IF YOU THINK MATTHEW 24:29-30 WAS FULFILLED IN 70AD PLEASE SHOW ME WHY

[Doug]

Hummmmm.

Is this where im supposed to supply you with my credentials to determine who has the real one?
Well, im Seminary Trained, and im trained in 'Manuscript evidence".
So, i can teach about "extant" Koine Greek Texts, of which there are about 30 completed NT Greek texts, but only about 3-4 of them are used to create Bibles, and that does not include the Latin Text that Jerome created for the MaryCult that cause Martin Luther to leave it, and create Protestantism that is a RETURN to the Bible.

I use a few different versions, but i use the KJV mostly, and i use it to evaluate other bibles regarding doctrine, clarity, and truth.

I am impressed
Do you think alot of the Bible versions are based on corrupted texts

 

[Jay Ross]

I am impressed
Do you think a lot of the Bible versions are based on corrupted texts

Possibly, but more likely they are based upon the faulty and corrupt biases and understandings of the translators themselves.

These people are very difficult to argue against, particularly when they appear to have been given letters after their names.

 

[rwb]

The kingdom doesn’t come with observation. Could you reconcile your understanding with this statement that Jesus made?

I'm not exactly certain of what you want me to reconcile, but for your consideration, I believe Christ said this because the Jews were expecting the promised Messiah to establish the PHYSICAL Kingdom of God on this earth during this age of time. For this reason, Christ says the Kingdom of God NOW in this age that He ushered in is not a physical Kingdom they expected because the Kingdom of God in this age of time is spiritual and is within you.

Since the Kingdom of God that came when Christ came to earth a man, evidenced when He cast out devils cannot be within you and be a physical Kingdom.

Matthew 12:28 (KJV) But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you. (also Lu 11:20)

Luke 17:20-21 (KJV) And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation: Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

John 18:33 (KJV) Then Pilate entered into the judgment hall again, and called Jesus, and said unto him, Art thou the King of the Jews?

John 18:36-39 (KJV) Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence. Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice. Pilate saith unto him, What is truth? And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all. But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the passover: will ye therefore that I release unto you the King of the Jews?

When Christ explains to Nicodemus how man who is fully grown must be born again. But not through being physically born again, but born again of the Spirit within him. Once again proving that the Kingdom of God is not a physical Kingdom that would be of this world, but is the SPIRITUAL Kingdom of God in heaven, that man can both know (see) and enter when they have been born again of the Spirit of Christ.

John 3:3-7 (KJV) Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God. Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born? Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

John 4:23-24 (KJV) But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

I hope this is what you were looking for.

 

[HealthyShape]

Hummmmm.

Is this where im supposed to supply you with my credentials to determine who has the real one?
Well, im Seminary Trained, and im trained in 'Manuscript evidence".
So, i can teach about "extant" Koine Greek Texts, of which there are about 30 completed NT Greek texts, but only about 3-4 of them are used to create Bibles, and that does not include the Latin Text that Jerome created for the MaryCult that cause Martin Luther to leave it, and create Protestantism that is a RETURN to the Bible.

I use a few different versions, but i use the KJV mostly, and i use it to evaluate other bibles regarding doctrine, clarity, and truth.

And you still do not understand how the text of the KJV came to be, historically? And why it is not the standard for today? And you still propose questions like "why did they take this verse from NIV?" Your questions and claims demonstrate you do not understand the topic, no matter what you studied.

There are many weird sectarian seminaries. If somebody wants to boast with credentials, then University programs is the way to go. Universities also teach how to use proper resources, how to do research and how to think objectively and critically.

 

[HealthyShape]

These people are very difficult to argue against, particularly when they appear to have been given letters after their names.

No way... people who are professional experts in their fields know what they are talking about. Who would have guessed. :)

 

[Doug]

Hummmmm.

Is this where im supposed to supply you with my credentials to determine who has the real one?
Well, im Seminary Trained, and im trained in 'Manuscript evidence".
So, i can teach about "extant" Koine Greek Texts, of which there are about 30 completed NT Greek texts, but only about 3-4 of them are used to create Bibles, and that does not include the Latin Text that Jerome created for the MaryCult that cause Martin Luther to leave it, and create Protestantism that is a RETURN to the Bible.

I use a few different versions, but i use the KJV mostly, and i use it to evaluate other bibles regarding doctrine, clarity, and truth.

I guess you missed my question
Your background is impressive
I was just wondering if you think, as I do, that most other translations other than KJV are based on corrupt texts.........no need to elaborate in depth

 

[rwb]

The new covenant will be established after those days which is the tribulation.....................[Jer 31:33 KJV] 33 But this [shall be] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.........................he will bring scattered Israel into the land.....................[Deu 30:5 KJV] 5 And the LORD thy God will bring thee into the land which thy fathers possessed, and thou shalt possess it; and he will do thee good, and multiply thee above thy fathers.........................He will cause them to keep the law..................[Eze 36:27 KJV] 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them].

