Is it possible to lose salvation?

[ProverbsInPink]

Before you wish me a good day...

how about providing some scripture to prove your point.
You won't find any.

Because what you're saying is that a person could go back to living a life of sin and still be saved.
If you could post some scripture that states this....it would be helpful to this conversation.

Otherwise, it is only your opinion.
And our personal opinions do not count for much.

And since you think what Paul said could not be of Christ...
perhaps we could see what Jesus said about your incorrect belief:


Matthew 7:24-27
24 "Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.
25 "And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and yet it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock.
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell -and great was its fall."


Jesus is stating that WISE MEN will ACT on His words...
IOW, they will keep His commandments.

FOOLISH MEN will NOT ACT on His words...
IOW, they will not keep His commandments.
These foolish men built their house on SAND and when the rains came
the house FELL.

Jesus said that if we disobey Him we cannot possibly be saved.

Do you believe Jesus?

1 Corinthians 2:14
I realize there are those who call eternal irrevocable Salvation a lie.

As soon as they do that we know they're not one of us.
The parable of the prodigal is a great teaching tool.

If you think we have to work to stay saved,you're wrong.

If we lose faith,if we were ever in Christ,and I'm not referring to the name only ones who say they're a Christian but Jesus does not know them, we are eternally in Christ.

God knows who are his. And he would foresee if we would lose faith down the road. When he called us to his grace despite his possibly seeing that in our future, we are in that grace forever.

You have to provide scripture that contradicts Jesus as you do in writing here.

Show the scripture where Jesus said if we lose faith he strips his grace from us. Removes his eternal seal, evicts his holy spirit, removes his redemption and our state of rebirth in him, and returns our minds to the hardened state where we are unable to understand the things of God.

Please proceed.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

Saved FOR good works (Ephesians 2:10) is not the same as saved BY good works.

2 Timothy 2:13
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.



I would hope those who labor to convince us we are not truly Saved by grace are not the norm in Christian communities.

 

[GodsGrace]

Saved FOR good works (Ephesians 2:10) is not the same as saved BY good works.

Again, for the millionth time
NO Christian believes they are saved by good works.
Must be a difficult concept.

So must we obey Jesus or not AFTER salvation?

Jesus said we must.

 

[GodsGrace]

2 Timothy 2:13
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.

You are not properly understanding 2 Timothy 2:13.

If you were right, it would obviously contradict 2 Timothy 2:12

I would hope those who labor to convince us we are not truly Saved by grace are not the norm in Christian communities.

Actually You are in the minority.

But it's OK...keep gambling with your salvation.

Ignore Paul, Jesus and all the writers.

Good night.

 

[GodsGrace]

1 Corinthians 2:14
I realize there are those who call eternal irrevocable Salvation a lie.

As soon as they do that we know they're not one of us.
The parable of the prodigal is a great teaching tool.

If you think we have to work to stay saved,you're wrong.

If we lose faith,if we were ever in Christ,and I'm not referring to the name only ones who say they're a Christian but Jesus does not know them, we are eternally in Christ.

God knows who are his. And he would foresee if we would lose faith down the road. When he called us to his grace despite his possibly seeing that in our future, we are in that grace forever.

You have to provide scripture that contradicts Jesus as you do in writing here.

Show the scripture where Jesus said if we lose faith he strips his grace from us. Removes his eternal seal, evicts his holy spirit, removes his redemption and our state of rebirth in him, and returns our minds to the hardened state where we are unable to understand the things of God.

Please proceed.

You forgot to post scripture that states that we can sin and still get to heaven.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

You forgot to post scripture that states that we can sin and still get to heaven.

I never said we can sin and still go to Heaven.

Have you found the scripture that supports your ideas?
We lose salvation if we lose faith. We're returned to our former state,etc...

 

[mailmandan]

Again, for the millionth time
NO Christian believes they are saved by good works.
Must be a difficult concept.

So must we obey Jesus or not AFTER salvation?

Jesus said we must.

I can see that it's a difficult concept for you. Acts of obedience which follow having been saved through faith are good works. Must or will obey Jesus after salvation? Obedience is not forced or legalistic for children of God.

 

[ProverbsInPink]

You are not properly understanding 2 Timothy 2:13.

If you were right, it would obviously contradict 2 Timothy 2:12

Actually You are in the minority.

But it's OK...keep gambling with your salvation.

Ignore Paul, Jesus and all the writers.

Good night.

It's true. I am in a small number of people. Those who are actually called by God into his irrevocable salvation.

I don't twist scripture so to make Jesus a liar.

You're on your own there.


