Not a future seeing Jesus coming guy

[Spiritual Israelite]

The kingdom that Jesus would receive is the kingdom of Heaven. When Jesus returns, He will bring the kingdom of Heaven to be the ruling Kingdom of God over the nations.

The kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are the same kingdom, so there's no reason to differentiate between them the way you are doing. Notice in the following passage how Jesus uses the terms "the kingdom of heaven" and "the kingdom of God" interchangeably in reference to the same kingdom that is hard for a rich man to enter.

Matthew 19:23 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

 

[MatthewG]

Jerusalem experienced the same plauges that pretty much befell on Egypt.


It's amazing how the start and the finish are reversed, it's like an inward ball being pulled to its right state again.

 

[MatthewG]

I'm not quite sure I understand your point regarding Muslims.


For context, I’ve had a friend who practiced Islam, and I respect his journey. At the end of the day, he's an adult making his own decisions, and that autonomy deserves to be honored.


What concerns me more broadly is the tendency for people to impose control over others. That kind of behavior—trying to dictate someone else's path—can be deeply harmful and counterproductive.

 

[Douggg]

If that's all meant to be taken literally then why does Paul talk about unbelievers saying "peace and safety" just before Jesus comes again (1 Thess 5:2-3)

The world will be saying "peace and safety" because it will have been deceived into thinking it has entered the messianic age. But it will be a false messianic age of the Antichrist as the perceived King of Israel messiah.

That illusion will be shattered when the Antichrist in 2Thessalonians2:4 commits the transgression act (Daniel 8:13) of going into the temple, sitting, claiming to have achieved God-hood. Revealing himself to be the man of sin and not the Jewish messiah after all.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

The second coming has already occured?

 

[MatthewG]

Do you hate muslim people? Do you hate mormons? Do you hate Jehovah witnesses? Douggg?

 

[Douggg]

Jerusalem experienced the same plauges that pretty much befell on Egypt.


It's amazing how the start and the finish are reversed, it's like an inward ball being pulled to its right state again.

In light of what the bible says, there are consequences to what people believe.

 

[Douggg]

Do you hate muslim people? Do you hate mormons? Do you hate Jehovah witnesses?

I hate what they believe. Not their humanity.

 

[MatthewG]

The bible states God will chasten those whom he loves, and prune them back.

So what is your point? God can cut people back. He doesn't need the bible to do so.

 

[MatthewG]

To me then it seems you like to have control. You wont have control over me.

 

[Douggg]

The kingdom of heaven and the kingdom of God are the same kingdom, so there's no reason to differentiate between them the way you are doing. Notice in the following passage how Jesus uses the terms "the kingdom of heaven" and "the kingdom of God" interchangeably in reference to the same kingdom that is hard for a rich man to enter.

Matthew 19:23 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “Assuredly, I say to you that it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. 24 And again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.”

Essentially the same yes. But the timing is that Jesus received His kingdom in heaven - when he ascended to heaven in Acts 1. And will bring his kingdom of heaven to be the Kingdom of God here on earth. In the Lord's prayer, we are taught to pray - "Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven".

 

[MatthewG]

Yes @Spiritual Israelite. Kingdom of God, Kingdom of Heaven are synomous with one another.

I believe we are part of the kingdom, when we are adopted through faith in the death, burial, and resurrection of the Lord Yeshua.

There are people the expect a literal kingdom, they may believe whatever they want.

What is good is you testing all things out for yourself. Never believing them or me.

 

[Douggg]

To me then it seems you like to have control. You wont have control over me.

What's that have to do with what the bible says ?

 

[MatthewG]

Be careful of people who love to seek control over anyone.

They are allowed to have their freedoms of though, but they are not allowed to dominate your faith and how a person puts it in to practice.

They are just fooling themselves.

 

[MatthewG]

Douggg, I’m addressing you directly here.

At this point, I’m not sure what more you're trying to prove. You've made your position clear, and I’ve heard it. I’m not here to argue endlessly—I simply want to express where I stand.

While I value Scripture deeply, my foundation is the Spirit of the resurrected Lord Yeshua. As Romans 8:14 affirms, “For all who are led by the Spirit of God are sons of God.” It is by His Spirit that we walk in faith, love, joy, peace, and self-control—fruit that reflects His presence within us (Galatians 5:22–23).

I respect your passion, but the repeated back-and-forth has reached its limit. I hear you, and I genuinely wish you well.

As for the idea of Jesus establishing a physical kingdom on earth, that’s not something I personally hold to. I believe the kingdom He inaugurated was spiritual in nature. Yeshua Himself said, “My kingdom is not of this world” (John 18:36), and I take that statement at face value—not as a veiled reference to a future earthly reign, but as a declaration of a present spiritual reality.

To reinterpret His words as a promise of geopolitical rule, in my view, distorts the essence of what He taught. The kingdom is within us (Luke 17:21), and it is accessed through faith, not through earthly dominion.

I say this not to offend, but to assert the freedom to think, discern, and be led by the Spirit. When dialogue becomes rigid and controlling, it loses its value. I’m simply choosing to walk in the liberty that Christ provides: “It is for freedom that Christ has set us free. Stand firm, then, and do not let yourselves be burdened again by a yoke of slavery” (Galatians 5:1).

Peace to you, and may the Spirit of Yeshua guide us both in truth and humility.

 

[quietthinker]

Those people refusing to enter the Ark in Noah's time did so in face of the evidence they witnessed. I think of the animals who came in their respective pairs and groups.
Imagine, lions weren't chewing up sheep and elephants weren't strong arming it to get in first as the multitude of creatures gathered.

Evidence of what is coming is plentiful when one has eyes to see.
What we see and how we see is no different to Jesus in his time. Some adored him, others vilified him. The message of his resurrection was either the touch stone for hope or the catalyst for denial.

We understand from scripture who wins the day, the question is even for those who give lip service to this reality, how is it won?

 

[MatthewG]

Jesus also said "I speak spirit and life."

He always spoke by spiritual means, and adds life, spiritual life which we are building as new people whom are adopted as Children of God.

Raising to newness of life with Yeshua, as he died, was buried, and resurrected.

 

[MatthewG]

QuietThinker, there is nothing wrong with teaching. Is there? Sure who at the end of the day is having faith and loving.

I can't judge that. God will.

 

[MatthewG]

It's good to remember that though.

Jesus spoke "Spirit and life. There is something to consider there.

 

[Douggg]

At this point, I’m not sure what more you're trying to prove. You've made your position clear, and I’ve heard it. I’m not here to argue endlessly—I simply want to express where I stand.

This a discussion forum.

If you want to express your views without comments of others, then I suggest that you make yourself a web site of your beliefs.