Not only will the new covenant be in literal place. but Christ will also will reign in the kingdom from Jerusalem.............................[Eze 36:27 KJV] 27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do [them].

Who is Israel to whom the promises are made? Is it the ethnic race, physical sons/daughters of Abraham's many seeds, or is it the believing/faithful race. sons/daughters of Abraham's spiritual Seed (Christ)?

Romans 9:6-7 (KJV) Not as though the word of God hath taken none effect. For they are not all Israel, which are of Israel: Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called.

Romans 9:7-8 (KJV) Neither, because they are the seed of Abraham, are they all children: but, In Isaac shall thy seed be called. That is, They which are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God: but the children of the promise are counted for the seed.

Galatians 6:15-16 (KJV) For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature. And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.

 

[Behold]

How many times has Jesus Been raised, I’m believing the answer to Matthew 24:30 has something to do with this?

Jesus was crucified once and resurrected once.

 

[Behold]

I am impressed
Do you think alot of the Bible versions are based on corrupted texts

Any bible that is created using the revised or newer "Nestlle" text has issues.
Previously and for a long time Nestle used the "Textus Receptus" that created the original KJV....but now they use a different Greek text and its not as accurate.

 

[JLB]

Doug, you are right to question those who believe that Matthew 24:29-30 was fulfilled in 70 AD but there is another scripture which speaks of the fulfilment of Matt 24:29-30

Consider Isaiah 24:21-23 as it sheds light on when these verses will be fulfilled.

View attachment 71562

Notice that Matthew 24:29-31 also talks of the sun being ashamed and the moon being disgraced after which this is applicable: -

And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

This certainly did not happen in 70 AD. This event is still a distant future event,

Yes.


Jesus was teaching His disciples in Matthew 24 what He had spoken through the mouth of Zechariah.



Behold, the day of the LORD is coming,
And your spoil will be divided in your midst.
For I will gather all the nations to battle against Jerusalem;
The city shall be taken,
The houses rifled,
And the women ravished.
Half of the city shall go into captivity,
But the remnant of the people shall not be cut off from the city.
Then the LORD will go forth
And fight against those nations,
As He fights in the day of battle.
And in that day His feet will stand on the Mount of Olives,
Which faces Jerusalem on the east.
And the Mount of Olives shall be split in two,
From east to west,
Making a very large valley;
Half of the mountain shall move toward the north
And half of it toward the south.
Then you shall flee through My mountain valley,
For the mountain valley shall reach to Azal.
Yes, you shall flee
As you fled from the earthquake
In the days of Uzziah king of Judah.
Thus the LORD my God will come,
And all the saints with You.
It shall come to pass in that day
That there will be no light;
The lights will diminish.
Zechariah 14:1-6


As we see none of these things happened in 70 AD.


Thus the LORD my God will come, and all the saints with You. = Revelation 19:11, 1 Thessalonians 4:13
Matthew 24:29-31

 

[Behold]

And you still do not understand how the text of the KJV came to be, historically?

Yes, i know how the Textus Receptus came into being.

And why it is not the standard for today?

The Textus Receptus should be the standard.

And you still propose questions like "why did they take this verse from NIV?

Yes, the NIV is dumpster food.
Its not even a true translation.....its a cross between a Translation and a Transliteration.
It purpose was not to be 100% accurate, its designed to be easier to read.
Its junk, and ive already explaind to you why.

" Your questions and claims demonstrate you do not understand the topic, no matter what you studied.

You have a an imagination that does not always work in your favor.

There are many weird sectarian seminaries.

When i was seminary Trained this "sectariean" issue, was not in vogue.

 

[Behold]

I was just wondering if you think, as I do, that most other translations other than KJV are based on corrupt texts.

I use the KJV to check other translations for both verse accuracy and doctrinal accuracy.
Most fail the test but not all.
The NIV is one of the worst fails.

 

[HealthyShape]

Yes, i know how the Textus Receptus came into being.




The Textus Receptus should be the standard.



Yes, the NIV is dumpster food.
Its not even a true translation.....its a cross between a Translation and a Transliteration.
It purpose was not to be 100% accurate, its designed to be easier to read.
Its junk, and ive already explaind to you why.



You have a an imagination that does not always work in your favor.




When i was seminary Trained this "sectariean" issue, was not in vogue.

More posts about this issue you are creating, the more certain it is you are not properly educated in the area.

 

[Behold]

More posts about this issue you are creating, the more certain it is you are not properly educated in the area.

One day you'll learn that continually posting false innuendo, only proves you're overall ignorance.

Another way to view this.. is.... when you post something false against a member, and you don't quote them.....this prove you are lying.