2 Timothy 2:13
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.

 

[Christian Soldier]

Its obvous that when you are confronted with the Satanic deception that is your Hyper-Calvinism........and its pointed out to you, that according to this "dung" theology you believe and teach........some of your family members, are "predestined for hell" before they were born...
So, i asked you 4x....."Which in your family are pre-destined for hell".? , and "why were you not predestined for Hell".?

You have not answered.... you keep running from the question 4x.... ..and the members and the MODs see you clearly. @Christian Soldier .
And they are going to see you again, when you post more of your carnality to me, as im going to ask you the same question again.

- see you there next time....

The definition of a fool, is one who keeps making the same mistake and never learning from his error. I have answered you silly question many times, but you just keep asking it over and over gain and that tells me you have a problem with comprehension or you're just tolling.

Your questions are foolish in the extreme, I'm not God. You need to ask Him why He does what he does, I told you God has never revealed why he does what He does to anyone. You have obviously come under strong delusion, if you don't know that your questions are blasphemous in the extreme.

Lucifer did exactly the same thing you are doing, and you haven't learned anything for His example, and worse that that you're following in His footsteps. Good luck with that, you'll need lots of it

 

[GodsGrace]

I never said we can sin and still go to Heaven.

Have you found the scripture that supports your ideas?
We lose salvation if we lose faith. We're returned to our former state,etc...

Then apparently you don't really understand what OSAS means.
ONCE SAVED
ALWAYS SAVED

It means that once a person accepts Jesus,,,
they will be saved forever....
no matter what they do or do not do.

This is not what Paul taught or Jesus or Peter or any of the writers.

If you could find some verses to support your position, it would be helpful.

If we do not obey Jesus,,,the wrath of God will be upon us.

John 3:36
36 "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; but he who does not obey the Son will not see life, but the wrath of God abides on him."

 

[GodsGrace]

1 Corinthians 2:14
I realize there are those who call eternal irrevocable Salvation a lie.

As soon as they do that we know they're not one of us.
The parable of the prodigal is a great teaching tool.

Agreed.
The parable of the Prodigal Son, taught by Jesus, is a great tool for understanding that salvation can be lost.

Let's look at it together.

The Prodigal son leaves home and is given ALL that his father owes to him.
2/3 of the total inheritance went to the older son.
The father now owes him nothing at all and the son is free to leave the home.

The son squanders his money and is left homeless and in poverty.
The pigs have more to eat.

So he decides to return home where his father is waiting for him with open arms.

THIS IS WHAT JESUS TAUGHT:

Luke 15:24
24 for this son of mine was dead and has come to life again; he was lost and has been found.' And they began to celebrate.


Jesus is teaching that the son had come to life AGAIN.

This AGAIN means that the son was.
saved
lost
saved AGAIN

It means the son lost his salvation when he left the home of the father.
It means it is possible to abandon the father and become lost.
Only if a person RETURNS to God Father will he come to life AGAIN.


Yes.
The parable of the Lost Son should be read very carefully.
JESUS did not teach OSAS.

If you think we have to work to stay saved,you're wrong.

If we lose faith,if we were ever in Christ,and I'm not referring to the name only ones who say they're a Christian but Jesus does not know them, we are eternally in Christ.

God knows who are his. And he would foresee if we would lose faith down the road. When he called us to his grace despite his possibly seeing that in our future, we are in that grace forever.

You have to provide scripture that contradicts Jesus as you do in writing here.

Show the scripture where Jesus said if we lose faith he strips his grace from us. Removes his eternal seal, evicts his holy spirit, removes his redemption and our state of rebirth in him, and returns our minds to the hardened state where we are unable to understand the things of God.

Please proceed.

 

[GodsGrace]

It's true. I am in a small number of people. Those who are actually called by God into his irrevocable salvation.

I don't twist scripture so to make Jesus a liar.

You're on your own there.


2 Timothy 2:13
If we are faithless, he remains faithful— for he cannot deny himself.

Please pay attention Proverbs:

2 Timothy 2:12
12 If we endure, we will also reign with Him; If we deny Him, He also will deny us;

IF we ENDURE we will also reign with Him.
If we DENY HIM,
He will also deny us.



13 If we are faithless, He remains faithful, for He cannot * deny Himself.

IF we are faithless,
He remains faithful because He cannot deny Himself.


So which verse is correct?
Verse 12 or verse 13?

Please explain because there is an apparent contrdiction here which you have not addressed.

 

[GodsGrace]

I can see that it's a difficult concept for you. Acts of obedience which follow having been saved through faith are good works. Must or will obey Jesus after salvation? Obedience is not forced or legalistic for children of God.

No obedience.
No salvation.

Jesus taught that the fool does not ACT on the WORDS OF JESUS.
The storm came.
The house fell.

