and unbiblical claims against Christ.” Anyone who doesn’t agree with them makes “false and unbiblical claims against Christ” according to them.

I’ve already told you plainly - and you’ve said, clearly - that I don’t believe what you are saying is truth. Some would have difficulty equating that with “false and unbiblical claims about Christ” but you won’t.

Where does that get us?

It is good that you see a difference in trinitarianism and monotheism...that is a sign of coming around full circle, back to God is One.

I am simply clarifying that, that One has an Image...and because that Image comes in flesh and blood, walks and talks, and identifies as a Child of even His own making--does not make Him another person, or not God. Full circle.

So, my--exception--is you seem to have categorized Christ as simply a man filled with the spirit of God and not God. Is that correct?

 

[dak]

There are many passages (not just John 1:1), God with us, etc., etc.

But I don't see that as the issue with Matthias, not exactly. It's just that he misrepresents the entire "Our image" claim of God in the beginning and the "One" claims in the end--event that--"The Beginning and the End"...as if he is not even true to the "One God" position of so called monotheism.

I see, well, as far as Jewish monotheists, (non-believers regarding the Christian Messiah), here's a quick and simple overview of what they say about Gen 1:26, and I'll leave it at that because it does wander off topic.

 

[Matthias]

It is good that you see a difference in trinitarianism and monotheism...that is a sign of coming around full circle, back to God is One.

You’re mistaken about my position on the matter. I’m on record acknowledging that trinitarianism is a form of monotheism. I know that you aren’t interested in confirming that I have but anyone who is can search my posts and see for themselves that I have.

I am simply clarifying that, that One has an Image...and because that Image comes in flesh and blood, walks and talks, and identifies as a Child of even His own making--does not make Him another person, or not God. Full circle.

So, my--exception--is you seem to have categorized Christ as simply a man filled with the spirit of God and not God. Is that correct?

No.

 

[ScottA]

I listened to you, considered it, and didn’t find it persuasive. Why, some might ask, am I not persuaded by your explanation? Jesus himself is a Jewish monotheist. When you speak against Jewish monotheism, you speak against Jesus’ theology.

Don't misunderstand. I speak against 'isms if they speak against the scriptures. That's it. And you have named your 'ism first before God by doing so against His Word.

 

[Matthias]

Don't misunderstand. I speak against 'isms if they speak against the scriptures. That's it. And you have named your 'ism first before God by doing so against His Word.

I haven’t misunderstood you. I also haven’t been persuaded that the Messiah’s Jewish monotheism is against God and the scriptures.

 

[ScottA]

Jesus hasn’t changed his theology. He was, is, and always will be a Jewish monotheist.

Jesus (the Word) did however seal a portion for due season well beyond His theology as presented during that time of His first appearing.