See you there next time @HealthyShape

Now if you want to learn some things , regarding where false bibles came from, then do a deep study of Wescott $ Hort, and also examine the reason that NESTLE stopped using the extant text that created the KJV, and switched to an inferior one some years ago.

 

[HealthyShape]

One day you'll learn that continually posting false innuendo, only proves you're overall ignorance.

Another way to view this.. is when you post something false against a member, and you quote them.....this prove you are lying.

See you there next time @HealthyShape

Somebody educated in textual criticism, manuscripts, translations etc. would hardly say things like "NIV removed verses" or that the Textus Receptus should be today's standard. It demonstrates rather some blog-like apologetic for the KJV than a scholarly, properly researched and objective education.

 

[Behold]

Nobody educated in textual criticism, manuscripts, translations etc. would say things like "NIV removed verses".

Understanding why 'New" bibles are often junk is to understsand that its simply because in trash versions like the NIV.... verses that should be in their bible, are omitted.
Important Words are omitted also, or they are changed and this causes a muddying of the verses, and often a total context//meaning change.
And because these situation are found throughout the NIV......doctrines are both hidden or destroyed.

The NIV is Trash.

It demonstrates rather some blog-like apologetic for the KJV than a scholarly, properly researched and objective education.

Of course the KVJ is a good version..........whereas the NIV is junk.

You are welcome to your opinions., as they are your proof text, ive noticed.

 

[HealthyShape]

Understanding why 'New" bibles are often junk is to understsand that its simply because in trash versions like the NIV.... verses that should be in their bible, are omitted.
Important Words are omitted also, or they are changed and this causes a muddying of the verses, and often a total context change.
And because these situation are found throughout the NIV......doctrines are both hidden or destroyed.

The NIV is Trash.

Repeating this nonsense over and over will not make it true. You are not the one to decide what "should be in their bible", textual research and scholarly consensus decides that.

You are welcome to your opinions., as they are your proof text, ive noticed.

Tell this to yourself.

 

[Behold]

Repeating this nonsense over and over will not make it true.

I can show you many many situations within the NIV......regarding where this version stripped a necessary doctrine, or omitted it, or changed it.
I can show you where the NIV removes words and verses completely that should be found in any bible.

So, as i told you previously......there is at least one Thread on this Forum that details all the verse issues and doctrinal issues related to the NIV version.
You can find it, or you can continue to not know the truth.
Its really up to you.

 

[HealthyShape]

I can show you many many situations within the NIV......regarding where this version stripped a necessary doctrine, or omitted it, or changed it.
I can show you where the NIV removes words and verses completely that should be found in any bible.

Comparing NIV to KJV or to Textus Receptus does not mean that NIV removed something!!! Come on. Stop repeating this nonsense and learn something about Nestlé Aland vs Majority text vs Textus Receptus.

Majority Text and Textus Receptus are late textual traditions with additions. Critical texts like Nestlé Aland try to reconstruct the original text which is frequently shorter, because late traditions added things in time to make the text more suitable for liturgy. That is also why the Majority text is sometimes called the liturgical text.

So, if you wanted to be more factual, you should say the Textus Receptus and the KJV have added verses compared to the first manuscripts of the New Testament.

But the situation is not that simple and the Textus Receptus and the KJV also omit some words that are found in the first manuscripts.

And the situation in the Old Testament is even worse for the KJV, because it is based solely on the Masoretic Text while the New Testament quotes various textual traditions of the Old Testament. Which produced plenty of inconsistencies throughout the KJV.

 

[Behold]

Comparing NIV to KJV or to Textus Receptus does not mean that NIV removed something!!! Come on. Stop repeating this nonsense and learn something about Nestlé Aland vs Majority text vs Textus Receptus.

Pay attention.

There are about 30 extant K.Grk Texts.

Nearly All bibles other then the MaryCult bible are made from them.

The Received Text, is the most accurate, and it created the KJV and many other bibles.
Nestle used it for a very long time....and then they stopped and now what they use, is inferior.
The JUNK NIV is taken fron that inferior Nestle-Aland Greek.

Now, just pass on the faux argument that tries to use "well scholarship says".. as in fact, this is all divided.....and its a useless rabbit trail argument for kiddies.

The fruit of a Bible is one of the main proofs of the Bible's anointing from God.

Now, If you actually knew anything about more recent Church History, you would know that all the Major Worldwide Revivals started under the preaching of a KJV Bible, and almost every notable Preacher, Teacher or Evangelist, was called into the ministry under the preaching and teaching of a KJV.

The NIV is a theologically confused piese of religious TRASH. that causes Christians to not learn doctrine, because the NIV omits verses, and changes the context of doctrine, throughout.

Majority Text and Textus Receptus are late textual traditions with additions.

I suppose you'll be tellilng us next that "only the originals" , the "original greek" ..is/are trustworthy.
= (Face-Palm)
So, let me stop you there before you hurt yourself..., as there is no such thing as an original K.Grk NT Text.