Matthew 7:26-27
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell -and great was its fall."


It's rather unfortunate that some that claim to be following Jesus
are not really following Him at all but making His statements to be lies.
Lies as taught by MEN...
NOT by Jesus Himself....

Who is the one that went to the cross for you.
NOT the men whose teachings you are following.

 

[mailmandan]

No obedience.
No salvation.

So, "type 2 works salvation" or salvation by works at the back door? Faith is the root of salvation and obedience which follows is the fruit. No fruit at all would demonstrate there is no root. Obedience is how genuine faith manifests itself. James 2:14–26 contrasts living faith that produces obedience/works with empty profession that produces nothing/no works.

Jesus taught that the fool does not ACT on the WORDS OF JESUS.
The storm came.
The house fell.

Matthew 7:26-27
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell -and great was its fall."

In Matthew 7:24-27, we see two different foundations with two different results, and not salvation by works, as some would suppose. Each house has a different material upon which its foundation is laid, and each house has a different final outcome. One house is built by a wise man upon a rock and it stands. (represents believers) The other is built by a foolish man upon the sand and it collapses. (represents unbelievers) The rock the wise man builds upon is true righteousness found in Jesus Christ alone. The sand the foolish man builds upon is self-righteousness. Only those who truly believe in Him are described as wise and hear the words of Jesus and properly act on them.

Keep in mind that in context, Jesus starts out by saying - Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves. As we read further, we continue to see a contrast between a good tree that bears good fruit and a bad tree that bears bad fruit. (Matthew 7:16-20) Jesus said you will know them by their fruits.

It's rather unfortunate that some that claim to be following Jesus
are not really following Him at all but making His statements to be lies.
Lies as taught by MEN...
NOT by Jesus Himself....

I don't believe that His statements are lies. You need to read what Jesus said in context and see the contrast He was making.

Who is the one that went to the cross for you.
NOT the men whose teachings you are following.

Jesus went to the cross for me. Which men's teachings am I following? I have been quoting scripture and not uninspired writings of men.

 

[nedsk]

Would you mind providing me with 2 passages that imply works goes with faith for salvation?

Why 2? How many times does something need to be said for it to be true? How many times did God say "Let there be light"? What's wrong with you people but I'll play along.

From James
24 You can see, then, that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

26 For just as the body is dead without a spirit, so faith without works is also dead.

Matthew
Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my heavenly Father. (Notice the verb, does)

Theres more

 

[nedsk]

nedsk
Sorry but Augustine was heretical.
Want to go down the list?
Do you know that Calvin based his teachings on Augustine's writings?
Do you know that Augustine based his beliefs on the fact that he was so guilt ridden due to his previous life?

I know he's a brain and a church doctor....
but he was an gnostic and brought many of his ideas with him into the CC...10 year's worth.

When I was studying with a Catholic friar a lesson finally came up about Augustine.
He knew the reasons why I don't care for Augustine.
The day he did the lesson I was home sick. My friend said that the friar said that it was good that I wasn't there that day!

Anyway...just some thoughts you might want to look into.

I will but what's been posted here by him is not heretical

 

[nedsk]

I already explained it. You just don't get it.

No you haven't. You just keep repeating yourself. If faith is sufficient then there is no need for works therefore no need to even mention works. You cant show that faith causes works

 

[GodsGrace]

I will but what's been posted here by him is not heretical

If you're speaking about SOLA FIDE, then I agree.
Sola Fide was NEVER taught in the early church and was not until the reformation.
ALL the ECFs understood that good deeds were part of salvation...
Jesus Himself taught this and why not?
Did Jesus not say that the Kingdom of God was at hand?
On earth?
Doesn't the Kingdom of God require good works for it to be functional?
Yes sir, it does.

But, as heretical means going against established core issues of the church...
I'd say he definitely was.
On free will
On original sin.
Look into it, it's an interesting study on both him and his positions.

 

[GodsGrace]

No you haven't. You just keep repeating yourself. If faith is sufficient then there is no need for works therefore no need to even mention works. You cant show that faith causes works

@mailmandan always assumes the other member "doesn't get it".

That's rather prideful...
as if it cannot be HIM that is "not getting it".

 

[mailmandan]

No you haven't. You just keep repeating yourself. If faith is sufficient then there is no need for works therefore no need to even mention works. You cant show that faith causes works

Faith is sufficient to save because the object of our faith (Jesus Christ and His finished work of redemption) is the allsufficient means of our salvation. (Romans 3:24-26) There is a need to mention works because they are the evidence of a living faith and there are those who merely claim to have faith but demonstrate by the lack of works that they have a bare profession of faith instead. (James 2:14-26)